Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #106

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Your post popped up after I posted mine. Yes, I strongly believe something was already going on earlier this year.

If LE had been able to proceed with an arrest of a suspect they’d have done so without a PC, regardless if the suspect looked like a sketch. PCs and media tours are for one reason only, to engage the public in seeking helpful information. Hopefully this recent blitz has achieved a desirable outcome!

They could absolutely have enough to arrest a POI right now, but maybe they don’t feel they have enough to solidly secure a conviction, hence the request for additional info. Probable cause and beyond a reasonable doubt are two different things. On a case like this LE should take it slow and make sure it’s right.

Just a guess - the only useable DNA is touch. That means the person only touched something at the scene or it could’ve been a transfer. It’s possible that the person has been in contact with either LG or AW or even KG (she said they borrowed her sweatshirts that day) so they could explain their DNA being there.

Maybe their phone was hitting that tower immediately before or after the crime, but not during it. Maybe they actually did find a SC connection, but not an aha connection like an actual conversation (BG viewed the ? o’clock AW snap and they could tie him to the SC account). I’d like this to be the case because technical data can be icing on the cake and/or hard to dispute if combined with other info.

It’s possible that LE got info from the 42K tips or from an informant too.

They now need to put that person actually at the trail/park that day between 12-5 because they provided an alibi that puts them somewhere else. Maybe there was something funky with that alibi in the first place.

This is a total hypothetical and I do not have a specific POI. I’m not married to this at all.
 
Evening All.

Looking for help/clarification on a couple of points...

I have it in my head that there may be a msm article ,or footage of an interview, in which possibly LEO mentions feeling ,or being, betrayed by someone/something in the investigation period of the first 2yrs,prior to the April PC. Or This may be my own interpretation of the LE feeling at the April PC that Ive turned into 'Fact' ,or a discussion on this topic of betrayal that Ive also adopted as 'Fact'. Is anyone aware of any verified source for this?


Similarly, Im far more convinced that Ive seen interview footage or coverage in which LE or BP/MP/AW or similar persons state that they have heard extra audio from LG's recording and that it records audio of the Perp getting or becoming impatient/frustrated with the girls ( or similar). This in particular is driving me nuts .

Appreciate any pointers to being able to verify or refute the above 2 points.

At this time both may be just MOO
 
When you are closing in on a suspect you don't broadcast it to every Tom, Dick & Harry...
However: I think, as another poster said: this was a 'hail Mary'....they've a very good idea of the direction now....they just need that ONE tip
I hope to heck I'm wrong - and an arrest is imminent
JMO
editing to say: whether I am right or wrong: hope an arrest is imminent
 
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Evening All.

Looking for help/clarification on a couple of points...

I have it in my head that there may be a msm article ,or footage of an interview, in which possibly LEO mentions feeling ,or being, betrayed by someone/something in the investigation period of the first 2yrs,prior to the April PC. Or This may be my own interpretation of the LE feeling at the April PC that Ive turned into 'Fact' ,or a discussion on this topic of betrayal that Ive also adopted as 'Fact'. Is anyone aware of any verified source for this?


Similarly, Im far more convinced that Ive seen interview footage or coverage in which LE or BP/MP/AW or similar persons state that they have heard extra audio from LG's recording and that it records audio of the Perp getting or becoming impatient/frustrated with the girls ( or similar). This in particular is driving me nuts .

Appreciate any pointers to being able to verify or refute the above 2 points.

At this time both may be just MOO

Yes, I recall the comment about BG getting impatient. I cannot find the news reference either. Believe it was a short segment within a news report. IIRC it was sheriff office, not ISP.
I thought it was on the day or the next day after the audio.
 
Unless this ends up some weird internet thing - him stalking them or otherwise - for instance he IS indeed a serial killer....
I lean to this being very spur of the moment - he didn't have any 'plan' - didn't know what he was doing or was going to do..."guys, down the hill.." Like some coach of a sports team: directing them to what's next...just so odd
He spent a lot of time there - just took the moment he was given, was going to act on it, there they were, there he was: he decided to do it, right then, in the moment - no forethought
As if he was taking control in the moment....riding it out not knowing where it was going...
Eh. It's very strange indeed. And maybe I am totally, utterly mistaken
JMO
 
Glad the grandparents beat the crap out of him, judging by the mug shot. If only they had been armed. On the bright side, his DNA will be collected since he is being charged with felonies.
Well to me, every one of these arrested miscreants is "BG" until ruled out by a DNA sample.

Amateur opinion and speculation
 
I keep seeing people saying that LE "knows" who did it, but that they're "building an airtight case." We must have vastly different experiences with LE & DAs then. My experiences with LE here, and with LE in Delphi, is that if they have reason to suspect a person of comitting a crime-especially a major one-they'll arrest if they have any evidence at all. Especially in a high-profile crime. They'll often work with the DA as a professional courtesy, and they will bounce ideas off of each other, but I can't fathom a situation where LE would say, "We know this dude brutally killed 2 kids, but prosecution doesn't think we're ready so we will hold off on an arrest. Hopefully he doesn't kill anyone else in the meantime!" I have multiple family members in LE including some in the Delphi area, family that works homicide and narcotics, and they have always erred on the side of caution when it comes to public safety. They gather evidence, they interview, they make arrests and keep the public safe-the DA is the one who puts all of that together to ensure that it's an "airtight case." I can see a world in which they have an idea of who it might be, but don't have any hard evidence in which to back it up. I can not, however, after a dozen years of writing true crime and listening to LE discuss things off the record, fathom them holding off on the arrest of a high-profile child murderer who could very well attack again.

They must have some evidence since they've weeded people out.
 
This just made me think of something. Because it sounds like the bridge is not something many “outsiders” know about and because he seems to be comfortable walking on the bridge it is quite likely he has been to the bridge (and walked on it) many times.

He may have disguised himself that day so he may not have looked the same as he may have on previous visits to the bridge - whether they were “scouting missions” or just innocent excursions at previous times. He may be basically non-distinct or non-threatening appearing so people may not even notice him or, even if they did notice him he didn’t leave a lasting impression.

Or he could be someone that wasn’t necessarily KNOWN by others but someone that others had seen around in some capacity that was safe - or at least non-threatening.

It would be interesting to see if any locals that frequent the bridge may remember seeing someone like this on other occasions that they have previously dismissed as “not being the killer type”.

I say this because I remember reading Ann Rule’s book “Green River Running Red” and it was found that Gary Ridgway’s name had come up previously because he was not a stranger to the areas frequented by prostitutes. When LE talked to several prostitutes in the area they all said he couldn’t be the killer because they had “worked” for him before and nothing bad had happened.
<snipped>

If you recall with Ridgway, so many reports of the truck with paint on it were noted, but nothing was confirmed/fully understood until he was caught.

<snip>They could absolutely have enough to arrest a POI right now, but maybe they don’t feel they have enough to solidly secure a conviction, hence the request for additional info. Probable cause and beyond a reasonable doubt are two different things. On a case like this LE should take it slow and make sure it’s right. <snip for brevity>

There are so many outright odd people who have done horrible things in the Delphi area and beyond.

When it was asked for anyone to relay information about a car parked at the abandoned social services building, I assume there is some educated thinking BG had a car to get to the Delphi trails. Not much seemed to have come from asking about a car parked on the trail head parking lot back in ‘17.
 
I'd said awhile back I have my own, unprofessional profile. I can't get my thoughts to run together so here it comes in no particular order.

He may work nights in a pretty isolated career (not lots of coworkers). Like night security or something.

His neighbors may not know him due to his work/sleep schedules.

He may keep curtains drawn at all times.

I think he's average in intelligence and looks and totally off radars. You wouldn't think he's super smart or ugly or really good looking. He's not a jock or a bully or involved in community in any way.

I asked awhile back if there are any strip joints nearby. You can go in quietly, stay away from the stage, and leave just as anonymously.

I doubt anyone has ever pegged him as weird. Maybe quiet.

I don't think he's been married or has a girlfriend. I just see him as going about his life in a very anonymous, quiet way.

You all may tell me how completely wrong I am someday! Or right. Who knows!
I think you just might be right.
 
I keep seeing people saying that LE "knows" who did it, but that they're "building an airtight case." We must have vastly different experiences with LE & DAs then. My experiences with LE here, and with LE in Delphi, is that if they have reason to suspect a person of comitting a crime-especially a major one-they'll arrest if they have any evidence at all. Especially in a high-profile crime. They'll often work with the DA as a professional courtesy, and they will bounce ideas off of each other, but I can't fathom a situation where LE would say, "We know this dude brutally killed 2 kids, but prosecution doesn't think we're ready so we will hold off on an arrest. Hopefully he doesn't kill anyone else in the meantime!" I have multiple family members in LE including some in the Delphi area, family that works homicide and narcotics, and they have always erred on the side of caution when it comes to public safety. They gather evidence, they interview, they make arrests and keep the public safe-the DA is the one who puts all of that together to ensure that it's an "airtight case." I can see a world in which they have an idea of who it might be, but don't have any hard evidence in which to back it up. I can not, however, after a dozen years of writing true crime and listening to LE discuss things off the record, fathom them holding off on the arrest of a high-profile child murderer who could very well attack again.

They must have some evidence since they've weeded people out.

Agree with this 100% but...

The only way I could see LE not arresting the perp if they know who it is, because of waiting for further evidence, is if they have him completely under 24/7 surveillance.
 
I keep seeing people saying that LE "knows" who did it, but that they're "building an airtight case." We must have vastly different experiences with LE & DAs then. My experiences with LE here, and with LE in Delphi, is that if they have reason to suspect a person of comitting a crime-especially a major one-they'll arrest if they have any evidence at all. Especially in a high-profile crime. They'll often work with the DA as a professional courtesy, and they will bounce ideas off of each other, but I can't fathom a situation where LE would say, "We know this dude brutally killed 2 kids, but prosecution doesn't think we're ready so we will hold off on an arrest. Hopefully he doesn't kill anyone else in the meantime!" I have multiple family members in LE including some in the Delphi area, family that works homicide and narcotics, and they have always erred on the side of caution when it comes to public safety. They gather evidence, they interview, they make arrests and keep the public safe-the DA is the one who puts all of that together to ensure that it's an "airtight case." I can see a world in which they have an idea of who it might be, but don't have any hard evidence in which to back it up. I can not, however, after a dozen years of writing true crime and listening to LE discuss things off the record, fathom them holding off on the arrest of a high-profile child murderer who could very well attack again.

They must have some evidence since they've weeded people out.

Though I agree with you, let ponder this possibility

They are confident they know who it is but do not have:

A murder Weapon
An Eye witness
Someone to Refute an alibi
Physical evidence
A DNA Sample or usable DNA

I think they are after someone to refute this guys alibi, that hopefully start this chain of dominoes falling over and get this turd arrested!

Can police present quietly to the District Attorney to see if they would proceed with what they have?
 
I keep seeing people saying that LE "knows" who did it, but that they're "building an airtight case." We must have vastly different experiences with LE & DAs then. My experiences with LE here, and with LE in Delphi, is that if they have reason to suspect a person of comitting a crime-especially a major one-they'll arrest if they have any evidence at all. Especially in a high-profile crime. They'll often work with the DA as a professional courtesy, and they will bounce ideas off of each other, but I can't fathom a situation where LE would say, "We know this dude brutally killed 2 kids, but prosecution doesn't think we're ready so we will hold off on an arrest. Hopefully he doesn't kill anyone else in the meantime!" I have multiple family members in LE including some in the Delphi area, family that works homicide and narcotics, and they have always erred on the side of caution when it comes to public safety. They gather evidence, they interview, they make arrests and keep the public safe-the DA is the one who puts all of that together to ensure that it's an "airtight case." I can see a world in which they have an idea of who it might be, but don't have any hard evidence in which to back it up. I can not, however, after a dozen years of writing true crime and listening to LE discuss things off the record, fathom them holding off on the arrest of a high-profile child murderer who could very well attack again.

They must have some evidence since they've weeded people out.

BBM - it looks that way

Where I live (not Indiana) LE doesn’t consult with the prosecutors on every case necessarily, but a whodunnit high profile double homicide they would and do. The prosecutor doesn’t direct the investigation - It’s more of a collaborative effort.

The legal and LE fields are on the same team and have the same goals, but they also have different thresholds they have to meet to achieve those goals. They walk a fine line between public safety and patiently working a case to the point they can secure a conviction.

LE wants to make an arrest and they need probable cause. They have to convince a judge or attorney that it is more probable than not that BG murdered LG and AW based on the evidence they have for an arrest warrant.

Legal wants a conviction (LE too of course) and they need beyond a reasonable doubt. They have to convince a jury (or possibly just a judge - I think the chances of an acquittal are better with a jury though) that there is no doubt BG murdered LG and AW.

A case of this magnitude I would think they’d want to have things pretty buttoned up from the get go because no one wants to risk an acquittal or hung jury. I suspect the defense might request a change of venue in this case which makes the jury pool a little more unpredictable.

Just my thoughts. Sorry for my wordy posts today.
 
Agree with this 100% but...

The only way I could see LE not arresting the perp if they know who it is, because of waiting for further evidence, is if they have him completely under 24/7 surveillance.

I could see that as well, but if that were the case then it seems like their pressers would be less about asking family/friends to identify him and more about trying to place him at the park that day.
 
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