OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #58

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN REMINDER:

Unless you are 100% certain that the person you are posting about is an individual involved in this case, do not post their information or link to information about them.

Also, when stating information as fact or quoting directly from a source, you must provide a link to the source. Otherwise your post gets removed.

Thanks.

 

[CIA Team Member]

I think I speak for alot of posters in general.

We want to know why <modsnip> did you killers drive the extra 15 miles to Left Fork Road to kill Kenny. For crying out loud why on earth involve Kenny?
I have seen the most speculation and questions directed in this case about Kenny.

Thousands of posts, through the last 4 and a half years since the murders, speculating on why was he targeted?

I think Gary was targeted only because he was living with Chris at the time. I think Hannah G was targeted only because she was living with Frankie.
And Camera specifically said the Wagner's killed all the witnesses.

So the biggest question I want answered is why Kenny?

If I were on the Jury <modsnip>, I would want to know. And if I were on the Jury I would push to know. Writing the judge, whatever....

Maybe the answer will come out at trial but if not I would have a problem with that if I were on the Jury. Think of Kendra, God Bless Her.

By the way, Kendra herself thought she would have been murdered along with her dad if she had stayed that night with Hanna. Imagine what this young lady has endured. <modsnip>

Kendra Rhoden: I could have been the ninth victim in Pike Co. family massacre

The question of why Kenny was answered: "The Wagners killed all the witnesses." He had to have been and CSR's, Frankie's or Dana's and knew they were probably the last to have seen the Wagner's with/around the Rhoden family.

 

[CIA Team Member]

I think I speak for alot of posters in general.

We want to know why <modsnip> did you killers drive the extra 15 miles to Left Fork Road to kill Kenny. For crying out loud why on earth involve Kenny?
I have seen the most speculation and questions directed in this case about Kenny.

Thousands of posts, through the last 4 and a half years since the murders, speculating on why was he targeted?

I think Gary was targeted only because he was living with Chris at the time. I think Hannah G was targeted only because she was living with Frankie.
And Camera specifically said the Wagner's killed all the witnesses.

So the biggest question I want answered is why Kenny?

If I were on the Jury <modsnip>, I would want to know. And if I were on the Jury I would push to know. Writing the judge, whatever....

Maybe the answer will come out at trial but if not I would have a problem with that if I were on the Jury. Think of Kendra, God Bless Her.

By the way, Kendra herself thought she would have been murdered along with her dad if she had stayed that night with Hanna. Imagine what this young lady has endured. <modsnip>

Kendra Rhoden: I could have been the ninth victim in Pike Co. family massacre

The question of why Kenny was answered: "The Wagners killed all the witnesses." He had to have been and CSR's, Frankie's or Dana's and knew they were probably the last to have seen the Wagner's with/around the Rhoden family.

 

[Betty P]

Sorry for my last post.

I would also like to know the differences that may come out between the 4 different defendants and get what you mean by might not judge as harshly.

Again sorry about my former post, I get way too emotional sometimes over this case, no disrespect meant towards you in any way.

My apologies, too, if I sounded harsh.

I actually agree with what the prosecution has revealed to us so far - that all 4 Wagners were present that night and were aware that they had planned and executed the murders of 8 members of the Rhoden family. JMO, all of the evidence we've seen so far indicates that's an accurate assessment.

If, by some remote possibility, someone was at home taking care of the children, sufficient evidence has been revealed to indicate that person knew about the said planning and execution of the murders. Under Ohio law, they are still considered guilty.

Keep in mind, the prosecution has enough evidence to prove the other charges that have been brought against the 4 Wagners. The Grand Jury returned 22 criminal counts against them in relation to the murders:

Here's a link to the indictments. It's as good a time as any to review these again and discuss what they mean, what actions they refer to and match up with what we now know:

https://www.ohioattorneygeneral.gov...cial-Prosecutions/PikeCountyMurderIndictments

It starts out with 8 counts of Aggravated Murder, each with 6 specifications:

That each of the 4 Wagners possessed firearms, brandished them in the commission of the crime, that the aggravated murder was committed when using an automatic firearm with suppressor, that the aggravated murder was committed with the intent to escape detection, apprehension, trial or punishment for another offense, committed the aggravated murder as a part of a course of conduct of killing or attempting to kill two or more persons and committed the aggravated murder while attempting to flee immediately after committing aggravated burglary with prior calculation and design.

I'm paraphrasing here, but read the Grand Jury charges at the links to refresh your memory at the specificity of the charges.

Don't forget Count 9, the felony conspiracy. JMO, you can't be part of a conspiracy to plan a murder without knowing that a murder is going to take place. Evidence is listed in this count. Among the evidence listed in Count 9 is trail cameras belonging to the victims. JMO, trail cam video evidence in a conspiracy charge indicates all 4 individuals charged appear on that video. Either that or all 4 individuals are linked to one or more of the items of evidence listed.

 

[Ann99]

ADMIN REMINDER:

Unless you are 100% certain that the person you are posting about is an individual involved in this case, do not post their information or link to information about them.

Also, when stating information as fact or quoting directly from a source, you must provide a link to the source. Otherwise your post gets removed.

Thanks.

OK, Sorry. Now I realize the problem.

The CB I linked to - did know the Rhodens and did make public comments about their friendship, as the links explained.
He did die in a vehicle accident.

What is not clear is if it is the very same CB as in the AW documents.

So yes, not 100% certain.
Again, sorry.
Thanks!

 

[Cool Cats]

The question of why Kenny was answered: "The Wagners killed all the witnesses." He had to have been and CSR's, Frankie's or Dana's and knew they were probably the last to have seen the Wagner's with/around the Rhoden family.

I don't know. It's possible the killers are so deranged that they only killed Kenny to make it look Cartel-drug gang related. None of us can understand that, we do not have the mind of a killer. But hopefully for Kendra the truth will come out about her father. She might even know now, BCI probably has already told her why they think her dad was targeted.

Kenny, if you believe DS, had dollar bills scattered all over his legs from the knees down. Also, Kenny was the only one with just one gun shot.

Think about it. If true that paper money was tossed over him then there has to be a reason. Why? And only one gunshot, why?

My opinion is to make it look like a drug hit or Cartel hit.

Hard to believe they would kill him for only that reason, could be more reasons.

I think there is a reason they killed him that we do not know about and then they decided to, on top of the unknown reason, to make it look like a Cartel-drug gang type of related hit.

When I researched this money thing I found out that when a drug type gang throws money on a victim it is to send the message that they were greedy and ripped the drug gang off. Also, one shot to the eye is a drug gang thing from what I have researched, but just my opinion only. So I think it is possible the Wagners were trying to do this:

Make the murders look Cartel-drug gang related but also had another motive to kill Kenny.

LE was clear, they tampered with the crime scenes and tried to cover their tracks at the crime scenes but....

DeWine said they left evidence at the crime scenes!!

Opinion only

 

[Cool Cats]

Sorry Double

 

[Cool Cats]

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[Cool Cats]

Based on the evidence that has been revealed so far - in testimony, discovery, etc. - I would have no problem rendering a verdict of guilty.

• Custody motive is strong. Broken relationships, jealousy and custody disagreements are very common motivators for males murdering a former partner and their family members. Plenty of evidence of violence and escalation behaviors just prior to the murders
• Digital / social media evidence appears very strong WRT planning, forging of custody documents, researching and purchasing the tools the killers used. Indications are there's much to indicate threats, planning, cover up, etc.
  
• Crime scene evidence - we aren't privvy to all those details yet, but it seems very incriminating, particularly DNA evidence
• Ballistics evidence - also strong, linking the murders to at least 2 weapons owned by the Wagners
• Video evidence, including but not limited to shoe print evidence
  
• Recorded conversations

I was also very impressed with Special Prosecutor Canepa's questioning of Agent Ryan Scheiderer at GW4's recent hearing. She did an excellent job of helping him reveal all of the evidence that points to GW4's involvement in the murders. It was very clear and detailed, easy for jurors to understand. She will have no difficulty dealing with defense attorneys and keeping the jury focused on and understanding the state's evidence against the Wagners.

What I want most to see is how they organized and carried out these murders and why. So few details have been made public, its difficult to imagine how they accomplished the massacre in such a short period of time. I suspect we'll learn that mistakes were made, incriminating evidence was left, etc. I really want to hear why the Wagners felt this massacre was necessary to achieve their goals. I doubt we'll learn that, or what we hear will not make sense to normal people.

I'd also like to be assured that all the people who took risks to offer tips, testimony, etc. about the murders and the killers will have protection. I really hope they and the surviving family members don't have to live their lives in fear. They've suffered enough.

BBM

No DNA evidence in these 4 Cases according to Canepa....

 

[IType]

There are several things I want to see clarified.
1. Who was the first of w4 to get the idea to murder this family?
2. Clarification of BW "7th grade education". Is that all the schooling he had, or did his legal team use incorrect choice of words...should have said IQ of a 7th grader?
3. When did AW and BW stop living together?
4. Did FR's oldest son actually witness the murders in FR's trailer or did he sleep through them? (oh how I hope he didn't see anything).
5. Where were SW and Gw4's son at time of murders?

 

[Cool Cats]

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[Johnny B Bad]

BBM

No DNA evidence in these 4 Cases according to Canepa....

What is the DNA listed in the discovery

 

[Betty P]

BBM

No DNA evidence in these 4 Cases according to Canepa....

Do you have a link? TIA

The only one I recall her stating that was in GW4's case.

No DNA link in George Wagner IV's Rhoden murder case

 

[Johnny B Bad]

One of the Grandfathers had to be the brains of the hit on the Rhodens family, from the time that Jake and Angela Wagner started getting interviewed they became suspects, Jake and Angela could not get their story straight on when SW was picked up, and Billy, he was caught with Bulletproof vest, why in this world would he tell mommy to buy him a couple bulletproof vest, GW4, he has crazy eyes , if anyone of the Wagners get a crazy plea deal, it will be him, JMO

 

[Cool Cats]

Do you have a link? TIA

The only one I recall her stating that was in GW4's case.

No DNA link in George Wagner IV's Rhoden murder case

At GW4's bond hearing, closing argument, she was talking in the context of all the Wagners being involved together and in that context she said:

"We do not have DNA, we do not have fingerprints, Special Agent Scheiderer talked about how much premeditation went into these crimes, they obviously killed the only eyewitnesses other than themselves that night."

To me it sounded like she was talking about not having DNA or fingerprints to use to prove any of the Wagners did it.

However, I concede that this was GW4's Bond Hearing and it is possible she was only referring to GW4 and not the other Wagners.

So I better clarify and say that it's only my opinion that Canepa meant that there is no DNA or fingerprints for all 4 Wagners.

I'm talking about DNA and fingerprints to prove they were at the crime scenes that night, not about normal fingerprints or possibly DNA from Jake having lived with them and going over there for visitation.

 

[Cool Cats]

What is the DNA listed in the discovery

It's just my opinion that there is no DNA tying any of the Wagners to the crimes. Yes, Canepa could have been referring only to GW4 but I think she was talking about all 4 Wagners when she said "we do not have DNA, we do not have fingerprints."

Just my take on it only.

Good question though, DNA is listed in the Discovery for all 4 Wagners and we do not know whose DNA it is. It could even be the Wagner's DNA for all we know.

In my opinion if it is the Wagner's DNA it could simply be the DNA they submitted to BCI during the investigation, or submitted after their arrests.

 

[Johnny B Bad]

It's just my opinion that there is no DNA tying any of the Wagners to the crimes. Yes, Canepa could have been referring only to GW4 but I think she was talking about all 4 Wagners when she said "we do not have DNA, we do not have fingerprints."

Just my take on it only.

Good question though, DNA is listed in the Discovery for all 4 Wagners and we do not know whose DNA it is. It could even be the Wagner's DNA for all we know.

In my opinion if it is the Wagner's DNA it could simply be the DNA they submitted to BCI during the investigation, or submitted after their arrests.

CC do you think it could be Hannah Gilley and the other Rhodens found somewhere else not at the crime scene???? JMO

 

[Betty P]

At GW4's bond hearing, closing argument, she was talking in the context of all the Wagners being involved together and in that context she said:

"We do not have DNA, we do not have fingerprints, Special Agent Scheiderer talked about how much premeditation went into these crimes, they obviously killed the only eyewitnesses other than themselves that night."

To me it sounded like she was talking about not having DNA or fingerprints to use to prove any of the Wagners did it.

However, I concede that this was GW4's Bond Hearing and it is possible she was only referring to GW4 and not the other Wagners.

So I better clarify and say that it's only my opinion that Canepa meant that there is no DNA or fingerprints for all 4 Wagners.

I'm talking about DNA and fingerprints to prove they were at the crime scenes that night, not about normal fingerprints or possibly DNA from Jake having lived with them and going over there for visitation.

Yes, I took that to mean she was referring to GW4. DNA evidence has been submitted, it's listed in discovery. Further, there was extensive news coverage of that hearing and testimony. If reporters thought she was stating no DNA at all in the case, they would have reported that. Most of the reporters covering these hearings are pretty good.

 

[Betty P]

It's just my opinion that there is no DNA tying any of the Wagners to the crimes. Yes, Canepa could have been referring only to GW4 but I think she was talking about all 4 Wagners when she said "we do not have DNA, we do not have fingerprints."

Just my take on it only.

Good question though, DNA is listed in the Discovery for all 4 Wagners and we do not know whose DNA it is. It could even be the Wagner's DNA for all we know.

In my opinion if it is the Wagner's DNA it could simply be the DNA they submitted to BCI during the investigation, or submitted after their arrests.

So, are you saying Prosecutor Canepa is being dishonest?

Why have none of the other defense attorneys asked if the DNA in evidence belonged to their clients?

JMO, I think they would have done so, if their client's DNA was not retrieved at one of the crime scenes.

The indictments also mention video and trail camera evidence belonging to the victims as being part of the evidence against the Wagners. It was listed in the indictments of all 4. That will be pretty bad if they're all on camera going to the crime scene and their DNA is present, too.

 

[Cool Cats]

CC do you think it could be Hannah Gilley and the other Rhodens found somewhere else not at the crime scene???? JMO

I have no clue about the DNA in evidence, was just giving an opinion about it.

Jake's hearing is this week but will probably be short if they are not arguing his motions. There are important motions to throw out incriminating evidence that still haven't been argued.

If his attorneys could get the shoe print and ballistics thrown out he could walk I think. Shoe print and ballistics is overwhelming evidence in my opinion.