Found Deceased CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #13

[RANCH]

Good Info to revisit IMO

@sroad post from thread 2, post #687
OR MEDIA THREAD, page 2

CA - CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #2

 

[NervousNellie]

Good Info to revisit IMO

@sroad post from thread 2, post #687
OR MEDIA THREAD, page 2

I believe this is the referred post.

CA - CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #2

 

[1&2&3]

I am very grateful and relieved that Barbara Thomas has been found. May her family and loved ones be blessed that they can bring her home for a proper burial.

The nagging thought for me is if BT was starting to feel signs of too much sun/heat when she went ahead of RT, it is doubtful she walked very far before collapsing.
Add to the fact that she may have been perturbed with RT for taking so long photographing, so she walked off in a huff. If she was already feeling light headed, adding anger to it would speed up her blood pressure. She is walking faster, getting more dehydrated, and not thinking clearly by now. No way she walked any distance! What really happened? There is more to this story.

I was hit with heat stroke last summer and within 12-15 minutes the sky was swirling, I could not hold my head up, nauseous, and felt like fainting. It came on in a flash. I am in good health, use to the atrocious summer heat and humidity, but something went wrong this day. That is why I say, if Barbara was beginning to feel symptoms, she didn’t make it far. And she had already been out in the heat for a good amount of time.

 

[RANCH]

I think it's possible that Barbara made it at least couple miles away from the RV before succumbing to heatstroke and therefore made it much harder for searchers to discover her. JMO

 

[Lilibet]

The nagging thought for me is if BT was starting to feel signs of too much sun/heat when she went ahead of RT, it is doubtful she walked very far before collapsing.
Add to the fact that she may have been perturbed with RT for taking so long photographing, so she walked off in a huff. If she was already feeling light headed, adding anger to it would speed up her blood pressure. She is walking faster, getting more dehydrated, and not thinking clearly by now. No way she walked any distance! What really happened? There is more to this story.

You could be right and I’m really glad you survived your heatstroke! But I wouldn’t go so far as to say it’s impossible that she walked a distance beyond the search zone. We have to make a lot of assumptions to say that. We don’t know that she was feeling the effects of too much sun and heat when she went ahead (she may have just needed to use the RV bathroom) and we don’t that she was perturbed when she went on ahead. She may have only become upset if/when she couldn’t find the key. Being upset is just a theory that might explain why she kept walking and might not have responded to RT calling her name. I still think it’s possible that he took longer taking his photo than he thinks he did, which would affect his timeline.

So if she didn’t become upset (assuming she did) until she left the RV, and wasn’t yet feeling the effect of the heat, she could have walked a couple of miles or so before succumbing to heat, snake bite, medical event or whatever. She wasn’t found by SAR within the search zone. So either she got beyond it in the several hours before the search started or was missed by searchers. Now that her remains have been found, we know she was there, but we don’t know exactly where she was found. How she got to wherever she was found is the mystery...on her own or with “help.” On her own makes sense to me until further notice.
JMO

I think it's possible that Barbara made it at least couple miles away from the RV before succumbing to heatstroke and therefore made it much harder for searchers to discover her. JMO

Although 15-20 minutes is the average time to walk a mile, for someone her age and in those conditions it could take up to 30 minutes...just guessing. So in an hour, she could go two miles and in two hours (if the heat didn’t affect her badly) she could walk four miles. I looked through the media thread to see if I could find the size of the search area, but came up empty. But at the time the search was called off I remember thinking she could have gotten beyond that area, so I must have known at some point how much area they searched.

Although we assume she may have been dehydrated, I recall that our fifth wheel had an outside water faucet. So she could have accessed water there. Most RVers don’t travel with totally empty water tanks in case they have to dry camp without hookups.

 

[RANCH]

You could be right and I’m really glad you survived your heatstroke! But I wouldn’t go so far as to say it’s impossible that she walked a distance beyond the search zone. We have to make a lot of assumptions to say that. We don’t know that she was feeling the effects of too much sun and heat when she went ahead (she may have just needed to use the RV bathroom) and we don’t that she was perturbed when she went on ahead. She may have only become upset if/when she couldn’t find the key. Being upset is just a theory that might explain why she kept walking and might not have responded to RT calling her name. I still think it’s possible that he took longer taking his photo than he thinks he did, which would affect his timeline.

So if she didn’t become upset (assuming she did) until she left the RV, and wasn’t yet feeling the effect of the heat, she could have walked a couple of miles or so before succumbing to heat, snake bite, medical event or whatever. She wasn’t found by SAR within the search zone. So either she got beyond it in the several hours before the search started or was missed by searchers. Now that her remains have been found, we know she was there, but we don’t know exactly where she was found. How she got to wherever she was found is the mystery...on her own or with “help.” On her own makes sense to me until further notice.
JMO



Although 15-20 minutes is the average time to walk a mile, for someone her age and in those conditions it could take up to 30 minutes...just guessing. So in an hour, she could go two miles and in two hours (if the heat didn’t affect her badly) she could walk four miles. I looked through the media thread to see if I could find the size of the search area, but came up empty. But at the time the search was called off I remember thinking she could have gotten beyond that area, so I must have known at some point how much area they searched.

Although we assume she may have been dehydrated, I recall that our fifth wheel had an outside water faucet. So she could have accessed water there. Most RVers don’t travel with totally empty water tanks in case they have to dry camp without hookups.

One square mile is 640 acres. That's a lot of land to search every piece of for a body.

Square mile - Wikipedia

 

[Cherwell]

From the link:
Details of Disappearance
[..]
In November 2020, Thomas's body was found in the desert near Essex, California. Her death is under investigation.

I don't think that means anything. They haven't got the detail that she was found off Kelbaker Road, which narrowed it down a lot from "in the desert near Essex".

 

[cocomod]

Here in Utah, several years ago there was a 2 year old that wandered off who was left sleeping in pajamas in a truck. It took a week to find his body (he died of hypothermia). He was found miles from the truck even though it was bitter cold and he didn’t have shoes on. You never know how far someone can wander even in extreme circumstances.

 

[Curiousobserver]

That's assuming you have all your senses working as they should. Might be different if your brain was scrambled by the heat.

One thing I've wondered. Are there ever mirages in the Mojave? Could she have thought she'd seen something interesting and headed towards something illusory?

You don't even have to envision getting lost. She may have fallen and hit her head, or had a heart attack or any number of other urgent medical issues.

 

[SuzDuJour]

While we know she drinking a beer during the walk, we don’t know how many she had before the walk. That amount could also affect her hydration and ability to find her way around.

 

[anneg]

A sad but interesting story about a German family who died in Death Valley who were not found after an extensive search until hikers found them 13 years later.

Death Valley bones linked to German tourists

Thanks, Ranch. I read about this some time ago after someone posted a link. If you search for "Death Valley Germans," there are a lot of stories online. I read a few, including:
The Hunt for the Death Valley Germans
[a long article but very interesting to read]

The Hunt for The Death Valley Germans - Companion Reading — Jay Penner Books
[this one is a followup and includes helpful maps]

A Websleuths thread: CA - CA - Egbert Rimkus (dec'd), Cornelia Meyer, & 2 kids, Death Valley, 26 July 1996

 

[K9Enzo]

I know better than to say someone could not get lost from where they went missing from.

There are so many factors of the missing person to consider (health condition prior to the event, knowledge of the area, what the person ate or drank that day, what supplies they had on them, ect.).

I took one of my younger dogs on a casual walk at our local park, well marked maintained gravel trail, wide open parking lot, a two mile flat loop. There was a women who asked me where the parking lot was. She seemed embarrassed to ask, I pointed then offered to have her walk out me with me. She didn't want to bother me. I have a good way of casually talking to hikers and asking questions to gauge alertness when I'm concerned, by doing this she naturally walked out with me and my dog. I think she would have figured it out but who knows... IMO

 

[PommyMommy]

CA - CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #2
The search area was marked with flagging for several square miles.

 

[al66pine]

Criminal Investigation?

Barbara Thomas – The Charley Project
Last updated December 27, 2020; case resolved.

@mlhenn bbm. Thx for your post and link.

IIUC, The Charley Project's "resolved" status = BT is no longer missing, iow, remains were identified as hers.
IIUC, that stmt does not reflect status/nature of LE's current investigation, i.e., criminal or non-criminal.

LE's Dec 18 NIXLE stmt says "cause of death is pending"* and
"INCIDENT: Missing Person/Death Investigation"* bbm Before Dec. 18, did <-- say "Missing Person" only?

Does anyone recall --- before Dec 18, did SBSD characterize case as:
- anything other than "Missing Person"?*
- "Death Investigation" (LE phrasing in Dec. 18 update)?*
- "criminal investigation" which LE did not say in Dec 18 update?*
Thx in adv.

________________________________________________
* INCIDENT: Missing Person/Death Investigation
"UPDATE – December 18, 2020
On November 27, 2020 two people were hiking in a field off Kelbaker Road when they discovered human remains. On November 28th a further search was conducted, and additional bones and evidence was recovered.
The remains have been positively identified as Barbara Thomas. The cause of death is pending.
No other details are available for release at this time."
^ http://nixle.us/CE3JA

 

[rosesfromangels]

...

Criminal Investigation?
@mlhenn bbm. Thx for your post and link.

IIUC, The Charley Project's "resolved" status = BT is no longer missing, iow, remains were identified as hers.
IIUC, that stmt does not reflect status/nature of LE's current investigation, i.e., criminal or non-criminal.

LE's Dec 18 NIXLE stmt says "cause of death is pending"* and
"INCIDENT: Missing Person/Death Investigation"* bbm Before Dec. 18, did <-- say "Missing Person" only?

Does anyone recall --- before Dec 18, did SBSD characterize case as:
- anything other than "Missing Person"?*
- "Death Investigation" (LE phrasing in Dec. 18 update)?*
- "criminal investigation" which LE did not say in Dec 18 update?*
Thx in adv.

________________________________________________
* INCIDENT: Missing Person/Death Investigation
"UPDATE – December 18, 2020
On November 27, 2020 two people were hiking in a field off Kelbaker Road when they discovered human remains. On November 28th a further search was conducted, and additional bones and evidence was recovered.
The remains have been positively identified as Barbara Thomas. The cause of death is pending.
No other details are available for release at this time."
^ http://nixle.us/CE3JA

"Last updated December 27, 2020; case resolved."
As you point out, "case resolved" as of yesterday. I wouldn't expect any further info will be made available to the public as this is not a criminal case.

RIP Dear Lady.
Condolences to her Robbie.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[LAhiker]

...

"Last updated December 27, 2020; case resolved."
As you point out, "case resolved" as of yesterday. I wouldn't expect any further info will be made available to the public as this is not a criminal case.

RIP Dear Lady.
Condolences to her Robbie.

Amateur opinion and speculation

As far as I can tell, "case resolved" on that site means that the person or their remains have been found. The cause of death is still pending. We don't know whether further information will be made available or not.

JMO

 

[anneg]

...

"Last updated December 27, 2020; case resolved."
As you point out, "case resolved" as of yesterday. I wouldn't expect any further info will be made available to the public as this is not a criminal case.

RIP Dear Lady.
Condolences to her Robbie.

Amateur opinion and speculation

Thanks, Roses. Condolences also to Robert's sister and niece, who were evidently close to Barbara, and other relatives on RT's side of the family...and to her son and his family, the VI and his family, and other relatives and friends who are grieving the loss of this beautiful and vibrant woman.

I'm so glad she was found. May she rest in peace.

 

[BlisseMai]

Wow. I heard about this a week after she went missing in July 2019. I had no idea she was found deceased until finding her case resolved on The Charley Project.

I read the most recent messages and apparently a cause of death has not been released yet. Hopefully we know soon, RIP.

 

[oceanstarryeyes]

How far was she found from where the motorhome was parked?

 

[oceanstarryeyes]

Some good maps. Maps & Brochures - Mojave National Preserve (U.S. National Park Service)