Found Deceased Spain - Esther Dingley, from UK, missing in the Pyrenees, November 2020 #3

[RickshawFan]

This is a really good point!!! Their videos do show them just using any kind of shelter they might run into. I wonder if the investigators checked odd places on the trails. If you watch the videos they spent one night in a place where they cannot even stand up....looks like a child’s playhouse.

I suppose that would be another example of "trusting in the universe to provide", similar to the discussions about food upthread.

It also suggests they didn't like to use their tent and went out of their way so as not to have to. This reluctance might have played a role in this case.

 

[otto]

I would like to correct/modify something I posted upthread.

I understood that Esther and her partner both graduated from Oxford, Esther in Economics and Management, 2001, and Dan Colgate in Chemistry. I saw somewhere that she put her life on hold so that he has a PhD. I could not find his publication on Google Scholar.

If he has a PhD, even if his work was never published, that could have changed the relationship balance in terms of who made decisions, or how Esther felt about her decision making ability.

Her partner favours kidnapped over voluntary disappearance simply because voluntary disappearance without a trace suggests that she has a reason for secretly escaping.

 

[RedHaus]

SBM I'm not good with these trail maps, but is that the trail that dips into France. I know, but I understand the SAR searched thoroughly away from the trails too. I know you have looked into all of this really well. Don't let me take you backwards, but some might feel a fresh look is worth it.

Hi patCee. Here is a map I had put together marking the route ED took on 22/11 up to summit of Pic de Sauvegarde and then her stated (to DC) route into France via Port de Vanesque. In this version I added an approximate border.

ETA: I should clarify that this is a bit of an interpolation of the route that ED / DC depicted in that picture we have from the dossier. My interpolation is that ED may have intended on returning via the Port de Vanesque... but the route in the dossier pic has ED returning via Port de Glere (both are on this map). That may be mute if she aborted her hike on 22/11 and returned to Banasque or never made it past the Pic de Sauvegarde or beyond the Refuge de Vanesque...

 

[Puzzles]

...Maybe the moderators could give us a bit of a hand and warn us when we are getting too carried away, before we overstep any marks - can they do that?

SBM

Her partner favours kidnapped over voluntary disappearance simply because voluntary disappearance without a trace suggests that she has a reason for secretly escaping.

Snipped and BBM
Hi otto, this statement unfortunately has an air of confidence that belies it being solely your opinion.

 

[otto]

I think she meant dipping into France properly i.e. to go to a shop or village. Proper French France with French people and things - the mountains probably feel a bit state-less! I am pretty sure that even being a basic French speaker she knew the “refuge de” would be in France.

Does "dipping into France" mean hike to the Hospice de France? That seems a bit far fetched given that dipping into France is the same as crossing the Port de Venasque.

I'm guessing that Esther was aware of the France/Spain border, especially since she crossed the France/Spain border to avoid covid regulations.

Even if she knew that the refuge was in France, why was she talking about dipping into France after the Refuge de Venasque and why didn't she book online?

I'm going to give the benefit of the doubt that Esther and her partner, who relied on cabins, refuges and hostels for the last 6 years, would never miss a payment when staying overnight. Why is there no sign of Esther at the refuge yet her partner is directing SAR farther down the trail?

 

[otto]

Did they, ED and DC, usually pay or were they more into ‘ninja camping’ in someone’s barn, shed etc? At least that’s the impression I get from their videos on YouTube/Facebook. So should we expect her to sign in if she was in the refuge?

I have to believe that a financially secure couple from the UK making use of refuges, hostels and cabins for 6 years are playing fair and paying their way even with the honour system.

 

[otto]

But if we assume that, then she would have had cell service for her ph0ne. I wonder why they presumed she had gotten that far?

Wishful thinking. Just like the map in the dossier, it starts at the refuge, but her last known contact was at the Pic de Sauvegarde. It's almost as though that part of the trip, from the Pic de Sauvegarde to the Port de Venasque to the Refuge de Venasque, should be left alone, ignored.

 

[otto]

SBM
Snipped and BBM
Hi otto, this statement unfortunately has an air of confidence that belies it being solely your opinion.

Her partner favours kidnapping - perhaps I should have framed it "third party involvement."

January 9

"Mr Colegate told the newspaper ... 'A third person being involved is the only other viable alternative.'"
​

Boyfriend of Briton who vanished in Pyrenees rubbishes claim she was unhappy in their relationship | Daily Mail Online[/QUOTE]

 

[BobbleBob]

I'm going to give the benefit of the doubt that Esther and her partner, who relied on cabins, refuges and hostels for the last 6 years, would never miss a payment when staying overnight. Why is there no sign of Esther at the refuge yet her partner is directing SAR farther down the trail?

SBM and BBM

Perhaps DC’s confidence comes from seeing a payment ED’s made for the refuge on their bank account? It’s one of the many bits of missing/not shared information in this case.

Making a payment to stay there for the night would show the intention to stay there at least.

 

[Inspectormotive]

Perhaps no signing of book in refuge because of the French lockdown. Would you leave an easy paper trail if you thought you may be fined for breaking lockdown? I know I wouldn't.

 

[patCee]

Hi patCee. Here is a map I had put together marking the route ED took on 22/11 up to summit of Pic de Sauvegarde and then her stated (to DC) route into France via Port de Vanesque. In this version I added an approximate border.

Thank you RedHaus, that makes sense to me now I was never clear about the border. When driving I can read maps all over the country and beyond, but the trail maps lost me.

 

[patCee]

Wishful thinking. Just like the map in the dossier, it starts at the refuge, but her last known contact was at the Pic de Sauvegarde. It's almost as though that part of the trip, from the Pic de Sauvegarde to the Port de Venasque to the Refuge de Venasque, should be left alone, ignored.

That is interesting and highlights my brain fog re the trail maps. I couln't see the Pic de S in context of the refuge and Port de Venasque. It may have been clearer on some posters maps and I missed them. The map RedHaus marked gives me the border, with the Pic de S, and the perspective I needed.

 

[patCee]

SBM and BBM

Perhaps DC’s confidence comes from seeing a payment ED’s made for the refuge on their bank account? It’s one of the many bits of missing/not shared information in this case.

Making a payment to stay there for the night would show the intention to stay there at least.

I think SAR would have mentioned that and been more confident ED stayed there, or definitely intended to, if a payment had been made.

 

[patCee]

Perhaps no signing of book in refuge because of the French lockdown. Would you leave an easy paper trail if you thought you may be fined for breaking lockdown? I know I wouldn't.

Also DC stated there was no signing in book there, IIRC.

 

[PeggyHenry]

I remember reading (can’t recall source) that Esther had informed the Spanish relevant body that she would be hiking in the area for a while. I’m not sure whether this was a requirement, simply good hiking practice, or because she felt it would be beneficial for her should some sort of accident occur.
If she did this, then at least it indicates that she was thinking ahead and mindful of her well-being to some degree. I’m not sure when she did this though... how early in her expedition. This element of foresight and planning could arguably be perceived as slightly at odds with her ‘food provision’ planning though ..

 

[Quietey]

Not read all the above posts yet, but stumbled across this (not sure whether it has been mentioned before), which further confirms Esther's accomplishments and talents:

Esther’s the image of a winner

 

[axelcruze]

If she has fallen, as experienced searchers surely must be indication when they checked area of a fall or an item that fell from her pack or quick thinking from ED to deliberately leave a trace on fall. Alternatively she doubt want to be found. If she is not in the mountains I.e mountain kidnap (imo v unlikely), or if voluntary disappearance or village kidnap (parking lot), then surely there will be CCTV of ED or suspicious vehicle or even just checking reg plates and bits of straightforward detective work in local surrounding villages may indicate something. I'm sure they would have done the latter with no results, so they have now looked at state of mind and the relationship psychology. Also on the previous academic status, I can testify that having PhD and MAs mean very little in academic life if you have been outside of that profession for 10 years. Lots of PhDs working in Supermarkets for example.

 

[stmarysmead]

I spent last night watching Dan and Esther’s videos again..from their 80 day trek this summer. What a cheerful happy couple! What awe-inspiring views from seemingly the top of the world! They are so joyful ...in their element, so far from the troubles of the world below, suffering from a deadly pandemic and crushing lockdowns. Their only concerns seem to be where to place their foot next. The world below does not exist when all one must think about is securing the next safe step on a mountaintop.

But far below those mountain tops, the social and economic ravages of the pandemic are taking a secondary toll. I googled ‘suicide and Covid-19” and found a plethora of articles that were chilling. But, IMO, it appears as long as Esther is moving, high above the worlds problems, she can contain the fears and anxieties that beset her ...hold depression at bay...with the distraction of DAILY “adventure!” Its a “Child at Disneyland Life”IMO.

But she cannot stay up there forever.

“When I drift into seriousness and become goal oriented is when the joy goes and the fears take hold. ‘Esther May 16, 2020

Books being written, lockdown, REAL life. Esther is grounded...but..

But soon, despite lockdowns, they are off on an 80 day trek and Esther seems gleeful again in all their videos. But once home, it doesn’t take long...about three weeks later...

On October 19, Esther posts on her public FB...

Oct 19__’going thru a difficult spell again with some deep self searching needed.” We are not invading her diary here..this is a public post.

She is quoting Alex Boye lyrics..’stretched out like a rubber band, stressed out like a working man All I need is a helping hand. A little care from someone who loves me.” I wonder what was occurring in regard to the publicity that would be coming from the BBC? Was Dan soliciting interviews in order to sell their books? Did it make her feel like “a working man” again? Was it too ‘goal-oriented?’

Two days later, she leaves. Supposedly, just for a few days. Then repeated promises to come home...but she keeps extending. Then she disappears.

IMO...Esther is not living somewhere and making a new life. But IMO she could be one of those individuals whose mental health issues were pushed to the brink due to the pandemic. I think Esther and Dan had a beautiful love story. As much as he could, he enabled her need to be in a mountaintop world of just the two of them. But Covid has overturned everyone’s lives and stretched coping abilities.

Like Esther, I sometimes relate to song lyrics. Watching Esther in the videos, I thought of the lyric from “Starry starry night”...”The world was never meant for one as beautiful as you.”

 

[patCee]

I spent last night watching Dan and Esther’s videos again..from their 80 day trek this summer. What a cheerful happy couple! What awe-inspiring views from seemingly the top of the world! They are so joyful ...in their element, so far from the troubles of the world below, suffering from a deadly pandemic and crushing lockdowns. Their only concerns seem to be where to place their foot next. The world below does not exist when all one must think about is securing the next safe step on a mountaintop.

But far below those mountain tops, the social and economic ravages of the pandemic are taking a secondary toll. I googled ‘suicide and Covid-19” and found a plethora of articles that were chilling. But, IMO, it appears as long as Esther is moving, high above the worlds problems, she can contain the fears and anxieties that beset her ...hold depression at bay...with the distraction of DAILY “adventure!” Its a “Child at Disneyland Life”IMO.

But she cannot stay up there forever.

“When I drift into seriousness and become goal oriented is when the joy goes and the fears take hold. ‘Esther May 16, 2020

Books being written, lockdown, REAL life. Esther is grounded...but..

But soon, despite lockdowns, they are off on an 80 day trek and Esther seems gleeful again in all their videos. But once home, it doesn’t take long...about three weeks later...

On October 19, Esther posts on her public FB...

Oct 19__’going thru a difficult spell again with some deep self searching needed.” We are not invading her diary here..this is a public post.

She is quoting Alex Boye lyrics..’stretched out like a rubber band, stressed out like a working man All I need is a helping hand. A little care from someone who loves me.” I wonder what was occurring in regard to the publicity that would be coming from the BBC? Was Dan soliciting interviews in order to sell their books? Did it make her feel like “a working man” again? Was it too ‘goal-oriented?’

Two days later, she leaves. Supposedly, just for a few days. Then repeated promises to come home...but she keeps extending. Then she disappears.

IMO...Esther is not living somewhere and making a new life. But IMO she could be one of those individuals whose mental health issues were pushed to the brink due to the pandemic. I think Esther and Dan had a beautiful love story. As much as he could, he enabled her need to be in a mountaintop world of just the two of them. But Covid has overturned everyone’s lives and stretched coping abilities.

Like Esther, I sometimes relate to song lyrics. Watching Esther in the videos, I thought of the lyric from “Starry starry night”...”The world was never meant for one as beautiful as you.”

I couldn't snip as the whole is so valuable.
Profound - an astute observation of clear patterns relating to EDs needs and difficulties with pandemic/general life. With thoughtful, if ominous, pointers for the potential outcome here. IMO

 

[RedHaus]

I spent last night watching Dan and Esther’s videos again..from their 80 day trek this summer. What a cheerful happy couple! What awe-inspiring views from seemingly the top of the world! They are so joyful ...in their element, so far from the troubles of the world below, suffering from a deadly pandemic and crushing lockdowns. Their only concerns seem to be where to place their foot next. The world below does not exist when all one must think about is securing the next safe step on a mountaintop.

But far below those mountain tops, the social and economic ravages of the pandemic are taking a secondary toll. I googled ‘suicide and Covid-19” and found a plethora of articles that were chilling. But, IMO, it appears as long as Esther is moving, high above the worlds problems, she can contain the fears and anxieties that beset her ...hold depression at bay...with the distraction of DAILY “adventure!” Its a “Child at Disneyland Life”IMO.

But she cannot stay up there forever.

“When I drift into seriousness and become goal oriented is when the joy goes and the fears take hold. ‘Esther May 16, 2020

Books being written, lockdown, REAL life. Esther is grounded...but..

But soon, despite lockdowns, they are off on an 80 day trek and Esther seems gleeful again in all their videos. But once home, it doesn’t take long...about three weeks later...

On October 19, Esther posts on her public FB...

Oct 19__’going thru a difficult spell again with some deep self searching needed.” We are not invading her diary here..this is a public post.

She is quoting Alex Boye lyrics..’stretched out like a rubber band, stressed out like a working man All I need is a helping hand. A little care from someone who loves me.” I wonder what was occurring in regard to the publicity that would be coming from the BBC? Was Dan soliciting interviews in order to sell their books? Did it make her feel like “a working man” again? Was it too ‘goal-oriented?’

Two days later, she leaves. Supposedly, just for a few days. Then repeated promises to come home...but she keeps extending. Then she disappears.

IMO...Esther is not living somewhere and making a new life. But IMO she could be one of those individuals whose mental health issues were pushed to the brink due to the pandemic. I think Esther and Dan had a beautiful love story. As much as he could, he enabled her need to be in a mountaintop world of just the two of them. But Covid has overturned everyone’s lives and stretched coping abilities.

Like Esther, I sometimes relate to song lyrics. Watching Esther in the videos, I thought of the lyric from “Starry starry night”...”The world was never meant for one as beautiful as you.”

Well done, stmarysmead, there is a pattern here I'd agree, and a very sad one at that.

The lyrics that come to my mind for ED is Pearl Jam's Just Breathe by Eddie Vedder. He apparently wrote this song based on the instrumental soundtrack he wrote for Into the Wild. To me it speaks to a gentle soul trying to survive in the world.
Just Breathe Lyrics