ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 61

[10ofRods]

I think when it was found not to have a license plate on the front, that was a big break. Eliminated cars with WA and ID plates so that narrowed the number of possible vehicles considerably.

Very good point.

 

[NottaYutz]

Because that's the exact time the dog started barking; he was upstairs, and his owner was upstairs. It makes no sense to me for Murphy to remain silent while the killer was butchering his owner and her bff only to start barking later when he was downstairs butchering other people.

Dogs have excellent hearing and an even better developed sense of smell. How far away can dogs smell and hear?

MOO: It's possible that when the dog caught a thick scent of blood, frantic barking began then.

 

[Sakura2Sophia4Lucia]

I found John Wayne Gacy's brain under study:

Scientists look at infamous serial killer's brain in search for explanation

The shrunken, sliced brain of serial killer John Wayne Gacy has been preserved in a Ziploc bag since his execution 15 years ago.

www.wmbfnews.com

It was preserved and was no longer its initial dimensions, but the brain morphology was still there. However, at the time of its dissection, science didn't have the powerful techniques it has now for looking deep into the neurons, so it wasn't very helpful.

Scientists use the next best thing (S.P.E.C.T. analysis, which is a kind of MRI). And there, we do find differences between serial killers (usually in prison for life or on death row, they consent to these studies) and the rest of us.

Ted Bundy's brain was given over for study, but I can't find anything scholarly published about it (or in reputable newspapers, for that matter). If anyone finds anything, please post. What they did find, of course, was that MRI and other brain scans showed an abnormal brain (it's probably the physiology as much as the anatomy and things like S.P.E.C.T. can help figure that out - we didn't have S.P.E.C.T. back then, but there were CAT-Scans and maybe MRI's (not sure).

Here's an article on what the scanning data seem to show:

Scientists look at infamous serial killer's brain in search for explanation

The shrunken, sliced brain of serial killer John Wayne Gacy has been preserved in a Ziploc bag since his execution 15 years ago.

www.wmbfnews.com

The actual academic literature on this topic just gets bigger every year. Right pre-frontal cortex, hippocampus and the amygdala all seem to operate differently in the convicted killers (and for the last two structures, the differences are very small on gross examination, but show up when the brain is in action).

Quite interesting that the right pre-frontal cortex, hippocampus and the amygdala seem to operate differently in the convicted killers.

I'll look for some scholarly articles on this topic.

After BCK's purported heroin use and recovery, when he came back to his senior year in high school, some people reported that he had lost a significant amount of weight (one person said he lost100 lbs) and was overtly mean and aggressive.

When you're an addict as a teen, your emotional growth is permanently stunted at the age when you began your addiction.

Often adults who were teenage addicts struggle with problems with their education, occupations and relationships.

People who were addicts in their adolescence often have a problem learning, planning and making decisions, which is evident in BK's poor planning and flawed decision-making in this horrific crime.

MOO

 

[JohnBull]

Thank you for clarifying!

Which is perhaps why the affidavit states "approximately" instead of giving it as a definite time.

 

[SharonNeedles]

IMO BK knows someone who lives nearby?

I definitely think so.

 

[Helechawagirl]

That would be a better bet for him (there are youtubes on how to dismember and clean deer).

He is supposed to be an extreme vegan, but maybe he did want to know more about the interiors of non-human animals.

I personally think the skills he gained in boxing/kickboxing transfer readily to using a knife. While I don't practice with a knife, I do carry one as personal defense in my car. I watched some military and other training videos. The key to using this style of knife for someone like me (not strong), is to use the saber grip and then one's body weight (no need to have strong arms although strong hands helps). USMC teaches its marines to lean into the target, using body weight, so that even my relatively tiny Marine cousin is able to dispatch someone with a KaBar knife. Momentum and body weight. Just like boxing.

Mr. G described a pattern of wounds on KG that is mentioned in the article posted on the last thread (and it has been posted several times). My personal view is that his "training" was entirely watching things online. He was probably so focused on which injuries would achieve his goals (silence and rapid death with no arterial blood spurt to get him overly soaked in blood) that he forgot his logistical issue (don't forget the sheath!)

I don’t think he practiced on animals—no need too—just had to know approximately where heart and lungs were located. The boxing training would have provided that knowledge or a simple anatomy diagram. JMO

 

[flowershop]

"ETA [Headline/byline]:

Bryan Kohberger was eager to make friends, neighbors say — and so chatty one sometimes dodged him​

Nate Schweber and Haven Orecchio-Egresitz Jan 10, 2023, 3:06 PM

PULLMAN, Washington — For residents who aren't undergrads bouncing between parties and Greek life, living in this college town can feel isolating.

So when Arun Dash, a 28-year-old engineering student at Washington State University, got a new downstairs neighbor in his Steptoe Village apartment complex in August, he understood why the stranger was eager to make friends.

Dash said Bryan Kohberger — who is now charged with brutally killing four students at the nearby University of Idaho in November — went out of his way to introduce himself and to try to make plans to hang out.

On December 30, when law-enforcement officials announced Kohberger as the man charged in the killings, the portrait of a loner — a gruff student of the criminal mind who kept to himself — began to form.

But interviews with Dash, his roommate, and others who casually knew Kohberger paint a different picture: one of a man who wasn't always introverted and could sometimes have an outgoing demeanor that left people feeling impressed or put off.

Popping in and out of Pullman coffee shops, dropping by local craft-beer establishments, and attempting to hang out with his neighbors — Kohberger didn't stand out as unhinged but rather as a sometimes chatty guy whose lengthy conversations might throw a wrench in his neighbors' days."

Bryan Kohberger was eager to make friends, neighbors say — and so chatty one sometimes dodged him

An article like this tells me he is capable of displaying endearing characteristics and then I wonder if he will be able to manipulate a jury.

 

[NottaYutz]

SO creepy! Do scientists ever study the brains of deceased serial and thrill killers? I ask because I have a family member who just always seemed a little off. He lived a normal life, but there was just something not quite right. When he was a young adult he was in a car accident and had to undergo brain surgery. During that surgery they found that part of his brain hadn’t developed properly, and it was an aha moment for all of us. (I don’t know specifics about what part of the brain or anything).
This kind of denial/gaslighting and complete lack of understanding social cues just makes me wonder what the heck is going on in that brain! I know that’s the million dollar question, and nobody knows. I am just curious if studying brains of these monsters is a thing that is done.
As an aside, I just learned recently there is a way to donate your brain for research, but you have to actively set it up while still alive b/c it has to be harvested immediately and it’s not included in regular organ donation that you sign up for. I am planning to do that because I have migraine disease. They need healthy brains as well as ones w/neurological disease. Just FYI for everyone.

Yes, studying their brains is done, and you may find this article very interesting. The Neuroscientist Who Discovered He Was a Psychopath

 

[Diogenetic]

I’m new here but have followed the threads intensely. The thing I wonder about is, how is it not one of them got off a loud scream, especially X?

People can be in such shock from an extremely shocking and frightening situation they are unable to make sound or even move. perhaps just sobbing. And if victim's stabbed in upper chest by a knife made to be lethal, and stabbed hard, my guess is victim may well e physically unable to make much of a sound at all. From what we know of this event it could have resulted in a lot of screaming -- or in none. I think neither case would be strange.

I do think it was likely the perp was surprised, to find one room, and then a second room, both occupied by two people. I think maybe why he stopped and left quickly. The data he had in front of him -- two people per room, and four rooms -- ; indicated he could have had to face down eight people, the last four more roused than the first four, more able to resist, more able to scream, and more likely to cause him injury, a well as cause him to leave evidence.

 

[Helechawagirl]

I recall that too, I'm sorry I don't remember. It was very early on, so either MPD or SG I'd guess.

It was a rumor on TikTok or Reddit—not confirmed yet. AFAIK

 

[aaron44]

I talk to myself and would definitely NOT describe myself as smart in any way lol

Yes I do, No I don't. Yes I do. There's someone in here but it ain't me.....

 

[Diogenetic]

Maybe he put his hand over her mouth and said “sssh… don’t say a word, I’m going to help you”. DM heard words partially to that effect. Then he may have just knifed her. Hate typing that.

Welcome to Websleuths!

Let's hope the prosecutors evoke that line at several times. It is chilling and utterly cold blooded.

 

[hopewell]

they say people who talk to themselves are of higher intelligence

As long as you don't answer yourself.

My opinion.

 

[SharonNeedles]

I don’t think he practiced on animals—no need too—just had to know approximately where heart and lungs were located. The boxing training would have provided that knowledge or a simple anatomy diagram. JMO

I'm personally don't think he had - or needed - any special training or knowledge.

 

[rsd1200]

I could be wrong (as I often am) but I don't think the camera in question is necessarily on the front of the house at 1112. And I don't think the time change is an issue. In the DVR setup, one simply sets the time zone and it changes automatically.

OP had questioned if someone's camera could be off on the time. I was just replying that it is possible. Is it? Yes. Would it matter? No.

ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 60

I think yours is an interesting theory and very plausible. My theory really is a bit silly, but I'll share it. I, too, do not think BCK has a very high opinion of himself. He had some problems growing up. Being overweight and bullied, visual snow issues (which sounds like like an absolutely...

www.websleuths.com

-----
OP had asked if there was a security camera on the back of the house;

ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 60

I think yours is an interesting theory and very plausible. My theory really is a bit silly, but I'll share it. I, too, do not think BCK has a very high opinion of himself. He had some problems growing up. Being overweight and bullied, visual snow issues (which sounds like like an absolutely...

www.websleuths.com

I think you and I are probably in agreement re; the security cam.

The front faces King Rd., and the entrance is on Queen. The audio that was picked up was less than 50' from X's Room, so if any surveillance audio was picked up in front of the home, it is unlikely to be the same audio discussed in Exhibit A.

"The security camera is less than 50' from the west wall of K's bedroom".

-----

I probably should have expanded, but was being lazy, instead of quoting and attaching Exhibit A. Unless I'm mistaken, this is 1112, which is the home that had the Surveillance camera that picked up the audio. I don't think a camera on the front of the house, facing King Road, would be within that distance and would be more likely to pick up something from in front of the 1112 King Rd address. So, I do believe that there was surveillance on the side or back of the home due to the measurement being 50' or less from X's west wall of her room.

photo link: Video Investigators still searching for suspect in murder of 4 Idaho college students

Exhibit A: https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case...it - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett-Payne.pdf

 

[Sakura2Sophia4Lucia]

I’m new here but have followed the threads intensely. The thing I wonder about is, how is it not one of them got off a loud scream, especially X?

they say people who talk to themselves are of higher intelligence, not sure he is a genius but he might be rather IQ smart and common sense dumb

Science Says People Who Talk To Themselves Are Geniuses - LifeHack

I talk a lot to myself. It helps me to keep my concentration on the activity on hand, makes me focus more on my studies, and gives me some pretty

www.lifehack.org

Let's go with this -- all of us who talk to ourselves are, in fact, geniuses! Cannot wait to tell my adult children!!

 

[wilsodh]

A man walked into my apartment one time, and I was so scared that I could barely get a breath, much less scream, so it wouldn't surprise me that much if no one let out a full-throated scream.

Sounds like a nightmare where you are trying to scream and wake up, but can't!

I’m new here but have followed the threads intensely. The thing I wonder about is, how is it not one of them got off a loud scream, especially X?

It's a reasonable question. If I were the killer intent on stealthy murder of sleeping victims using a knife, the first thing I'd probably do is slash throats for a quick bleed out and to inhibit sound. No single knife wound is likely to kill instantly, so the victim(s) came to, struggled for their lives briefly before bleeding out (defensive wounds), and they were unable to scream because of slashed tracheas.

It is still amazing there wasn't more sound!

 

[LonghornSpeakEasy]

I’ve been debating whether or not to tell this story ‘cause it’s really off-topic but the coincidence is just too bizarre to keep it to myself.

When I was in college in the late seventies, the fiancée of one of my sorority sisters was arrested for murdering his teenage neighbor. He strangled her to death and then stabbed her dead body over 30 times. At the time this occurred, it was my understanding that he had been found mentally incompetent to stand trial and sent to the prison hospital for the criminally insane in our state. It was creepy to me because I had actually met him once, walking across campus with her to a football game, and was impressed with how “cute” he was when (forgive me) she was definitely “not a catch in the looks department.” He was a senior at our large public university in a very demanding major and came across very normal, whatever that is, in that single interaction. I haven’t heard anything about him since then.

Fast forward to the present…this case made me think about him and I was curious as to what actually happened so I started doing some research. Newspaper articles from his trial did indicate that his attorneys used a defense based on psychological issues. He claimed that stress from his father’s recent death, difficulties he was having in school, his recent engagement, etc. combined with a preoccupation or fascination with a science fiction series that focused on the domination of women led him to disassociate or depersonalize and that he felt he was “outside himself watching someone else” commit the crime. The jury ultimately didn’t believe it and he was found guilty. He was sentenced to only 30 years, however. Evidently what I had previously heard about mental incompetence was the defense strategy, not the outcome.

Now for the coincidence…I looked him up in the Department of Corrections inmate locator for my state and he’s not there, which makes sense, of course, since it’s been more than 30 years (even without a reduction in his sentence for good behavior or parole). I continued to do some research, however, and ran across a post that one of the victim’s schoolmates had located his current whereabouts based on his FB account…he’s in BOISE, IDAHO!

 

[Miss Jennifer]

"He seemed really nervous," a police source who was involved in the process tells PEOPLE. "He was narrating to himself everything that was happening. At one point, he was saying something to himself like 'I'm fine, this is okay.' Like he was reassuring himself that this whole thing wasn't awful."

Idaho Murder Suspect Spoke About Slain Students During Extradition: 'It's Really Sad What Happened to Them'

Bryan Kohberger, 28, was arrested in Pennsylvania in connection with the killings of Ethan Chapin, Xana Kernodle, Madison Mogen, and Kaylee Goncalves

people.com

IMO, he's cubing. Excellent read about it here on BTK.

 

[Diogenetic]

I'm beginning to think that the mitigating evidence presented by BK's attorneys (in the death penalty phase of the proceedings) will lean heavily into a dissociative or depersonalization disorder. Interesting to read the above anecdotes and then read about the symptoms of such disorders. If BK was already experiencing depersonalization circa age 15, he's lived half of his life with this condition and with awareness of this condition.

Depersonalization-Derealization Disorder

We all feel a bit of detachment from the world sometimes. Find out when to seek help.

my.clevelandclinic.org

One noteworthy quote:

The difference between depersonalization and psychotic disorders is awareness. People with depersonalization disorder know the feelings of detachment are not real. People with a psychotic disorder believe their feelings are reality.

Without diagnosing from a web forum, if he has competent defense team, and does not himself resist bringing mental health into, we can't say it won't be evoked. In Idaho you can't plead "not guilty by reason of insanity" but the jury can find "guilty but insane" which has implications for his punishment. And if he had a heroin abuse issue, and did not kick it himself, but kicked it in treatment he may well have been diagnosed with OUD, then he will have had a DSM listed mental "disorder."