ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 71

[Nila Aella]

I wonder if he saw lights on in the house, so that’s why he kept driving around.

Sounds right.

If he saw a light on initially, why not wait longer so there is a greater chance they are sleeping deep? Maybe the lights were only on the first pass, so he waited 1/2 hour? And he didn't see the door dash. Just thinking while I type.

I also wonder about Xana. Would she turn a light on to go retrieve her food or to eat it?

JMO

 

[jepop]

Just jumping off your post b/c I wanted to point out he wasn't really parked at 4:04, he was still driving and trying to find a spot to park. Excellent point about the gas station three point turn, that shows he makes three point turns to change direction. Just thinking about it, I rarely do that. MOO

He drove by three times between 3:29 - ?. No road given, just that he leaves on Walenta. MOO

These sightings show Suspect Vehicle I makes an initial three passes by the 1122 King Road residence and then leave via Walenta Drive

According to the PCA, he entered the area a forth time at 4:04. He drove east King - turn, west King - attempted park/turn, three point turn at intersection, east on Queen, then presumably parked). JMO

Suspect Vehicle 1 can be seen entering the area a fourth time a approximalely 4:04 a.m. It can be seen driving eastbound on King Road, stopping and tuming around in front of 500 Queen Road #52 and then driving back westbound on King Road. When Suspect Vehicle I is in front of the King Road Residence, it appeared to unsuccessfully attempt to park or tum around in the road. The vehicle then continued to the intersection of Queen Road and King Road where it can be seen completing a three-point tum and then driving eastbound again down Queen Road.

The PCA also says Xana receives Door Dash approx 4. DM wakes approx 4 to dog playing. A short time later she hears Kaylee say "there's someone here." Then DM hears crying from Cara's room.

For me, the timeline doesn't fit with him being the one making the dog playing noise. I suppose that LE might just be purposefully vague in the PCA, but I also wonder if they really know specific times other than the Door Dash, car time stamps, tik tok, plus phone communication inside the house. JMO

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/122922 Affidavit - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett-Payne.pdf

DM's timing might be off re the dog playing sounds. Maybe that was at 4.07/4.08 and was either the sound of the dog moving in agitation in KG's room while the killer has just entered M's room , or some muffled sounds :-( coming from M's room whilst the dog is moving agitatedly around. Just ideas. MOO

ETA: I think the most approximate time stamps of all in the PCA relate to what DM heard from approximately 4am. The street video re arrival and departure of elantra and next door audio (4.17am thump,whimper, dog barking) are probably accurate to within a min IMO. The way Dylan's account of what she heard is worded makes me think it is probably deliberately vague to reflect her unceratinty re exact times, except that it was after 4am (after door dash). MOO

ETA: added "in KG's room"

 

[NCWatcher]

What does it exactly mean that "they need to do their own testing"?

Isn't testing done by Prosecution reliable or what?

Might be reliable, might not be. Just because a prosecution witness testifies the results of some test say X, that information cannot be assumed to be true. A defense team that accepts everything the prosecution experts claim to be true isn't a team I'd want to hire! Some people are liars, some people are incompetent and some people are both. Famous case-- Michael Peterson/Staircase Murders.

Michael Peterson - Crime Museum

On December 9th, 2001 in Durham, North Carolina, Kathleen Peterson died. According to the 911 call, she was found by her husband Michael Peterson at the bottom of a staircase in their home. He was soon charged with first degree murder, that it had not been a fall, but he had in fact beaten her…

www.crimemuseum.org

Peterson was found guilty of killing his wife & sentenced to Life but 8 years later he was granted a new trial because "the prosecution’s [longtime] Blood Spatter Analyst, Duane Deaver, was reporting false information, withholding information, and being inattentive in, not only Mr. Peterson’s case, but numerous other cases." (Some estimates said over 100 trials were tainted by this one witness.) Further the DNA testing requested by LE wasn't done. It was supposed to be done before spatter analysis. It wasn't & Deaver stored the clothing improperly so it could never be done.

There was an Alford Plea and Peterson got time served. (Judge later said he thought a 2nd trial would have not led to a conviction.)

So stuff does happen with prosecution witnesses. I'm glad BK's team seems to be on the ball.
JMO

 

[mooseandcoffee]

So why did he express hope to be "exonerated" if he has no proof of his supposed innocence?

It's been a week. It is going to take time for his team to work through all of the materials given to them.

 

[mooseandcoffee]

He could present:
- a cctv and his signature from a gym if he claimed he attended it that night
-a cctv and a receipt from a night store if he claimed he went there
- a statement from a friend if he claimed he visited this person that night
Etc, etc

A person can always prove one's innocence, provided it is true.

Wherever we go, we leave some traces.

As he left his at murder scene.

JMO

I don't think that every person is able to prove innocence, even if it's true. If I was home alone all night when I'm accused of doing something, I'm not sure how exactly I could prove that. It happens to people more than we want to believe.

 

[danablue1]

Sounds right.

If he saw a light on initially, why not wait longer so there is a greater chance they are sleeping deep? Maybe the lights were only on the first pass, so he waited 1/2 hour? And he didn't see the door dash. Just thinking while I type.

I also wonder about Xana. Would she turn a light on to go retrieve her food or to eat it?

JMO

I just can’t wrap my head around the fact that he was able to kill 4 people in such a relatively short period of time

 

[tysonm266]

Good morning all! I agree about the article containing questionable assertions about how trackable cell phones are. My family and I all use Life360 and I can tell you, it's pretty darned accurate. I tested it last night when Hubs stopped on the way home and it accurately told me what store he stopped at. I blew up the map and it also told me correctly, within a few yards, when he left the building.

Having said that, I still wonder whether the reporter accurately represented what Cell Phone Man said. Not a deliberate hash job by the reporter, but editors sometimes either deliberately stoke drama or they need to pay more attention. I once came home to scary messages on my answering machine (yes, that long ago) because my letter was edited to make it very inflammatory and no longer representative of what I meant. If Cell Phone Man's comments were abridged, they could give a different - or at least incomplete - message compared to what he actually said. Another unknown is whether the reporter fully understood the technical aspects of the discussion. If I had written an article about cars, we certainly couldn't count on me, LOL.

ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 70

I used other university's libraries when I was in college and grad school. Not every library system has access to the same databases. For a seminar paper I had to do for my undergraduate history degree, I spent all day at another college's library using their databases that were unavailable to...

www.websleuths.com

My family does the same and the accuracy is within a few feet, no question.

 

[mooseandcoffee]

But when you are officially told "you are under arrest" you must be read your Miranda rights.

People are questioned all the time about crimes and not read Miranda Rights. Look at YouTube and you see this all the time, cops interviewing people at their jobs, on the street, etc.... Suspecting them of a crime but not arresting them, not reading Miranda Rights. When you see them actually getting arrested they are always read their rights.

I had cops at my door questioning me and my kids because the car in our driveway matched the car a criminal had just used right after he had just robbed a local gas station. The cops made me wake up my sons so they could rule them out because they had the suspect's photo on camera.

I never heard a thing about Miranda Rights.

If he hadn't been Mirandized, we would have heard about that by now.

 

[tysonm266]

I don't think that every person is able to prove innocence, even if it's true. If I was home alone all night when I'm accused of doing something, I'm not sure how exactly I could prove that. It happens to people more than we want to believe.

I could show Ring data as well as wireless data on my router to corroborate my alibi

 

[mooseandcoffee]

Absolute coward

-Tormenting women by his creepy behaviour,

- harassing students, who had misfortune to have him as a TA, with unfair bad grading - showing off his"imagined superiority".

Argh!
I feel anger even writing this post

JMO

I am NOT defending this guy's actions by any means. However, I don't know if he realized how creepy or off-putting his behavior was. Maybe he did. Was he tormenting people by his behavior purposely? I don't know.

 

[Nova]

BBM.At this point, those are unknowns IMO.The PCA is silent on those questions. We can read the PCA, weigh the info, research door dash delivery etiquette/norms perhap?s and try to come to a position. Probably become much clearer as the proceedings proceed. MOO?

Isn't it odd that the Door Dash delivery time is left so vague in the PCA?

I live in a small enough city that nothing is very far away. I have never used an independent delivery service (nor have I tried Uber or Lyft).

But I would think there would be cell phone apps to keep precise track of pick ups and deliveries. Just as Domino's Pizza does--come to think of it: I have had pizzas delivered more times than I like to admit. Domino's tells me what time the pie goes into the oven, what time it comes out, when the driver picks it up and exactly when s/he delivers it to my door!

Not so with DD?

 

[Nova]

And if BK is convicted by a jury of his peers then I am sure it won't be a wrongful conviction. Sounds like a topic that should have it's own thread.

I think we covered it. Nobody was predicting a wrongful conviction in this case. We were just pushing back on the idea that innocent people should speak freely with the police. It's a personal choice, obviously, but not one that proves guilt or innocence.

Once upon a time I would have said, "Why not speak if you have nothing to hide?" But that was 1,049 true crime books and 3,448 episodes of DATELINE ago. (I'm being facetious about the exact numbers.)

 

[Nova]

I agree. It’s not always possible to prove an alibi. But I’d say it’s a lot easier now than an century before us. It’s almost impossible to not be tracked digitally or via video most hours of the day. Likewise, as we may see with this case (“may” because innocent until proven guilty), the digital footprint also results in most cases being solved these days as well.

I think that's all true of middle-class suburbanites. But my friend who is a federal appeals PD still has plenty of innocent clients. They usually live in poor neighborhoods and travel on foot, bike or skateboard; they and their neighbors don't have all the gadgets that people with more money have. And they are more likely to have been overcharged in their original trial, one reason for their appeals.

In the current case, of course, BK and the Idaho 4 are all middle-class suburbanites, so your post is right on point. I'm only posting here to remind us (myself included) that there is more than one way to live in the USA.

 

[jepop]

Isn't it odd that the Door Dash delivery time is left so vague in the PCA?

I live in a small enough city that nothing is very far away. I have never used an independent delivery service (nor have I tried Uber or Lyft).

But I would think there would be cell phone apps to keep precise track of pick ups and deliveries. Just as Domino's Pizza does--come to think of it: I have had pizzas delivered more times than I like to admit. Domino's tells me what time the pie goes into the oven, what time it comes out, when the driver picks it up and exactly when s/he delivers it to my door!

Not so with DD?

I think DD arrived at 4am and this was confirmed by LE via driver. MOO. People on other threads have said DD same as Dominoes et. al. with time stamps on phone apps. IOWs LE would have a precise time. Other people also suggested DD would be drop and run. MOO. The poster I responded to wanted to know which door of the house DD delivered to; slider or front and if X actually received if from the driver. LE pwould know that too via driver, IMO, but not important for PCA probably. Personally, I think DD was dropped at 4am or close enough (a minute either side) and X collected straight away from front door. I don't think BK entered the house until about 4.08am, and was just entering Queen Street as DD exited it. MOO

 

[Nova]

I wonder if he saw lights on in the house, so that’s why he kept driving around.

I can't know for sure, of course, but I imagine that is almost certainly the fact of the matter.

 

[Nova]

I think DD arrived at 4am and this was confirmed by LE via driver. MOO. People on other threads have said DD same as Dominoes et. al. with time stamps on phone apps. IOWs LE would have a precise time. Other people also suggested DD would be drop and run. MOO. The poster I responded to wanted to know which door of the house DD delivered to; slider or front and if X actually received if from the driver. LE pwould know that too via driver, IMO, but not important for PCA probably. Personally, I think DD was dropped at 4am or close enough (a minute either side) and X collected straight away from front door. I don't think BK entered the house until about 4.08am, and was just entering Queen Street as DD exited it. MOO

I trust you on cell tower pings and other matters of space and time.

FWIW, Domino's also has "contactless delivery" (at least here in CA) and they still know the precise time the pizza is left outside my front door. (As you suggest for DD, they can also tell me at which door the pizza is left.)

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

Isn't it odd that the Door Dash delivery time is left so vague in the PCA?

I live in a small enough city that nothing is very far away. I have never used an independent delivery service (nor have I tried Uber or Lyft).

But I would think there would be cell phone apps to keep precise track of pick ups and deliveries. Just as Domino's Pizza does--come to think of it: I have had pizzas delivered more times than I like to admit. Domino's tells me what time the pie goes into the oven, what time it comes out, when the driver picks it up and exactly when s/he delivers it to my door!

Not so with DD?

DD gives delivery time so police would have that information. IMO, they have a reason for not revealing it. Maybe DD driver also saw something they didn't need for the PCA and don't want to reveal yet. JMO.

 

[jepop]

I trust you on cell tower pings and other matters of space and time.

FWIW, Domino's also has "contactless delivery" (at least here in CA) and they still know the precise time the pizza is left outside my front door. (As you suggest for DD, they can also tell me at which door the pizza is left.)

Ah well, All of that is just my interp of studying and hypothesising around the PCA. BK wasn't pinging on the night on Queen ST. THe times are extrapolated from neighborhoood cameras and audio cameras. Feel like I've almost got a PHD in that PCA now! Aside, IMO, there is no way that LE don't know the exact time that DD was delivered, to what door, whether driver saw X and also what car the driver drove. Le would have interviewed driver and have footage of their car arriving and exiting Queen ST. Plus,as you say the digital data to confirm from X's phone and the driver's work phone! MOO

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

All of the above was shared MONTHS ago. On the day of the murders, in fact. The majority of what was shared was from sources who were 1 or 2 degrees separated from the people in the house. Most of the things shared have ended up in the PCA (DMs experience that night, discovery of Ethan's body) and this article. With the last remaining unreported tidbit being what BF recalled and where the two ended up sleeping that night.

Snipped and bolded by me for focus. Can you please point to where I can find what BF recalled and where they ended up sleeping? I didn't see it in the article.

 

[Boxer]

I agree. And one reason the house was idea is that it housed young women he could attack.

How did he find the house?