GUILTY NV - Yadira, 38, & Karla Martinez, 10, raped, murdered, Las Vegas, 15 April 2012

stillwatersc said:

I am thinking someone from a rival gym - someone with a bad attitude who was thrashed in a competition.

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I'd go there, if not for the rape and murder of the little girl. It takes a special kind of monster to do that. Someone with the personality of Joseph Duncan.

Ughhh!

MOO

Mel

I have been checking LV papers every day and nothing...what is going on here??

cluciano63 said:

I have been checking LV papers every day and nothing...what is going on here??

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BBM

I'm wondering the same thing. I've been searching online every day for more news, and nothing new.

I hate to be so cynical and awful, but under the circumstances some bad thoughts are going through my head, and it would be nice to see some information released that proves me wrong...

Fairy1 said:

This whole case is so bizarre. LE just left that house today - having been there since Monday. I just don't believe the father is the killer. He's terribly injured and the murder weapon hasn't been found.

http://www.lvrj.com/news/police-boy-didn-t-name-father-in-slaying-of-mother-sister-148004695.html

A 10-year-old girl who was beaten to death in a brutal double slaying this week also had been raped, sources said Wednesday.

Multiple law enforcement sources confirmed that Karla Martinez was raped and killed in her home sometime between Sunday morning and Monday morning.

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IMO the most telling statement is from this article

The 9-year-old boy, as well as a 4-year-old boy found at the bloody crime scene, were taken into custody by child welfare officials. A source said the shell-shocked children might have been in the home with their dead family members for more than 24 hours.

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If the deaths occurred more than 24 hours before, Mom and sis were dead.... father injured why would the kid not go for help earlier? Unless someone was preventing him from going. And if there was an intruder/killer that means the intruder/killer knew the father was alive. Why would an intruder/killer leave the father and son alive as witnesses? Why take a chance that the father/defender of the home would come after the intruder? That 24 hour period to me indicates that IMO father did it. He prevented the boy from going for help, probably while he cooked up a good story. When he thought he firgured it out, he sent the boy for help.

Yes father was injured too. But that could have been either a suicide attempt or self inflicted. Wouldn't be the first time a domestic inflicted their own injuries either in an attempt at suicide or to give some support to a story that someone else broke in a killed the family members. Or it could have been the result of the mother catching the father raping daughter. She could have gone after him with the hammer and he took it away from her then used it on her.

Kid knew when he went to the school that Mom and Sis were dead. So it was over by the time he left. He left the 4 year old at home, to me that indicates that likely father was concious when he left. Otherwise he would have taken the little brother with him.

IMO the story the father will give is an intruder, broke in tied him and boys up, raped the daughter, killed the mother and it took them that long to get free. But IMO the story the boy will tell is that father did it, father kept him from going for help.

However LE won't confirm that until they get some forensic testing done to prove it and until they can interview the father and the kids. They don't want defense attorney saying there was a rush to judgement and accusation.

There is one very remote possibility...... if they were in the country illegally, and if they had fallen behind on their payments to the smugglers it has been known for the smugglers to do similar crimes in order to send a message about what happens when you don't pay up. The smugglers try to make sure suspicion falls on father. But that is a pretty remote possibility.

Fairy1 said:

This whole case is so bizarre. LE just left that house today - having been there since Monday. I just don't believe the father is the killer. He's terribly injured and the murder weapon hasn't been found.

http://www.lvrj.com/news/police-boy-didn-t-name-father-in-slaying-of-mother-sister-148004695.html

A 10-year-old girl who was beaten to death in a brutal double slaying this week also had been raped, sources said Wednesday.

Multiple law enforcement sources confirmed that ********** was raped and killed in her home sometime between Sunday morning and Monday morning.

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I am curious why a 10 year old rape/murder victim is named in the story. [I have redacted her name because that's just my way of thinking] Is it because she is deceased? It just bothers me to read that. IMHO

mysteriew said:

IMO the most telling statement is from this article



If the deaths occurred more than 24 hours before, Mom and sis were dead.... father injured why would the kid not go for help earlier? Unless someone was preventing him from going. And if there was an intruder/killer that means the intruder/killer knew the father was alive. Why would an intruder/killer leave the father and son alive as witnesses? Why take a chance that the father/defender of the home would come after the intruder? That 24 hour period to me indicates that IMO father did it. He prevented the boy from going for help, probably while he cooked up a good story. When he thought he firgured it out, he sent the boy for help.

Yes father was injured too. But that could have been either a suicide attempt or self inflicted. Wouldn't be the first time a domestic inflicted their own injuries either in an attempt at suicide or to give some support to a story that someone else broke in a killed the family members. Or it could have been the result of the mother catching the father raping daughter. She could have gone after him with the hammer and he took it away from her then used it on her.

Kid knew when he went to the school that Mom and Sis were dead. So it was over by the time he left. He left the 4 year old at home, to me that indicates that likely father was concious when he left. Otherwise he would have taken the little brother with him.

IMO the story the father will give is an intruder, broke in tied him and boys up, raped the daughter, killed the mother and it took them that long to get free. But IMO the story the boy will tell is that father did it, father kept him from going for help.

However LE won't confirm that until they get some forensic testing done to prove it and until they can interview the father and the kids. They don't want defense attorney saying there was a rush to judgement and accusation.

There is one very remote possibility...... if they were in the country illegally, and if they had fallen behind on their payments to the smugglers it has been known for the smugglers to do similar crimes in order to send a message about what happens when you don't pay up. The smugglers try to make sure suspicion falls on father. But that is a pretty remote possibility.

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I wondered that myself; if it is done as an example to others of what could happen.

Jacie Estes said:

I am curious why a 10 year old rape/murder victim is named in the story. [I have redacted her name because that's just my way of thinking] Is it because she is deceased? It just bothers me to read that. IMHO

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Yes I am pretty sure she would not be named if she was still alive.

Children can be very heavy sleepers. Maybe the boys slept through all of it.

What a horrible, horrible crime! That little girl was so beautiful, sweet, and innocent looking. And her mother was pretty too. I wonder if someone tied up or held back the father and made him watch what happened to his wife and daughter before hitting him in the head. It would have to be a very vicious and angry person to do what was done to those people. I too wonder if the boys slept through the whole thing. Personally, I don't think the father did it. It seems like it was done by someone who wanted to get revenge against the family for some reason. I hope whoever did it is caught and punished.

this case is just too quiet for comfort. I wonder what's going on behind the scenes?

While this was a small gym and one dedicated to martial arts, when I think of gyms I think of steroids and when I think of steroids I think of 'roid rage and when I think of 'roid rage, I think of brutal beatings.

stillwatersc said:

Children can be very heavy sleepers. Maybe the boys slept through all of it.

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One of the articles I read said that authorities believed the murders had happened about 24 hours before. That is a long time to sleep. If they had been asleep when it happened, would they have got up seen their parents and sister and waited a while before going to the school?

mysteriew said:

One of the articles I read said that authorities believed the murders had happened about 24 hours before. That is a long time to sleep. If they had been asleep when it happened, would they have got up seen their parents and sister and waited a while before going to the school?

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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nez-horrific-Las-Vegas-crime-scene-loose.html

I can't find a quote about the 24 hours. It appears something was still going on early Monday morning - neighbors say they heard gunshots, a man yelling and a child crying (and they roll over & go back to sleep???). The boys could have been hiding and afraid to come out. The article also says the child was 'in shock'. I don't know how that would affect his actions or ability to think clearly. What happens to a person 'in shock'?

stillwatersc said:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nez-horrific-Las-Vegas-crime-scene-loose.html

I can't find a quote about the 24 hours. It appears something was still going on early Monday morning - neighbors say they heard gunshots, a man yelling and a child crying (and they roll over & go back to sleep???). The boys could have been hiding and afraid to come out. The article also says the child was 'in shock'. I don't know how that would affect his actions or ability to think clearly. What happens to a person 'in shock'?

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I found it in a couple of articles, here is one

The 9-year-old boy, as well as a 4-year-old boy found at the bloody crime scene, were taken into custody by child welfare officials. A source said the shell-shocked children might have been in the home with their dead family members for more than 24 hours.
http://www.lvrj.com/news/police-boy-didn-t-name-father-in-slaying-of-mother-sister-148004695.html

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stillwatersc said:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nez-horrific-Las-Vegas-crime-scene-loose.html

I can't find a quote about the 24 hours. It appears something was still going on early Monday morning - neighbors say they heard gunshots, a man yelling and a child crying (and they roll over & go back to sleep???). The boys could have been hiding and afraid to come out. The article also says the child was 'in shock'. I don't know how that would affect his actions or ability to think clearly. What happens to a person 'in shock'?

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Yeah that works better in a scenario where it was the father. If he had raped the daughter, fought with the mother and killed her and the daughter he may have been on a rampage for a good while. Their deaths could have made him worse, because he knew he would be in trouble. But eventually he may have calmed/ran out of steam. He could have been in a suicidal mode, but what to do about the boys? Or he could have been working on an explanation. At that point he may have come up with a story he thought he could use. Send the kid for help or send him to school.

Since the child went to school, IMO I think he may have told the kid not to tell and made plans to dispose of the bodies.

I've been thinking more about the smuggler/intruder possibility, and I just can't see that as what happened. It took too long, too many live witnesses.

sure hasn't been much news coverage on this one. I am sort of surprised by that.

Inside the boxing school Arturo Martinez ran, the lights remain dark. The landlord of the property says police came and asked him to unlock the doors. He was asked to remain outside while they looked through the building.

The landlord says they were there for a few hours and removed the money and a computer. They also asked him to not let anyone on property until further notice. Thick, silver chains and several padlocks are now in place.

http://www.8newsnow.com/story/17696390/police-tight-lipped-on-double-murder-case

mysteriew said:

Yeah that works better in a scenario where it was the father. If he had raped the daughter, fought with the mother and killed her and the daughter he may have been on a rampage for a good while. Their deaths could have made him worse, because he knew he would be in trouble. But eventually he may have calmed/ran out of steam. He could have been in a suicidal mode, but what to do about the boys? Or he could have been working on an explanation. At that point he may have come up with a story he thought he could use. Send the kid for help or send him to school.

Since the child went to school, IMO I think he may have told the kid not to tell and made plans to dispose of the bodies.

I've been thinking more about the smuggler/intruder possibility, and I just can't see that as what happened. It took too long, too many live witnesses.

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I am not sure but I thought the father was unconscious? And that police still could not question him as much as a few days later?

Shelby2 said:

Maybe there was no phone?

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stillwatersc said:

The perp(s) could have taken the phone(s).

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Could be. I am just baffled why neither child would seek help...like running next door if they had no phone--- unless they were taught not to talk too much with outsiders/strangers. Or they were scared of the neighbors?

The father is the bio dad of the girl..right?

I am thinking fear kept the boys hidden while mom, dad and sis were being attacked. Eventually, when it felt safe, the older of the two boys realized dad was not in shape t be much help to them. in shock himself, he went to school on autopilot. He goes there regularly, it is known and familiar, possibly even the routineness of the walk offered some comfort to a chaotic mind.

Still withholding judgment that dad is guilty of anything save living through something horrific his wife and daughter did not?

cluciano63 said:

I am not sure but I thought the father was unconscious? And that police still could not question him as much as a few days later?

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Yeah that is another puzzler. This article is from Monday, April 23, 2012

Surviving victim in grisly crime improves, but he still is unable to communicate, police say
http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2012/apr/23/condition-surviving-victim-grisly-crime-improves-s/

They have upgraded his condition to stable, but he is still unable to communicate. They don't say if he is concious or not.