TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #6

Sleuthy1 said:

:twocents:I believe that comment was made by SMM when they were talking about AD's laptop that GP was in possession of at the time of her disappearance. I will listen to the interview AGAIN but I think you are mistaken about the timing of that particular comment. Let me get back to you on that :waitasec:

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Your correct.

Sleuthy1 said:

:twocents:Yes...the couple in Birmingham, Alabama (Hoover,AL) is the same couple that GP left her jewelry with for safe keeping. NOW....the husband (Mr. G) is the attorney that is suppose to be representing MP in his wrongful termination suit against BCBS of TN. Mr. G's wife was also one of the ppl who GP had confided in about her finding out from Gail's P.I. that MP was cheating on GP. Later, ppl became aware that Mr. G's wife had called MP to tell him what GP knew about MP's cheating ways. That the person she confided in AND TRUSTED... had betrayed her:loser: By calling MP and telling him what she knew....and by giving back the jewelry that GP had entrusted Mr. G to keep safe for GP. Some friend huh ???:banghead:

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That's terrible. MP was saying Gail was paranoid, well heck, I'd be paranoid too if my husband was lying to me, and if I gave personal belongings and information to someone who then betrayed me. Not to mention the stuff we don't know about: She could have seen others following her, people on that security DVR, who knows what all was going on. Dang.

I'm not digging on MP using all these attorney friends of to release statements to the media to bolster his own case by saying "Gail was flat f-- up." Unprofessional, unethical, just horrible thing to do. It's messing with a potential jury pool is what it is, putting doubt out there in the media to try to sway LE. Also, one of these lawyers used to be the DA, plus he hired an expert who used to be a police officer.

Speaking of, where is he getting all the money? Arlene said he was running out of his own cash, yet he's hiring a lot of pricey people to ... uhm, "help" him.

Sleuthy1 said:

June 24, 2011 ~POLICE SEARCH PALMGREN HOUSE ON SIGNAL MOUNTAIN~ www.TimesFreePress.com

http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2011/jun/24/police-search-palmgren-house/

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From the article:

investigators conducted the search at night so they could use an alternative light source to check for body fluids, such as blood, throughout the residence.

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and

Authorities also photographed areas throughout the home, and it’s unclear what other evidence they found. They also searched the grounds leading into the woods near the home.

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If there was anything there, I hope they found it. But at nearly 8 weeks from disappearance, I'm not that hopeful.

I notice the article also confirms MP hired both Hoss and Davis. I always wondered about that. So he's got a PI, 2 defense attorneys, a 3rd attorney for the BCBS lawsuit, and an expert who used to work for the police department working for him. Must be nice.

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Sleuthy1 said:

I think if ANYONE/SOMEONE in the SMPD or HCSO had just communicated with AD throughout this entire investigation....I mean if they at the very least made her feel that all the information she had readily given to both PD's (SMPD and HCSD) then we would not be blasting AD the way we seem to be today...and SMM would not have to give a voice to AD via her radio show either. But,NOBODY has seen fit to even communicate with AD regarding the investigation.

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They're not talking to Gail's own sister Diane (link) so as not to compromise the case, so I don't see why we should expect them to talk to Arlene. Seriously.

Friday, June 24, 2011
Gail Nowacki Palmgren: Beyond the Mountain Top


http://murphymilanojournal.blogspot.com/2011/06/gail-nowacki-palmgren-beyond-mountain.html

glorias said:

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They're not talking to Gail's own sister Diane (link) so as not to compromise the case, so I don't see why we should expect them to talk to Arlene. Seriously.

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:twocents:I think PD should communicate with the family and Arlene. Remember, Arlene has alot of documentation and first hand knowledge of what GP had been going through. Diane did not know the extent of what GP was going through or dealing with in her marriage etc.and Diane did not have any documentation from GP, like AD did.JMO:twocents: I am by no means suggesting that the PD let them in on every move they make or plan to take, but come on think about what they are going through...maybe it would be nice if JA the HCSO spokesperson made contact with them every now and then to assure them with regard to the investigation.....SOMETHING... any little tidbit would have gone along way....but I guess they couldn't find the time...JMO

glorias said:

I'm frustrated too (by a lot of things, to be honest). That said, I don't think the situation is that dire. I doubt every lead is being announced via Arlene, because she surely doesn't have any contacts in LE who would be telling her anything.

Remember, LE has the power to do something about anyone who is interfering in an investigation. They haven't done anything. Yet.

And at the risk of people getting mad at me again :innocent: there are two things that stick out at me with this issue:

1. We don't know what Arlene has, and she may not actually have anything that would be useful to LE. Maybe she has stuff that would never be admissible or she's piecing things together herself without much evidence. If that's true, then she's not really revealing anything important.

2. LE can step in at any time and stop Arlene. If they don't do something, then either AD isn't mentioning anything too serious or maybe LE really is in over their head. I know some people don't like LE to be criticized, but if this is a situation where AD is giving out important info and all LE does is text her once then ignore everything, maybe they deserve a little criticism on this point.

This is an absolute, complete, 100% mess, and it seems to me that there are multiple people with agendas that are not compatible with getting Gail found and justice meted out. Some of these people just have louder voices than others.

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Well said, glorias. I agree. Thanks for posting it.

My concern is that SMM is going to fan Arlene's flames until she does cross the line. She needs someone calm and level-headed to guide her, help her to document all her info and tips, and mail it off to LE, FBI, TBI, SMPD, HCSO, the AL DPS, ECSO, the DA, whomever.

LE doesn't respond well to hysteria, especially if it's rife with insults, accusation, and strident demands.

Calm demeanor, clear information, sent to multiple agencies gets results. And people have to give LE time to investigate your info, and accept that they usually can't tell you what they find out, and what they're doing about it.

But if you write up info clearly and intelligently, and send it to multiple agencies, you're pretty much guaranteed that somebody at one of those agencies is going to follow up.

Yelling and cursing at LE on the radio, calling them incompetent and accusing them of corruption, saying you want to "usurp" what they are trying to do, does not work.

hollyblue said:

Sounds like more what a lawyer would say instead of LE, imo.

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Bingo. Hard for me to imagine LE relaying that to someone by text message. That's just not how LE works.

Sleuthy1 said:

:twocents:Yes...the couple in Birmingham, Alabama (Hoover,AL) is the same couple that GP left her jewelry with for safe keeping. NOW....the husband (Mr. G) is the attorney that is suppose to be representing MP in his wrongful termination suit against BCBS of TN. Mr. G's wife was also one of the ppl who GP had confided in about her finding out from Gail's P.I. that MP was cheating on GP. Later, ppl became aware that Mr. G's wife had called MP to tell him what GP knew about MP's cheating ways. That the person she confided in AND TRUSTED... had betrayed her:loser: By calling MP and telling him what she knew....and by giving back the jewelry that GP had entrusted Mr. G to keep safe for GP. Some friend huh ???:banghead:

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Mr. G.? We have a name for the Birmingham friend(s)?

Gail told the Birmingham friends what the PI found out?

Do we have an article for the name and that Gail told them what the PI found out?

Thanks!

Sleuthy1 said:

:waitasec:
Just to put to rest any of those ideas that someone sent AD a text on her phone that day she went to Batesville, MS ....It was Detective Tizzio who sent the text message. I know this because the text message from Tizzio to AD was followed by a phone conversation, in which pretty much the same conversation took place. For AD's part of the conversation she wanted to know what she was doing that prompted him to send the text message...he just reinterated his text warning and then hung up on AD. He called the next day to apologize to her for hanging up, but stood by his text. I can tell you I was in contact with AD throughout her trip to Batesville,MS and she went there to pass out flyers. She stopped and handed them out along the way. She stopped at local police stations along the way and in Batesville, MS making sure they all had the current posters/flyers. As a matter a fact it was the Batesville police that suggested she add information like GP's D.O.B. and her N.C.I.C. # to the newflyers when they were made. The Batesville PD were fine with AD being there in their community and were not even aware that GP was missing. The Batesville PD called SMPD , asking SMPD if there was any other information that could be shared with the PD in Batesville, MS. ... as a professional courtesy. When Tizzio caught wind that AD was in Batesville....he sent the text to her....and now you know "the rest of the story", as Paul Harvey would say.:sick:
Oh and as for SMM....that woman knows more than you all are giving her credit for....believe me when I say that:twocents: She doesn't need any1's help to sell her book....it sells itself:maddening:

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IIRC, per the news articles, Arlene did more than just post flyers.

Batesville. Wasn't that where Arlene got Tammy's phone numbers and tried to call her?

Drove by Tammy's house?

Found Tammy's ex-husband and talked with him?

No way would a detective send a text like to someone just for posting flyers.

(So far as SMM selling her book etc, just look at her two blog posts about Gail. Only half is about Gail and her plight. The other half is all a big fat ad. I'm dead set against the exploitation of victims and their families for making money. I have a dear friend who's the close relative of a missing little baby, and the pain all these exploiters cause the families, and their interference in finding out what happened to the missing person, and the lengths they go to in order to make a buck, regardless of the impact to the victim and the family and LE, gets under my skin in a BIG way.)

glorias said:

That's terrible. MP was saying Gail was paranoid, well heck, I'd be paranoid too if my husband was lying to me, and if I gave personal belongings and information to someone who then betrayed me. Not to mention the stuff we don't know about: She could have seen others following her, people on that security DVR, who knows what all was going on. Dang.

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I have to disagree that it's terrible to say someone is paranoid or delusional. Calling someone crazy or using other pejorative terms for mental illness is terrible.

It's the same as saying someone has low blood sugar, or chest pain, or is dizzy, or is stumbling around when they walk, or any number of other symptoms of an illness.

What's terrible is to see symptoms of an illness, and say they don't exist. If someone is clutching their chest and bending over and has a look of pain on their face, for example, it would be terrible to say they were standing upright and smiling and perfectly fine. Or to say it was nothing. Or to insist they were just bending over to pick something up.

Because it leaves that person stranded, and possibly left to get more sick, and possibly even to die.

It's the same with mental illness. Just as there's nothing wrong with having heart condition or diabetes or a broken leg, there's nothing wrong with having mental illness. And we need to take away that stigma.

I think Gail was paranoid and delusional. Multiple people describe multiple incidents in which her behavior fell outside the norm. I can't ignore that, any more than I could ignore it if multiple people described multiple incidents in which she was bending over clutching her chest. It wouldn't be fair to her. And I couldn't figure out what had happened to her.

I think Gail was a wonderful woman who was just fine and good to those around her for all of her 44 years of her life, up until just one week before she disappeared, when for some reason, she suddenly became paranoid and delusional. Sure, it could have been the stress of her situation, but that would be unusual for a woman her age. I'm trying to figure out what else could have caused that, and I'm very concerned about what I'm finding in my research.

That's not terrible. I'm doing it because I care about Gail, I have compassion for her, and I want to find out what happened to her, especially because I think she might be alive somewhere, and if so, I want her found and rescued, so she can get back to the people who miss her and love her and need her, and who she misses and loves and needs.

Okay, I'm off that soapbox. I had to get that off my chest.

I listened to the interview and found it to be interesting and have a gut feeling it was smart.

Hope there is news of Gail soon.

A question for anyone local to Chattanooga or the area: post-storms, were the power lines that cross the Teneessee River at W.19th St to Moccasin Bend Rd still intact? TIA

quote=BeanE IIRC, per the news articles, Arlene did more than just post flyers.

Batesville. Wasn't that where Arlene got Tammy's phone numbers and tried to call her?

Drove by Tammy's house?

Found Tammy's ex-husband and talked with him?

No way would a detective send a text like to someone just for posting flyers.

(So far as SMM selling her book etc, just look at her two blog posts about Gail. Only half is about Gail and her plight. The other half is all a big fat ad. I'm dead set against the exploitation of victims and their families for making money. I have a dear friend who's the close relative of a missing little baby, and the pain all these exploiters cause the families, and their interference in finding out what happened to the missing person, and the lengths they go to in order to make a buck, regardless of the impact to the victim and the family and LE, gets under my skin in a BIG way.)[/quote]

BBM ~ BeanE, I was wondering if you would supply us with those MSM LINKS, as I do not recall reading anything about what you have stated in the comment above. I look forward to reading those articles or watching those news reports.:waitasec: Thanks

BeanE said:

I have to disagree that it's terrible to say someone is paranoid or delusional.

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I think Gail was a wonderful woman who was just fine and good to those around her for all of her 44 years of her life, up until just one week before she disappeared, when for some reason, she suddenly became paranoid and delusional. Sure, it could have been the stress of her situation, but that would be unusual for a woman her age. I'm trying to figure out what else could have caused that, and I'm very concerned about what I'm finding in my research.

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What's terrible about saying she becamse paranoid and delusional is that, EVEN IF it were true (which I'm not sure), some are taking those terms out of context to paint a picture of a woman she defnitely is not.

I heard long ago that many "crazy" people are often "normal" people in "crazy" situations. I do know that many people going through various types of crisis would test out with various clinical mental disorders if tested during that time. And I have read research to back up that statement.

I'm very interested in knowing what you are finding in the research you are referring to.

Sleuthy1 said:

:twocents:Yes...the couple in Birmingham, Alabama (Hoover,AL) is the same couple that GP left her jewelry with for safe keeping. NOW....the husband (Mr. G) is the attorney that is suppose to be representing MP in his wrongful termination suit against BCBS of TN. Mr. G's wife was also one of the ppl who GP had confided in about her finding out from Gail's P.I. that MP was cheating on GP. Later, ppl became aware that Mr. G's wife had called MP to tell him what GP knew about MP's cheating ways. That the person she confided in AND TRUSTED... had betrayed her. By calling MP and telling him what she knew....and by giving back the jewelry that GP had entrusted Mr. G to keep safe for GP. Some friend huh

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[bbm]

Wow, what a betrayal. And I'm guessing "ppl became aware" because the grapevine did what it always does, beginning from Mrs. G?

I'm wondering if Mr. and Mrs. G were both friends of Gail, or was it just Mrs. G that was her friend.

Did she confide in both, or did she confide in one, who may then have shared with the spouse as spouses often do?

glorias said:

LE can step in at any time and stop Arlene. If they don't do something, then either AD isn't mentioning anything too serious or maybe LE really is in over their head.

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I've wondered if they've avoided arrest out of respect for the grief Arlene is going through. I don't think it means they don't wish she would hush.

glorias said:

This is an absolute, complete, 100% mess, and it seems to me that there are multiple people with agendas that are not compatible with getting Gail found and justice meted out. Some of these people just have louder voices than others.

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I think you're right. And people with loud voices sure can do a lot of damage or give a lot a help. It can go either way, depending on their style and their intentions.

Can anybody clarify what Gail's family would like to see happening in this case? Are they ok with all the media stuff, or do they wish it would stop? Do they want AD, SMM, and FB to keep talking and doing? Or even WS? We're part of this too.

I really think their wishes should be respected unless there is a clear indication it would be harmful to the case. Can anybody say what the family wants?

BeanE said:

IIRC, per the news articles, Arlene did more than just post flyers.

Batesville. Wasn't that where Arlene got Tammy's phone numbers and tried to call her?

Drove by Tammy's house?

Found Tammy's ex-husband and talked with him?

No way would a detective send a text like to someone just for posting flyers.

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You've got your facts wrong there. Batesville is where Tammy Helton lives now.

Tammy's ex-husband lives in Ider, Alabama, which isn't that far from Chattanooga and nowhere near Mississippi.

http://www.chattanoogan.com/articles/article_203035.asp

She traveled to Ider, Ala., to speak with the ex-husband of Ms. Helton. He told her, "I didn't hear about the affair until everybody started calling me."

The interesting piece of information in that tidbit is that Mr. Helton didn't know about the affair when his wife filed for divorce back in February.

In fact, according to one article, the divorce just cited irreconcilable differences:

http://www6.lexisnexis.com/publishe...picId=100020825&docId=l:1439930104&isRss=true

In a court deposition, Tammy Helton cited an "irretrievable breakdown" in the marriage and said attempts to reconcile were futile.

"We no longer enjoy each other's company and each want to move on with our lives. We do not have the same wants and desires for our future, and have different goals for our lives," the deposition said.

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And why is that important to this case? Because it shows that there are at least two extremely deceptive people involved in Gail's life - her husband and the other woman. That's a fact not a conjecture, imo.

So while they can certainly call Gail whatever names they like such as "crazy" or "delusional," we have to be aware of the basic dishonesty inherent in an extra-marital affair that has now broken up two marriages and lost both people their high-paying jobs.

There's a terrible ripple effect going on here, with innocent children involved and a missing woman whose only fault seems to be that she trusted some of the wrong people and confided in others who are making her disappearance their mission in life. Let's please not blame the victim, thanks. :twocents:

fran said:

I've seen this same type of thing happen in other cases, other states, etc.....oh, and the cases are still unsolved. Because, LE was NOT doing anything. It doesn't matter if it's in OC, Calif, or Small Town USA,.... if LE doesn't look into the matter, nothing gets done.

To ME, it doesn't look like LE is doing anything. But what do I know?

Gail is missing and no one seems to be looking for her...................EXCEPT Arlene.

Where is Gail?

JMHO
fran

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Fran, what have you seen work in the other cases? And why do we think no one is looking for Gail?

Pearl* said:

What's terrible about saying she becamse paranoid and delusional is that, EVEN IF it were true (which I'm not sure), some are taking those terms out of context to paint a picutre of a woman she defnitely is not.

I heard long ago that many "crazy" people are often "normal" people in "crazy" situations. I do know that many people going through various types of crisis would test out with various clinical mental disorders if tested during that time. And I have read research to back up that statement.

I'm very interested in knowing what you are finding in the research you are referring to.

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Oh I absolutely agree, Pearl. It's terrible to take advantage of someone who's ill. e.g. Someone is bending over, clutching their chest, look of pain on their face... and you pick their pocket!!!!

And definitely it's terrible regarding someone having some sort of mental episode, to pretend it's worse than it is in order to exploit them or a situation, or gain some advantage or control over them, etc.

So what's terrible is not saying someone is paranoid or delusional, in and of itself. No moreso than saying someone is having chest pains or low blood sugar or broke their leg.