Maddie and Kayleigh were texting an ex at around 3am and Xana received door dash at around 4am. Xana's phone was active on Tiktok at 4.12am. DM heard XAna crying after 4am and saw a masked male stranger pass across the living room and head towards the slider soon after that. See PCA for refs.
How could the crimes happen at 2am if they ordered food after that time, seen by delivery driver, and were texting after that time and they were heard by the surviving roomies after that time?Why did the time of the crime change? It started at 2, moved to 3, then to after 4am.
Usually, LE would use hard scientific evidence such as time of death based on body temperature of the victims to determine when the crime happened. There is a simple equation called The Glaister Equation based on algor mortis which can be used to make this determination. It is known to be 98% accurate in determining time of death. This equation assumes rectal body temperature drops by 1.5 degrees per hour.
Algor mortis - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
The Glaister Equation is as follows:
98.4 degrees Fahrenheit - the rectal body temperature of the decedent/1.5 degrees per hour = Hours elapsed since death.
The ambient temperature can affect the results of the Glaister Equation. Heat is more problematic than cold. One of the rumors in this case is that the front door was open and 1122 was cold inside, but there is no mention of this in the PCA, so there DOES NOT APPEAR to be any reason to think that the Glaister Equation would not work in this case. And...there is another way in which time of death can be determined: Liver temperature can be used to determine time of death and this method is considered even more accurate in determining core body temperature than rectal temperature.
Another, less accurate way of determine time of death is the stomach contents. Did the victims have undigested food in their stomachs and where was it in the process of digestion? Reportedly XK and EC had pizza around midnight (per XK's father and sister) and there was a pizza box in the trash can on the back patio when CSI was investigating at the house which may have confirmed this and KG and MM had their carbonara after they got home around 1:45. There is a takeaway container in the same trashcan as the pizza box which resembles one of the types of takeaway containers that the food truck uses which may have confirmed if MM and KG ate the carbonara. We have reason to believe that they did not eat the carbonara on the way home because their driver told police that they were talking about eating the carbonara when they got home. You can see a photo of the trash here: Moscow Homicide
But reading the PCA, it says the time of the crime was determined by what DM told police and downloads of DM and BF's phones which we have learned showed them texting each other between 4am and 4:25am and a video of a white Elantra. This timeframe is problematic and contradictory because the white Elantra was still driving around at 4:04am and trying to do a 3-point turn, making the earliest time the driver could have parked and made entry into 1122 at 4:05am or as late as 4:08am. The vehicle is next seen leaving the neighborhood at 4:20am.
A Timeline of the Night of the Idaho College Murders (Published 2023)
New investigative details released on Thursday provide the first clear view of the apparent movements of the man accused of fatally stabbing four University of Idaho students on Nov. 13.www.nytimes.com
With the time of the crime changing 3 times from 2am to 3am and finally 4am, I'm wondering if the victim's core temperatures and stomach contents indicated the crime took place closer to 2am? Shouldn't scientific evidence take precedence in determining the time of the crime?
All JMO.
It initially said "died sometime after 2 a.m. "I'm sure you meant to type Xana. But we really don't know who, if anyone picked up the DoorDash bag or even if the bag in the kitchen is the one that was ordered. I looked at the JITB menu and now I'm concerned about where the squeeze packet of applesauce that Mrs. G found in Kaylee's trash came from. Is it the same brand/size JITB carries? Is it evidence that LE missed? In case you missed what I found:
Different Moscow authorities gave us different times.
"Nov. 17, 2022
Preliminary autopsy results show that the four victims were likely attacked with a large knife and died sometime after 2 a.m. from multiple stab wounds, Latah County Coroner Cathy Mabbutt says.
She describes their wounds as "pretty extensive.""
A "very complex" case: The events that led to an arrest in the Idaho student slayings
The quadruple homicide stunned the college community of Moscow, sparking weeks of speculation and thousands of tips before culminating in an arrest.www.nbcnews.com
By December 19, 2022, police thought the timeframe was between 3 and 4am:
Neighbour recalls hearing odd noise from crime scene on night of Idaho murders
The neighbour recalls hearing what he first thought was a scream or a “party sound” coming from the victims’ home before going to bed around 4am.www.the-independent.com
Then when we saw the PCA the time was 4am.
There are many free work-arounds for the New York Times:
1. You can get the articles for free if you start a 7 day free subscription and then cancel by the end of 7 days.
2. If you don't want to do that, no problem, go to your local public library website for free, login and read it there. If you don't normally use the library, it is free for everyone and your can create your own user ID and password and use it whenever you want. Mine has the entire NY Times online for free for all library members.
According to the PCA the white Elantra was still driving around at 4:06. The timeframe for the murders is about 12 - 13 minutes at most, maybe less. It's a lot to accomplish for one person in a short amount of time.
You don't have to interface with TikTok for it to appear that you are using it. She may have been using TikTok before she was murdered and it was left on afterwards. There would be no way to know for how long.
I personally have no opinion as to what time the murders took place without seeing the body core temperatures and stomach contents evidence from the autopsies and knowing whether or not it was verified that MM and KG ate the carbonara after their arrival home and XK and EC ate pizza near midnight. I think they probably ate due to the boxes in the trash, so that should give some insight to time of death along with core temperatures.
Prove that. I have never seen any information anywhere where the DoorDash person claimed he saw Xana. Link, please.
DD driver is apparently on the prosecution witness list. Are they going to testify that they never saw or heard anyone when they made the delivery?
Agreed. Not saying it's untrue, but I'd just love to see the source itself. Always wondered if BK actually ordered it.
How do we know if it was delivered to a person or just left at the door. We don't know if he actually even saw her before he drove away. He maybe just marked it as delivered and took a photo as proof of such
Does JITB or doordash routinely write the names of customers on the bags. I have never seen that. Also alot of times there's contactless delivery especially during covid
Xana collected her door dash delivered at 4am.I'm sure you meant to type Xana. But we really don't know who, if anyone picked up the DoorDash bag or even if the bag in the kitchen is the one that was ordered. I looked at the JITB menu and now I'm concerned about where the squeeze packet of applesauce that Mrs. G found in Kaylee's trash came from. Is it the same brand/size JITB carries? Is it evidence that LE missed? In case you missed what I found:
Different Moscow authorities gave us different times.
"Nov. 17, 2022
Preliminary autopsy results show that the four victims were likely attacked with a large knife and died sometime after 2 a.m. from multiple stab wounds, Latah County Coroner Cathy Mabbutt says.
She describes their wounds as "pretty extensive.""
A "very complex" case: The events that led to an arrest in the Idaho student slayings
The quadruple homicide stunned the college community of Moscow, sparking weeks of speculation and thousands of tips before culminating in an arrest.
By December 19, 2022, police thought the timeframe was between 3 and 4am:
Neighbour recalls hearing odd noise from crime scene on night of Idaho murders
The neighbour recalls hearing what he first thought was a scream or a “party sound” coming from the victims’ home before going to bed around 4am.
Then when we saw the PCA the time was 4am.
There are many free work-arounds for the New York Times:
1. You can get the articles for free if you start a 7 day free subscription and then cancel by the end of 7 days.
2. If you don't want to do that, no problem, go to your local public library website for free, login and read it there. If you don't normally use the library, it is free for everyone and your can create your own user ID and password and use it whenever you want. Mine has the entire NY Times online for free for all library members.
According to the PCA the white Elantra was still driving around at 4:06. The timeframe for the murders is about 12 - 13 minutes at most, maybe less. It's a lot to accomplish for one person in a short amount of time.
You don't have to interface with TikTok for it to appear that you are using it. She may have been using TikTok before she was murdered and it was left on afterwards. There would be no way to know for how long.
I personally have no opinion as to what time the murders took place without seeing the body core temperatures and stomach contents evidence from the autopsies and knowing whether or not it was verified that MM and KG ate the carbonara after their arrival home and XK and EC ate pizza near midnight. I think they probably ate due to the boxes in the trash, so that should give some insight to time of death along with core temperatures.
So could she be the one that said "there's someone here" as she noticed the slider door open as she walked back upstairs?
Exactly. Artempting to create uncertainty about the time line.
MOO I think BK entered a the house a few minutes after Xana would have gotten her Dash food.
Doordash will often just leave at the door as long as the order was pre-paid, which is the general way to handle it. I've never read whether the Doordash delivery person saw her or not.
