AK, NY Israel Keyes - Who are all of his victims???

[JaimeSommers]

(((Vibes))) and thoughts of strength and peace to you, digndoodle. So very sorry about the loss of your husband.

 

[JFinlay86]

So sorry to hear of your loss Digndoodle, God be with you.

The stalking is interesting, that would work somewhat with Samantha Koenig - I would be inclined to say that she was not randomly selected. Didn't he say something about how he had considered trying to take both Samantha and her boyfriend... that would imply that he knew she was picked up by the boyfriend... Perhaps some of his victims were stalked where as others were random selection such as the couple he said he was going to shoot but then the police showed up.

 

[Foxfire]

Digndoodle, I am very sorry about the loss of your husband.. Prayers from north GA..

 

[sfbaynancydrew]

We had a couple here that was camping and found shot with ZERO clues left. The murders have still not been solved. This was in 2004. I guess I need to research when he might have been in California.

It was this case:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Jenner,_California_double-murder

 

[Lucky 1]

The stalking is interesting, that would work somewhat with Samantha Koenig - I would be inclined to say that she was not randomly selected. Didn't he say something about how he had considered trying to take both Samantha and her boyfriend... that would imply that he knew she was picked up by the boyfriend... Perhaps some of his victims were stalked where as others were random selection such as the couple he said he was going to shoot but then the police showed up.

ITA JFinlay. He knew way too much about Samantha Koenig. If she were completely random, how did he know about the boyfriend and when he would be arriving to pick her up??

Perhaps he did randomly kill some people, spur of the moment just because he thought he could get away with it. Like us out on the trail. No one around, easy to dispose of......but I screwed that up by sneaking around him. Nothing saying he couldn't have followed us to the trailhead, watched us get into our car and followed us home. We lived in a very remote area, no near neighbors, attached garage and an old, abandoned house 1/4 mile down the road. His perfect formula, according to what he told the police at least.

One week before my house was broken into (nothing taken or disturbed by the way.....just the back door standing wide open) one of my dogs was acting extremely odd, barking at the back door. I came home from getting groceries to find him standing at the back door vomiting and shaking. Couldn't stop. And if let out into the yard, he would run to the back of the yard barking his head off. I took him to the vet and they couldn't find anything wrong. One week later I come home to find my back door standing wide open and the same dog waiting for me in the driveway. I NEVER EVER left the dogs outside or the doors open. In fact, I am OCD about checking the doors before I leave the house FWIW.

IMHO, you cannot take what he said literally. He spent his entire life covering up what he was and hiding it. That didn't stop when he got caught.

 

[digndoodle]

ITA JFinlay. He knew way too much about Samantha Koenig. If she were completely random, how did he know about the boyfriend and when he would be arriving to pick her up??

Perhaps he did randomly kill some people, spur of the moment just because he thought he could get away with it. Like us out on the trail. No one around, easy to dispose of......but I screwed that up by sneaking around him. Nothing saying he couldn't have followed us to the trailhead, watched us get into our car and followed us home. We lived in a very remote area, no near neighbors, attached garage and an old, abandoned house 1/4 down the road. His perfect formula, according to what he told the police at least.

One week before my house was broken into (nothing taken or disturbed by the way.....just the back door standing wide open) one of my dogs was acting extremely odd, barking at the back door. I came home from getting groceries to find him standing at the back door vomiting and shaking. Couldn't stop. And if let out into the yard, he would run to the back of the yard barking his head off. I took him to the vet and they couldn't find anything wrong. One week later I come home to find my back door standing wide open and the same dog waiting for me in the driveway. I NEVER EVER left the dogs outside or the doors open. In fact, I am OCD about checking the doors before I leave the house FWIW.

IMHO, you cannot take what he said literally. He spent his entire life covering up what he was and hiding it. That didn't stop when he got caught.

Well here I am again..LOL....had some time before the service this evening....Thanks to the kind words about my husband!!!
Lucky 1....You sure picked the correct name...You are one Lucky 1........I will say in my heart IK probably had already been by your house, knew you all loved to hike and I'm more inclined to think he knew you were on that particular trail that day...He made it a point to be there and run into you both......
PLEASE don't think I'm trying to be an IK Genius.....but when I say I am into a person....this person has got into me in a way I never ever dreamed could....I NEVER dreamed in my lifetime I would be into a SK...I didn't even watch things like that on TV....but as I've said many times that 1st photo released before they knew Samantha was dead????????????.......It was just something inside I could not possible put into words..and 2 nights not 1 eye closed.....and the more I read and learn, the more he haunts me
I agree Lucky 1....5000% IK stalked many of his victims...there was no way he just randomly picked that one coffee stand in Anchorage....He knew they stayed open a little while after others had closed.....he knew all about when Sam got off, that the boyfriend arrived very close after that.....and I'm sure he knew much more about her that will never be known

I do feel the Curriers SADLY fit what his weak, mean mind wanted for his next victims and NOTE****.....He wanted a couple with no dogs??????????....That tells me he had done some crimes that he had to face DOGS in...he didn't like that...I'm sure barking when he was sneaking into a yard, home and etc. was the #1 reason...That is why the Anderson's makes me feel this was possible IK work...the dog being at the tree tied meant nothing to him, the wife in the home and the man in the barn...He knew (in my mind) the dog could not do anything and they have discussed a lot about a truck being seen parked across the street at the Anderson's...You can bet if this was IK.....he knew the exact place the wife was, he knew the man went to the barn...he had a home run to enter the home and do his dirty work...PLEASE I urge anyone with doubts to watch the video on items known taken that night...the guns would have very much pleased IK....some are probably hidden in a kill kit as we write on WS today.....the bow....Keyes was known to be very athletic and he probably used that for his own pleasures....the gold coins probably had no particular mark of anykind on them...again probably used for his own pleasure or doings
and if you go online and read various articles there is more knowledge to be learned about this case
I know he was (supposed) to be in Belize at the time....but IK was a busy little creep......I have never said I thought he took a plane out of there during his stay, but Belize is a very drug-inhabited place.....I know for a fact he used
Marijauna at times...and there is a possibility he could have sneaked out on some type of boat during this time period...but it would be simple....they got DNA from the Anderson's....No POI as of this date....I would 100$ urge the daughter of the Anderson's to go to authorities and tell them to compare with IK's DNA that is now in the system....All she could get was a positive YES or NO

 

[digndoodle]

We had a couple here that was camping and found shot with ZERO clues left. The murders have still not been solved. This was in 2004. I guess I need to research when he might have been in California.

It was this case:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Jenner,_California_double-murder

I know that this couple is being looked at very close in connection with IK...on a site on the internet authorities think very possible this was the work of IK, but stated they were working hard to get info and enough evidence to come out and say IK was their killer.........but California was one of his top places to be, he has tons and tons of relatives in various part of Calif.

 

[digndoodle]

I'm sorry, digndoodle, I didn't mean to come across argumentative, and I'm so very sorry to hear about your recent loss. My sincerest condolences to you, what sad news.

By way of explanation for my posting tone.. I tend to have intense conversations at times. I lean in closer to people and talk a little faster and louder and whatnot, it's a sign of me being very interested, I didn't mean to sound rude or hostile at all. I love websleuths because intelligent people post here and I love being able to have conversations with people who put so much thought and effort into making their opinions heard. I will try harder in the future not to come across as though i'm trying to be difficult.

GGE, I just had not met you on WS and I don't know how to take some things you post....I will say I was sorry about the man in 2007, I thought it was 2008 of the 18th...SORRY
I like you have worked, studied and found out more than I wanted to know of this creature IK...I would love to sit down with all the WS people and have a good cup of coffee and be in a room where we could actually face each other and have a conversation and compare with IK findings
I guess I'm a little touchy inside right now...I lost Mom on March 9th and now 2 months later my husband...that will definitely get inside a person and work on their mental mind
GGE, the reason I keep saying I don't put a whole lot into the timeline issued by FBI.....YES Keyes lied to authorities, he lied his whole life to keep people from finding out just what type of monster he really was....I feel he loved to taunt APD....Why would he tell them the whole truth???.....He knew the ending of his life and I feel he fed them some info. correct and some was off the wall just to get out of his cell, get that cup of Expresso and a bagel or snickers bar plus his cigar...I just feel he told them a lot of garbage to get all the extra things when he would talk
They knew they had messed up bad when he killed himself (supposedly) with a RAZOR, so they had to come up with something so in about 2 weeks here comes the 1st timeline
I feel Keyes was such a Monster that he very well could have been about anywhere during the weeks and days he was un-accounted for on the timelines
I will always say the known GIRLFRIEND had to know things...maybe not the murders but I was married to Jim 30 years and if he had bought something we didn't have money for....He was all smiles and very talky, thinking this would make me not ask WHY...lol....I could tell by the look in his eyes if he was feeling bad, he was very quiet in the evening if things didn't go well that day on the job...so much more....She had to know he was different when he had killed...I will always believe that.......Did he isolate himself (being on the computer) following the murder he had just done,....Did he drink more than usual (he was a known Alcoholic) and how in the world did she not question him on taking all these trips???.....Construction Work??? Just how many trips do you take doing a few jobs here and there...I just know my husband would have had to come up with an enormous story if he was taking these trips and after awhile I'm the type of person that would have followed him in some way to see exactly where he was going during all these trips....Something just don't add up with all this to me

Lucky1.....I will say I'm almost certain by what you have posted this was probably IK...been watching your home I would say for sometime....The person I said that had been stalked by him was very similar like a key to the house that only she knew where it was on the outside of the home was all of a sudden missing, 1 holiday item outside was missing, the next week the 2nd one went missing......turned the light on and an image or person was peeking from behind a tree, riding by the house multiple times, slowing down each time, and was known to have followed them at times......I can say I about know this probably would have been one of his next victims....as I stated above this person was frightened so much so that they use a fake name, no address given but THANK GOD, a little at a time...I feel when this overwhelms this person they just have to talk...so You are one Lucky1 for sure and your husband

 

[Lucky 1]

Thank you digndoodle. Thank you for taking me seriously. My husband TOTALLY doesn't want to believe this, even with the photographs he took. He thought I was being overly dramatic when the door was left open, and even went to work the next day and told them I accidentally left it open - NOT!!!

The part I left out was the fact that we didn't have dead locks on our doors (lived in the country!) and the night of the back door incident I was freaking out. Tied the basement door shut (the one that was opened) with wire and booby trapped the window next to it, but the door on the landing (where the dog was sick - incidentally all the power/phone/cable lines were right outside this door) and the front door I couldn't tie shut, so I rigged them with empty beer bottle 'alarms'. Hubby went to bed on the top floor, I stayed in a screened-in porch that was right over the two back doors so I could hear. At 9:25 the bottle on the front door fell. I went running out there and didn't see anything (WASN'T going outside to check however!), replaced the bottle and went and laid back down. 5 minutes later it fell again. I put it back again and nothing else happened that night. The next morning I got up, pushed on the door, jumped up and down in front of it and outside, did everything I could think of and that bottle wouldn't budge. Never fell off again, although I continued to rig it like that for months afterward.

I felt like I had a stalker. I felt that way for a long time but couldn't prove it. Still can't. I thought for a long time someone was coming in my house at night while we were asleep, but nothing was ever amiss or out of place.

How exactly did IK accomplish his "blitz" in the Currier's home......good guessing or perhaps been inside several times before he decided to kill them?????

 

[dotr]

digndoodle, so sorry that your dear husband passed away.
Hope you are okay and thanks for your tremendous contributions here, even as you face your own loss.

 

[digndoodle]

There is a friend of mine that posted this case on FB, I want to see what all you sluethers think of this....and I will try to add a photo that my friend also following IK done in some side by side photo's

http://panachereport.com/channels/more short stories/PracticeKill.htm







This is the only photo in these cases they got of the killer using the 1 mans ATM card...grainy but I feel the nose is a dead give away, and those eyes look ANGRY...just something about IK's eyes that gives me the creeps

 

[digndoodle]

Thank you digndoodle. Thank you for taking me seriously. My husband TOTALLY doesn't want to believe this, even with the photographs he took. He thought I was being overly dramatic when the door was left open, and even went to work the next day and told them I accidentally left it open - NOT!!!

The part I left out was the fact that we didn't have dead locks on our doors (lived in the country!) and the night of the back door incident I was freaking out. Tied the basement door shut (the one that was opened) with wire and booby trapped the window next to it, but the door on the landing (where the dog was sick - incidentally all the power/phone/cable lines were right outside this door) and the front door I couldn't tie shut, so I rigged them with empty beer bottle 'alarms'. Hubby went to bed on the top floor, I stayed in a screened-in porch that was right over the two back doors so I could hear. At 9:25 the bottle on the front door fell. I went running out there and didn't see anything (WASN'T going outside to check however!), replaced the bottle and went and laid back down. 5 minutes later it fell again. I put it back again and nothing else happened that night. The next morning I got up, pushed on the door, jumped up and down in front of it and outside, did everything I could think of and that bottle wouldn't budge. Never fell off again, although I continued to rig it like that for months afterward.

I felt like I had a stalker. I felt that way for a long time but couldn't prove it. Still can't. I thought for a long time someone was coming in my house at night while we were asleep, but nothing was ever amiss or out of place.

How exactly did IK accomplish his "blitz" in the Currier's home......good guessing or perhaps been inside several times before he decided to kill them?????

Never let anyone take away from that deep deep gut instinct....usually that feeling turns out to be right........Your story is so much like the person I am in contact that was stalked for a long time...that is why I don't think the TRUE IK will be brought out as other SK....he said he idolized Bundy, but made it known he did not pattern his works after no particular SK...............IK had way too much time on his hands...I know some will laugh at this, but it's TRUE......that's my country way of speaking it out....He had time to stalk, make phone calls and etc.....when he was on one of his trips he made sure most of them was for several days at a time...so he sure was not going to sit in a motel all the time, he was too antsy for this.....If this was IK at your home, he knew the bottle would be a thing barely noticed but he could make a person's life miserable by doing simple dirty things...like the one person I am in contact with...taking 1 holiday ornament....he wants to give people the creeps and then a week later to the date the 1st one was took the 2nd one goes missing....My opinion is he could tell LE he picked victims at random...I totally agree on that for some.....but in his OFF TIME, I feel he got such a HIGH from stalking some people, and I am almost certain he was somewhere close to see if the little things made people upset and then following them without them knowing, yet making a sudden "appearence in out of the way places", where he would let some know he was on their paths but only for a few minutes at a time...I feel he loved stalking....Look at how he did Samantha's family....used her phone to blackmail them, making the photo of her sitting up with the latest paper in her search in front of her...he knew this would about drive the family crazy but he loved it....and if you read the article of when he was caught and they found her body Goedon told him that when she 1st read the ransom note, she could only think that this was not a human it was some kind of Monster, and he laughed....I'm sure this ransom note was somewhat like his suicide note.....but I'm sure he put FEAR in Sam's family....to say it made her think some type of MONSTER had written the note...it had to be really really bad
I cannot possibly say this was IK at your home, but sure sounds a lot like the other victim's experiences so far...I always go for the GUT FEELING...I heard in psychology once a statement that has followed me through life "you know what you need to know, and you already know it"....I had to study on this for several weeks..it sounds off the wall, but to me it means we have a gift for having internalized knowings, but so hard for us to trust this knowing, but it is trying to give us the answers we need.......and I have found myself sometimes in a very mixed up case of LIFE..not knowing what to do, where to turn, but when I get alone and try to study it all out....The true answer I need turns out to be that deep deep gut feeling....sometimes it may be an answer we don't want to acknowledge because of fear or dread...but we already know what we need to know

 

[digndoodle]

digndoodle, so sorry that your dear husband passed away.
Hope you are okay and thanks for your tremendous contributions here, even as you face your own loss.

Thank you for the kind words, I'm OK...not great but will take time....I lost Mom on March 9th and now a little over 2 months my hubby, but he had been bedridden for over 5 years and he ran a long hard race with that horrible disease DEMENTIA........That is a horrible disease but he is my hero for the brave fight he gave trying to hang on from the many sicknesses this sometimes causes

I find dotr that I get some relaxation at my computer...when LIFE comes crashing in on me...I usually get on the net and read and search

 

[dotr]

That was a very interesting link and one to keep in mind for some other cases that involved real estate.
IK has a definite look imo, hard yet "spacey"wide-set eyes , broad forehead and in particular a cruel,smug and somewhat lopsided protruding lip.
In the composite above, they capture the eyes and forehead similar to IK.

 

[GGE]

There is a friend of mine that posted this case on FB, I want to see what all you sluethers think of this....and I will try to add a photo that my friend also following IK done in some side by side photo's

http://panachereport.com/channels/more short stories/PracticeKill.htm



This is the only photo in these cases they got of the killer using the 1 mans ATM card...grainy but I feel the nose is a dead give away, and those eyes look ANGRY...just something about IK's eyes that gives me the creeps

Well yeah, didn't they already link this as being him? I guess I just assumed they had because it's so totally obvious that it's him. I saw this pic on Sam Koenig's father's faceboo page, that "Have You Ever Met IK, SK?" page, awhile back.

If LE hasn't figured this one out yet that's really confusing to me. It seems so obvious.

 

[GGE]

.I always go for the GUT FEELING...I heard in psychology once a statement that has followed me through life "you know what you need to know, and you already know it"....I had to study on this for several weeks..it sounds off the wall, but to me it means we have a gift for having internalized knowings, but so hard for us to trust this knowing, but it is trying to give us the answers we need.......and I have found myself sometimes in a very mixed up case of LIFE..not knowing what to do, where to turn, but when I get alone and try to study it all out....The true answer I need turns out to be that deep deep gut feeling....sometimes it may be an answer we don't want to acknowledge because of fear or dread...but we already know what we need to know

I so agree with you, digndoodle.

I think all animals have instinct (or "gut" instinct), including the HUMAN animal.

 

[GGE]

There is a friend of mine that posted this case on FB, I want to see what all you sluethers think of this....and I will try to add a photo that my friend also following IK done in some side by side photo's

http://panachereport.com/channels/more short stories/PracticeKill.htm


This is the only photo in these cases they got of the killer using the 1 mans ATM card...grainy but I feel the nose is a dead give away, and those eyes look ANGRY...just something about IK's eyes that gives me the creeps

Gonna try to post this a little bigger for you -

 

[Lucky 1]

Never let anyone take away from that deep deep gut instinct....usually that feeling turns out to be right........Your story is so much like the person I am in contact that was stalked for a long time...that is why I don't think the TRUE IK will be brought out as other SK....he said he idolized Bundy, but made it known he did not pattern his works after no particular SK...............IK had way too much time on his hands...I know some will laugh at this, but it's TRUE......that's my country way of speaking it out....He had time to stalk, make phone calls and etc.....when he was on one of his trips he made sure most of them was for several days at a time...so he sure was not going to sit in a motel all the time, he was too antsy for this.....If this was IK at your home, he knew the bottle would be a thing barely noticed but he could make a person's life miserable by doing simple dirty things...like the one person I am in contact with...taking 1 holiday ornament....he wants to give people the creeps and then a week later to the date the 1st one was took the 2nd one goes missing....My opinion is he could tell LE he picked victims at random...I totally agree on that for some.....but in his OFF TIME, I feel he got such a HIGH from stalking some people, and I am almost certain he was somewhere close to see if the little things made people upset and then following them without them knowing, yet making a sudden "appearence in out of the way places", where he would let some know he was on their paths but only for a few minutes at a time...I feel he loved stalking....Look at how he did Samantha's family....used her phone to blackmail them, making the photo of her sitting up with the latest paper in her search in front of her...he knew this would about drive the family crazy but he loved it....and if you read the article of when he was caught and they found her body Goedon told him that when she 1st read the ransom note, she could only think that this was not a human it was some kind of Monster, and he laughed....I'm sure this ransom note was somewhat like his suicide note.....but I'm sure he put FEAR in Sam's family....to say it made her think some type of MONSTER had written the note...it had to be really really bad
I cannot possibly say this was IK at your home, but sure sounds a lot like the other victim's experiences so far...I always go for the GUT FEELING...I heard in psychology once a statement that has followed me through life "you know what you need to know, and you already know it"....I had to study on this for several weeks..it sounds off the wall, but to me it means we have a gift for having internalized knowings, but so hard for us to trust this knowing, but it is trying to give us the answers we need.......and I have found myself sometimes in a very mixed up case of LIFE..not knowing what to do, where to turn, but when I get alone and try to study it all out....The true answer I need turns out to be that deep deep gut feeling....sometimes it may be an answer we don't want to acknowledge because of fear or dread...but we already know what we need to know

ITA digndoodle! The gut KNOWS!! And as you say, he may have been doing this for several years. I have a photo of a set of tire tracks backed into the side of the road across from my house in 2007. I had walked my dogs the night before and they were not there, walked them again the next morning at 7:00 am and there they were. Backed in so that the car was facing my house at about the level of our master bed room (the house faced a hill). I am suspicious by nature and that freaked me out. There was absolutely no reason for a car to be backed in right there, period. I went back to the house and got the camera and took the pictures. I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that he was watching me from the woods and getting quite the rise out of my reaction. I know he didn't follow me, it would have been too obvious, but he knew where I lived and came whenever he pleased.

On the topic of accents; when we met him on the trail he had an accent. Thick. I remember thinking Amish, like Pennsylvania Amish, although at that time I had no idea what that would sound like. I think that is why he targeted me and he thought that Amish accent would be a draw. I very truthfully didn't listen to the conversation because I was freaking out and trying to get around him. Hubby doesn't want to talk about it, so I'm going just on memory. And I've watched the jail interviews....that was not his voice, at least not the one he used on the trail with us.

I think he was probably extremely smart, and had multiple different scenarios going in multiple different locations, each one feeding a different f'd up fantasy of his. And they were all in different stages of play. In between he would pacify himself with random killings he could get away with and general mayhem like robbery, arson, etc.

You could well be right, he may have jacked with the bottle just to freak me out. It worked, very well. And would fit perfectly with his desire to see fear in his victims eyes, as stated in his note.

 

[dotr]

Lucky 1, wondering if some of the stalking/ gas-lighting behavior was not only to push his "control button", but to test your reaction to his sick idea of "foreplay"?

 

[Lucky 1]

Lucky 1, wondering if some of the stalking/ gas-lighting behavior was not only to push his "control button", but to test your reaction to his sick idea of "foreplay"?

I would definitely say YES dotr. He got his jollies out of this in more ways than one. I would so love to know if Lorraine Currier had been noticing small things out of place or just a general feeling of being watched. I would have that feeling intensely for periods of time and then feel like I was absolutely perfectly safe there other times. Could be written off to many things.

I think the most valuable thing I or anyone like me could offer is a clearer picture of exactly how he worked and perhaps establish a traffic pattern if you will to these trips of his, because I feel certain they were visiting specific people and areas each and every time he went there. If he was simply choosing random individuals and "blitz" attacking them in their homes after a short period of surveillance I will eat your hat. I think that only happened if he stumbled into the perfect set up. More likely to me he would have followed that couple home and continued his sick game from there. Shooting a cop like that seems way too risky, backup or no backup. I think that was another one of his red herrings for the police to chase around, keep them busy with small, unprovable nonsense so they can't get to the real story. Keep it from his family at all costs. He outright told them he started that at 14 when he killed the cat.

I really believe he was evening scores in his head with the stalking/murders. I don't think there was anything random about them at all.