Found Deceased AL - Paighton Houston, 29, left bar with 2 men, Birmingham, 20 Dec 2019

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Am I pulling at straws thinking the the thwarted recent kidnapping that was in the news can be connected? The man was from California and has a history of kidnapping, assault etc charges. A witness reported a girl being forced into a van near Sharon Heights RD Baptist Church which is 21 min from the bar PH was "last seen." Having a cage and chains in the van would seem he was on the prowl with a purpose. I know there has been no link between the 2 per LE but it is a pretty big coincidence in my book. The man is definitely not big but accomplices? Either way it is very frightening.
Victim being freed? WATCH: Brookside police release bodycam video of kidnapping suspect arrest
BREAKING: California kidnapper captured in Jefferson County, woman rescued
Screaming, bloodied woman rescued from van with cage & chains after kidnapping suspect beats her with tire iron
 
Am I pulling at straws thinking the the thwarted recent kidnapping that was in the news can be connected? The man was from California and has a history of kidnapping, assault etc charges. A witness reported a girl being forced into a van near Sharon Heights RD Baptist Church which is 21 min from the bar PH was "last seen." Having a cage and chains in the van would seem he was on the prowl with a purpose. I know there has been no link between the 2 per LE but it is a pretty big coincidence in my book. The man is definitely not big but accomplices? Either way it is very frightening.
Victim being freed? WATCH: Brookside police release bodycam video of kidnapping suspect arrest
BREAKING: California kidnapper captured in Jefferson County, woman rescued
Screaming, bloodied woman rescued from van with cage & chains after kidnapping suspect beats her with tire iron
Chilling!
 
If this was not in my adult kid's nature, and they had been near death from addiction in the not so recent past, you bet your bippy my tail would be on their trail with LE in tow. Their butt goes missing, all bets are off. "Voluntary"- well that means diddly- it's called "get in touch". Proof of life. I could care less if they were 20 or 50. I don't see my husband sitting around either. Mine know it, and would expect us to. I know things about each of mine that I would rather not know. 95% of LE here have known us since the kids were babies. I have friends in low places as well. Living in the country has its advantages. Mine know better than to test my crazy- so I would be flipping out. I lost my daughter- and I knew where she was and who she was with. Too bad her BFF had 2 faces.The guilt of that eats at me daily.

I imagine her family is doing plenty to find her- I see a lot of strength in her Mama and her family. We just aren't hearing about it. I don't have a lot of faith in many agencies, and they need to play by the rules. This family almost lost her once- I cannot imagine the agony they're in right now.
 
I would like to know how long PH knew the co-worker?? Very important piece of the puzzle to me.

I also feel something is going to break open very soon on this case. Praying for the best and PH family.

JMHO
 
Am I pulling at straws thinking the the thwarted recent kidnapping that was in the news can be connected? The man was from California and has a history of kidnapping, assault etc charges. A witness reported a girl being forced into a van near Sharon Heights RD Baptist Church which is 21 min from the bar PH was "last seen." Having a cage and chains in the van would seem he was on the prowl with a purpose. I know there has been no link between the 2 per LE but it is a pretty big coincidence in my book. The man is definitely not big but accomplices? Either way it is very frightening.
Victim being freed? WATCH: Brookside police release bodycam video of kidnapping suspect arrest
BREAKING: California kidnapper captured in Jefferson County, woman rescued
Screaming, bloodied woman rescued from van with cage & chains after kidnapping suspect beats her with tire iron

This was horrifying. That's not even a strong enough word. This, and that poor man who met up with his killer/sadist on Grindr.
 
If this was not in my adult kid's nature, and they had been near death from addiction in the not so recent past, you bet your bippy my tail would be on their trail with LE in tow. Their butt goes missing, all bets are off. "Voluntary"- well that means diddly- it's called "get in touch". Proof of life. I could care less if they were 20 or 50. I don't see my husband sitting around either. Mine know it, and would expect us to. I know things about each of mine that I would rather not know. 95% of LE here have known us since the kids were babies. I have friends in low places as well. Living in the country has its advantages. Mine know better than to test my crazy- so I would be flipping out. I lost my daughter- and I knew where she was and who she was with. Too bad her BFF had 2 faces.The guilt of that eats at me daily.

I imagine her family is doing plenty to find her- I see a lot of strength in her Mama and her family. We just aren't hearing about it. I don't have a lot of faith in many agencies, and they need to play by the rules. This family almost lost her once- I cannot imagine the agony they're in right now.
You sound like me and my Mom. I live next door to her and if she hasn't heard from me by at least 2p every day she is calling me. I had a very bad health scare in the past, drugs were not involved, but I had a stroke 3 days after I had my youngest. REGARDLESS, A mother ALWAYS wants to know that their kids are safe. I'm 38 now and my Mom still calls me. My brother will be 50 and if we don't hear from him for a few days, we are callin to check on him. He has had mental health issues and we call either him or his wife to make sure all is ok.
I can only GUESS what Paighton's Mom is going through and if I were here I would be all over the "friend" asking what happened, in person. I would forgo the texting back and forth and MAKE her look me in the eyes and tell me what happened from the moment they got in the car to leave. I keep wondering if she made it to the bar, but wouldn't LE have said something if she wasn't on the video?
 
MSM can ask all they want. BPD is not obligated to answer , and they should not answer anything until they are ready.
That's true. I was basically saying that MSM USUSALLY questions like the LE do during interviews or stories, but on this one they just kinda seem to be like "well here's the information so far" and don't seem to be pushing forward.
The questions are what LE should hopefully have answers to even if they are keeping it close to the vest. I apologize, I know there are times I can be a bit hard to understand. It sounds fine in my head, but doesn't always come out the right way.
 
Where would I find pictures from that night? I've read a couple of references to these pictures on WS.

I've not seen any photos from the Tin Roof bar specifically marked Dec 20, 2019 but I did view their Instagram and studied the photos and video posts from last December to get an idea of the typical lighting and crowd placement.

If the Friday night in question was as I imagine -- crowded and dimly lit, I personally think it would be difficult for PH and her movement to stand out.

Also, it appears to me that there's both an indoor and outdoor stage (in fenced patio area) but lighting appears similar to me.

MOO
 
Thinking out loud here.

My understanding of the facts of the case (please correct me if I am wrong):
Friday, Dec. 20th:
Morning: Paighton Houston leaves her parents’ home for work;

Time Unknown: PH is at the Tin Roof with friends from work. PH rode there with one of them.

Saturday, Dec. 21st:
12:14 AM: PH sends a text to the friend that she rode with to the Tin Roof, stating, “IDK who I am with so if I call please answer. I feel in trouble.”

[Sometime over the next 24 hours (“Evan Houston said, ‘We made the missing person report before the 24-hour-period ....’”)]

The same friend contacts PH’s family and tells them PH left the bar with two heavy set black men and appeared to do so willingly. The friend also shares the text message she says she received from PH that “if I call answer, I don’t know these people and I feel in trouble.”

“After hearing from the friend, Houston’s brother and father went straight to police and filed the [missing person] report.”

However:
“Sergeant Johnny Williams with the Birmingham Police Department said investigators have reviewed surveillance video from a bar where Paighton Houston was last seen and have not found anyone matching the description of the two men she is believed to have left with.”

That does not prove that the “two heavy set black men” never existed. Personally, I find it odd that there have been no reports that the friend tried to call or text Paighton back, but maybe she did. It’s also rather unusual, IMO, that the friend apparently left the venue without PH especially since they rode there together, but perhaps there is an innocent explanation for that also.

Based solely on what has been reported, if I were a detective, I think I would want to look at the friend’s phone records, particularly, location-tracking information.

If she has given LE access to her phone, great, but if not, I’m not sure what they can do without a warrant. I also wonder if the friend is cooperating because if she has decided not to talk to them, I don’t think there is much that they can do unless there is evidence of crime.

I am also curious as to what the other coworkers have told the investigators about what they saw that evening.

Sources:
Trussville family makes plea for missing daughter’s return

Missing woman last seen leaving bar with 2 men, texted friends she was in trouble: Brother

B’ham Police: Surveillance video in Paighton Houston case does not show 2 men she reportedly left with

Prayer vigil for missing Trussville woman Paighton Houston

So the co-worker contacted her parents? How did she/he have their contact information? Just an observation as I was reading through.
 
Media Contacts:
  • bdionne@wbrc.com - WBRC FOX6 News
  • mhightower@wbrc.com- WBRC FOX6 News
  • alancollins@wbrc.com - WBRC FOX6 News
  • michael.seale@patch.com - Patch User Profile for Michael Seale
  • cscarborough@hearst.com - WVTM 13
  • skillian@wvtm.com - WVTM 13
  • News@TrussvilleTribune.com
  • newstip@abc3340.com - ABC 3340

Does anyone have any additional thoughts for media contacts? A couple of pages upstream poster LMR contacted a member of the media and requested a clarification.
That gave me the idea to email some of our questions to members of the media, who hopefully will consider contacting BPD to ask said questions and publish the answers they might receive. Obviously BPD has been pretty tight lipped, it's an open investigation. But it certainly doesn't hurt to ask.

Bestill-
  1. I would like to know where her phone pinged all Friday.
  2. How many coworkers were at the bar Friday night?
  3. What time did they actually get to the bar?
  4. Is it unusual for Paighton to leave her car somewhere and catch a ride with someone else? Personally I like to have my freedom to leave whenever I want.
  5. Is this coworker she texted someone that she would depend on if she needed help? I think Paighton is close to her family and friends, so she could easily texted them too.
  6. Would love for LE to show a map of Paighton's known activities on Friday and Friday night.
Peppery-
  1. -was she at work on 12/20 and who saw her there
  2. -who was she in contact with that day and night via text/cell
  3. -when was the last time her mother actually spoke to her on the phone
  4. -who can confirm she actually went to TR
  5. -was she seen on video at TR or any nearby business cameras
  6. -if she was there, did she eat or drink alcohol
  7. -did she text anyone else mentioning feeling in trouble
  8. -when and where did her phone ping that night
  9. -when did her phone go silent
  10. -is her car at the coworkers home as would be expected
  11. -has the car been processed
  12. -have any of her possessions been found? Coat, phone, purse, wallet, credit cards, etc
  13. -why hasn’t LE organized any searches for her
Proctorelites-
  1. Did anyone see Paighton at the bar or leaving the bar?
  2. Has Paighton ever used Uber or Lyft? Does she have an account with either?
  3. Has anyone ever offered to pay for Paighton's Uber or Lyft ride? (yes i know thats against their TOS or so I hear, but it happens)?

Anyone else have a question not covered above?

 
That's true. I was basically saying that MSM USUSALLY questions like the LE do during interviews or stories, but on this one they just kinda seem to be like "well here's the information so far" and don't seem to be pushing forward.
The questions are what LE should hopefully have answers to even if they are keeping it close to the vest. I apologize, I know there are times I can be a bit hard to understand. It sounds fine in my head, but doesn't always come out the right way.

I think the difference here is that LE has not given any pressers for this missing person investigation and therefore no opportunity for media to ask questions -- even if met with the usual "no comment due to an ongoing investigation."
 
Why hasn’t LE confirmed Paighton was on the video?
Could it be like another said?? Poor lighting and a packed house (as they say in the bar industry) so would make it hard to see one's movements in the location?? Or do they not what to compromise the investigation and are holding everything close to their vest? PERHAPS they caught SOMETHING on the video and are looking more into it. Fights break out in bars all the time. My BF has been a bartender for the past 15 years, 4 different bars and it's all the same. It gets busy, the more people drink the tipsier they get, the mouthier some get and then fists start flying. PH was with 1 friend, and THEY got into a fight. It's never been stated as to what the altercation was about (or if it happened at all). Maybe LE has it on the video and are asking said "friend" about it.

@momrids6 PH's car was at the "friends" house if I remember the detail right they went to the Tin Roof together and she left her car at the friend/co-workers house. There are a few similarities to Savannah Spurlock's case that I have seen and I believe someone else even mentioned that as well. (The similarities that is)
 
I would think this family has a rule like ours. No matter how old, how far away, and in any condition, one of us will come get you- no questions asked. We have Uber Family Profile as well- as do most of our friends. I don't think she would make them worry. I just don't.
 
There seems to be a lot of questions about the “friend.” Did PH leave her car at her house, the questions about the text, how long they have been friends, etc. Does anyone think there could be more to this “friend” than just being platonic?
 
Media Contacts:
  • bdionne@wbrc.com - WBRC FOX6 News
  • mhightower@wbrc.com- WBRC FOX6 News
  • alancollins@wbrc.com - WBRC FOX6 News
  • michael.seale@patch.com - Patch User Profile for Michael Seale
  • cscarborough@hearst.com - WVTM 13
  • skillian@wvtm.com - WVTM 13
  • News@TrussvilleTribune.com
  • newstip@abc3340.com - ABC 3340

Does anyone have any additional thoughts for media contacts? A couple of pages upstream poster LMR contacted a member of the media and requested a clarification.
That gave me the idea to email some of our questions to members of the media, who hopefully will consider contacting BPD to ask said questions and publish the answers they might receive. Obviously BPD has been pretty tight lipped, it's an open investigation. But it certainly doesn't hurt to ask.

Bestill-
  1. I would like to know where her phone pinged all Friday.
  2. How many coworkers were at the bar Friday night?
  3. What time did they actually get to the bar?
  4. Is it unusual for Paighton to leave her car somewhere and catch a ride with someone else? Personally I like to have my freedom to leave whenever I want.
  5. Is this coworker she texted someone that she would depend on if she needed help? I think Paighton is close to her family and friends, so she could easily texted them too.
  6. Would love for LE to show a map of Paighton's known activities on Friday and Friday night.
Peppery-
  1. -was she at work on 12/20 and who saw her there
  2. -who was she in contact with that day and night via text/cell
  3. -when was the last time her mother actually spoke to her on the phone
  4. -who can confirm she actually went to TR
  5. -was she seen on video at TR or any nearby business cameras
  6. -if she was there, did she eat or drink alcohol
  7. -did she text anyone else mentioning feeling in trouble
  8. -when and where did her phone ping that night
  9. -when did her phone go silent
  10. -is her car at the coworkers home as would be expected
  11. -has the car been processed
  12. -have any of her possessions been found? Coat, phone, purse, wallet, credit cards, etc
  13. -why hasn’t LE organized any searches for her
Proctorelites-
  1. Did anyone see Paighton at the bar or leaving the bar?
  2. Has Paighton ever used Uber or Lyft? Does she have an account with either?
  3. Has anyone ever offered to pay for Paighton's Uber or Lyft ride? (yes i know thats against their TOS or so I hear, but it happens)?

Anyone else have a question not covered above?

Yes, "what exactly did Sergeant Johnny Williams say about the video"? The site being quoted, doesn't have any quotes surrounding his speech; meaning the reporter summarized it. What if the reporter scrawled their notes down wrong?
 
Media Contacts:
  • bdionne@wbrc.com - WBRC FOX6 News
  • mhightower@wbrc.com- WBRC FOX6 News
  • alancollins@wbrc.com - WBRC FOX6 News
  • michael.seale@patch.com - Patch User Profile for Michael Seale
  • cscarborough@hearst.com - WVTM 13
  • skillian@wvtm.com - WVTM 13
  • News@TrussvilleTribune.com
  • newstip@abc3340.com - ABC 3340

Does anyone have any additional thoughts for media contacts? A couple of pages upstream poster LMR contacted a member of the media and requested a clarification.
That gave me the idea to email some of our questions to members of the media, who hopefully will consider contacting BPD to ask said questions and publish the answers they might receive. Obviously BPD has been pretty tight lipped, it's an open investigation. But it certainly doesn't hurt to ask.

Bestill-
  1. I would like to know where her phone pinged all Friday.
  2. How many coworkers were at the bar Friday night?
  3. What time did they actually get to the bar?
  4. Is it unusual for Paighton to leave her car somewhere and catch a ride with someone else? Personally I like to have my freedom to leave whenever I want.
  5. Is this coworker she texted someone that she would depend on if she needed help? I think Paighton is close to her family and friends, so she could easily texted them too.
  6. Would love for LE to show a map of Paighton's known activities on Friday and Friday night.
Peppery-
  1. -was she at work on 12/20 and who saw her there
  2. -who was she in contact with that day and night via text/cell
  3. -when was the last time her mother actually spoke to her on the phone
  4. -who can confirm she actually went to TR
  5. -was she seen on video at TR or any nearby business cameras
  6. -if she was there, did she eat or drink alcohol
  7. -did she text anyone else mentioning feeling in trouble
  8. -when and where did her phone ping that night
  9. -when did her phone go silent
  10. -is her car at the coworkers home as would be expected
  11. -has the car been processed
  12. -have any of her possessions been found? Coat, phone, purse, wallet, credit cards, etc
  13. -why hasn’t LE organized any searches for her
Proctorelites-
  1. Did anyone see Paighton at the bar or leaving the bar?
  2. Has Paighton ever used Uber or Lyft? Does she have an account with either?
  3. Has anyone ever offered to pay for Paighton's Uber or Lyft ride? (yes i know thats against their TOS or so I hear, but it happens)?

Anyone else have a question not covered above?
The friend /co worker. Male or female?
 
So the co-worker contacted her parents? How did she/he have their contact information? Just an observation as I was reading through.

From comments attributed to PH's mom, it's my understanding that PH lived with her parents. I imagine her co-worker had or obtained the parent's contact info the way any prudent person or co-worker would. I don't think the contact has been questioned that I'm aware of. MOO
 
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