Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #45

[Bazinga]

Looking at GBC phone records (such an amazing effort Curiousasacat!) I wonder if GBC's
group text at 19.46 to a few including Allison and Kate R might have been along the lines of him thinking it might be better if only one person went to the conference eg Kate and that Allison should instead help at the office as v busy. Sort of testing the idea.
I have also wondered if Allison already knew TMc was in the shadows again (text about the back seat) and might have guessed or found out that TMc was going to the conference. Maybe getting her hair done to look good and being at the conference was part of a way for Allison stand up, hold her head high, try to make TMc feel shame. Maybe the text sparked an argument.

 

[Sleuthilicious]

Looking at GBC phone records (such an amazing effort Curiousasacat!) I wonder if GBC's
group text at 19.46 to a few including Allison and Kate R might have been along the lines of him thinking it might be better if only one person went to the conference eg Kate and that Allison should instead help at the office as v busy. Sort of testing the idea.
I have also wondered if Allison already knew TMc was in the shadows again (text about the back seat) and might have guessed or found out that TMc was going to the conference. Maybe getting her hair done to look good and being at the conference was part of a way for Allison stand up, hold her head high, try to make TMc feel shame. Maybe the text sparked an argument.

I'm not sure about the timeline. What time did Allison get home from the hair dressers (approx)? Why would he text Allison if he was either sitting next to her on the couch or expecting her home any minute? Is it just me or is that a bit hinky?

 

[Bazinga]

Sleuthilicious,
I must learn how to do the quote or snip thing.

Yes, it seems weird if Allison was already home but for a group work type text it wouldn't seem completely strange to be included in even if you're there with the sender. I just wonder if there is something in that text and then the next group text not long after Allison is not included that seems meaningful to me. NBC is in on all the messages though - creepy!

 

[Maigret]

Quite chilling is that once he is over the telling the police and Allison's parents - wow how short was that call!! And then it's 'business as usual' with him and Toni - even calls her late on the Saturday night (to wish her goodnight???)
Very hinky and so totally enforces he was not afraid of Allison looking at his phone records.
Wouldn't surprise me if he hadn't popped into St Lucia on his way back from the solicitors

 

[Timmy]

Quite chilling is that once he is over the telling the police and Allison's parents - wow how short was that call!! And then it's 'business as usual' with him and Toni - even calls her late on the Saturday night (to wish her goodnight???)
Very hinky and so totally enforces he was not afraid of Allison looking at his phone records.
Wouldn't surprise me if he hadn't popped into St Lucia on his way back from the solicitors

Yes... One 3 second call to the parents of your missing wife, 2 hours after calling police. Almost an afterthought!

 

[spratsmum]

Yes... One 3 second call to the parents of your missing wife, 2 hours after calling police. Almost an afterthought!

How on earth could you explain what happened in three seconds?

 

[DrWatson]

How on earth could you explain what happened in three seconds?

I would think that a 3-second call is one where it connects (hence registers as a call) but the answering machine picks up, and the caller then hangs up straight away without leaving a message.

 

[McCoy]

Yes - the lack of a clear cause of death at autopsy, due to the extensive decomposition, is a problem in itself. The most likely, and consistent with the findings, would be suffocation/smothering (as opposed to strangulation). The hyoid bone was intact, which is often (but not always) fractured in manual strangulation, either from in front or from behind. But suffocation wouldn't leave any telltale marks after that period exposed to the elements.

A hand over the mouth, while pinching the nose closed - easy peasy for somebody GBC's size. And who's to know that the "lightbulb" injury on his right hand isn't the marks produced by a row of teeth? We haven't seen any photos of that injury.... Maybe even chipped a tooth with a finger ring while he was at it - but I don't know if he wears a ring on his right hand...

And that is my conjecture only....

One good thing about the lack of trauma ie no fractures at autopsy is that it should stop the other story which has been suggested ie the drunk driver who hit Allison as she was walking and who was so worried about losing his/her licence again they took Allison to the creek. I doubt she could be so critically injured that it made the driver panic, yet have no fractures

Also it now seems evident Allison wasn't well on the 19th, still on antiobiotics (current prescription for Amoxycillin was found) and the hairdressers testimony mentions she wasn't well. All the more reason why she wouldn't go walking on a fairly cool night or morning.

 

[Chief of Funtime]

And ..the calls to TM between 3 Ana 4 0clock . I thought she was home asleep then . And also wasn't it supposed to be a full day conference ?

 

[Anonthemouse]

Working on the 'KISS' principle I really don't think that TM was involved. I honestly think she is a wreck due to the situation she finds herself in. She imagined a life with GBC. She left her partner to be with him. I think she still loves GBC and it is going to take some time for to work through that this man who she dreamt of being with forever has murdered his wife. In my opinion this is why she was evasive and untruthful with the police as well. Trying not to get him into trouble.

I agree, if there was any collusion between the two, then surely he would have got T to say that it was her who'd scratched him when she'd found out that Allison was going to the conference....or whatever. A better story would have been than T came over and fought with G, A saw and that was the final straw, she walked out and we haven't seen her since...

 

[Liadan]

sorry to do this again, HGL...

Davis didnt question Toni about what lies Gerard had told the police at any stage.. in fact, he cant, that would be hearsay and opinion .

Davis did not refer to Gerards outstanding lie in his first 5 minutes with the first responding police... and then the second lot.

What I said was, or meant to say was.. Davis, by questioning Toni about the ongoing element of the affair, after December up until Gerards arrest, Davis was tacitly agreeing that his client lied to the police, because Gerard said the thing had ended 'last year'... he has made no other reference to it at all.. no statements, no nothing. so.

What I was implying was, Davis knows his client is a liar, he has this particular hurdle to get over, and by bringing up that element, Davis knows and Gerard knows and the police, the magistrate, you, me and Uncle Tom Cobbly know that Gerard , with his wife missing, and this is Gerards claim, nobody else's, it's Gerards call , is already lying.

My query .. or I suppose you could say, my interest in this bit is Davis acknowledging, albeit in a tacit manner, opaque , not overt, and already this early into the whole panoply of Committal, Trial, Appeal etc, that his client lied to the police from the beginning.

Davis gets his instructions from Gerard. Therefore, Gerard has discussed with Davis the ins and outs of the ongoing yet very secret affair after the outing of it originally. and its Post-Allison Missing continuance.

But Davis must clearly know that Gerard told all attending police that it ended last year. so did Toni at her interviews, but thats beside this point.

Hmm so Davis is trying to 'contain' the lies - that is a hard line to follow with GBC. There are so many of them, and we have the closest person to him currying favour with him and his family with the lips sealed - so you think Davis is going to - try and paint a picture that we cannot work out what happened? What is your take on it further down the track Trooper?

 

[Curiousasacat]

Re Suncorp.....
Remember the lady who visited the BC residence early on in the Suncorp uniform and some of us thought that was TM in the yellow car?
Did we find out who that lady was?

 

[spratsmum]

Re Suncorp.....
Remember the lady who visited the BC residence early on in the Suncorp uniform and some of us thought that was TM in the yellow car?
Did we find out who that lady was?

So something seems to be going on with Suncorp - changing loans, guarantors, insurance - something to do with finance, and from CuriousCats excellent memory involving the senior BC - umm I didn't hink it was possible but this is getting more interesting.

Does anyone on here know why bank officers would visit your home?

 

[stormyweather]

So something seems to be going on with Suncorp - changing loans, guarantors, insurance - something to do with finance, and from CuriousCats excellent memory involving the senior BC - umm I didn't hink it was possible but this is getting more interesting.

Does anyone on here know why bank officers would visit your home?

Looks like you can book for an appointment on the website, maybe they requested for someone to come to them?

 

[Flinders]

Addicted to love

Date April 2, 2013
By Sarah Berry

Pretty much from the first moment we got together I knew it was not healthy and I could not get out," she says. "I tried to break up that many times and would go back. It got to the point where I lost faith in myself. I'd say 'It's over, I'm out, it's done' and then it wouldn't be."...

"Love addiction, however, is a compulsive, chronic craving and/or pursuit of romantic love in an effort to get our sense of security and worth from another person. During infatuation we believe we have that security only to be disappointed and empty again once the intensity fades. The negative consequences can be severe and yet the love addict continues to hang on to the belief that true love with fix everything."

http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/life/addicted-to-love-20130401-2h2bz.html

Reading this reminded me of TMcH.

 

[Couldbe]

Addicted to love

Date April 2, 2013
By Sarah Berry

Pretty much from the first moment we got together I knew it was not healthy and I could not get out," she says. "I tried to break up that many times and would go back. It got to the point where I lost faith in myself. I'd say 'It's over, I'm out, it's done' and then it wouldn't be."...

"Love addiction, however, is a compulsive, chronic craving and/or pursuit of romantic love in an effort to get our sense of security and worth from another person. During infatuation we believe we have that security only to be disappointed and empty again once the intensity fades. The negative consequences can be severe and yet the love addict continues to hang on to the belief that true love with fix everything."

http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/life/addicted-to-love-20130401-2h2bz.html

Reading this reminded me of TMcH.

That is how TM portrays it ...... BUT, at the time of meeting GBC her twin boys must have been about 10 yrs old and needed her (although there was a Partner). Apparently, from what she has said, she didn't want to continue being unfaithful to him so she left him. At that point, she must have thought that GBC would do the same ........ but it didn't happen.
Four years later, GBC is still being unfaithful to Allison (but that didn't seem to matter to her) but she was trying every 'trick in the book' to get him to leave Allison. She knew he was financially needy (and whatever other needy!), and maybe even that he was fiddling the books!
SHE WANTED GBC to herself ..... especially now that she had left her Partner and was available.

Having tried all sorts of 'tricks' .... sex / no sex..... in fact the night that Allison disappeared, she has said that she wanted to meet with him and find out what was going on in his head ...... TM WASN'T GIVING UP!! As far as she knew, Allison was the one who was in her way.

...certainly must have been a shock when she found out about others that he had tried 'playing around with' .... she didn't know that 'was going on in his head'.

Now, Allison is no longer here, so she can tell the world about her 'love affair' and feel that it has somehow become validated. We shouldn't be fooled!

 

[Flinders]

Thanks Couldbe. Yesterday Trooper asked the question why did GBC and TMcH get back together in December and that it's hard to understand the behaviour of T. I don't understand either which is why I posted this news story.

The other thing that irks me is her statement...

"When I first started working with Gerard, there was definitely chemistry for me. I admired him. I was attracted to him," she told police."

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ndooroopilly-gym/story-e6freoof-1226537628016

So from the get go she was herself in a committed relationship with kids. Was she playing with fire every day by going to work?

You are right Allison isn't here. I have lost 2 family members recently and the pain is that death is final. I feel the loss every day but more so for the children involved.

 

[Couldbe]

Thanks Couldbe. Yesterday Trooper asked the question why did GBC and TMcH get back together in December and that it's hard to understand the behaviour of T. I don't understand either which is why I posted this news story.

The other thing that irks me is her statement...

"When I first started working with Gerard, there was definitely chemistry for me. I admired him. I was attracted to him," she told police."

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...ndooroopilly-gym/story-e6freoof-1226537628016

So from the get go she was herself in a committed relationship with kids. Was she playing with fire every day by going to work?

You are right Allison isn't here. I have lost 2 family members recently and the pain is that death is final. I feel the loss every day but more so for the children involved.

Flinders ....... I am so sorry; it must be awful pain that you are dealing with, and working your way through it will take time. Try and be strong. Hugs.

 

[squizzey1]

Just throwing in a spanner in the works.
I've always believed the chamberlains guilty
I know it's not politically correct now days but have been friends
For years with one of the forensic people who worked on the case
And many have no doubt at all it was human not animal

Yes Olli Before the trial i was having dinner with a very prominent criminal barrister and he said " its odds on her , even money him and the dingoe can name its own odds "

 

[Trooper]

Flinders.. my original query, really, I didnt put it well, was why would GERARD get back with Toni in December.. no problem as to why Toni would , she's been ringing him , emailing him, ringing, ringing , she doesnt understand, she wants an explanation since the big throwout on Oct 12th... I say it was OCT 12 2011 Gerard panics when Allison finds out about Toni , fires her, calls a big meeting in the office, tells everyone, all that stuff, the screaming, the crying, the phoning, phoning, phoning ( the date I took is from Phillip Brooms statement )....

My curiosity, probably unhealthy, is why , in December, after this enourmous showdown in his public and private life, having fired Toni, placated Allison ( I presume , because she is still there ) , Gerard tells Toni he wants to start it all up again. From Toni's point of view, it never finished , it was merely interrupted , what she has to do is educate Gerard how much better off he would be with her, how he should be with her, how he is destined, fated, you name it, and finally, after about 40 days, Gerard agrees .

I just wondered why he did, is all..... that is, go back into the same, but hotter frypan. Not leave Allison, continue with Toni... further in debt, and faster into debt, partners having to be bought out , staff leaving, on a short leash at home and at work. His financial absurdity really escalated during this time, also.. .. that is, the due dates got closer, but the means to stave them off got less and less.

I wondered what the catalyst was... I thought perhaps he had thought of a solution. Extreme, but necessary. Possible?? Needing someone who had no end to their gullibility to talk it over with ? Far from being rather blatant about the previous affair, this new arrangement between GG and GM was strictly secret. Lots of mechanics were put in place, secret email addresses, secret identities, secret phones * fleggys phone* secret meeting places, Toni even went to the trouble of playing Jocelyn Frost ( former partner in the business) along with the fiction of the whole thing being over ( Jocelyn Frost statement) ...

According to Toni, this recycled romance, Mark 2, was based on solid promise and hope.. .. Confirmations etc... what I am curious about is, how did Toni, and certainly Gerard create a solution to a problem that before ... before December, had no solution. What was the solution to the problem ( Allison, always Allison) that appeared in December that wasnt there during the previous 3 years?