Armchair Psych Profile and Treatment

so where is this gonna fall back? school or LE?

Good question, February!
There is a possibility of both, I think! JMO MOO and all that jazz


DOES NOT MATTER. they can only take a report.

He should have been comitted against his will.

I think you might be mistaken, songline. Read Shadowraith's post #495 above and then mine, #497.

Sorry Shadow, didn't mean to step on your toes. I post like at turtle-neck speed rather than break-neck speed. ;)
 
Yep, i got slightly interested with the series of Butterfly Effect too..
Haven't seen the series but have long been interested in chaos theory, specifically the strides made by Edward Lorenz and his Lorenz Attractor ( link ). Though, chaos theory isn't exactly about time travel, per se. Rather, it's about predictive capabilities based upon pattern recognition. The latter being another of my hobbies.

The butterfly effect movie, and probably the shows, too, appear to lean more towards elementary time travel concepts, while playing around with Lorenz's butterfly effect concept, to demonstrate how changing seemingly insignificant past events can result in unexpected future outcomes.
 
Somebody asked above why he didn't target the school instead of a theater.

IMO, I think it's bc he couldn't get in the school. They dropped him and his access to that school quick.
 
Somebody asked above why he didn't target the school instead of a theater.

IMO, I think it's bc he couldn't get in the school. They dropped him and his access to that school quick.

And? How would that stop him? He'd only not be able to get to restricted areas. There are plenty of areas that are not restricted. And even then, if he really wanted to, he'd be likely able to convince someone to open the doors for him.
 
Somebody asked above why he didn't target the school instead of a theater.

IMO, I think it's bc he couldn't get in the school. They dropped him and his access to that school quick.

He still had access to all public areas and public buildings.
 
The butterfly effect movie, and probably the shows, too, appear to lean more towards elementary time travel concepts, while playing around with Lorenz's butterfly effect concept, to demonstrate how changing seemingly insignificant past events can result in unexpected future outcomes.

Yes! Ashton Kutchner time travelled in the past to change their past so their future will not be affected by it and while he was travelling in the past, he was playing a techno music
 
Sorry Shadow, didn't mean to step on your toes. I post like at turtle-neck speed rather than break-neck speed. ;)
Looks down at toes, wiggles them. No prob. They're fine. Mainly, cuz they weren't stepped on... well, c'ept by me when I walk. ^_~
 
He still had access to all public areas and public buildings.

Maybe?it was just me guessing that maybe shooting at that college would be hard. Summer and not as many people. Sounds like jh wanted an easy place.

I know at my daughters school......there are only a few places I am allowed to go on campus. The parking lot and the main greeters center that has the cafe/lunch room in it. There are tons of security around her school. I was sitting out in the parking lot one day waiting on her. Security went around in their golf carts a few times and finally stopped to ask was I a student. They wanted to know why I was just sitting there.

As always, just my 2 cents and opinion.:fence:
 
Appreciate your views Cariis. I have only run into this sort of thing by way of investigating criminal activity that often involved some of the same backgrounds and same types of MI individuals. I've seen it, I can recognize it, I can differentiate most types and have a pretty good idea whos capable of what but I have no proper training in that area. I come from a totally different perspective but in general I get what you are all saying. I believe Holmes intelligence demanded a more intricate dilusion of him than most. I believe the circumstance of the movie provided that.

I fear we aren't going to get much in the way of new information that you can hang your hat on any more. Unfortunately that will lead to more speculation without much to prove anything one way or another. I usually try to sort things into some sort of ballpark theory and then look around to see what can be found to support either side. Besides the joker aspect, I would be interested in that McDonalds job Holmes once held and his coworkers insights. I believe there is a potential for a Ronald McDonald like character to do some other grave act somewhere yet. I doubt he will be near as intelligent and may drop early simplistic signs to watch for. This was highly educational for me to hear what some of you trained in the field had to say.

The dividing line in basic opinion on the theater so to speak is somewheres in here. (qoute attached) My views are pretty well all on the same side as yours Cariis but I like to entertain the other positions as well. This is what you are up against especially if getting too far out in front of any actual event for the intended pupose of stopping it. Part of Fenton's position is, how was she to know anything like that would happen and especially how and where? My question goes to How did she know it wouldn't be at the university?

If I suspected for instance a McDonalds shoot out in the offing and had my eye on an individual exhibiting signs, maybe even saw him seeking a way to get close to and or even attempting to get a costume, who would you tell and how would it be recieved? Right, you are first met with a lot of scoffing. Even after the fact, it is not easy to see the the psychological trail foundational to the act.
Like I said, this was quite educational for me, thnz all.

from Cariis


And all without caffeine! The doctor is still puzzling in that how did she know he wouldn't return to the uni? Was she more privy to the specifics of the dillusion than we know?
Appreciate yours as well sir or madam!!!!

YES! She knew, it is not like unless you say I am going to go kill Otots at 5:32 AM on Friday XX XX XXXX that we don’t have the skills, the training, the whole deal to say my client is decomping, he is losing contact with reality, he is indicating a desire to harm. I find it in a way frustrating, this is complicated stuff BUT I would never worry about getting in trouble with asking for a duty to warn safety drive by.

I just would not , I trust my clinical skills, and unlike so many here think that this is about locking people up it is not, it is at most 72 hours of a human being s life that is so out of control, so stressful so exhausting, THEY ARE PETRIFIED ; in his intelligence the biggest gift we could give them is a three day wind down (which often does not really do a whole lot - they system ($) just overdoses them to the point of near coma -- they crawl home, sit there getting over the doctor overdose, and it all starts again in about a month and a half or so
Its criminal, it’s pathetic, it is wrong, -- when I started, years ago average time in the hospital was 30 45 days! We could get their meds right (or closer than now days $) and they could go back out not in a COMA and go for a bit
would they end up back yep, but their quality of life in between placements, not being overdosed cause insurance does not want to pay for hospiilazation, was FAR better .

They managed.

It is sad, it is wrong, it is gross, and it will continue to happen more and more until this society realizes, that at the end of the day, humanely, this is real medical stuff, that it is better to pay the tab when you have them in a safe and secure environment, and can really tweak their meds wherein their side effects are minimized, increase the likelihood that they will take them.

It is repulsive and wrong and there are hundreds of victims from July 20 that would concur here..... believe it or not , the lil;ihood of this occurring could have been markedly reduced if MI was not stigmatized, if it were not a blame deal, if it were recognized as a medical problem as opposed to some little whim of some prick who is hunting for a dash of attention or is angry etc.

This is a mentally ill KID! Folks…………..He is sick…………..

See the other day for proof (temple) – and this stuff is going to keep going until we as a society decide oh my we better really try to help these folks………

. It is real, it is medical, it is neurotransmitters no different than diabetes, and until this society can grasp that well grab your bullet proof vests
Whew I feel better now!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Besides the second hand statement of him identifying himself as the Joker

What else makes you think that the film itself was central to the planning, rather than the fact that it would be a full theater?
Respectfully, you have got to me kidding me - I would love to know not being rude and I mean it it is so befuddling to me your resistance to the whole thing in its entirity is NOT joker batman delsioion mental stuff--- how do you like start there?

Confuses me...... resistance there on your part , but what is the reason for the resistnace,

Better question, why is it so out of your realm that this is totally batman joker etc?
 
re: newsluther


For me it was the total accumulation of many a minor nebulous thing akin to the feel of "for whom the shoe fits." The length of time it took to gather and accumulate the items, the planning right down to which night the detonators were set to correspond with the time of opening night. I had suspicions the very name, The Return of The Dark Kniight would trigger something like this from someone somewhere.

Many years ago I had an encounter with an individual of considerable intelligence who went on to become a serial killer. I knew (felt) something was wrong with that individual then. Little did I know the depths of it. What I recall most was that he had a thing against technology and was quite sarcastic when speaking of the commonly accepted higher teck of the day. He rode an old bycycle and for the most part seemed quite harmless but for some reason the alarm bells went off in me. For all his apparent intellect, he had a distain for technology to a degree I'd seldom seen before or since. He later chose targets appropriate and suiting to his particular dillusion. I remembered that point from all those years back. Everything matches right from within the dillusion to the eventual act. The more planning, the more that seems true. Like I said, I come from a criminal investigative approach and what I describe is a very early indicator, nothing you take to court. If you know the dillusion, you can get ahead of it and identify possible targets. If you only see the end result, you have to backtrack to uncover the individual with that dillusion. But it gives a start, a means to find the leads to where the proof may lay. In this case The uni records, Holmes computer records, etc etc would all likely provide whatever was required. It shouldn't be a mystery in this case; what is hidden to us is likely well known to others.

The individual I refered to in the above was Ted Kaszinski.

And on a side note.. I saw the new trailer to the gangster movie last night for the first time. Catch line- paraphrasing,- "once you do it you can never turn back you know." Interesting feed in, Hollywood likes that, box office and all.
oh i pmed before I got to end !

Your writing is awesome!

the gangster movie last night for i played it it grossed me out!

Bottom line -- are we ever gonna get to real documented stuff he said i said i did they did here is waht i saw felt etc or is this gag crap just gonna make this never knowing anything?
 
A temporal Illusion is an unproven theory relating to time travel/multiple timelines/being able to change past events.

Like the Butterfly Effect
the bigger part of that in my mind was when he said something akin to it is about what is going on INSIDE ones own head -- if that is not an awesome , quiet referecne to delsionial thinking not sure what else could be!
 
http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/consciousness-temporal/temporal-illusions.html

and a simple explanation here, it seems it is what happens when you are in a car accident, time slows down in your mind temporarily:



http://brane-space.blogspot.com/2012/07/getting-grip-on-temporal-illusions-and.html

I'm still poking around for more links, but it may be boring to everyone. (It makes sense that he may have studied, or taken a class in this, the college was cited as studying Alzheimer's which really is a messed up time frame(s) in the person's head. Trying to figure out what is going on in the brain at that time may help find a way to help Alzheimer's patients, they really need it.)


http://papers.cnl.salk.edu/PDFs/Untangling Spatial from Temporal Illusions 2002-3516.pdf
It is fascinating to me you all are focusing on the first part of his sentenace (past) wherein what struk me so was the second sentance ---- what is going on in your head as oppossed to reality (J O K E R ) this was years ago ......


the second sentance IMO is far more telling as it relates to July 20..............
 
Maybe?it was just me guessing that maybe shooting at that college would be hard. Summer and not as many people. Sounds like jh wanted an easy place.

I know at my daughters school......there are only a few places I am allowed to go on campus. The parking lot and the main greeters center that has the cafe/lunch room in it. There are tons of security around her school. I was sitting out in the parking lot one day waiting on her. Security went around in their golf carts a few times and finally stopped to ask was I a student. They wanted to know why I was just sitting there.

As always, just my 2 cents and opinion.:fence:
In some way this is confusing. Several folks are typing as if this is an individual, who has 6000 rounds of ammo, his house ready to set the neighborhood to pieces, has 4 guns, heavy duty outfits, as if this is an individual is canvassing not being caught.

Come on guys, the last thing on the jokers mind was worrying about "getting away with it" figuring out if he had rent a cops around or near , he was the joker, the joker succeeds (obviously),

the joker was gonna go shoot as many as possible, he was not even bothered if a rent a cop asked him his name , or for his batman ID!

He is the joker , the joker does not bother than mundane stuff , he must do what he must .......................... D E L U S I O N I A L folks ! MI



imo that is silly !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Respectfully, you have got to me kidding me - I would love to know not being rude and I mean it it is so befuddling to me your resistance to the whole thing in its entirity is NOT joker batman delsioion mental stuff--- how do you like start there?

Confuses me...... resistance there on your part , but what is the reason for the resistnace,

Better question, why is it so out of your realm that this is totally batman joker etc?

I think the Batman thing was attached to by the press for ratings and a shocker story.

Explain to me, other than the hair (which is the wrong color), how he is this "Joker" entity? It's all speculation. There's no evidence leaning towards it at all. Everyone claims the hair... his hair isn't even the color of the Jokers hair.

No one from his past has even said he was obsessed with Batman, all I've heard is Guitar Hero.

All people are going on is second hand information from one statement and one alone.

I believe he targeted this movie simply because it was sold out all over the country and guaranteed to have a full house at night time.

I believe he is mentally ill. I do not believe he has a delusion where he thinks he is the Joker, and planned out this entire attack around Batman/Joker. Nope. Don't buy it.
 
In some way this is confusing. Several folks are typing as if this is an individual, who has 6000 rounds of ammo, his house ready to set the neighborhood to pieces, has 4 guns, heavy duty outfits, as if this is an individual is canvassing not being caught.

Come on guys, the last thing on the jokers mind was worrying about "getting away with it" figuring out if he had rent a cops around or near , he was the joker, the joker succeeds (obviously),

the joker was gonna go shoot as many as possible, he was not even bothered if a rent a cop asked him his name , or for his batman ID!

He is the joker , the joker does not bother than mundane stuff , he must do what he must .......................... D E L U S I O N I A L folks ! MI



imo that is silly !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

May I ask if you have ever read any of the Batman comics, watched the TV Show, or seen the movies? What exactly are you basing your knowledge of the Joker and his persona on?

(ps - the joker does not always succeed and is jailed a few times)
 
You maybe right, cariis, but it is my opinion......he wanted a huge kill streak. Why do all this if it was not in his mind to kill as many people as he could? Mi or not, his intention was to kill.....and it was his intention to kill as many people as he could.

He picked his place, mi or not, bc he knew it would pretty much be like shooting fish in a barrel. He "may not have" cared about security, cops, or whoever else. I don't know. Seems to me he thought his plan out....or at least the pre plan then the killing plan.

He MAY have been mi, but to some degree...his brain functioned well enough to buy lots of guns, ammo, and rig his apartment. That will always be a part of this story that stands out.

As always.....this is just my 2 cents.
 
You maybe right, cariis, but it is my opinion......he wanted a huge kill streak. Why do all this if it was not in his mind to kill as many people as he could? Mi or not, his intention was to kill.....and it was his intention to kill as many people as he could.

He picked his place, mi or not, bc he knew it would pretty much be like shooting fish in a barrel. He "may not have" cared about security, cops, or whoever else. I don't know. Seems to me he thought his plan out....or at least the pre plan then the killing plan.

He MAY have been mi, but to some degree...his brain functioned well enough to buy lots of guns, ammo, and rig his apartment. That will always be a part of this story that stands out.

As always.....this is just my 2 cents.

errr you sound like me on the other thread!
Yes, he bought so many ammunition so his intention was to kill as much as he can, why would he put his plan on risk by buying 6k ammo if all he wants is to kill 2-5 people, he doesnt need to carry 4 guns there too...no need to wear gas mask or whatsoever.....
 

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