Aruba - Natalee Holloway, 18, Oranjestad, 30 May 2005 *AL extortion trial* *Guilty* #3

[ChatteringBirds]

I don't buy that he couldn't have discreetly taken a boat out to do what he, IMO, did. It's tragic that he got away with it.

 

[NuttMegg]

I agree. I wasn’t arguing. Was just curious where it came from. Didn’t think you made it up. And i certainly don’t think BH did. Just wondering which “confession” of his it came from.

Was it something said in the recorded confession but not released to the public or was it something y’all learned earlier in the investigation years ago…
That’s more what i was trying to figure out.

I’m still catching up….

Thx for clarifying

If the words "advertiser censored" are use, that term could cover 1) acts one does to oneself, 2) bad acts one does to a child, 3) bad acts one does to a spouse. 4) deciding to cut one's life short 5) paper or online acts and so forth. Which is why I used that abbreviation so that the two instances of reference to prn could be compared, without confusing something censored with being another category completely.

You were polite so I answered you. I'm off for enjoying real life, this is the last thing I want to be attacked for, a simple suggestion that someone might compared the prn that Beth referred to in court with the prn rumored to be played in the car the night she disappeared. Not the contents of the prn, just the fact that it was referred to 2 times between the time Natalee got in the car and when he went home to watch it, per Beth Holloway but not part of confession. Along with the terms he used like "walked her" to the shoreline, and earlier use of that term, that someone "walked her" to a boat. This method was used for Watts and Morphew lately. Comparing terms used in different instances to see which seemed "off".

IMO if the MSM interview, or court testimony or VI statement is related to the confession, it should be clarified by the person interviewed that it IS or IS NOT part of the confession. The only confession that counts, per the court, as it was verified by polygraph. Otherwise the rumor just gets perpetuated.

That's the document that interviews are based on. Not rumors unverified by poly, since that's the basis that Beth and Dave accepted the confession.

Anyway! I've just walked myself to the waterline, waded to knee depth, and pushed this topic off into the Bermuda Triangle.

IMO

 

[arielilane]

Sometimes, there are no words.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1716776946195939671

https://twitter.com/CoffindafferFBI

 

[arielilane]

The first time Beth Holloway was face-to-face with her daughter’s killer was just a day after the teen went missing on a high school graduation trip to Aruba.


Beth was in a car looking for Natalee Holloway when the 17-year-old boy — who was among the last people seen with her as they left an island bar in the early morning hours of May 30, 2005 — approached the mother’s parked vehicle.


“I want my daughter back,” Beth told him, recalling how Joran van der Sloot smirked and beat his chest in reply. “What do you want me to do?” he asked.

Natalee Holloway's Mom Beth Shares Her 18-Year Fight for Justice: 'My Never-Ending Nightmare Is Over' (Exclusive)

Alabama teen Natalee Holloway went missing in Aruba in May 2005. Joran van der Sloot just admitted to killing her but may not be charged with murder.

people.com

October 24, 2023 10:00AM EDT

 

[Smelly Squirrel]

IMO if the MSM interview, or court testimony or VI statement is related to the confession, it should be clarified by the person interviewed that it IS or IS NOT part of the confession. The only confession that counts, per the court, as it was verified by polygraph. Otherwise the rumor just gets perpetuated.

They didn't release the full confession so none of us have any idea if it's included or not. Well, I mean those of us who want to call BH a big fat liar don't.

 

[Caj1977]

Lots of missing stuff...did deepak really return for him? He must have been covered in blood or very wet without bloody shirt. Something is not ringing true about just putting her in the water. It must have been 3 am or so and they were right by the fishermen's huts. Early risers, fishermen. What, maybe 2-3 hours for the body to drift slowly along shore? Haven't heard about sharks, but that could be quick

I’m so glad I’m not the only one who still has questions. I do believe he is responsible for her death but I’m not buying the story he gave.

 

[Barb Wire]

Interesting.

The fishermen's huts one one side was cinder blocks other side was big traps per Art Woods ( retired SS agent ) who I was working with at this time. He thinks Joran put Natalee in a trap. Used a friends boat to take her out to sea name of the friend in question KG PVS arranged this I bet. JMO
Thank You

Mica for the trap pictures​

When Kyle Kingman took pic from TX ES and showed them to us we put the pieces together the cage also contained cinder blocks a white sneaker and a cop hat and blue fabric. A lot of this are lost it's been 18 years.. I just finding my info now on disks

 

[LinasK]

Gross!!! She likely knew at that point that she was not safe. I would have immediately began to worry about being raped. I also wonder if he drugged her drink. I read that they found the wrapper to a date rape drug in Stephany Flores’ car after he killed her. Article posted below.

Makes me think he drugged NH…

Here they mention his tale of her falling and hitting her head on a rock after taking ecstasy so his being left with “no choice” but to put her body into “shark infested” waters.
Article from 2005 with one of his tall tales

NYP article on murder of Stephanie Flores mentioning date rape drugs and possible plans to put her body in the ocean

I googled, btw, and apparently there are RARELY shark attacks in Aruba. The last one was in 2015! So I’m not buying the whole she just got gobbled up immediately by sharks….

I’m quoting:

Shark attacks are extremely rare in Aruba.

But despite being more famous for its shark-free waters, there is actually one documented shark attack in Aruba.

This incident occurred in 2015. It happened after a Venezuelan trading boat capsized, leaving Captain Adrian Esteban Rafael and four crew members clinging to the wreckage.

So why did her body disappear so quickly? The ocean is a big place - i guess that’s the only explanation. He or they likely anchored her somehow

I've long believed that Joran slipped a date-rape drug into her drink at the bar they met at and that's why she left so willingly with him. I used to follow this case back in the day...

 

[arielilane]

I heard @NBCNews is doing a Feb documentary on Natalee Holloway…something has been leaked to me about it..and if NBC puts a particular thing in it that I am told will be there, I will release one email from the FBI in 2010 that will undermine the credibility of the project..

https://twitter.com/x/status/1716789343702974514

I am holding this email for Congressional hearings…but who knows? Maybe NBC will call me..and want to read it @NBCNews

https://twitter.com/x/status/1716790131665854470

(And to think Dutch Fed investigators turned a blind eye when I met w/them for 8 hours in Sept 2022 and would not pursue) Aruba requests van der Sloot case documents, including his description of killing Natalee Holloway | AP News

https://twitter.com/x/status/1716837572167492039

 

[SteveS]

4 To add to that point - Aruba's Statute Of Limitations actually might not be as helpful as he might think, and might open a door. [I won't share my thinking on that until he signs and submits his sworn-under-oath statement and the sentence and plea is in place, but will share more in a day or three.]

It's time to follow up on this comment from before the verdict, along with some observations about the verdict itself.

ABOUT THE VERDICT
1 Like most of you, I had expectations about the verdict that were not met. However, with the release of the "Sentencing Memorandum" it has been made apparent that the problem was not in the judge's sentence, but in my expectations. They were not realistic.
2 I do think that, in JVDS eyes, he got away with this crime by simply saying confession words that, in his mind, didn't really matter and didn't really have to be 100% true. And he felt the SOL in Aruba, plus a non-use agreement of the confession by USA authorities, would give him full insulation from consequences.
3 That made it easy for him to confess to whatever, and has us focusing on the truth (or lack thereof) in the details. In so doing, I think we have missed the game being played.

FURTHER PROSECUTION
1 As I noted before the plea-and-sentence, the SOL seemed like immunity for JVDS after this. But I don't think it will work that way - in fact, I think the whole point by BH and the rest was just to get a confession under oath that he killed NH (Think: they know he's a liar who has told a million different stories as to what happened, and a lie detector test is not reliable ... so why would they TRULY be so focused on getting him to say more words? I think getting those details were not really their aim.)
2 In fact, I think BH-and-Friends goal in the whole case was to get JVDS to think he was bulletproof if he confessed, and that they were going to be happy with ANY sentence and even ANY confession from JVDS, just so long as he admitted under oath he murdered NH. What was he giving them? They were only going to believe WHAT THEY ALREADY KNEW, which means they learned nothing at all.
3 How JVDS can be prosecuted further:
a. He is now locked into 1 story, that he cannot change, as to the events with NH. That's huge. If he backtracks, it's a perjury charge, and more time served.
b. While Aruba has a SOL, they also have people there who are not happy that they had a murderer who tricked them, lied, and then goes scot free. You could see this coming, and it happened. He has now made it clear that HE MURDERED A YOUNG TOURIST JUST BECAUSE HE FELT LIKE IT. (And he can't go back and say he didn't do it.) I don't think they will let this lie until they find a way to bring justice to the situation. Previously they didn't care, but now it matters. And his words can be used against him in Aruban court.
c. JVDS words cannot be used against him in US court -- but he can be tried in the US using what FBI already knew beforehand, as well as what they might learn in the future. US law says he can be tried here for crime against a US citizen, if that other country is unable or unwilling to do so, which means any Aruban SOL works against him in relation to the USA's ability to prosecute.
d. It is possible that, with his confession under oath, prior differing statements might now make him subject to perjury charges for those other untruthful sworn statements.

 

[schooling]

I've long believed that Joran slipped a date-rape drug into her drink at the bar they met at and that's why she left so willingly with him. I used to follow this case back in the day...

Back in the day when Riehl World View was reporting out what the locals were saying....this was the prevailing theory. A lot came out about Joran and his crew's M.O. at Charli and Carlo's (or whatever).

I remember reading that friends knew that she was drunk. And that Natalie was barely able to walk. And thats why they were OK with letting her get into the car. As they promised to bring her directly home. And they trusted Joran because they had seen him on previous nights there and he was buying everyone drinks. They told Joran that Natalie had to fly out early the next morning and they figured that would be more motivation to make sure she got home.

When you're that young you make stupid decisions like that.

 

[William N]

Back in the day when Riehl World View was reporting out what the locals were saying....this was the prevailing theory. A lot came out about Joran and his crew's M.O. at Charli and Carlo's (or whatever).

I remember reading that friends knew that she was drunk. And that Natalie was barely able to walk. And thats why they were OK with letting her get into the car. As they promised to bring her directly home. And they trusted Joran because they had seen him on previous nights there and he was buying everyone drinks. They told Joran that Natalie had to fly out early the next morning and they figured that would be more motivation to make sure she got home.

When you're that young you make stupid decisions like that.

How many times have we seen cases were a girl goes off alone with a boy (or man) she doesn't know and is never seen alive again?

 

[Marysmith]

How many times have we seen cases were a girl goes off alone with a boy (or man) she doesn't know and is never seen alive again?

But I think he friends did know him as well as they could know someone there… they had met him before that night.

 

[Seattle1]

Joran van der Sloot's extradition to Peru is DELAYED

Natalee Holloway's killer remains in the US after the plane that was due to take him back to Peru to serve out a separate sentence for murder malfunctioned.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Mica]

Natalee Holloway’s confessed killer returns to Peru to serve out sentence in another murder​

Natalee Holloway’s confessed killer returns to Peru to serve out sentence in another murder

A Dutchman who recently confessed to killing American high school student Natalee Holloway in 2005 in Aruba was returned to Peru on Tuesday to serve the remainder of his prison sentence for murderi…

nypost.com

 

[schooling]

Attorney says van der Sloot's confession about Natalee Holloway's murder was 'chilling'

A lie detector test conducted by FBI agents determined with the “highest level of confidence” that Joran van der Sloot was telling the truth about killing Natalee Holloway

abcnews.go.com

so it looks like the FBI interview was extremely thorough and took 3 hours to complete. It’s especially telling when the quote from that article says that it was clear the FBI used every resource.

And the interview combined with the lie detector test has them confident that they have their person.

 

[Seattle1]

Attorney says van der Sloot's confession about Natalee Holloway's murder was 'chilling'

A lie detector test conducted by FBI agents determined with the “highest level of confidence” that Joran van der Sloot was telling the truth about killing Natalee Holloway

abcnews.go.com

so it looks like the FBI interview was extremely thorough and took 3 hours to complete. It’s especially telling when the quote from that article says that it was clear the FBI used every resource.

And the interview combined with the lie detector test has them confident that they have their person.

I don't think there's ever been any doubt that they had the right person but what the family really wanted to know was the how, where, and when their daughter and sister was murdered.

IMO, JVDS confirmed what they'd long believed which is that he murdered Natalee when she fought off his sexual advances, adding he used a cinder block and his physical limbs to extinguish her life.

That said, I think I'm with Dave -- Natalee's father in that he continues to question who helped him conceal his crime.

IMO, this begins with what did JVDS really do with Natalee's body after killing her on the beach because it's not logical that we dragged her to knee deep water and the ocean simply carried her away forever.

I think this is nonsense but you can't have every thing when dealing with a psychopath. JMO

 

[minor4th]

Back in the day when Riehl World View was reporting out what the locals were saying....this was the prevailing theory. A lot came out about Joran and his crew's M.O. at Charli and Carlo's (or whatever).

I remember reading that friends knew that she was drunk. And that Natalie was barely able to walk. And thats why they were OK with letting her get into the car. As they promised to bring her directly home. And they trusted Joran because they had seen him on previous nights there and he was buying everyone drinks. They told Joran that Natalie had to fly out early the next morning and they figured that would be more motivation to make sure she got home.

When you're that young you make stupid decisions like that.

Riehl World View - that brings back memories. The Natalee Holloway case was my first foray into true crime. I’m glad to see it come full circle. I never understood all the hostility toward the family- Joran was so obviously guilty.

 

[minor4th]

Aruban Police Are Embarrassed by Joran van der Sloot Murder Confession: ‘We Were Outsmarted by a Teenager’ (Exclusive)​

'It doesn’t make us look very good,' a law enforcement source on the island tells The Messenger. 'It's embarrassing'​

Aruban Police Are Embarrassed by Joran van der Sloot Murder Confession: 'We Were Outsmarted by a Teenager' (Exclusive)

'It doesn’t make us look very good,' a law enforcement source on the island tells The Messenger. 'It's embarrassing.'

themessenger.com

It’s been an embarrassment since 2005. This was a solvable murder, but the Aruban were too focused on tourism - they didn’t actually want to solve the crime IMO

 

[Marysmith]

It’s been an embarrassment since 2005. This was a solvable murder, but the Aruban were too focused on tourism - they didn’t actually want to solve the crime IMO

And because it wasn’t dealt with another innocent young person was murdered.
ETA: At least one other.