CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013 - #5

[No Joe Friday]

Okay, you all want me to give up my concept, but why? It freakin' fits!

Give me a reason.

Because it might not be right, no matter how convinced you are. Plain and simple. No one has asked you to give the concept up -- just to consider other possibilities and to stop asserting your speculation as fact. Is that so difficult or so terrible?

 

[FiveFelines]

- I have been reading up on this fascinating case ( due in large part by finding this great site.....seriously, thank you to everyone who participates)

- always thought that "how she ended up inside the tank" was the most polarizing.

- I'm still not sure if the tank doors had locks on them.

I made a video showing how she could have ended up inside the tank, and how she fit through the tank door

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRa9nDWdmZo&feature=youtu.be

Awesome analysis. Thank you for taking the time to make this video!

 

[noodled1]

Link to transcripts of the CNN interview:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1302/22/cnr.12.html

Reading that. thanks

So what day are we putting her in the bookstore? that kind of reads like it's the 31st

 

[AlphaWolf]

Nice video, was that you in the dummy demonstration? Elisa may have been carried inside a luggage case, can you test that out using the wall ladder? Did you try the fireman's carry using the dummy?

How likely is it that Elisa accidentally "slipped" into the water tank opening? While it may be easy to fit inside, I don't think it's easy to fall inside, especially with the metal pipes there which can be used for grip.

I can test the luggage case....but I know from experience that it would be almost impossible to carry 115lbs+ up a wall ladder by hand.....you could use a rope and pull it up.( but even that it hard to do for the average person)


If she was somewhat stable, she could have braced herself from falling inside the tank door (assuming it was already open) she would have had to fall straight in....as the opening is only 16" X 18"

( also reports said the body had very little to no trauma)

 

[bessie]

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[bessie]

Reading that. thanks

So what day are we putting her in the bookstore? that kind of reads like it's the 31st

LAH: That was January 31st. The young woman planned to see more of California, say police...

LAH is CNN correspondent Kyung Lah.

CNN Newsroom transcript aired February 22, 2013 - 14:30 ET

 

[houndstooth]

LAH is CNN correspondent Kyung Lah.

CNN Newsroom transcript aired February 22, 2013 - 14:30 ET

Do we know this by the use of credit cards for room rentals and book purchases?

 

[Xavier]

I can test the luggage case....but I know from experience that it would be almost impossible to carry 115lbs+ up a wall ladder by hand.....you could use a rope and pull it up.( but even that it hard to do for the average person)


If she was somewhat stable, she could have braced herself from falling inside the tank door (assuming it was already open) she would have had to fall straight in....as the opening is only 16" X 18"

( also reports said the body had very little to no trauma)

IMO if Elisa did commit suicide it's interesting she selected the water tank, since I've been reading one of the Chinese burial rites is cleansing the naked body in water

I don't think it's a suicide. From reading EL had alot to look forward to in life, friends, family, promising future career. And her look on the elevator showed an upbeat, playful demeanor

 

[fred&edna]

Okay, you all want me to give up my concept, but why? It freakin' fits!

Give me a reason. I'm starting to think that the real reason I'm upsetting you all, is because you're like me and can't figure out of it.

I've fallen behind on this thread and so I'm not sure about your concept, but if you have facts to support it and you are unconvinced by those who disagree then... so be it.

I still believe she is "mimicking" some kind of double pulling (of something?) when she bends her knees on that video. I don't think anyone agrees (and I'm not sure we will ever know) but that doesn't stop me from believing Also, I'm not trying to convince anyone else either.

 

[houndstooth]

I am actually curious about the tight timeline for reporting her missing.
I recall reading she was reporte missing on Feb.1.
She is an adult. At what time of day was she reported missing?
Was it because she missed a deadline for a phonecall home?
That seems extreme, yet warranted after the fact only.

I realize that there is no 24 hour wait for adults to be reported missing is there?

 

[Marlon]

IMO if Elisa did commit suicide it's interesting she selected the water tank, since I've been reading one of the Chinese burial rites is cleansing the naked body in water

I don't think it's a suicide. From reading EL had alot to look forward to in life, friends, family, promising future career. And her look on the elevator showed an upbeat, playful demeanor

Im sorry, but most suicides come out of the blue,.. Or . Nobody noticed cos the person seemed as "having much to look forward to in life" etc etc... Heck,. Mind goes over matter.

 

[Xavier]

I've read all of the threads on Elisa's case but rarely post. I'm curious, if she was due to check out on the 1st, was her room cleaned (and personal belongings taken to Lost & Found) or did they just leave the room the way it was? You'd think they'd have to go in there to clean the room. If they saw a laptop or other personal belongings... It would be obvious something was not right. Did they ignore that or was the room just not cleaned for a few days?

I don't think she harmed herself, but if she did and left a note - could it have been cleaned up by housekeeping (assuming they did go in)? If she did take her own life, maybe she took a cocktail of prescribed meds and got in the tank to ensure she didn't wake up and/or wasn't saved. Maybe she chose to commit suicide in another country so that her parents didn't have to deal with the body, etc. Maybe she left a note to explain things and its gone, causing the mystery. That could be why she scheduled the Tumblr posts the way she did.

What goes against suicide, I think, is that she had more stops to make and more sights to see. Why end your life at this point? Maybe the creepy hotel's history appealed to her. As others have posted, though, she seemed depressed but not suicidal. I guess you never really know. Meds can also cause people to do things they normally wouldn't. Also, if she was nude, where did her clothes go?

It is all just so sad and I can't wait for answers. Thank you to all who have kept this forum going - even without news. I've been addicted to it and I appreciate all who have contributed. I especially appreciate anansie's translations. They are amazing and very helpful!

Good thinking...LAPD would've had to cordon off EL's room, since she's the victim of possible "foul play" as they put

I would like to think her room will not be cleaned or occupied by another guest until LAPD has everything they need from it

I would also check her hotel phone logs...using the htoel phone is really a rip off, especially for long distance outside of the romaing area and if she's on a tight travel budget, I doubt she used the hotel phone, but maybe she did, we don't know

 

[FiveFelines]

I am actually curious about the tight timeline for reporting her missing.
I recall reading she was reporte missing on Feb.1.
She is an adult. At what time of day was she reported missing?
Was it because she missed a deadline for a phonecall home?
That seems extreme, yet warranted after the fact only.

I realize that there is no 24 hour wait for adults to be reported missing is there?

Was it because she was supposed to check out that day? Although... do we know who reported her missing? Was it her family or the hotel staff?

 

[FiveFelines]

Im sorry, but most suicides come out of the blue,.. Or . Nobody noticed cos the person seemed as "having much to look forward to in life" etc etc... Heck,. Mind goes over matter.

Often true. And if it does turn out that she killed herself (not my personal theory, but not implausible, IMO), I wonder if her family will accept that. I've read of some cases where parents don't want to believe that their loved ones would commit suicide, especially if it's in an unusual way like this. Something tells me if that's the ruling, there will always be people who think she was murdered.

 

[houndstooth]

Was it because she was supposed to check out that day? Although... do we know who reported her missing? Was it her family or the hotel staff?

It's something surprisingly I haven't seen discussed.
But, I don't think it would be hotel staff directly.
Only if upon not reaching EL, her family contacted the front
desk to ask if she'd checked out...but still, I am surprised the
haste with which she was reported missing. Do we know at what
time of day on Feb 1st police were first contacted?

 

[necco]

Im sorry, but most suicides come out of the blue,.. Or . Nobody noticed cos the person seemed as "having much to look forward to in life" etc etc... Heck,. Mind goes over matter.

Excellent point. Many suicides don't happen at the rock bottom of depression. At rock bottom, it's too much effort. I believe it was Susanna Kaysen who characterized mental illness as velocity or viscosity. The bottom of depression is often like trying to walk through jell-o. It is when people start feeling a bit better that many suicides occur because they actually have the energy and motivation to do something. Also, making the decision and coming up with a plan often bolsters a person spirits as there is an end in sight. (I'm looking for links that back this up, this is being dredged up from the back of my mind from the place where old psych classes are stored.)

Aha! http://www.suicide.org/suicide-myths.html

 

[FiveFelines]

It's something surprisingly I haven't seen discussed.
But, I don't think it would be hotel staff directly.
Only if upon not reaching EL, her family contacted the front
desk to ask if she'd checked out...but still, I am surprised the
haste with which she was reported missing. Do we know at what
time of day on Feb 1st police were first contacted?

CNN says that "Lam's parents reported her missing in early February. The last sighting of her was in the hotel on January 31, Los Angeles Police said.":

http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/20/us/california-hotel-water-corpse

Pretty vague, if you ask me.

NY Daily News (ugh) says she "was reported missing on January 31":

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/body-missing-canadian-woman-found-water-tank-article-1.1268631

 

[Xavier]

I've read all of the threads on Elisa's case but rarely post. I'm curious, if she was due to check out on the 1st, was her room cleaned (and personal belongings taken to Lost & Found) or did they just leave the room the way it was? You'd think they'd have to go in there to clean the room. If they saw a laptop or other personal belongings... It would be obvious something was not right. Did they ignore that or was the room just not cleaned for a few days?

I don't think she harmed herself, but if she did and left a note - could it have been cleaned up by housekeeping (assuming they did go in)? If she did take her own life, maybe she took a cocktail of prescribed meds and got in the tank to ensure she didn't wake up and/or wasn't saved. Maybe she chose to commit suicide in another country so that her parents didn't have to deal with the body, etc. Maybe she left a note to explain things and its gone, causing the mystery. That could be why she scheduled the Tumblr posts the way she did.

What goes against suicide, I think, is that she had more stops to make and more sights to see. Why end your life at this point? Maybe the creepy hotel's history appealed to her. As others have posted, though, she seemed depressed but not suicidal. I guess you never really know. Meds can also cause people to do things they normally wouldn't. Also, if she was nude, where did her clothes go?

It is all just so sad and I can't wait for answers. Thank you to all who have kept this forum going - even without news. I've been addicted to it and I appreciate all who have contributed. I especially appreciate anansie's translations. They are amazing and very helpful!

To my know how EL's clothes have not been found

Which makes me think the perp knew the video cams would see what she was wearing that night and taking her clothes would slow down the LAPD much more and the investigation making it more drawn out, which works to the perp's favor

 

[FiveFelines]

Here is another article that says her parents reported her missing, initially to the RCMP, who contacting LAPD. That makes me wonder if they reported her missing on February 1 when they didn't receive a call from her. [?]

http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/questions-swirl-after-missing-vancouver-woman-found-dead-at-l-a-hotel-1.1163870

 

[houndstooth]

CNN says that "Lam's parents reported her missing in early February. The last sighting of her was in the hotel on January 31, Los Angeles Police said.":

http://www.cnn.com/2013/02/20/us/california-hotel-water-corpse

Pretty vague, if you ask me.

NY Daily News (ugh) says she "was reported missing on January 31":

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/body-missing-canadian-woman-found-water-tank-article-1.1268631

Wow, really? On the 31st?? I just read a snippet from an article that stated she was reported missing on the 1st and thought that was pretty speedy, like within hours. But, that makes it almost precient...

...and problematic.