CA CA - Hannah, 16, Devonte, 15, & Sierra Hart, 12, Mendocino County, 26 March 2018 #1

[human]

I cannot find the article now. It said that they left MN because a cross was burned on their property in Alexandria.

Then the article said that they left Linn because of an incident a child had at achool, but the children were not attending school.

I looked online, but I cannot find a news story that talks about the cross burning. I would guess it would be newsworthy enough to be printed in lots of Mn papers.

No luck. I wonder if the story was made up?

 

[Whiteorchids]

There is American and there is International Montessori. Both need degrees. Lots to learn in the Montessori method which uses the three dimensional methods of learning that I discussed earlier, even for writing sentences.

I did not realize people confused Waldorf with anything else.

I brought up the Waldorf schools as an example not because the Harts used the method, but because some people felt not using a computer was a terrible injustice done the Hart children.

I brought it up because there are educated tech parents and others who are upset by electronics for kids.

If people want to freak out more, read about Summerhill. That guy would be convicted of child sex abuse nowadays, I feel,

My son is a software engineer electronics is the future going forward everything is computerized even self driving cars are here, tablets are used in public schools, cell phones replacing landlines, electronic wallets, Amazon Alexa controlling lights, dishwashers, etc bar codes on our phones scanned to pay for items, pay bills and taxes online, online school courses.

My parents are old and don’t know how to use a computer and don’t know how to email or text. They are lost and frustrated in this computer world we are living in. Even the President tweets.

I do feel in this generation it would be an injustice not to teach kids how to use computers. As much as we do or don’t like it that’s the world we are living in.

 

[Talullah]

Hide from CPS but take the whole family to protests where tensions are high and anything can happen. Priorities.

 

[EstrellaEspectral]

West Linn and the town next to it, Lake Oswego are very affluent areas and are well known for having a lot of racist people. Not many black people live in those areas except Portland Trailblazer players. Recently it made the news over there that a student was being called the "N word" and the kids bullying him were barely punished. I would totally understand if they wanted to get out of that area, but I wouldn't believe Woodland Washington would be that much better.

I cannot find the article now. It said that they left MN because a cross was burned on their property in Alexandria.

Then the article said that they left Linn because of an incident a child had at achool, but the children were not attending school.

I looked online, but I cannot find a news story that talks about the cross burning. I would guess it would be newsworthy enough to be printed in lots of Mn papers.

No luck. I wonder if the story was made up?

 

[Whiteorchids]

I cannot find the article now. It said that they left MN because a cross was burned on their property in Alexandria.

Then the article said that they left Linn because of an incident a child had at achool, but the children were not attending school.

I looked online, but I cannot find a news story that talks about the cross burning. I would guess it would be newsworthy enough to be printed in lots of Mn papers.

No luck. I wonder if the story was made up?

Someone posted earlier they lived near there it would have made the local news for sure. I think that was made up to make excuses and to get empathy. Klu klux clan? Ok right. Turpins moved a lot as well. I think when they thought a neighbor might be catching on to the abuse they would leave to find a new place. OMO JMO

 

[EstrellaEspectral]

Hide from CPS but take the whole family to protests where tensions are high and anything can happen. Priorities.

Again lots of children are at protests in Portland. I've been going to all sorts of protests in Portland over the years. They usually start peacefully and are family events. When they start going south it's usually at the end and people are leaving with their children. Our rule is that the moment things get rowdy and we no longer feel safe, we get the heck out.

 

[everybodhi]

From your link:
SUV's on-board computer shows the vehicle, a 2003 GMC Yukon, stopped at a dirt pullout off Highway 1 on the California coast, and then accelerated a distance of 70 feet before driving over the cliff, plunging about 100 feet onto the rocks below.
"The speedometer could have moved at impact or somehow was manipulated," Baarts said. "We do have reason to believe, however, that the crash was intentional."

can one accelerate that quickly? From 0-90 within 70 feet?

No.

WHAT WE KNOW: HART FAMILY CRASH

Greg Baarts, Acting Assistant Chief for CHP, Northern Division, said Sunday the speedometer of the Hart family's SUV was "pinned" at 90 mph. CHP cautioned that finding is not conclusive.

"A statement regarding the speedometer reading of 90 mph prior to the collision does not mean the vehicle was traveling at 90 mph," CHP said in a press release Monday. "The speedometer reading could have been affected by the impact, affected by an electrical charge, or could have been unintentionally manipulated during recovery efforts."

 

[Whiteorchids]

The dogs in the birthday video and photos were really cute. They weren’t found in the house. They must have been in the SUV too. I’m an animal lover and this is upsetting.

 

[everybodhi]

They said based on the information they have at this time they believe it was intentional. They have not confirmed it yet. They might confirm it tomorrow, but I don't believe they have yet. I respectfully disagree that this is a "fact" at this moment.

The only other explanation is the driver was disoriented and tired, and driving at night, possibly fog, not paying the proper attention.

It’s easier to imagine a teenager making that mistake, they have a bad record going over cliffs around the SF Bay Area.
Or, someone altered on drugs or alcohol.

I don’t know if we will ever know, definitively, if it was an accident or intentional.
If not for the timing of the abuse allegations, driving off a cliff is usually written off as an accident around here, absent a suicide threat or note.
The history and the timing of abuse allegations changed all that.

 

[LayzeeDayzee]

Yes, now that we know the car stopped, it seems reasonable some got out.
They had dogs that needed to be walked, too.

Yes but if you're planning to drive your family over the side of a cliff and into the ocean, are you really going to worry about stopping right beforehand to walk the dogs?

 

[wendiesan]

Thanks everybodhi for the clarification regarding the speedometer.

 

[Jax49]

[h=1]What we know about the mysterious California crash that killed five family members[/h]
https://www.cnn.com/2018/04/02/us/family-suv-pacific-coast-crash-what-we-know/index.html

There is "every indication" that Hannah, Devonte and Sierra were riding in the SUV, too, but it's also possible they were left behind with friends, Allman said.

Authorities are still searching for the three children.

 

[claudianunes]

Just a word of caution about discussing the backgrounds of these kids prior to adoption and any kind of abuse they may have suffered before they were adopted.

This is the narrative of the adopted mothers. Adoption records are sealed. There is no way, right now, to know the circumstances of these kids early lives.

What we do know with certainty is that there was a criminal conviction of one adoptive mother for abuse and several reports over a number of years to others from the kids themselves that their adoptive parents were abusing them.

If I read correctly, kids in Texas can be put up for adoption if their parents are being sentenced to prison for more than 2 years. Likewise, the death of parent(s) with no other family members willing to take the kids could make them eligible for adoption. My point is that it is entirely possible that these kids were never abused prior to adoption.

I agree with you. And it bothers me that the mothers were so "open" about what these kids went through. It wasn't their story and it wasn't their place to share.

 

[claudianunes]

My point was that Bill Gates became a computer genius without being raised with a computer, I think kids will do just dine without one.

I posted articles that some of these back to the land types re thinking electronics are not good for kids work in Silicone Valley . They send their kids to Waldorf schools. It seems that there are some high income people that send their kids to Waldorf type schools.

Kids need a three dimensional life. For instance, what do you learn from a drawing of an apple? A photo? A plastic replica? An actual apple?

Smart boards are a great tool for schools. And there are good things about computers. But children need a foundation in life on which they can build skills and those are learned by dealing with real life.

The Hart kids were isolated in a weird way,

Life is weird to me now. Play dates. What in the heck! We went outside and over to a friend’s house . It was an automatic that your friend was coming out to play unless some event such as chores or relatives visiting happened

I do agree with you to some extent. I was surprised to see so many kids outside, just walking around where I live during Spring Break. I haven't seen it for a while. But at this point, kids do need to have some knowledge of technology, since many things are taken care of online like taxes. Bottom line is, the extremes are not healthy and kids need to be raised to be functioning adults.

 

[Auntisemantic]

Are we basing the idea that they were going hungry by one child going to the neighbors house to get food multiple times one week?
This non biological family is a collection of children, probably all from different backgrounds. IMO some or all may have some trauma or mental issues that stemmed before being adopted.This may be reasons for strange visits to the neighbors.
It was also stated that they didn't eat sugar and grew their own veggies. Could this one child gone over and received food once and thought "wow this is great" and decided to return to get more of the food they didn't have access to at home?
These, of course, are just other views from the outside looking in. It doesn't explain the hurried exit after CSB visited.

I do find it strange that the children didn't have seat belts on but the parents did...usually its the other way around.

* didnt see the NYT article until after I posted.

The three found with the SUV were all siblings (biological) adopted together. The three missing were also biological siblings adopted together.
There were only 2 different backgrounds.
This case is so tragic.
Those kids came from troubled homes, only to endure the hell they lived with up until the end with those 2 cruel & sadistic women.
I can't imagine the terror they must've felt as "momster 1" braked momentarily before flooring the SUV towards the cliff.
So friggin depressing.
RIP to the innocent 6 lives lost.

 

[nothingnew]

Yes, I think it would be in the local news if it had happened. Or even someone in their MN neighborhood would step up and confirm. IMO it didn't happen, just like the grocery story- nobody confirmed that either except Jen.

 

[nothingnew]

I cannot find the article now. It said that they left MN because a cross was burned on their property in Alexandria.

Then the article said that they left Linn because of an incident a child had at achool, but the children were not attending school.

I looked online, but I cannot find a news story that talks about the cross burning. I would guess it would be newsworthy enough to be printed in lots of Mn papers.

No luck. I wonder if the story was made up?

Oops, forgot to add who I was replying to.

 

[everybodhi]

Yes but if you're planning to drive your family over the side of a cliff and into the ocean, are you really going to worry about stopping right beforehand to walk the dogs?

When I try to imagine what happened, I don’t think pulling off the road where they did was planned when they left. I don’t believe they traveled to that particular cliff to drive over it, it was the moment they chose, they happened to be there when that moment came.

Maybe someone in the car had to pee, if you pull over, those dogs are going to want out.
Then everyone wakes up.
It explains them not being in seatbelts.

I also think they very likely may have pulled over to sleep, the kids in the back with the seats down.
The women get out and have a fight, one says, “I want a divorce and I’m taking the kids, you are an abuser”.
It’s freezing on a cliff at night, they got back in the car, exhausted and stressed, maybe one even laid down in the back with the kids.

I think it happened at night because there is hardly any traffic on that road at night but it’s fairly active during the day, especially this time of year.

This is just speculation, trying to imagine wtf could have happened.

 

[everybodhi]

Yes, I think it would be in the local news if it had happened. Or even someone in their MN neighborhood would step up and confirm. IMO it didn't happen, just like the grocery story- nobody confirmed that either except Jen.

There’s so much hearsay from friends and neighbors in this case, pick what you want to believe and there’s some hearsay to confirm it.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

I cannot find the article now. It said that they left MN because a cross was burned on their property in Alexandria.

Then the article said that they left Linn because of an incident a child had at achool, but the children were not attending school.

I looked online, but I cannot find a news story that talks about the cross burning. I would guess it would be newsworthy enough to be printed in lots of Mn papers.

No luck. I wonder if the story was made up?

Here is the article

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ple-plunged-cliff-fled-home-targeted-KKK.html