CA - Jonathan Gerrish, Ellen Chung, daughter, 1 & dog, suspicious death remote hiking area, Aug 2021

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I know that to be true. I once "memorized" (yeah right) the general ranger station map after a friend turned back with the copy. Later, I encountered a deliberately twisted trail sign. A five mile hike then turned into a nine mile hike during August heat in Texas.

After that sweaty and thirsty lesson, I order and use the USGS topographic map for any area that I am hiking- and also take two copies of the ranger station map.

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There might not of been a drug or poison. Rather, there could have been collective panic, stress and tunnel vision compounding each other and snowballing.

In hiking groups, this can lead to the abandonment of needed gear, the rejection of clearly viable courses of action, energy wasted trying to do everything at once- but actually doing nothing, obessive tunnel vision on a risky or contradictory solution as being the "only solution", obsessively retaining un needed gear etc.

My guess is that one of the adults started to falter. This produced stress. But.... the presence of and danger to the baby snowballed the stress into stress approximating close combat. The adults had probably never experienced anywhere near this level of stress in the past.

Sadly, on this occasion, panic might have set in resulting in tunnel vision, contradictory efforts, energy wasted on doing everything, but accomplishing nothing. Then factor in the heat. Heat can be stullifying- like thinking in slow motion. The second adult then started to falter and things got worse.

I experienced some of the above on a hike. Many points of logic said to ignore the sign (twisted) and take the trail off the mesa. A brief backtrack confirmed the logic. My mind just kept going into "re-set mode.
I do wonder if Ellen had existing vulnerabilities as she said she was diagnosed with a “debilitating health condition” in a May 2018 IG post, quit her job, and said she may never work for a company again (“good bye corporate America and hello funemployment”). I think that was in addition to her TBI, which happened in 2008. If she was the more experienced hiker of the two (and she also had knowledge of medicine and first aid), Jonathan might have panicked if she was incapacitated and not known what to do next.
 
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Could she have been trying to get to a higher area to get phone reception to call for help?

There don’t seem to be any woods in that area—just exposed switchbacks—no cover. So I would have a hard time thinking there were any meth labs in that area, but I don’t know. You’re thinking of fentanyl I think for the super deadly drug.

I get what you’re saying that they seemed to be making some strange decisions, including going on a hike in the first place in the afternoon when the temps were in the 100’s. With a baby in a hot pack and a furry dog. I also wonder if there was something clouding their judgement, but it could have even been something that started at home. I don’t know if that makes sense & not entirely sure what I mean but I am so stuck on why they went on that hike in the conditions that they did.

Also I agree that normally a mother wouldn’t leave her baby alive or dead. We don’t really know if that was even what she was doing. Maybe she was just trying to get to the top of a hill to see how far away they were or where they even were if they were maybe lost. It’s all confusing.
 
So here's a question that popped into my head while chewing on the different scenarios -- for those of you who've had the misfortune of losing someone to suicide, how many of those people made the effort to reach a place like this for the purpose of taking their life? Of the many, many people I have lost to suicide, all of them chose a place that was at least moderately private -- rooms with closed doors, barns, garages. Those who chose a public place still made an effort towards privacy -- a cemetery at night, a dense patch of woods in a state forest, parked in a car on a remote, unpaved road. I mean, I know that there is no rulebook for suicide, but I feel like midway through a hike on a public trail is a very odd choice unless it had some sort of significance to them. It makes me think that suicide is the least likely choice just based on location alone.

To answer just that question in my experience on the Blue Ridge Parkway and other National Parks there are several suicides every year. People who want to go to a place that is beautiful and what they would want to be the last thing they see, or that has a special memory for them. Some go to a more secluded place some not.
 
To answer just that question in my experience on the Blue Ridge Parkway and other National Parks there are several suicides every year. People who want to go to a place that is beautiful and what they would want to be the last thing they see, or that has a special memory for them. Some go to a more secluded place some not.
Devil's gulch is not beautiful this time of the year.
 
Thanks, @Cryptic. Your post above makes a lot of sense to me. In my experience, catastrophe from human error is rarely one big mistake but more like a snowball. I can't stop thinking of this family, and what I think is that one simple desire -- a short, nearby Sunday jaunt with baby and dog-- slid into a series of grievous misfortunes and mistakes. Which in the end, is very human and unlucky.
 
I do wonder if Ellen had existing vulnerabilities as she said she was diagnosed with a “debilitating health condition” in a May 2018 IG post, quit her job, and said she may never work for a company again (“good bye corporate America and hello funemployment”). I think that was in addition to her TBI, which happened in 2008. If she was the more experienced hiker of the two (and she also had knowledge of medicine and first aid), Jonathan might have panicked if she was incapacitated and not known what to do next.
I think the reverse is the more likely scenario - Jonathan was physically incapacitated and Ellen due to her prior health conditions (which I would guess were mental health related rather than physical), might have panicked and not known what exactly to do next even though she was an experienced hiker.
 
I think the reverse is the more likely scenario - Jonathan was physically incapacitated and Ellen due to her prior health conditions (which I would guess were mental health related rather than physical), might have panicked and not known what exactly to do next even though she was an experienced hiker.
I think either scenario is plausible.

Witnessing the effects of heat stroke is pretty upsetting. I used to think that the term "heat stroke" was just a dramatic way of describing someone who had become dehydrated and tired in hot weather. But then one day, while on a long hilly hike with a friend, I saw what heatstroke was really about.

We had been hiking uphill for almost two hours. Temps were in the 90s with minimal shade. All of a sudden, my friend (who had seemed fine the entire hike) said he felt a little dizzy and needed to sit down. A minute or two after sitting down, he remarked that his arms and legs felt numb. A minute or two after that, he could no longer speak--he could only moan. He remained in a seated position against a rock, but he couldn't lift his head, which was hanging down. He behaved as if he had serious brain damage. I had no idea what to do. I tried to give him water, but he couldn't drink--at least not voluntarily.

While I desperately tried to figure out what I should do, a man and woman approached from the other direction on the trail. The man immediately said "this is heatstroke; we've got to cool him down." Fortunately, there was a lake just a quarter mile away up trail. We carried my friend to the lake (which wasn't easy), and submerged him in the water. He seemed relatively fine after just a few minutes in the lake.

If my friend and I had been entirely alone on that trail, I don't know what I would have done. I was pretty panicked seeing my friend in the state he was in. The nearest road was probably an hour's hike away. Maybe the smart thing to do would have been to immediately start hiking for that road, but that wasn't my initial instinct. It seemed like my friend was dying and I didn't want to leave him.
 
Since they routinely went hiking every weekend (presumably) on this same trail, now I wonder what the weather forecast was like from the weekend before (on all hours of the morning/day), and if it was just as hot or a bit milder.

We have had 100*plus down here in the valley. For over 100 days. 103, 105, 109....never a chance for the weather to cool down. Plus the wildfires up in the mountains. Bad air quality.

It hasn't been pretty.
jmo
 
There have been so many cases here, in Australia, where people have got lost in our outback and desert areas and were found dead.

What surprises me here is that the dog died as well.

In just about all the cases here, where there was a dog with them, the dog was usually the only survivor.

I can't recall any cases at all where the dog didn't survive.
 
There have been so many cases here, in Australia, where people have got lost in our outback and desert areas and were found dead.

What surprises me here is that the dog died as well.

In just about all the cases here, where there was a dog with them, the dog was usually the only survivor.

I can't recall any cases at all where the dog didn't survive.

"Dogs get dehydrated faster and are much more susceptible to heatstroke than humans"
When Temperatures Rise, Keep Dogs Off the Trail
 
Here's a case where a man chose to die on a mountain.

'Strychnine poison' killed mystery man on Saddleworth Moor

The man, aged between 65 and 75, was found fully clothed near Dove Stone Reservoir, Oldham on 12 December, 2015.

The day before, he had gone into a pub and asked the way to "the top of the mountain" after travelling by train from London to Manchester.

I think there was another case, of an Australian man who travelled to the US to die on a mountain.

I guess people choose all kinds of places and maybe it was somewhere they loved.

But to die under a hot blazing sun is maybe not a choice that many would make. I don't know.
 
Weather in Yosemite is deceptive. I know Vegas and Southern Utah, even in the summer, the early morning can be nice, not blazing hot. One time I was taking kids for a walk, it felt fine...around 7:00 am, 7:30 we left, by 0800 it was blazing hot!!!! Geez, I was really worried that we wouldn't get back to the school!

It was crazy how fast it got hot.

So, I am not sure what time they left for the hike, but I can see something like this happening.
 
"Dogs get dehydrated faster and are much more susceptible to heatstroke than humans"
When Temperatures Rise, Keep Dogs Off the Trail

Our vet told me that dogs with flat faced snouts, like our shitzu, are more susceptible to heat stroke than dogs with longer snouts, like our German Shepherd. Our Shih Tzu could not tolerate heat at all.


Flat-faced dogs are TWICE as likely to get heat stroke... - Daily ...
https://www.dailymail.co.uk › article-8422757 › Flat-fa...

Jun 18, 2020 — 'Dogs pant to cool down – without a nose, panting is simply less effective. 'In fact, brachycephalic dogs may even generate more heat simply ...
 
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Perhaps the breed of dogs makes a difference and whether they are local to the area and acclimatised to the conditions.

I have yet to hear of any dogs here not surviving when people lost in hot conditions in outback areas were found dead.

Usually it was the dog that left and found humans, and some travelled quite long distances to find help.

"Dogs get dehydrated faster and are much more susceptible to heatstroke than humans"
When Temperatures Rise, Keep Dogs Off the Trail
 
So here's a question that popped into my head while chewing on the different scenarios -- for those of you who've had the misfortune of losing someone to suicide, how many of those people made the effort to reach a place like this for the purpose of taking their life? Of the many, many people I have lost to suicide, all of them chose a place that was at least moderately private -- rooms with closed doors, barns, garages. Those who chose a public place still made an effort towards privacy -- a cemetery at night, a dense patch of woods in a state forest, parked in a car on a remote, unpaved road. I mean, I know that there is no rulebook for suicide, but I feel like midway through a hike on a public trail is a very odd choice unless it had some sort of significance to them. It makes me think that suicide is the least likely choice just based on location alone.

I lost someone very dear to suicide. I see it as a very possible scenario based on the location. Somehow in my mind it makes so much sense. They were doing something they loved so much in the wild. I'll be very happy to see this have a far more innocent explanation, of course. Interesting to note that Ellen and I had yoga acquaintances in common. I studied yoga in San Francisco and Ellen's pre and post natal yoga teacher and I trained together years ago. Lovely woman. I saw many familiar names on her IG page. My heart breaks for all those who loved her and her sweet little family.
 
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