Still Missing Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #29

deugirtni

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I thought that was splitting hairs. Garland had one reason for committing the murders and that was outlined by the prosecution. He held a grudge against Alvin Liknes in relation to a business deal that soured. Alvin's wife was a casualty because she was his wife, and Nathan was a casualty because he slept at the estate sale that night.

It was one event of business grudge leading to the torment of his business partner and anyone else who was in the house.

If they were conscious at the acreage, and perhaps Alvin was, then each murdered for a different reason makes a lot more sense ... but that doesn't make sense to the public because there was no proof that they died at the acreage ...


... unless it's in the blood spatter evidence.

Princess Buttercup and Centrail Alberta, could you please repost the information you gathered about blood spatter evidence.

Thanks

What I'm thinking is that there's a reason why the defence conceded that Alvin and Kathryn were separate events. The defence attempted to argue that Nathan was part of the original event by claiming accident, and perhaps he was the first, perhaps he wasn't. We always want to believe the most gentle interpretation of evidence tweeted to the universe.

What was the media thinking by contesting a no-publication order on aerial photos of the dead bodies?

Which news organization made the application?

May I ask where you are getting the impression that KR conceded that AL and KL were separate events? I read it differently myself, and got the impression he sees it all as one event.

Lucie Edwardson [email protected] Feb 17
"It's clear it's one continuous act," says Ross says of #Garland crimes #yyc Gates asks if Nathan's is separate #yyc

Lucie Edwardson [email protected] Feb 17
Ross tells Gates he can look at murders as a continuous act and can give concurrent sentences for A+K and consecutive for Nathan #Garland
 

JadeSLeuth

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This case be like ...
:rollercoaster:
... of emotions and events.
Good Lord, I need a nap every 2.5 hours from thinking about it lol

:thud:
 

deugirtni

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I should have quoted Otto post in his entirety. I did not made it clear that I was referring to the guards involvement.

Yes, understood.. but the recording may show them deliberately turning a blind eye or something.
 

PrincessButtercup

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This case be like ...
:rollercoaster:
... of emotions and events.
Good Lord, I need a nap every 2.5 hours from thinking about it lol

:thud:
I think we need a group ordered nap [emoji42] [emoji42] [emoji42]

Sent from my SM-G920W8 using Tapatalk
 

otto

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It's possible that Allen had written more, but was too emotional and knew he couldn't read it all. He had just listened to Jenn and Rod's statements before his turn. I wouldn't be able to keep my composure either. Just a guess on my part.

Wasn't Allen's (the brother) statement read into the record by the Judge? Alvin's twin brother lives in Mexico - where Alvin was planning to live.
 

naz

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Yes, understood.. but the recording may show them deliberately turning a blind eye or something.

Maybe, when T.Vader claimed that he was hit by a guard, the CCTV showed him going down but that's it. The guards know where the cameras are and must be leery of lawsuits.
 

deugirtni

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Maybe Garland's belief that he was too smart to get caught (let alone be convicted with consecutive sentencing), and voir dire arguments to exclude evidence on the basis of law, just maybe that allowed Garland to believe that he would get away with these murders?

The prosecution probably conceded the exclusion of a percentage of the 1400 pieces of evidence by law, but prosecution and Judge still insist that the victims died at the acreage.

Why?

The Judge mentioned that Garland nearly got away with it by removing all trace of himself at the Liknes house ... other than CCTV of his truck, it was an estate sale mystery - something that scared the crap out of every garage saler in Calgary

DG seemed to believe that he couldn't/wouldn't get convicted because there was no evidence of him being in the L residence. He seemed to also believe the DNA found at the farm would not convict him on the charges that were laid against him, since there was no proof that the victims were killed there. There may have been evidence of other crimes, but he wasn't charged with those. He was apparently trying to have all of the Airdrie evidence excluded because of the initial improper seizure of his shoes. Can you imagine if the Crown had conceded that the family died at the L residence, and then the farm evidence got excluded (Either in this trial or a future appeal trial)? That seems to be why it was so important to the Crown that the actual murders occurred at Airdrie. moo.
 

Spellbound

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I wasn't questioning if it was normal for DG's family to side with the Likneses. Of course it is! Any decent human being would turn their family member in in this situation. What i am questioning is why did Allen say "I'm glad your family turned you in" during his victim impact statement. That is literally the only thing he said so there has to be a reason. When your victim impact statement is only one sentence and you are speaking directly to the murderer you are expecting your one sentence to make a big impact.

Actually, I think that was pretty powerful ... his own family recognized the evil he may have wrought and turned him in, as he should have been. It did not take a long, intense plea for help from the public or LE, it saved even more time dragging on to know where his family was; in short,his own family solved this case quickly and Alvin wanted him to know. Sort of the ultimate pain he could inflict on Douglas, although I doubt he even flinched. After all, was he not estranged from his sister for a very kong time? Also, I am sure it was very difficult for any of them to make a statement in court and knowing it was going to get out to all of us, the public. He probably kept himself from saying a lot more he may have wanted.

I misunderstood your post, sorry. I wonder if we got the 'condensed version' of the twin's VIS, via tweets? Is there anywhere where it is published what the VISs said in their entirety? It sure wasn't much of an impact statement, if that is all there was to it? I took Allen's statement as simply being grateful that he was caught, since without that truck being recognized, who knows what would have happened? I doubt if there is more to it, since I doubt if Alvin's twin would have known anything about DG or his family. I believe he also lived in a different city, IIRC. jmo

BBM
All the impact statements are here. http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/garland-victim-impact-statements-1.3989495

This is all that was from the brother:

[h=2]Alvin Liknes' brother, Allen Liknes, Sr.[/h]I want to thank everyone that was involved in the process of seeing this through the investigation and the court process. I thank God his family turned him in.

 

deugirtni

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Wasn't Allen's (the brother) statement read into the record by the Judge? Alvin's twin brother lives in Mexico - where Alvin was planning to live.

IIRC, Allen also had a vacation property in Mexico, but not sure that he lived there.

Lucie Edwardson [email protected] Feb 17
Allen Liknes, Alvin's brother, will now read his victim impact statement #Garland #yyc

Lucie Edwardson [email protected] Feb 17
Allen begins by thanking the court, says he thanks God #Garland family turned him in. "I have nothing more to say"

Nancy Hixt [email protected] Feb 17
Next is Allen Liknes -Alvin's brother -breaks down, "i just thank God his family turned him in" #Garland
 
D

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People can't be convicted for what is in their mind. Garland could fantasize about all sorts of things, but he can't be convicted of torturing the victims if there's no evidence.

It could all well be true that he was going to torture like what's in his computer hard drive, but even if the prosecutor proved the victims were all alive when removed from the house, some of them may have either deceased on the truck on the way to the farm, or upon arrival, or during the time DG took a shower or went to the doctor's appointment... any time before he returned to the victims to start his sinister plans. This would be quite a real possibility.
 
D

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If Jennifer and Max also stayed for the night as she originally intended, how things could have turned out? Probably worse.
 

JadeSLeuth

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If Jennifer and Max also stayed for the night as she originally intended, how things could have turned out? Probably worse.

I've thought about that so many times
 

kiki09

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It is odd that he was in the common area. I wonder if DG lawyers had to request confinement for their client when he was being processed?

Inmate protection before and during trial is a priority. Once the verdict is read and the sentence handed down, they're released into the wild. As has been mentioned several times, prison is a parallel society with rules, codes and practices of its own.
 

naz

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Inmate protection before and during trial is a priority. Once the verdict is read and the sentence handed down, they're released into the wild. As has been mentioned several times, prison is a parallel society with rules, codes and practices of its own.

Still odd that DG was not segregated..His beating must/should have been foreseen. Not that I care a fig what happens to him..
 

naz

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"What happened at the farm, that does not prove to you that DG caused the death of Alvin Liknes, Kathy Liknes, Nathan O'Brien" Kim Ross.

Did he mean the incineration of the bodies? I know that KR is not implying mercy killings but he sounds tortuous in this statement. I'm not sure what he was implying there if anything at all..
 

otto

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"What happened at the farm, that does not prove to you that DG caused the death of Alvin Liknes, Kathy Liknes, Nathan O'Brien" Kim Ross.

Did he mean the incineration of the bodies? I know that KR is not implying mercy killings but he sounds tortuous in this statement. I'm not sure what he was implying there if anything at all..

What he's implying is that Garland simply disposed of the bodies.
 

kiki09

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Still odd that DG was not segregated..His beating must/should have been foreseen. Not that I care a fig what happens to him..

No doubt it was. As is/was the case with dozens currently in remand. You're talking about a facility notoriously over-crowded, under-funded, under-staffed and housing some of the most dangerous and depraved humans in the city. <modsnip>

It's difficult to read some of the posts about where law inforcement may have slipped up or what the defence may try to appeal. Where I believe the prosecution and judge so admirably succeeded was keeping our perspective on the whole picture. There was not just one, three or five coincidences, no single piece of evidence that was the backbone to this case while the rest remained circumstantial. <modsnip>

Judge Gates imposed the sentence he did, I believe, because DG has no remorse whatsoever. He feels vindicated by his actions based on the fallout he had with Alvin. This case had no business going to trial. It should have been plead out and I have no doubt the judge, prosecution and defence pushed for it. DG forced everyone's hand in this case simply to feed his psychotic ego. I truly believe the gravity of who he is/was will only intensify as time passes.
Whether or not it will ever be shared, I am intrigued to hear what went on behind the scenes over the past 2.5 years.
*apologies for the ramble... it's a rather disconnected rant*
 
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