Identified! Canada - Tofield, AB, 'Septic Tank Sam' Ntv/WhtMale 1046UMAB, Apr'77 - Gordon Edwin Sanderson

[theshadow45]

Bumping, today is Gordon’s birthday.

 

[FrankieFalzon]

The burned-out holes in the clothing suggest that they were torturing him while he was still dressed - an interesting note, since keeping the outer clothes on the victim is not too common in similar cases.

 

[FrankieFalzon]

I stumbled on descriptions of tortures similar to what was done to Gordon. I can't go into much details for the sake of my sanity, but all it took was that groups of perps find themselves in position of power. They were attacking guys who in they saw as below them, after experiencing violence and repression from another group.

Snowtown?

 

[FrankieFalzon]

I believe that rumor about him being a child molester is very important. This is something that would make anyone who heard someone spilling beans about his murder shut up and never came forward. Cause who would like to be the one who helped imprison guys who did a "right thing", torturing and murdering a child molester? This IMO sounds like a direct coverup that could came from people involved, not only show up as stupid conclusion from someone who knew very little about the case.

An excellent point. If there only was a chance to find out who was the first man to have muttered "I hear he was diddlin' kids!" in some local smoke-filled bar outside Alberta, when the discovery of the body at the abandoned farm was brought up for discussion... and if he kept repeating it...

 

[beubeubeu]

The burned-out holes in the clothing suggest that they were torturing him while he was still dressed - an interesting note, since keeping the outer clothes on the victim is not too common in similar cases.

I'd tend to think that was cause it was freezing winter weather and cause likely it was done to him in some garage/barn/unheated basement kind of location, close to where they had their stash of lime.
Taking his clothes off may not cross their minds OR they wanted to decrease any possible numbing effects that cold could bring.

Snowtown?

I don't remember anymore and I'm pretty glad that I don't.

An excellent point. If there only was a chance to find out who was the first man to have muttered "I hear he was diddlin' kids!" in some local smoke-filled bar outside Alberta, when the discovery of the body at the abandoned farm was brought up for discussion... and if he kept repeating it...

For me it's same with lime.
Unless it was common misconception from the time and place - with people genuinely believing that lime speds up decomposition (cause of some urban legend or popular movie theme) - I don't get that logic at all.

I think we can all agree on some facts here:
Lime is used in farming.
Cause lime it's used in farming, farmers are buying and stashing tons of lime to fertlize the soil with it early Spring.
Lime does not speed up decomposition.
Gordon's body was found covered in lime, in the area where there were big farms and farmers.
Septic tanks on the other hand ARE speeding up decomposition.
Gordon was found in a septic tank.

Why the conclusion there was that he was covered in lime cause... "probably" his murderers wanted to sped up his decomposition, so they tried covering him with lime and accidentally just preserved his body better, cause newsflash, lime does not speed up decomposition?!
This is just ridiculous for me.
They put him inside a septic tank, on abandoned property, head down, in a place where NOBODY was expected to show up at all, and where NOBODY was supposed to open that septic tank.
That was what they did to make sure that his body will decompose quickly and that he won't be found.

IMO much better quess in trying to figure out the reason why he was covered in lime would be to consider that he was either murdered where somebody stashed their lime, or that his body was transported there in lime bags or same way that lime bags, and got covered in it accidentally.
And that illogical theory with lime was made or strenghtened just to stop everyone from wondering too much who could have a lot of lime near that abandoned farm.

 

[branmuffin]

I'd tend to think that was cause it was freezing winter weather and cause likely it was done to him in some garage/barn/unheated basement kind of location, close to where they had their stash of lime.
Taking his clothes off may not cross their minds OR they wanted to decrease any possible numbing effects that cold could bring.

I don't remember anymore and I'm pretty glad that I don't.

For me it's same with lime.
Unless it was common misconception from the time and place - with people genuinely believing that lime speds up decomposition (cause of some urban legend or popular movie theme) - I don't get that logic at all.

I think we can all agree on some facts here:
Lime is used in farming.
Cause lime it's used in farming, farmers are buying and stashing tons of lime to fertlize the soil with it early Spring.
Lime does not speed up decomposition.
Gordon's body was found covered in lime, in the area where there were big farms and farmers.
Septic tanks on the other hand ARE speeding up decomposition.
Gordon was found in a septic tank.

Why the conclusion there was that he was covered in lime cause... "probably" his murderers wanted to sped up his decomposition, so they tried covering him with lime and accidentally just preserved his body better, cause newsflash, lime does not speed up decomposition?!
This is just ridiculous for me.
They put him inside a septic tank, on abandoned property, head down, in a place where NOBODY was expected to show up at all, and where NOBODY was supposed to open that septic tank.
That was what they did to make sure that his body will decompose quickly and that he won't be found.

IMO much better quess in trying to figure out the reason why he was covered in lime would be to consider that he was either murdered where somebody stashed their lime, or that his body was transported there in lime bags or same way that lime bags, and got covered in it accidentally.
And that illogical theory with lime was made or strenghtened just to stop everyone from wondering too much who could have a lot of lime near that abandoned farm.

I think there has been a public misconception that lime hastens decomposition ever since seeing WW2 newsreels of grainy images of hundreds of bodies being dumped in mass graves and covered with lime. The lime wasn't to hasten decomp but to counteract the smell of decomposing bodies.

Lime isn't just used in farming. Lime is used in building construction, water purification plants, sewage treatment plants, steel production, cement production and other types of industries.

So maybe a body found on a derelict farm and farms use lime to amend soil and lime was dumped in the septic time, so the lime came from the farm. Yes, that definitely sounds like Occam's Razor. But there's a lot of cement companies in Edmonton. Steel companies. Water purification plants. And last but not least the oil production industry. Remember the oil boom in Edmonton in the 70s? All of these companies use lime in their businesses.

We've been talking about gangs which usually conjures up images of bikers and tattoos and drugs. But there's other gangs too; gangs that trade in stolen vehicles and vehicle parts, gangs that are involved in theft in manufacturing environments. These are all considered blue collar thefts. With the industrial boom going on in Alberta in the 1970s these businesses would be multiplying providing lots of opportunities for work. Did Gordie work in any of these industries? In his high school yearbook he stated he wanted to be a Partsman. I looked up a Partsman. Here's a job advertisement for one:

Partsman I Journeyman - RMA

Rural Municipalities of Alberta

rmalberta.com

Gordie struggled with addiction and multiple interactions with the law. Perhaps he became a partsman/journeyman and had the skills to work in any of those industries listed above. His arrest record may have precluded him from working in a legitimate position but his skills could have come in handy for groups who engaged in organized crime.

Nearly 50 years have gone by since Gordie was murdered. I think it's time Sgt Lammerts releasesd the details of that odd and suspicious interaction he reported on that may shed light on who may be responsible for Gordie's death, regardless of the perp's age. IMO

 

[dotr]

There was a torture scene in the fictionalized film (cannot pinpoint the exact one, there are many) based on a true story about an Amish man involved in the drug trade who secretly helped LE capture a huge shipment of drugs.
When the man was discovered to have been helping LE, he was tortured in a very similar manner as the formerly UID Tofield man experienced, imo, speculation, fwiw.

Complete speculation, fwiw, imo, noting.

''Feb 24, 2017
It is a closed religious society with traditional values. At the turn of the century thousands of Mennonites left Canada for Mexico and the area around Cuauhtémoc. At the time of our 1992 piece, their ways were changing in their society as alcohol and economic problems grew and were faced with a bigger issue, a flourishing drug trade. Immigration and border officials in Canada and the United States said at the time there was a Mennonite Mob smuggling tons of drugs into both countries.''

Salem Mennonite Church (Tofield, Alberta, Canada) - GAMEO

gameo.org

 

[musicaljoke]

I'd tend to think that was cause it was freezing winter weather and cause likely it was done to him in some garage/barn/unheated basement kind of location, close to where they had their stash of lime.
Taking his clothes off may not cross their minds OR they wanted to decrease any possible numbing effects that cold could bring.

I don't remember anymore and I'm pretty glad that I don't.

For me it's same with lime.
Unless it was common misconception from the time and place - with people genuinely believing that lime speds up decomposition (cause of some urban legend or popular movie theme) - I don't get that logic at all.

I think we can all agree on some facts here:
Lime is used in farming.
Cause lime it's used in farming, farmers are buying and stashing tons of lime to fertlize the soil with it early Spring.
Lime does not speed up decomposition.
Gordon's body was found covered in lime, in the area where there were big farms and farmers.
Septic tanks on the other hand ARE speeding up decomposition.
Gordon was found in a septic tank.

Why the conclusion there was that he was covered in lime cause... "probably" his murderers wanted to sped up his decomposition, so they tried covering him with lime and accidentally just preserved his body better, cause newsflash, lime does not speed up decomposition?!
This is just ridiculous for me.
They put him inside a septic tank, on abandoned property, head down, in a place where NOBODY was expected to show up at all, and where NOBODY was supposed to open that septic tank.
That was what they did to make sure that his body will decompose quickly and that he won't be found.

IMO much better quess in trying to figure out the reason why he was covered in lime would be to consider that he was either murdered where somebody stashed their lime, or that his body was transported there in lime bags or same way that lime bags, and got covered in it accidentally.
And that illogical theory with lime was made or strenghtened just to stop everyone from wondering too much who could have a lot of lime near that abandoned farm.

Lime has long been used to neutralize outhouse odors, as well as ward away flies.

 

[theshadow45]

Today is Gordon’s birthday.

 

[Blurgle]

Unless it was common misconception from the time and place - with people genuinely believing that lime speds up decomposition (cause of some urban legend or popular movie theme) - I don't get that logic at all.

That was in fact an extremely common misconception: that because lime reduces the smell, it must be also speeding up decomposition.

 

[searchingforyou]

So...
The blue line is the most obvious path between Edmonton and Lindbrook.
40ish mins long drive... to the Lindbrook "centre".
But if Gordon lived in downtown Edmonton, and ended up somewhere along Range Road 220 (red line) then it's just about 20 minutes.

Orange circle is roughly 5 minutes long drive from the likely location of abandoned farm. Red circle would be roughly 2 minutes.
And this "peculiar incident" happened somewhere there, in January.
View attachment 352906
That exact crossroad look pretty similar to what they showed in the vid but unless their recording was kinda old, it's not the same place.
View attachment 352908
If it's indeed there, then abandoned property was right next to the Cooking Lake.
Which means... somewhere here:
View attachment 352910
Likely no neighbours who could notice anything out of ordinary... but also no way that wind could take away snow from that road.

hi just dropping in a couple years late but i watched the global news video and it was taken from this intersection

53°26'27.8"N 112°48'12.7"W · 51504, Range Rd 200, Beaver County, AB T0B, Canada

51504, Range Rd 200, Beaver County, AB T0B, Canada

www.google.com

implying he was found somewhere in beaver hills estates