CO CO - Garfield Co, WhtMale 35-65, 789UMCO, skeletal in tent, Sep'04

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I'm back to looking at this threads. I haven't read all the posts again, but maybe we can collate some old material, as has @papijoe2002 . I actually thought I saw a major article on this case quite recently, though can I find it? Of course not.

Here's an older one:

madisontramel.medium.com

A Body at No Name Creek

An unidentified man was found at a campsite and is still an enduring Colorado mystery after almost 20 years.
madisontramel.medium.com madisontramel.medium.com
 
This gent has standard backpacking equipment. Backpacking was a whole different adventure back in the day. You took a lot of stuff! It was bulky and heavy. Interestingly, he had fuel for max a week of cooking (depending on size of canister and what he wanted to cook), but 20 packs of cigs. That's one heavy smoker!

Jansport backpack.... Jansport is now owned by Vanity Fair, which also owns TNF, Smartwool, and Altra, all companies that ain't what they used to be. IIRC Jansport has always been a backpack company. At this moment, their backpacks are serviceable (but not remarkable or particularly robust). Back in the day, they were excellent external frame packs for backpacking. I owned one, especially designed for travel. Loved it. IIRC they didn't make it into the revolution towards internal frame packs (led by Gregory) or the specialized women's designs.

IMO this UID is an old-school backpacker. I think he'd had his equipment for a while, and perhaps his way of doing things, maybe back to the early 80's. Eureka tents were very popular then, too. Lighter tents were just coming in. He's old-school about the canteen thing. The filter would have been a new purchase (before that, we generally used iodine). The Sweetwater was newish in early 2000's: I forget, but I own one, purchased in 2005 or so. Nifty thing, and light as things went back then.

There's a lot of consternation ^^^ about the canteens. I attach little significance to them at all, except they're dated. It would not be rare to be carrying that much water for a tough hike; we also don't know how far away the water source was, or whether the UID had a system where he filled the bottles with dirty water and then pumped.

All that stuff? It would all fit in that pack of his, because the sleeping bag, mat, and tent would be strapped onto the outside.

A poncho in any conditions in mountainous Colorado is totally inadequate. It's possible he didn't know that, in which case, he's not from out West, but maybe visited years prior.

I'm thinking he got caught in a blizzard and had to hole up in his tent.
 
RickshawFan said:
This gent has standard backpacking equipment. Backpacking was a whole different adventure back in the day. You took a lot of stuff! It was bulky and heavy. Interestingly, he had fuel for max a week of cooking (depending on size of canister and what he wanted to cook), but 20 packs of cigs. That's one heavy smoker!

Jansport backpack.... Jansport is now owned by Vanity Fair, which also owns TNF, Smartwool, and Altra, all companies that ain't what they used to be. IIRC Jansport has always been a backpack company. At this moment, their backpacks are serviceable (but not remarkable or particularly robust). Back in the day, they were excellent external frame packs for backpacking. I owned one, especially designed for travel. Loved it. IIRC they didn't make it into the revolution towards internal frame packs (led by Gregory) or the specialized women's designs.

IMO this UID is an old-school backpacker. I think he'd had his equipment for a while, and perhaps his way of doing things, maybe back to the early 80's. Eureka tents were very popular then, too. Lighter tents were just coming in. He's old-school about the canteen thing. The filter would have been a new purchase (before that, we generally used iodine). The Sweetwater was newish in early 2000's: I forget, but I own one, purchased in 2005 or so. Nifty thing, and light as things went back then.

There's a lot of consternation ^^^ about the canteens. I attach little significance to them at all, except they're dated. It would not be rare to be carrying that much water for a tough hike; we also don't know how far away the water source was, or whether the UID had a system where he filled the bottles with dirty water and then pumped.

All that stuff? It would all fit in that pack of his, because the sleeping bag, mat, and tent would be strapped onto the outside.

A poncho in any conditions in mountainous Colorado is totally inadequate. It's possible he didn't know that, in which case, he's not from out West, but maybe visited years prior.

I'm thinking he got caught in a blizzard and had to hole up in his tent.
Click to expand...

I remember you and I and a couple of other people having a long discussion about his equipment a while back, prossibly through messages because I couldn't find it here on a quick thread search. We identified a couple of things he didn't have with him that we would have expected from a more experienced hiker.

I have a JanSport daypack, with no frame at all. That dang thing is never going to wear out. Very sturdy.

I agree the blizzard theory is likely.
 
carbuff said:
I remember you and I and a couple of other people having a long discussion about his equipment a while back, prossibly through messages because I couldn't find it here on a quick thread search. We identified a couple of things he didn't have with him that we would have expected from a more experienced hiker.

I have a JanSport daypack, with no frame at all. That dang thing is never going to wear out. Very sturdy.

I agree the blizzard theory is likely.
Click to expand...
Yes, Jansport continues to make daypacks. You must have one from the good ol' days, because they've lost their verve, at least in the last decade.

Here are some more thoughts for everyone:

On reflection, I think I've decided the things he didn't have with him (I forgot what they even were) were a matter of him digging out his equipment from the garage, and doing a 1980's redux kind of thing. And his boots are very 1980's, before there were the number of brands we have now. He bought a Sweetwater, which was new and current when he went missing. Everything else was from the wayback machine, as far as I can tell.

For me, a big tell is no Nalgenes. Those got standardized because they didn't leak, and the wide mouth let you fill them easily under a waterfall or from a body of water. They were available and de rigueur in the early 80's. I tell ya, this guy was "old school".

The Eureka tent tells me a lot, too. Very popular for backpacking "back in the day".

In the 1980's, it wasn't unusual for a backpack to weigh 60-80 lbs.

It bothers me a bit that there weren't even micro signs of food packaging.No peanut butter tubes (remember those? you filled them yourself?), no tube tops, no pieces of tinfoil...He could have hung it (but no one found it), or he could have used the extreme old-timer method and buried it. It's actually possible he got food poisoning, especially if he used a 1980's approach to backpacking food (that is to say, almost nothing special). Most people didn't use Mountain House because a)it was super bulky; b) it was super salty; c) it was expensive; and d) it wasn't a thing. Yes, by 2004, but really, people still didn't use it that much. There were no tuna foil packs in the grocery store. You could get powdered eggs, take spaghetti, use spices, crackers, gorp, use oil, make pancakes, dried soup....You'd spend the entire trip thinking about food, lol. The Sierra Club had a great book for lightweight food, but you had to kind of know about it (I used this book in the 1980's, but also as a foundation for some recipes on the AT in 2007). Sierra Club backpacking trips used VERY heavy food (and gear).

He does have an impressive number of backups for safety items most people forget about these days (to their regret, sometimes). You can signal with a magnifying glass. He has how many lighters? He had a waterproofed paper map, with clear route. He had a compass.

He didn't spring for a new (or even functional) set of rain gear, though. I'm guessing his old pair didn't fit, and he couldn't afford a new set. It should have been a priority in that location.

They think his trip was a week, yes?

My impression is, if he had 20 packs of Camels left, he must have expired soon into his trip. Otherwise, we'd have to imagine him carrying quite a few more than that for his week. Eeeek! I wish we had an idea how much canister fuel he had left, and which brand. It sounds like he had 2 total, but was he packing out an empty? The stove brand would be helpful too; it could date the event.

It sure is testimony to the durability of the gear that it lasted so many years exposed to the elements in identifiable shape and kept it's colors! Just a reminder to everyone to think carefully and get expert advice and fitting when you buy gear: you are likely to have it for YEARS.
 
My memory growing up in the Montana mountains is that in the summer and early fall, a lot of people don't bother with rain gear because there's so little rain. A poncho to get you through a thunderstorm is about all we carried.

You're right about the big pack. I remember the general formula for how big your pack should be is "not more than about half your body weight. Less for woman." My former Marine buddy in the 70s carried 125 lbs. (aside: My Jansport is from the 90s. :D This one: Vintage 90's Jansport Classic Day Backpack Black Nylon Made in the USA | eBay)

The sleepy cat in the drawing feels like a clue.
 
carbuff said:
My memory growing up in the Montana mountains is that in the summer and early fall, a lot of people don't bother with rain gear because there's so little rain. A poncho to get you through a thunderstorm is about all we carried.

You're right about the big pack. I remember the general formula for how big your pack should be is "not more than about half your body weight. Less for woman." My former Marine buddy in the 70s carried 125 lbs. (aside: My Jansport is from the 90s. :D This one: Vintage 90's Jansport Classic Day Backpack Black Nylon Made in the USA | eBay)

The sleepy cat in the drawing feels like a clue.
Click to expand...
I once signed up for a backpacking trip in Montana mountains with the Sierra Club. 1987 or so. They wanted me to carry the same pack weight as everyone else.The leader guessed 60-70 pounds. As I pointed out to him, I only weighed 105. He said it wouldn't be fair for me to carry less than anyone else (no thought that I might actually eat a lot less than everyone else). I declined my spot on the trip: the "leader" was intolerant and inflexible.
 
RickshawFan said:
Just a reminder to everyone to think carefully and get expert advice and fitting when you buy gear: you are likely to have it for YEARS.
Click to expand...
I'm reiterating this point after Carbuff's loving experience with his/her Jansport daypack. It's, what, coming up on 30 years, @carbuff ?

I'm also developing my point a bit. In the old days, when we did a pack fit (pre 2006), if we were an expert pack fitter, we could even bend the stays of a big internal frame pack to fit the contours of your back. Now, many people go on the internet and pick out a pack because they like the color, someone told them it was the right size, it got "great reviews". This is not a pack fitting. Nor is measuring your back according to someone or other's instructions (you can flinch, and end up 2" off). A pack fitting is when you go to a gear store with trained pack fitters, who may spend and hour and a half with you to get the right fit on a pack that corresponds to what you want to use it for (no more, no less). This is an art and a skill. And the fit is very individual. There are few stores that have this kind of personnel.

Same with sleeping bags: get it properly fitted. Same with a tent: if you're tall, it's hard to find a lightweight tent, 'cos, yes, they like to shave ounces!

This may cost you a bit more than if you simply order something on the internet, but having a pack that fits is a whole different pack experience. And yes, you could have it for 30 years, or, no pack fit and you could be miserable a whole trip.

But, then, consider this poor UID's equipment, and see how it's survived all those years in very harsh conditions. Other than likely mice holes, much of it looks like it might still be useable today.
 
I don't detect any passion between John Doe and Lib. I wouldn't tell my wife that I'd like her to claim the body (of course she would). He spends time mentioning his trip in the glider with Lib instead of telling her how much he loves her.

I'm convinced Lib is his sister.
 
papijoe2002 said:
I don't detect any passion between John Doe and Lib. I wouldn't tell my wife that I'd like her to claim the body (of course she would). He spends time mentioning his trip in the glider with Lib instead of telling her how much he loves her.

I'm convinced Lib is his sister.
Click to expand...
Also with no car found and his affinity for Sleepy Cat Peak I'm convinced that he's a local with no family of his own.
 
papijoe2002 said:
Also with no car found and his affinity for Sleepy Cat Peak I'm convinced that he's a local with no family of his own.
Click to expand...
As a kid I remember going to Sleepy Cat guest ranch in the 60’s.
Closer to Meeker if remembering correctly
 
papijoe2002 said:
Also with no car found and his affinity for Sleepy Cat Peak I'm convinced that he's a local with no family of his own.
Click to expand...
He could have hitched. Otherwise, he'd have had to leave his car at the trailhead for an extended period. Aha! Amtrak train station in Glenwood Springs, which is the closest town?

www.amtrak.com

Glenwood Springs, CO (GSC) | Amtrak

The Amtrak Glenwood Springs, Colorado (CO) Train Station, served by the California Zephyr train, is only about 1 mile from the magnificent Glenwood Canyon.
www.amtrak.com www.amtrak.com
HmmMysterious said:
Or maybe he's an overseas traveler who wanted to visit the park
Click to expand...
The gear is American, and I believe he'd had it for quite a while, except for a few items, like the filter.
 
Last edited:
RickshawFan said:
I'm reiterating this point after Carbuff's loving experience with his/her Jansport daypack. It's, what, coming up on 30 years, @carbuff ?

I'm also developing my point a bit. In the old days, when we did a pack fit (pre 2006), if we were an expert pack fitter, we could even bend the stays of a big internal frame pack to fit the contours of your back. Now, many people go on the internet and pick out a pack because they like the color, someone told them it was the right size, it got "great reviews". This is not a pack fitting. Nor is measuring your back according to someone or other's instructions (you can flinch, and end up 2" off). A pack fitting is when you go to a gear store with trained pack fitters, who may spend and hour and a half with you to get the right fit on a pack that corresponds to what you want to use it for (no more, no less). This is an art and a skill. And the fit is very individual. There are few stores that have this kind of personnel.

Same with sleeping bags: get it properly fitted. Same with a tent: if you're tall, it's hard to find a lightweight tent, 'cos, yes, they like to shave ounces!

This may cost you a bit more than if you simply order something on the internet, but having a pack that fits is a whole different pack experience. And yes, you could have it for 30 years, or, no pack fit and you could be miserable a whole trip.

But, then, consider this poor UID's equipment, and see how it's survived all those years in very harsh conditions. Other than likely mice holes, much of it looks like it might still be useable today.
Click to expand...
I would second everything that @RickshawFan has to say here. And I would add, the same thing applies to boots. There is nothing more miserable than getting two miles into a three-day mountain trip and finding out that your spiffy new boots have a funny seam on the inside that five minutes of walking around the store would have revealed.

Many, though not all, REI stores have qualified fitters, though you might have to make an appointment.

And I'm not sure how old the JanSport is. Minimum of 20 years because at least some of the offspring were still in school.
 
I agree that Lib is probably his sister, niece, maybe even a business partner. The tone is definitely not wife/lover. And I agree that he sounds like a man who lives alone and doesn't have family or others who he expects to be looking for him.

He also sounds like he expects to be found eventually.
 
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