CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #28 *ARREST*

[mcrazingwill]

Agreed. Why they did this interview at all is beyond me ?

New member of Websleuths here, but I've been a lurker for years.

I agree that the R's motives for doing the interview are odd. At the same time, this interview gives us some insight into potentially how many other random people may be aware of the murder plot months ahead of time. This case goes so deep. I hope that people continue to come forward.

 

[Hopefullyhelpful]

I am wondering if LE has requested that the interview not be released. in it's entirety, all at once, for a reason?

I believe most of us here would wholeheartedly agree that the blame for KB's death rests solely with the one(s) who did it...but...Good Lord! If you hear that someone is planning someone else's death, and you have even the remotest indication that the threat is real (BF was upset according to the R's), then by all means, sound the dang alarm!

Frankly, I would have anonymously contacted KB and told her!

BBM we have no indication that they had the remotest indication that the threat was real. Again, I will point out, this was across two states. So.....here is the possible scenario: THIS IS FICTIONAL MOO A POSSIBILITY of how i think it might of gone done

Girl who shall remain nameless shows up for work in a dither (maybe late?)
Employer R says, "Hey, what's got your goat this fine morning?"
Nameless, "I just had the weirdest talk with my BFF, etc...."
R, "That is messed up. Your BFF should call me. If this is true, this man sounds dangerous and she should protect herself as well."
Nameless, "I'll talk to her. Thanks."

later....

R, "Hey, what about your friend, we really should follow up."
Nameless, "Oh...I did....she said he was just spouting off and mad and to forget it. He would never hurt anyone, it was stupid and she feels like a heel for even saying anything. Please forget I said anything to you. I feel so silly betraying my friend's confidence."
R, "Well, if you're sure..."

Dec. 10 R - OH SUGAR. "Hello, FBI?"

Again, this is just how I think it may have gone down and I think that 99% of us would have done the same thing if we are really honest with ourselves. Think about how remote this was. The information was fourth hand...from PF, to KK to nameless to R's. It was across two states and hundreds of miles and by the time it got to the R's, it was a "threat" against an unknown person, by a person only known by the first name of Patrick. Not a lot of info to go on.

 

[Trudie]

No disrespect, but I find it hard to believe that in your entire state if BFF (or the R's) went to LE and said, 'hey, my friend KK just told me that her boyfriend asked her to kill his fiance', that LE wouldn't do anything. I think they would have a responsibility at that point to speak to KK, which would lead them to PF and Kelsey. Just having KK and PF aware that LE were asking questions could be enough to deter the murder. While there is no way to know if it would have made a difference, I believe for Kelsey's sake, LE should have been given the opportunity to look into it.

No. I dealt with

No disrespect, but I find it hard to believe that in your entire state if BFF (or the R's) went to LE and said, 'hey, my friend KK just told me that her boyfriend asked her to kill his fiance', that LE wouldn't do anything. I think they would have a responsibility at that point to speak to KK, which would lead them to PF and Kelsey. Just having KK and PF aware that LE were asking questions could be enough to deter the murder. While there is no way to know if it would have made a difference, I believe for Kelsey's sake, LE should have been given the opportunity to look into it.

It’s my opinion if I go to my local,police & tell them my neighbor asked me to kill or help kill his baby mom in another state they will not act. Because of TOS, I can’t elsborate, further.

 

[Ccging]

This article says KK was taken into custody.

As police continue the investigation into the case, they took an unidentified 32-year-old nurse from Idaho in custody.
Missing Colorado Mom Update: Patrick Frazee's Mistress Told Friend About Murder Plot

In custody! Yahoo!!! I hope this reporting is accurate.

 

[Esma]

Maybe the R's did feel concerned enough to ask the BFF/employee more. They were then told by the BFF that KK said to just drop it, forget all about it and they took that to mean it was just drama and that it had ended and they concluded it was a nothing burger.

 

[UnicornDragon]

No disrespect, but I find it hard to believe that in your entire state if BFF (or the R's) went to LE and said, 'hey, my friend KK just told me that her boyfriend asked her to kill his fiance', that LE wouldn't do anything. I think they would have a responsibility at that point to speak to KK, which would lead them to PF and Kelsey. Just having KK and PF aware that LE were asking questions could be enough to deter the murder. While there is no way to know if it would have made a difference, I believe for Kelsey's sake, LE should have been given the opportunity to look into it.

I've lived in CO. We had a pretty direct threat made at my work place towards a person. It was reported to LE, and it was dismissed same day with minimal effort. There was still a lack of exact evidence, so nothing they would do at the time. DV threats are still heavily ignored, which has been seen time and time again.

Is that every case/every time? No. But it's not uncommon from my understanding.

The R's, what they know is 2nd or 3rd hand, and potentially were told it was nothing after all, just a bad round of drinking or something dumb, and so it was nothing for the rest of October, November and the start of December until it makes national media.

Now, why they are talking to the media now is a different matter, but there's no gag order in place on this case, so anyone as of yet is free to yap away publicly.

 

[Esma]

Isn't that what happened? I'm so confused by all of this! I wish LE would speak or the arrest warrant/search warrants would be released so we would know for sure who went to police first...

We don't know for sure if LE was aware of KK before or after the R's call.

 

[InsightfulSage]

KB is dead due to TWO people's ACTIONS ! 3rd party inactions are moot at this point. IMO

Agreed, the R’s & the BFF’s level of accountability is minor compared to PF & KK. However, to go on TV & act like reluctant heroes is pretty unsettling. I can’t imagine any truly honorable reason for giving the interview. Even the premise of protecting their practice doesn’t cut it for me. IMO.

 

[Herat]

I've lived in CO. We had a pretty direct threat made at my work place towards a person. It was reported to LE, and it was dismissed same day with minimal effort. There was still a lack of exact evidence, so nothing they would do at the time. DV threats are still heavily ignored, which has been seen time and time again.

Is that every case/every time? No. But it's not uncommon from my understanding.

The R's, what they know is 2nd or 3rd hand, and potentially were told it was nothing after all, just a bad round of drinking or something dumb, and so it was nothing for the rest of October, November and the start of December until it makes national media.

Now, why they are talking to the media now is a different matter, but there's no gag order in place on this case, so anyone as of yet is free to yap away publicly.

Yes. This is a lot like what women have to go through to get Restraining Orders against partners who they know to be real threats, but the evidence is more subtle than an ER visit or a burned car

 

[Gunslinging Granny]

New member of Websleuths here, but I've been a lurker for years.

I agree that the R's motives for doing the interview are odd. At the same time, this interview gives us some insight into potentially how many other random people may be aware of the murder plot months ahead of time. This case goes so deep. I hope that people continue to come forward.

The R's motive may be to verify that KK was solicited to kill Kelsey. There are people in Twin Falls professing KK had no knowledge of Patrick's plan and they completely support KK.

 

[Gardener1850]

We don't know for sure if LE was aware of KK before or after the R's call.

Thank you! It's hard to keep it all straight what is confirmed and what is not. I have to keep reminding myself that LE has not even named KK yet to the public.

 

[Trudie]

BBM we have no indication that they had the remotest indication that the threat was real. Again, I will point out, this was across two states. So.....here is the possible scenario: THIS IS FICTIONAL MOO A POSSIBILITY of how i think it might of gone done

Girl who shall remain nameless shows up for work in a dither (maybe late?)
Employer R says, "Hey, what's got your goat this fine morning?"
Nameless, "I just had the weirdest talk with my BFF, etc...."
R, "That is messed up. Your BFF should call me. If this is true, this man sounds dangerous and she should protect herself as well."
Nameless, "I'll talk to her. Thanks."

later....

R, "Hey, what about your friend, we really should follow up."
Nameless, "Oh...I did....she said he was just spouting off and mad and to forget it. He would never hurt anyone, it was stupid and she feels like a heel for even saying anything. Please forget I said anything to you. I feel so silly betraying my friend's confidence."
R, "Well, if you're sure..."

Dec. 10 R - OH SUGAR. "Hello, FBI?"

Again, this is just how I think it may have gone down and I think that 99% of us would have done the same thing if we are really honest with ourselves. Think about how remote this was. The information was fourth hand...from PF, to KK to nameless to R's. It was across two states and hundreds of miles and by the time it got to the R's, it was a "threat" against an unknown person, by a person only known by the first name of Patrick. Not a lot of info to go on.

Ita. Now, if the girl told her lawyer her BFF had a trunk full of guns & ammo and was headed to east on John Doe expressway in a lime green VW, perhaps an APB would have been issued. Idk
In my state, LE are more than overwhelmed with DV, personality disputes, feuding neighbors, etc., MY experience tells me they have little interest w/o evidence.
I might engage in convo with a friend, we discuss John Doe & things we don’t like about him. I might say “oh, I’m going to kill him bc.....”. That does not mean I’m actually plotting a murder. Also, is the BFF a drama queen? Does she sensationalize things?
It strikes me odd KK would discuss murder with anyone. Unless she was trying to create an alibi. Then, when KB is killed, “oh oh, I told my friend in October PF wanted her murdered.” Moo

 

[Gardener1850]

This article says KK was taken into custody.

As police continue the investigation into the case, they took an unidentified 32-year-old nurse from Idaho in custody.
Missing Colorado Mom Update: Patrick Frazee's Mistress Told Friend About Murder Plot

Is Ibtimes MSM?

 

[Lhughessk]

Yes, this is true but we weren't in the shoes of the R's and have no idea how this played out in real time. In retrospect, they must wish they would have said something, but in reality maybe the situation as they experienced it was not taken seriously for multiple reasons- like one person said- 'young people drama' that appeared to have been in passing.

As attorneys and officers of the court, the Rs were kind of in a different category than a general member of the public would be when deciding how to handle the info. It would be interesting to hear from attorneys on this quagmire of a circumstance.

Think about it. You’re an attorney and one of your employees comes to you and shares information. Is she your client at that point, or your employee? Would she have to quit in order to be considered your client?

Then there’s the information - it’s hearsay. The BFF isn’t saying that she heard the threat communicated. She is saying that her friend heard the threat communicated. As a lawyer, I imagine the Rs probably didn’t feel comfortable given their position and reputation with contacting LE right away with a sordid tale of “someone we know said that someone she knows told her that someone she knows asked her to kill somebody.”

I think the right thing that they TRIED to do was to encourage KK to come talk to them. Maybe they were hoping she would agree to talk to LE and they could represent her in that meeting. But KK never showed, and as officers of the court they’re not going to go report things that are hearsay in the way that a member of the public might. JMO

 

[Esma]

Agreed, the R’s & the BFF’s level of accountability is minor compared to PF & KK. However, to go on TV & act like reluctant heroes is pretty unsettling. I can’t imagine any truly honorable reason for giving the interview. Even the premise of protecting their practice doesn’t cut it for me. IMO.

If it was in fact their phone call that brought KK into the light and helped FBI unravel this plot--- which will lead to murder conviction/s- then that is a good thing. I don't think they were acting like reluctant heroes in the video. 2 more interviews to come, we are still missing the full picture.

 

[Hatch]

Agreed, the R’s & the BFF’s level of accountability is minor compared to PF & KK. However, to go on TV & act like reluctant heroes is pretty unsettling. I can’t imagine any truly honorable reason for giving the interview. Even the premise of protecting their practice doesn’t cut it for me. IMO.

I agree IMO just a silent straw ! Until the final outcome is known. Then again LE may suggested the interview to shake more monkeys out of the trees.

 

[BingoBongo]

BBM we have no indication that they had the remotest indication that the threat was real. Again, I will point out, this was across two states. So.....here is the possible scenario: THIS IS FICTIONAL MOO A POSSIBILITY of how i think it might of gone done

Girl who shall remain nameless shows up for work in a dither (maybe late?)
Employer R says, "Hey, what's got your goat this fine morning?"
Nameless, "I just had the weirdest talk with my BFF, etc...."
R, "That is messed up. Your BFF should call me. If this is true, this man sounds dangerous and she should protect herself as well."
Nameless, "I'll talk to her. Thanks."

later....

R, "Hey, what about your friend, we really should follow up."
Nameless, "Oh...I did....she said he was just spouting off and mad and to forget it. He would never hurt anyone, it was stupid and she feels like a heel for even saying anything. Please forget I said anything to you. I feel so silly betraying my friend's confidence."
R, "Well, if you're sure..."

Dec. 10 R - OH SUGAR. "Hello, FBI?"

Again, this is just how I think it may have gone down and I think that 99% of us would have done the same thing if we are really honest with ourselves. Think about how remote this was. The information was fourth hand...from PF, to KK to nameless to R's. It was across two states and hundreds of miles and by the time it got to the R's, it was a "threat" against an unknown person, by a person only known by the first name of Patrick. Not a lot of info to go on.

Not sure what being multiple States has to do with anything in this regard. All they had to do was to have called their local LE, and let LE make decisions as to how to proceed.

What you portray may be very close to the truth, or it may not. We only know that the R's said their employee was "visibly upset".

In my world, a visibly upset person claiming murder is on someone's mind, is enough to call LE.

No. Matter. What.

Edited for typos, blame it on the dog.

 

[Seattle1]

Ugh, getting tired of the people blaming the R’s for not coming forward sooner.

The person who should have called LE was KK! She had all of the info that could have saved KB! She chose to not to. Blame her!!

If you want to blame someone else, blame the bff for not calling LE. The bff knew more info and rather than call LE herself she went to her employers. If she was visibly upset when she told her employers about the situation she should have stepped up and made the call to LE herself, she didn’t.

The R’s asked the bff to have KK call them, did the bff ever relay that to KK? We don’t know. Maybe they did ask the bff about it after she initially came to them and she told them not to worry about it (or something along those lines).

I really wish we were given the entire interview instead of this piecemeal! So many unanswered questions. I wasn't aware of the occupation of the whistle blowers and/or bff when I first watched the interview. I'm now wondering if KK told her bff about a man allegedly soliciting her-- not as her confidant, but trying to feel her out for free legal advice, and why the bff went to her attorney employer to begin with (who responded by suggesting KK contact him personally). And then, we don't know when-- whether the next day, a week,... KK tells them to forget it -- perpetuating the idea it's not serious, maybe just a guy blowing off steam. Legally thinking, the Attorney, and maybe even the bff, would understand that verbally soliciting a crime in itself is not actionable -- there's additional requirements to satisfy the statute. I want to know the rest of the story!! Did the subject never come up again until Thanksgiving? Later? How did the whole thing unfold within their own walls? When did KK realize PF was serious? Give us more, please.

ETA: Colorado criminal solicitation link posted in earlier thread provided a good example for solicitation

• Example: One night Lenny and Mickey are having a beer, when Lenny says to Mickey, “What do you say we kill my wife? That woman needs to die.” Without anything further, Lenny is guilty of nothing more than blowing off steam.
• But... let's say that after Lenny's wife gets killed, the police discover a history of Google queries on Lenny's computer asking the going rate for a hired killer. The prosecutor also finds several of Lenny's friends who testify that Lenny was always discussing scenarios for getting rid of his wife. A jury could find these to be circumstances strongly corroborative of Lenny's intent to kill his wife.

MOO

 

[Gardener1850]

Question-- We heard KK had retained a lawyer. Do we know her attorney's name? Has that person spoken on her behalf anywhere? TIA.

 

[Esma]

I really wish we were given the entire interview instead of this piecemeal! So many unanswered questions. I wasn't aware of the occupation of the whistle blowers and/or bff when I first watched the interview. I'm now wondering if KK told her bff about a man allegedly soliciting her-- not as her confidant, but trying to feel her out for free legal advice, and why the bff went to her attorney employer to begin with (who responded by suggesting KK contact him personally). And then, we don't know when-- whether the next day, a week,... KK tells them to forget it -- perpetuating the idea it's not serious, maybe just a guy blowing off steam. Legally thinking, the Attorney, and maybe even the bff, would understand that verbally soliciting a crime in itself is not actionable -- there's additional requirements to satisfy the statute. I want to know the rest of the story!! Did the subject never come up again until Thanksgiving? Later? How did the whole thing unfold within their own walls? When did KK realize PF was serious? Give us more, please.

ETA: Colorado criminal solicitation link posted in earlier thread provided a good example for solicitation

• Example: One night Lenny and Mickey are having a beer, when Lenny says to Mickey, “What do you say we kill my wife? That woman needs to die.” Without anything further, Lenny is guilty of nothing more than blowing off steam.
• But... let's say that after Lenny's wife gets killed, the police discover a history of Google queries on Lenny's computer asking the going rate for a hired killer. The prosecutor also finds several of Lenny's friends who testify that Lenny was always discussing scenarios for getting rid of his wife. A jury could find these to be circumstances strongly corroborative of Lenny's intent to kill his wife.

MOO

Great points. Puts the BFF in the hot seat, not the R's- imo.