GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #61

Discussion in 'Recently Sentenced and Beyond' started by ColoGirl, Aug 16, 2018.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. ColoGirl

    ColoGirl Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    173
    Likes Received:
    650
    Trophy Points:
    93


  2. liltexans

    liltexans Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    13,446
    Likes Received:
    25,678
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Please continue the discussion here. NK has turned out not to be a victim, but you still cannot call her names or wish violence against her. Just refer to her as NK or Nichol. Name calling and wishing violence upon anyone violate TOS no matter who is being discussed. And do not sleuth her family.
     
  3. Mitch11

    Mitch11 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    147
    Likes Received:
    2,692
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I have just been putting together this list of 'potential' difficulties that CW 'may' have faced in childhood. This information is gleened from the information we have discussed so far. Please feel free to correct any information that maybe incorrect or add your own opinion/findings etc. Obviously we do not know these things definitively happened to CW, so they are suggestions of his potential upbringing (rather than fact).


    Family enmeshment:

    Signs we know of:
    Mother over-involvement in CW life and relationship with SW.

    Mother disrespects and undermines others beliefs/parenting techniques and boundaries (eg nut incident, comments about SW as a mother)

    Power games with them both (e.g. wedding planning, not attending wedding or children's parties, nut incident),

    Their identity as a family may be built upon their children’s success. Eg their talk on his past achievements (eg sports, nascar).

    Threatened when CW married and moved across the country (eg CW responsible for dads increase in drinking, their comments about SW)

    CW may have taken on a caretaker role towards RW’s drinking

    Family dynamics look like they were built on power and submission, rather than equality and respect.


    Effects of enmeshment on an adult: A failure to adequately develop an individual sense of identity and self-esteem, A difficulty regulating one’s own emotions, feeling controlled by others causing them to emotionally withdraw, negatively affect on relationships, difficulty developing appropriate and balanced friendships and difficulties with trust outside immediate family, fear of intimacy as relationships seen as emotionally draining, may seek out relationships in which they are responsible for caring for a partner, repeating what was learned in childhood.


    Fathers substance abuse issues:
    The nature of substance abuse can reduce a child's experience with making friends, so later they may have difficulty with intimate relationships. CW does have issues in these areas

    Addiction tendencies may be familial -both socially modelled and possible genetic trait?

    Impact of growing up with this: overlaps with enmeshment traits, particularly around loss of identity, feelings of responsibility, used to playing the role of the caregiver, may have an excessive need to be in control in order to balance out the chaos in their lives. Or they may constantly need approval, to reassure themselves that they have value. Some become aggressive.


    Attachment
    Mrs Watts described as cold and overbearing. Although its reported he has a close relationship with his dad, he will still be impacted by his relationship with his mother. There are numerous issues that arise from having an in-secure attachment.


    Social modelling
    His family have socially modeled the following:

    Women are domineering.

    Men avoid to cope, rather than confront (eg Dad used substances as a form of escape most likely).

    Unkind behaviour towards others

    No respect for personal boundaries



    Social and emotional development

    Guaranteed CW grew up in an invalidating environment.

    Emotions likely to not be acknowledged let alone expressed, which is a huge issue as this causes someone to lack emotional awareness and stunts development.

    Love and kindness probably 'rewarded' only when doing something right. Therefore, love becomes associated with doing what someone else wants, not inherently given. This will be linked to wanting to be seen as ‘good’.

    Socially he had few friends and lacked a dating history. The question remains why was that? Lack of interest, fear of parental opinion? Etc. This isn’t always an issue, however in this case it is suggests why he was so excited by the prospect of the affair he was having and the thrill he was getting from this.

    Supposedly his sister was 'naughty'. This may be a sign of issues at home (although cannot definitely say this). However, children take up roles in a family. CW has taken up the 'good' boy role, which would be a partial contributor to why he wants to save face and be seen as ‘good’


    Empathy

    Others say he was kind and caring

    Seems empathic towards NK. Why? (Concerned about her being dragged in to the case).

    Important to differentiate between empathy and sympathy. Psychopaths and sociopaths use empathy (not sympathy) to learn about a person and use this in a self-fulfilling manner (eg for their own purpose).

    Psychopath vs sociopath – no criminal history that we are aware, indicates CW is not a psychopath, but rather a sociopath.



    ** There is obviously a lot more that can be added to this””
     
  4. liltexans

    liltexans Moderator Staff Member Moderator

    Messages:
    13,446
    Likes Received:
    25,678
    Trophy Points:
    113
  5. Tricia

    Tricia Owner Websleuths.com Staff Member Administrator Moderator

    Messages:
    26,560
    Likes Received:
    24,584
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Please continue here
     
    Alcina, borndem, kimpage and 8 others like this.
  6. rogue ant

    rogue ant Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    225
    Likes Received:
    770
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Alcina, LeeAnnB, Hazelnutty and 9 others like this.
  7. GraceVPrice

    GraceVPrice Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    293
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Let me preface this post by saying I have an ex who’s a sociopath. I heard all the alarm bells and still believed the lies.

    I listened to the full 2 hour NK interview last night. And about an hour in, a found myself believing her, sympathizing with her about being lied to. And then I stopped myself, just like in my previous relationship, I heard the “alarm bells of lies” when NK speaks but something about the way she delivers it makes my brain gloss it over.

    I don’t think she physically had anything to do with the murders nor do I think she thought this would be the outcome. But I do feel like she felt she was smarter than all of them and better than Shanann. It may have been a competition in her mind to “win” CW. It was very hard to listen to after coming to that realization and wow were her a CW a match or what.

    **edited to add. Just because her father knew "Jim" doesn't mean she wasn't sleeping with him too. My ex also did this, introduced all AP to family and made them feel safe/like she was being honest.**
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2018
  8. sun16

    sun16 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,108
    Likes Received:
    9,979
    Trophy Points:
    113
    So what is going on? The 3 terabyte release of stuff is out there, but we still can’t access all the items? And what about the driveway video? Chris was in the driveway for nearly 25 minutes, but we only have 3 minutes of video that only shows him walking to the truck and loading a gas can?
     
  9. Layla123

    Layla123 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,303
    Likes Received:
    13,950
    Trophy Points:
    113
  10. Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats

    Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    725
    Likes Received:
    10,110
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Did Chris and Ronnie discuss what happened on the ride from the airport?
    Discovery pg 605 (pg 538)
    Chris asked to speak with his dad, agents leave the room. Chris tells his story to his dad, agents come back in and discuss then leave again, Ronnie stays with Chris. At this point Chris asks his dad “Did you tell mom yet”. Ronnie answers no.
    Ronnie has not left the room, when did he have a chance to tell Cindy if he didn’t know before he entered the room. I also think it is odd that when Chris said smothered twice Ronnie said “choke or smothered”, why would he question what Chris was saying, was Chris going off script? Maybe I am looking at it with bias but I don’t know why he wouldn’t just accept Chris saying they were smothered. Chris was very close to his father, it is hard to believe he would not confide and seek his advice.

    I’ve commented before about the agents technique, how masterful they were. Watching how child like Chris is is both sad and disturbing. The agents knew to approach him as if speaking to a child, soft spoken voices, rubbing his back, constant reassurances.
     
  11. ilovewings

    ilovewings Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    992
    Likes Received:
    4,072
    Trophy Points:
    93
    We all know cases involving crime are all awful but there are some cases that stay with me that i will never forget and those cases involve small children. Caylee Anthony is one case that will never leave me: i see her little adorable face sitting in a high chair ---i can't get that picture out of my mind. The second case is this one: I cannot get the faces of Ce Ce and Bella out of my mind and seeing these babies on video makes it so much worse. When you see these sweet babies on video talking, laughing and being just children, it is actually incomprehensible that they are no longer on this earth and thinking of howtheir
    father chose to end their lives in the most horrific way possible is almost an intolerable thought.
     
    Babbakins, libraryg, colmans and 39 others like this.
  12. Check21

    Check21 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    628
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Slightly off topic but the delay in the video made it look like there was a stare down between CW and the female interviewer. (Frequently). Im not sure that was really the case though.
     
  13. Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats

    Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    725
    Likes Received:
    10,110
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Lol, why can’t women or men just speak with the voices they were born with? It is the purposeful change in the voice to create some kind of effect that I find puzzling. Be confident in who you are just how you are, no need for false effects.
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2018
  14. Gingerbread7

    Gingerbread7 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    878
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Does anyone have the exact timeline of when Chris left his house, how long was the drive to cervi 319 and when the first coworker showed up at the sight? I am curious about how much time he had. I imagine those sites have some surveillance. Has anyone any knowledge of surveillance systems at these oil tank sites?
    Also, did Inmate Watts contact anyone during the drive to and from the cervi site or while at the site?
     
  15. zea mays

    zea mays Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    545
    Likes Received:
    7,143
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I'm not a verified anything here, but I worked as an RN in an ENT clinic with a MD who specialized in voice for several years. The speech therapist that I worked with and I had many conversations about vocal fry LONG before it became popular to point it out in pop culture. It can be very annoying. I agree that we don't need to police people's voices, but when it is something that is affected, rather than caused by a condition of the vocal cords people notice it (eta: professionally - I'm not talking about pop culture here).

    I suggest reading this article written by a speech pathology professional organization which writes about the condition/affected speech with a less biased viewpoint.
    Totally Fried
     
  16. askedandanswered

    askedandanswered Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    35
    Likes Received:
    679
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Sorry that you feel like this group is sexist again...I just believe that the change in voice is purposeful and the majority of people that I know that speak with it have an attitude like they’re better than everyone (which I feel NK sounded like in her interview). However, to be quite honest her “vocal fry” has nothing to do with the fact that she showed little emotion in the interview...which was more concerning to me.
     
  17. The Farm

    The Farm Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10,931
    Likes Received:
    7,467
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Good Morning everyone,
    I myself have never heard of vocal fry and the things I learn on here.
    Last night I kept on waking up and thinking about the detective interviews the most. I found it amazing how they worked him, your a good guy, your a good father, everyone likes you. They turn on Shannan and I think that was what really got CW's attention and from there I think they had him in the bag. I found it so amazing but very disappointed that I could not hear everything they were saying.
    Someone way above posted that the camera was set up towards his back so that when CW heard noise behind him it would make him apprehensive (not sure if that was the exact wording) but I never saw him even flinch when there was any noise coming from behind him as a door opening. He seemed cool as a cucumber. I really would have liked to see the interview face on with CW and not his back.
    Of course the more times you look at these video's we will pick up different things and yesterday was truly overload.
    We kept on looking at those driveway videos over and over and now we know that parts are missing as he was seen bringing three bags out which we could not see. Am I correct on that? So today here we go again.....:(
     
  18. Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats

    Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    725
    Likes Received:
    10,110
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I agree, they were quite the match. After watching Chris’s interview, it occurred to me how childlike he is. While NK is not child like, I found her very immature. Her statement when he told her he had kids “ I thought that was cute, really cute” in that sing songy voice was so immature. She had googled Shan’ann, their house, I do not believe it is feasible she did not already know they had children. I don’t believe it is feasible she didn’t know about the pregnancy. Her deceptions through out the interview, deleting tests when there is a woman and children missing, saying work on your marriage while sending nude pictures all speak towards a selfish immaturity that was displayed in the interview.
     
  19. Angela_Beckett

    Angela_Beckett Lurker Extraordinaire

    Messages:
    219
    Likes Received:
    1,066
    Trophy Points:
    93
  20. rogue ant

    rogue ant Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    225
    Likes Received:
    770
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Mickey Mouse, Tiny, sassyblue and 8 others like this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page



  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice