Deaths of Male College Students-General Discussion #6

Discussion in 'Deaths of Male College Students/The River Killers' started by christine2448, Jun 27, 2009.

  1. Eleanor Rigby

    Eleanor Rigby Well-Known Member

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    It would appear he has been found, as all "Missing" posts asking for help have been removed. I certainly hope that is the case.

    Andrew was last seen driving his car, which is unlike the "drowning men" cases where the victims were last seen leaving a bar or party venue on foot after drinking.

    I believe this new case has circumstances more closely fitting the "drowning men" / "river killers" victim profile and circumstances. MOO.
    FL - FL- Matthew Robineau, 21, Melbourne, 10 Feb 2019
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 11, 2019
  2. Kip

    Kip Active Member

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    Yes, I'm glad the Gary, Indiana, detective is reopening the case. However, as the crime was initiated in Chicago, I don't foresee him making much progress. The FBI really needs to get involved in these cases.

    I wonder if any of the other cities will reopen investigations after reviewing the evidence. After these episodes aired, I imagine there must have been at least a bit of public pressure to do so.

    It is interesting that the victims are pretty much all college students. If young men were universally getting drunk and falling into water, you'd expect more variation in the backgrounds of the victims.
     
  3. Eleanor Rigby

    Eleanor Rigby Well-Known Member

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    Matthew Robineau, whom I mentioned in a post here yesterday, was found today--deceased in the Indian River. Apparently, after a night out with friends in downtown Melbourne, FL, he walked over a causeway to the river. I'll be very interested to see the cause and manner of death, if they are made public. (Link at end of post.)

    Reachingfornettles: After reading the article on Matthew, I immediately thought of the incident you related in your post on the previous page of this thread:
    "JMO in my own experience being drugged, I was at a bar by the river and ended up only remembering bits and pieces of the night. I remember being at a dock crying for no reason, walking back to the bar...that was it. I ended up getting the recording from that night from the bar owner and I had one drink."

    First, let me say how glad I am that you did not go off that dock and into the river! Thank you for sharing your story.

    Second, your terrifying experience seems to have similarities to quite a few of the deaths of the "Drowning Men," IMO. Many of the victims inexplicably walked away from a bar and headed off into the night in a direction that made no sense to the people they were with, nor to the family and friends who knew them well. It's really strange that so many victims headed to a body of water! Do you happen to remember if you were on your phone when you walked to the dock on the river? Your experience, and the case of Zach Marr for one, remind me of the few details known about Matthew's case. I wish there was some way for survivors, such as you, to be able to recall what compelled them to go to a river or other body of water. Anyone have any idea what drug causes that reaction?

    I've thought for a while that there may be more than one thing going on that might account for the number of victims recovered from water. Some, like the cases being investigated on the Oxygen series, are pretty clearly victims of homocides, who were deceased before being placed in water. Others, in which the victims did actually die from drowning, are much more mysterious and hard to explain, which likely accounts for them being classified as suicides or accidents. Entering the water while under the influence of a drug that one did not knowingly or willingly ingest, and also possibly under the control of another individual, is NOT an accident NOR a suicide. It's murder! All JMO.

    Police: Missing Brevard County Man Found Dead in Indian River
     
  4. IHAVENOCLUE

    IHAVENOCLUE Well-Known Member

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    I have been intrigued with these "so called" "Smiley Face Killers" cases for years...

    though... And as others have pointed out... I don't think the graffiti is really a marker anymore...

    The mystery of a certain demographics of young, adult, fairly successful males ending up deceased in bodies of water is just TOO coincidental to remain not investigated...

    I read through parts of this great "collection" of cases...
    And the connected comments and questions...

    A question I had NOT thought of before...
    Which I also believe to be quite compelling...
    Is that these cases seemed not to exist...
    Or at least in such great numbers...
    Prior to a certain year(s)...(was it 1996?)...

    Good work Sleuthers!
     
  5. IHAVENOCLUE

    IHAVENOCLUE Well-Known Member

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    I wish to commend these investigators who are dedicating so much effort to uncover the truth behind this mysterious "epidemic"....
    Especially as they are confronted with resistance at so very many organizational... (Governmental?)... Levels!
     
  6. Kip

    Kip Active Member

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    In this latest episode about the death of Thomas Booth, it definitely appears to be a case of murder and not an accident. But the smiley-face link seems tenuous as the group of "friends" he hung out with apparently had a motive for killing him. As far as I know, this is different from the other suspected smiley-face cases. Also, the smiley face they said was painted on the back of the bar seemed pretty abstract - I had trouble recognizing it as a smiley face.
     
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  7. Reachingfornettles

    Reachingfornettles Well-Known Member

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    Thank you....me too! (It caused years of problems for me because of who did it and how I got home?,!?) I remember when I became aware again (only for a moment) that I was honestly freaked out that I was on the dock. There is minimal lighting , not to mention extremely old docks and I'm night blind, it scared me because I was alone and crying and didn't know why...so headed back in the bar...I can only figure that my body and brain were subconsciously aware that something wasn't right...was I sad? No was I angry? ...not that I can reason. I was raised on Lake Erie and on a swampy canal. I love water it's calming. I love the night air, by the water tho not at the bar that I was at ...it stinks due to Edison and Ford plants on the river. So was my body trying to calm itself by doing what I love? I'm an introvert so I would run away from the crowd, but i was scared so I ran back.
    Like in the case with Nick Wilson, he was in a fight and was kicked out of the bar his girlfriend worked at on New Years Eve. I don't think he was a fighter by looking at him. I think the perp would be able to instigate something very easily to create chaos for the Victim. Normal feelings aren't normal and reason ability out the window as with me. Still bothers me I can't recall but I watched myself in the video saying " I don't know that person and I don't dance like that!" So what does this GHB drug do exactly.... GHB Drug: Effects, Hazards & Methods of Abuse - Drugs.com
     
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  8. EmmaRose

    EmmaRose Well-Known Member

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    These disappearances and drowning deaths have resonated with me for years now.

    I can't help but think that our best and brightest are being taken. Maybe a clue lies within who would want to do that.

    Bars should be restricted by law for throwing a customer out into the cold night. I wonder how many of these victims would still be alive today if someone had simply called them a taxi. So tragic.

    It is worrisome that these deaths are dismissed so quickly as accidental drownings. There's just too many of them.... It doesn't seem to matter what city or state, LE reach the same conclusion over and over again. Why?

    I pray we will find the answer to who is responsible and get them off the streets.
     
  9. IHAVENOCLUE

    IHAVENOCLUE Well-Known Member

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  10. Eleanor Rigby

    Eleanor Rigby Well-Known Member

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    It sounds to me like the circumstances in Martin's case are similar enough to those of the others for it to qualify. What is causing so many of these young men inexplicably to wander toward water? I've never heard of "date rape drugs" nor alcohol having this effect, but maybe they do??? @Reachingfornettles posted above in her frightening account that she doesn't have any memory of how or why she ended up on a dock after being drugged at a bar. I absolutely do not buy the "felt compelled to walk far away/ far off his route to pee in a body of water and fell in and drowned" explanation. That's almost ALWAYS the LE explanation. @Reachingfornettles, do you think maybe you went to the dock to pee? MOO.
     
  11. Reachingfornettles

    Reachingfornettles Well-Known Member

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    I'm cracking up...thank you...no. I do feel that if the boys that went in the water that they may snap out of it for a moment and get out of the water. As I watched myself in the video, it's not like I wasn't acting human I was just doing things I wouldn't normally do, talking to people I usually wouldn't approach.. And moving very slowly. Two things that would work against anyone that has a perpetrator lurking. It's our natural instinct to try not to drown and we are talking athletic boys. They most always pee standing up am I right. Unless it's a dose that knocks them out I'm thinking... I wasn't knocked out, just don't remember and nothing made sense. JMO
     
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  12. IHAVENOCLUE

    IHAVENOCLUE Well-Known Member

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    I agree with all your points here, Eleanor Rigby...
    ESPECIALLY in light of the news article in Martin's thread that a doctor has seen an unsettling rise in patients coming to ER for the effects of mysterious drugs being placed in their drinks...(or from some where)...
     
  13. Eleanor Rigby

    Eleanor Rigby Well-Known Member

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    I don't mean to be pestering you @Reachingfornettles, it's just that you are the only person I've ever encountered who was drugged at a bar, inexplicably ended up at the water, and lived to tell about it, so I was really hoping for some insight on what got you to the water. That's why I had asked if you know, from phone records maybe, if you were on your phone during the time you walked to the dock. It was the Zach Marr case that was so unsettling to me, and really made me think that something is drawing these men to the water, and it's not the urge to pee in it. After not being let back in a bar in Boston (a city he was not familiar with) and contacting his cousin to come out and meet him, which she agreed to do, Zach walked off instead of waiting for her. There are surveillance photos of him on the street outside a market talking on his phone, then he walked away while still on the phone, without a coat, on a dangerously cold February night. He walked a considerable distance, trespassed onto a bridge maintenance walkway, and reportedly was seen on CCTV "entering the water." I think his death was classified as a suicide, but the extreme oddness of the circumstances did not convince me of that. Especially with so many other young men (in Boston and so many other places) also mysteriously being drawn to the water and "entering" it by some means. I believe Zach's case is unusual because his actual "entrance" into the water was caught on CCTV. I've become a bit obsessed with trying to discover if being on the phone is a commonality in these cases. Is the "formula" bar + alcohol spiked with a drug + separation from companions / removal from bar + phone conversation + mysterious walk to water = "enter" the water and drown? MOO.
     
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  14. Reachingfornettles

    Reachingfornettles Well-Known Member

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    No problem answering questions, it still lingers, because its lost time and not much memory. I had one drink and within a half hour i was at the dock. I dont recall calling anyone, tho i could have. I didnt even know my ride left me until the next day. I wonder if the setting in of the drug has the brain saying "whats going on ?"..."your not safe" and escaping the loud music and people. I felt very fimiliar with where i was at. I cant remember and it is so scary. Never left a drink alone and never accepted one again. Learned the hard way. I must add that nothing i watched myself doing made any sense. IMO
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2019
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  15. Eleanor Rigby

    Eleanor Rigby Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for your answer! I realize it wasn't easy to piece together what you did. How horrible that your ride left you! So glad that under the terrible circumstances that things didn't turn out worse than they did.

    I've noticed that cell phones are often a part of, or at least present in, these strange scenarios, even with some haunting and terrifying last calls from victims. I've even heard some strange theories about phones in regard to these "drownings," so I'm very curious if phones are "used" in the victimization or are merely coincidental to it because almost everyone carries one.

    Also, I'm wondering if there are actually two different groups of young, male "drowning" victims. One group being the cases investigated by the Smiley Face team in the Oxygen series. In the five episodes I've watched, the investigators make the case that the victims were abducted, held for a period of time, killed and then placed in water, meaning they didn't fall in and drown. The second group, which wasn't included in the Oxygen series, are young males who actually did drown after inexplicably leaving a bar or party and going on foot, usually out of their way, to find and "enter" the water. Both scenarios are tragic and terrifying, and not being properly investigated by LE. MOO.

    Anyone else have any thoughts on the "two different groups" theory?
     
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  16. EmmaRose

    EmmaRose Well-Known Member

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    My heavens, reachingfornettles. Your story is terrifying! I'm so glad nothing further happened to you. We have to watch everything these days.... Such a shame we have to, but evil can be lurking in the most innocent of places. Thank you for sharing what happened to you with us. A good reminder to always be vigilant. Stay safe and well - Emma
     
  17. Reachingfornettles

    Reachingfornettles Well-Known Member

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    Thank you Emma, It was many years ago, say early 2000's yet it had a profound effect and even more an awakening to the fact that it can happen to me just like that. I have also wondered if the drug makes the body heat up and therefore needing the water or air to cool off , or maybe the breathing changes and they feel as though an open space is going to help? JMO
     
  18. EmmaRose

    EmmaRose Well-Known Member

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    Great observations regarding possible effects the drug could have on a person. Again, thank you for your insight.
     
  19. KerrinA

    KerrinA New Member

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    I will originally thought the same thing that the first case was Patrick McNeil 1997 however I am doing research on the cases for a podcast and It dates back further than that I saw 1993 cases that matched. so who knows
     
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  20. Eleanor Rigby

    Eleanor Rigby Well-Known Member

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    Are you able to post the name and episode / date of the podcast here? Thanks.
     
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