Jayelles
New Member
This is going to be long (sorry). I feel a ramble coming on.
Having watched Tracey's documentary a couple of times now and slept in it a few times and mulled it over......
The idea of a bad man killing JonBenet has always been the easiest to understand. She was a treasured child - I honestly believe that she was the most precious thing in Patsy's life. I can't conceive of a motive for John killing her. I don't believe that her father sexually abused her because she seemed to adore him, missed him when he was away. I understand that victims of sexual abuse aren't always obviously scared of their abusers, but would they actually "miss" them when they are away?
One thing that didn't fit for me was the notion that a lone stranger-perp would do a deed like this on Christmas Night when kids were excited and wakeful and people were MORE likely to be at home and receiving visitors. Too risky.
I have never been able to visualise a scenario where either or both Ramseys decided to kill their precious youngest child - apart from anything, they had a busy schedule for the next week or so - if they were going to do that, surely they would have chosen a time when they had a more convenient "window" (I'm being facetious BTW).
An accident followed by a cover-up has some merit, I agree. The Ramseys had a lot to lose and, as we have seen, image is vitally important to them. I think they would cover up anything which might look bad for them (and I believe they HAVE lied over some things in the timeline of events). Still, I do believe the headblow probably came last and so that means the strangulation came first - what kind of "accident" involves strangulation - except rage. If either Patsy or John Ramsey had raged at JonBenet, wouldn't the other have interceded? It doesn't make sense.
The only scenario that really has merit for the Ramseys doing a massive cover-up is one where Burke was involved. This is the only scenario where I can see both Ramseys being involved in a cover-up together - but even it has flaws. I don't think they would have allowed him to leave their sight and I think Burke was almost certainly transfixed by his Nintendo that Christmas and likely to be oblivious to his little sister. I know my son was. I emphasise that I don't believe Burke was involved in his sister's death.
So my best theory to date has been that the killer was someone who knew the family and who had an obsession for Patsy. It still seemed far-fetched, but stranger things have happened. I considered the killer to be intelligent and to have hated JonBenet - been jealous of JonBenet because of the obsession with Patsy
It was frustrating to read of the ramseys stubborn refusal to help the police in the early days of the investigation. I think it demonised them in public opinion. AT first I sympathised with them for the treatment they received at the hands of the media, but I now see that they brought much of this upon themselves by putting themselves before doing everything humanly possible to bring their daughter's killer to justice. I think they should be ashamed of themselves for that. I firmly believe that had they immediately sat down with police and told them everything they knew, that police would have moved on and that perhaps the killer would have been caught.
So now we have Tracey's theory. Not just one bad man, but two. Doing it for kicks and $$$s. Working in a pair makes more sense than the lone intruder-perp. They would egg each other on. Mr X is the scary one, the control freak and Helgoth tagging on for the thrill and hoping for $$$s. Yes, I can buy this theory even although it is disturbing to imagine JonBenet's terrifying end at the hand of two men in black, her parents close by and not responding.
So what is wrong with it? Some pieces still don't gel. For one, Helgoth and Mr X supposedly waited in the Ramsey house for them to return. I think they took a chance there. The Ramseys might have gone to stay with friends or family - as many people do at Christmas. How did they know the Ramseys were going to return?
Were they watching the Ramsey home - of so, from where?
Then there is the matter of the ransom note. If Kenady is to be believed, Helgoth and Mr X PLANNED a kidnapping. A ransom note is a key part of a kidnapping. Surely they would have brought one with them? One which was typed or made from newspaper clippings? A short and to the point ransom note? RST say they wouldn't like to risk being caught with a ransom note on their person - that doesn't fit with them liking to take risks inside people's homes and then of course they run a huge risk of being caught with the kidnappee.
Where did they plan to keep Jonbenet? Kidnappers usually have this carefully planned. If not, these guys must really have been the Bungle Brothers.
Where did they park for several hours whilst waiting? If they waited for hours inside the ramsey home, surely they would have needed to pee or poo? Even at the low end of the waiting scale, they would have to have stayed still, silent and not had to relieve themselves for at least 2 hours (an hour after the ramseys arrived home and an hour before to case the house and write the ransom note).
Finally (for now), there is still the matter of the pineapple. Tracey has never addressed this and as Lou SMit says - it is the big bugaboo. Experts say 2-5 hours for digestion. If she ate it before going to the Whites, that means she died soon after returning home. If she ate it AFTER returning from the WHites, that means the ramseys lied about her being asleep.
Of course, there is always the possibility that Helgoth and Mr X only intended the Ramsey home to be another midnight burglary and that JonBenet disturbed them in their deeds as she crept upstairs after sneaking a piece of pineapple....
Having watched Tracey's documentary a couple of times now and slept in it a few times and mulled it over......
The idea of a bad man killing JonBenet has always been the easiest to understand. She was a treasured child - I honestly believe that she was the most precious thing in Patsy's life. I can't conceive of a motive for John killing her. I don't believe that her father sexually abused her because she seemed to adore him, missed him when he was away. I understand that victims of sexual abuse aren't always obviously scared of their abusers, but would they actually "miss" them when they are away?
One thing that didn't fit for me was the notion that a lone stranger-perp would do a deed like this on Christmas Night when kids were excited and wakeful and people were MORE likely to be at home and receiving visitors. Too risky.
I have never been able to visualise a scenario where either or both Ramseys decided to kill their precious youngest child - apart from anything, they had a busy schedule for the next week or so - if they were going to do that, surely they would have chosen a time when they had a more convenient "window" (I'm being facetious BTW).
An accident followed by a cover-up has some merit, I agree. The Ramseys had a lot to lose and, as we have seen, image is vitally important to them. I think they would cover up anything which might look bad for them (and I believe they HAVE lied over some things in the timeline of events). Still, I do believe the headblow probably came last and so that means the strangulation came first - what kind of "accident" involves strangulation - except rage. If either Patsy or John Ramsey had raged at JonBenet, wouldn't the other have interceded? It doesn't make sense.
The only scenario that really has merit for the Ramseys doing a massive cover-up is one where Burke was involved. This is the only scenario where I can see both Ramseys being involved in a cover-up together - but even it has flaws. I don't think they would have allowed him to leave their sight and I think Burke was almost certainly transfixed by his Nintendo that Christmas and likely to be oblivious to his little sister. I know my son was. I emphasise that I don't believe Burke was involved in his sister's death.
So my best theory to date has been that the killer was someone who knew the family and who had an obsession for Patsy. It still seemed far-fetched, but stranger things have happened. I considered the killer to be intelligent and to have hated JonBenet - been jealous of JonBenet because of the obsession with Patsy
It was frustrating to read of the ramseys stubborn refusal to help the police in the early days of the investigation. I think it demonised them in public opinion. AT first I sympathised with them for the treatment they received at the hands of the media, but I now see that they brought much of this upon themselves by putting themselves before doing everything humanly possible to bring their daughter's killer to justice. I think they should be ashamed of themselves for that. I firmly believe that had they immediately sat down with police and told them everything they knew, that police would have moved on and that perhaps the killer would have been caught.
So now we have Tracey's theory. Not just one bad man, but two. Doing it for kicks and $$$s. Working in a pair makes more sense than the lone intruder-perp. They would egg each other on. Mr X is the scary one, the control freak and Helgoth tagging on for the thrill and hoping for $$$s. Yes, I can buy this theory even although it is disturbing to imagine JonBenet's terrifying end at the hand of two men in black, her parents close by and not responding.
So what is wrong with it? Some pieces still don't gel. For one, Helgoth and Mr X supposedly waited in the Ramsey house for them to return. I think they took a chance there. The Ramseys might have gone to stay with friends or family - as many people do at Christmas. How did they know the Ramseys were going to return?
Were they watching the Ramsey home - of so, from where?
Then there is the matter of the ransom note. If Kenady is to be believed, Helgoth and Mr X PLANNED a kidnapping. A ransom note is a key part of a kidnapping. Surely they would have brought one with them? One which was typed or made from newspaper clippings? A short and to the point ransom note? RST say they wouldn't like to risk being caught with a ransom note on their person - that doesn't fit with them liking to take risks inside people's homes and then of course they run a huge risk of being caught with the kidnappee.
Where did they plan to keep Jonbenet? Kidnappers usually have this carefully planned. If not, these guys must really have been the Bungle Brothers.
Where did they park for several hours whilst waiting? If they waited for hours inside the ramsey home, surely they would have needed to pee or poo? Even at the low end of the waiting scale, they would have to have stayed still, silent and not had to relieve themselves for at least 2 hours (an hour after the ramseys arrived home and an hour before to case the house and write the ransom note).
Finally (for now), there is still the matter of the pineapple. Tracey has never addressed this and as Lou SMit says - it is the big bugaboo. Experts say 2-5 hours for digestion. If she ate it before going to the Whites, that means she died soon after returning home. If she ate it AFTER returning from the WHites, that means the ramseys lied about her being asleep.
Of course, there is always the possibility that Helgoth and Mr X only intended the Ramsey home to be another midnight burglary and that JonBenet disturbed them in their deeds as she crept upstairs after sneaking a piece of pineapple....