Final Autopsy and Toxicology Report

[ripley666]

Where are you getting that there wasn't a "rape kit" performed? They performed an actual autopsy (not just a rape kit, which is obviously more thorough) and she was examined for sexual assault, which there was absolutely zero evidence of. Every person who dies experience dilation -- that isn't an "injury," but a natural occurrence upon death for all human beings.

It's all clearly stated on Page 7 of the autopsy report in the very first post of this thread.

Also, on Page 13, it clearly states that a "sexual assault evidence kit" was implemented. AKA, a rape kit.

Please don't spread misinformation.

Although you are right in that a rape and fingernail kit were implemented, neither were ever processed. You will notice that the autopsy has no results. The autopsy also records (on page 2) subcutaneous pooling of blood in Lam's anal area, which suggests sexual abuse.
The toxicology report did not test for any date rape drugs like Rohypnol (roofies), GHB, or Ketamine.

 

[Userid]

Although you are right in that a rape and fingernail kit were implemented, neither were ever processed. You will notice that the autopsy has no results. The autopsy also records (on page 2) subcutaneous pooling of blood in Lam's anal area, which suggests sexual abuse.
The toxicology report did not test for any date rape drugs like Rohypnol (roofies), GHB, or Ketamine.

That's your interpretation. Not the ME's.

The results of the toxicology report are at the end. Any of those would have shown up in a toxicology report.

Where are you getting your information that the kits were never processed? Source please.

 

[ripley666]

That's your interpretation. Not the ME's.

The results of the toxicology report are at the end. Any of those would have shown up in a toxicology report.

Where are you getting your information that the kits were never processed? Source please.

Sources for rape kit not being processed:
1. Death of Elisa Lam - Wikipedia (under unresolved issues)
2. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....2-the-elisa-lam-mystery-still-no-answers/amp/

The toxicology report doesn’t show the testing of any date rape drugs at all.

There’s no evidence to suggest she was raped but it is standard procedure to test women (especially found nude) for date rape drugs and to both implement AND process the rape kit. The fact that neither were done and included in the autopsy is highly unusual - and that’s not my interpretation - it’s fact.
But hey, maybe the pathologist was just reaaally bad at their job.

 

[Userid]

Sources for rape kit not being processed:
1. Death of Elisa Lam - Wikipedia (under unresolved issues)
2. https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www....2-the-elisa-lam-mystery-still-no-answers/amp/

The toxicology report doesn’t show the testing of any date rape drugs at all.

There’s no evidence to suggest she was raped but it is standard procedure to test women (especially found nude) for date rape drugs and to both implement AND process the rape kit. The fact that neither were done and included in the autopsy is highly unusual - and that’s not my interpretation - it’s fact.
But hey, maybe the pathologist was just reaaally bad at their job.

Wikipedia is never a good source to use. The newspaper article that's sourced on the Wiki page simply states: "For example, attempts were made to procure a fingernail/rape kit to use on Lam, but there is no evidence to suggest that these came to fruition." She forgot to write "to her knowledge" at the end of the quote. This is a logical fallacy on the writer's part. Simply because she herself can't find any evidence that it was processed, doesn't mean that it wasn't actually processed. Logical fallacy: absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

But let's assume you're right, and the rape kit wasn't processed. It's quite possible that there is no sinister reasoning behind why it hasn't been processed yet, considering the amount of rape kits and the back-log that exists in this country (unfortunately).

There was no alcohol found in Elisa's toxicology report, which is the most common way to slip someone a roofie. If alcohol was found in the toxicology report, then a second toxicology test would have been administered, but there wasn't, so it wasn't necessary. The following link explains it well: Toxicology Tests and Autopsies - Elite Learning

The pooling of blood, etc., is consistent with bloating. It isn't necessarily proof of rape.

My overall point is, none of this is "unusual." You can argue that the overall process in this country is flawed, but there is nothing particularly unusual about this specific case, compared to how every other death investigation is handled across the country.

 

[Hue Monguss]

Hello all!
I'm new here. I searched the forums before asking some of these real simple questions.
1) Is this the entire autopsy report? Seems a bit lightweight for such a high profile case.
2) what are the results of the rape kit?
3) what were the results of the hair kit? I'm guessing it contained the hair obtained from her clothing. Helpful to know if it was her hair.
4) Why does the autopsy mention the hoodie as being the only article of clothing soaking wet?
5) Why doesn't the autopsy go into greater detail about finding Cerebral Necrosis?
6) If Elisa Lam suffered Bipolar disorder, Then why was she prescribed Venlafaxine xr, an antidepressant drug? This should not be used with Wellbutrin XL, which is taken for Major Depressive Disorder (MDD).
7) On form 15, under "Toxicology Requests", the "NO" check box is ticked next to "Form 3A"? Yet "Form 3A" is present in the report. Not just that, but why is the original investigators name crossed out and some other name written in? there are some other strange oddities regarding this report, but I'll save those for another forum.
Finally...
8) Why doesn't the autopsy report bare the LA County Seal?

Thank you!

 

[Hue Monguss]

There was no alcohol found in Elisa's toxicology report, which is the most common way to slip someone a roofie. If alcohol was found in the toxicology report, then a second toxicology test would have been administered, but there wasn't, so it wasn't necessary.

Hello,
But you are assuming too much. We rely on science, when it pertains to autopsies. Not guess work or assumption. There are many ways to ingest drugs. I agree, they should have tested for date rape type drugs.
Kind regards

 

[neesaki]

Hello all!
I'm new here. I searched the forums before asking some of these real simple questions.
1) Is this the entire autopsy report? Seems a bit lightweight for such a high profile case.
2) what are the results of the rape kit?
3) what were the results of the hair kit? I'm guessing it contained the hair obtained from her clothing. Helpful to know if it was her hair.
4) Why does the autopsy mention the hoodie as being the only article of clothing soaking wet?
5) Why doesn't the autopsy go into greater detail about finding Cerebral Necrosis?
6) If Elisa Lam suffered Bipolar disorder, Then why was she prescribed Venlafaxine xr, an antidepressant drug? This should not be used with Wellbutrin XL, which is taken for Major Depressive Disorder (MDD).
7) On form 15, under "Toxicology Requests", the "NO" check box is ticked next to "Form 3A"? Yet "Form 3A" is present in the report. Not just that, but why is the original investigators name crossed out and some other name written in? there are some other strange oddities regarding this report, but I'll save those for another forum.
Finally...
8) Why doesn't the autopsy report bare the LA County Seal?

Thank you!

Good questions. I’ve always been suspicious about this case and the “findings”. Welcome to the forum, Hue Monguss!

 

[AlwaysCoffee]

About your point 6 and venlafaxine, I just wanted to comment that my best friend is bipolar and takes V as part of her medication cocktail. I don't know if she's also on Wellbutrin, but I can ask.

She's a social worker and well educated about mental health medication. She has mentioned that it is rare for venlafaxine to help bipolar people, but I just bring it up because it is possible.

Was Elisa type I or type II? Did she have a tendency to rapid cycle? After living with this friend for three years now and witnessing her own manic episodes, I can easily believe that Elisa was experiencing a swing that night.

 

[Heroine]

This is just my opinion and has been for as long as I started following this case. I feel like she was playing hide and seek with someone so to speak. If they were real or not I’m not sure, but either she got in the tank hiding from someone and then for whatever reason she couldn’t get out which makes no sense to me honestly or that someone put her in the tank. I know people who are bipolar but they aren’t insane.
Edited to add one more thing. There has to be other videos of her in that hotel in the days leading up to this if this one was available after all that time. Can’t they check to see who she was around during that time? Like who she talked to and things she may have done.

 

[Hue Monguss]

There has to be other videos of her in that hotel in the days leading up to this if this one was available after all that time. Can’t they check to see who she was around during that time? Like who she talked to and things she may have done.

I'm sure the authorities have footage from other cameras like the one right outside the elevator. It's routine for the police to request 24 hrs before and after the incident in question. I'm just shocked and amazed nobody has made a FOIA Request asking for all surveillance footage and all the case files. The case is closed so there's no legitimate reason to deny the request. They are legally required to supply any documents being requested. They can choose to deny certain documents to protect the identity of individuals or supply a redacted version. So has this been done? If not, then why?

 

[Userid]

Hello,
But you are assuming too much. We rely on science, when it pertains to autopsies. Not guess work or assumption. There are many ways to ingest drugs. I agree, they should have tested for date rape type drugs.
Kind regards

Actually, I'm not assuming anything. I'm going to be AR report.

 

[Userid]

I'm sure the authorities have footage from other cameras like the one right outside the elevator. It's routine for the police to request 24 hrs before and after the incident in question. I'm just shocked and amazed nobody has made a FOIA Request asking for all surveillance footage and all the case files. The case is closed so there's no legitimate reason to deny the request. They are legally required to supply any documents being requested. They can choose to deny certain documents to protect the identity of individuals or supply a redacted version. So has this been done? If not, then why?

The people on this board made a FOIA request -- that's how they got the AR report.

I could be wrong, but I highly doubt you can request "surveillance footage" through FOIA. That footage doesn't belong to any government or law enforcement agency; it belongs to the hotel (I would say).

Either way, FOIA requests can be denied on things like "personal privacy," which would definitely fall under with the tapes, as their were innocent bystanders on said tapes -- this is also why some of the video was edited out after EL got off the elevator (because two people who were simply staying at the hotel got on the elevator, but the police wanted to protect their privacy).

 

[KinseyWannabe]

Userid, I've been following this case for years and am curious about your connection to the case. I'm hoping that it will explain why you must always have the last word. This is a sincere question on my part.

 

[Userid]

Userid, I've been following this case for years and am curious about your connection to the case. I'm hoping that it will explain why you must always have the last word. This is a sincere question on my part.

I was the one who erased part of the video before it was released.

Joking -- I have no connection to the case, like everyone else here. I've just been following it from the beginning.

Also, not sure what your "last word" comment means exactly -- I just comment when I have something to say. I think it's important to not fantasize this case and keep the facts accurate.

 

[Wormybooknerd]

I think some people are disappointed by the fact that the answer to a seemingly complicated case is much simpler than they thought it would be: Elisa got onto the rooftop and willingly climbed into the water tank and died as a result of drowning. I also think it's not fair to her family that people who didn't even know their daughter come up with all sorts of gruesome theories about her death. It must be hard for them to accept what she did and are probably wondering what she was thinking at that time. So if they don't know, then why should a bunch of internet strangers know?

I do think that her mental ilness ultimately led to her death and I dont know if I've mentioned this before but I also think she wasn't taking her medication adequately. For example, she was prescribed 60 caps of the standard Venlafaxine (150 mg) and 60 of Venlafaxine 75 mg and she was supposed to take each of one every day, together. The numbers of remaining caps are uneven: 64 and 60. But my assumption is only based on the number of pills prescribed, on the one of those remaining and the directions of use. But then again I'm not familiar with how prescription medication works in the U.S or Canada. But I'm assuming since it's psychiatric medication involved you get a certain amount that will suffice you until your next appointment.

Also, if she wasn't taking it accordingly, I can completely understand why. It's a bit difficult for such a young person to understand the implications of mental illness and deal with the side effects of these medications.

As a person who is on psychiatric medications I agree with you. I thought the exact same thing on the pill count. I myself have ended up with extra meds when refill was due. And sometimes I all together stop taking them because I "feel" fine. So it's my thinking that she displayed a form of psychosis in the video. And with psychotropic meds if you stop taking them you can have an almost schizophrenia effect as a result and lose control. Thus unknowingly committing suicide. I am not medically schooled but I read and research a lot. And I have studied psychology college books in my alone times. I even tell my doctor what to prescribe and what not to lol. I know my body and mind as well as what works. Lastly the amount of meds she was on and the type of them could also had a part in it. Often times doctors do not think of the interactions mixing can cause. I hope this case finds closure and she might be able to rest in peace. I think it was an accidental suicide imo. And she was tiny wearing clothing far to big for her which could have kept from any sort of bruising. As for the sand substance on her clothes.... she was in California and they have sand. It was likely left over from an outing or something.

 

[Wormybooknerd]

Won't go point by point, but I'd like to comment that while your conclusions are very intelligently stated and well sourced, I would add that you also include a number of speculations and assumptions that may or may not be true. For one thing - the elevator video. You see one thing, I see a scared girl. Why I believe she was scared is up for debate. Again, either a paranoid schizophrenia type of thing, or she legitimately was afraid of someone in the hall. That is entirely open to interpretation, and if it was the latter then of course some of us might be skeptical about "accidental". Secondly, her clothes and personal items being in the tank with her would actually be a smart thing to do by a perp as it would suggest suicide or accidental more than homicide of hiding a naked body in a tank. Additionally, the fact that her father said she was not bi-polar may or may not be true. It is possible that some of her medications were used off-label, and her comments on feeling bi-polar may be her own feelings on it, rather than a professional psychiatrist. Remember, the psychiatrist's diagnosis' has never been put on record. Ultimately what I'm saying is that "accidental death" may be a logical conclusion for law enforcement, but no matter how you cut it, it is still somewhat speculative as, wacked-out theories they may be, there are other ways for this to have happened beside accident or suicide. Maybe not likely, but they are still technically "possible". And despite your dismissal of her father's comments on her psychological issues, I would still point to further quotes from the article:

"The father of a Chinese-Canadian woman whose body was discovered in a hotel's rooftop water tank in downtown Los Angeles said he is unsatisfied with the autopsy conclusion that his daughter accidentally drowned, Canadian media reported.

Lam’s father said that he is planning a trip to L.A. to get more information himself, according to the report."

SNIP

"“How did she climb up (to the rooftop tower) and how did she die? These questions remain unclear,” said Lam’s father to the newspaper Sing Tao Daily. He also said his daughter was alert and quiet that she was not bipolar."

Have you ever hs psychosis? Or delusional thinking? Have you ever take psychotropic medication? Do you suffer from mental illness? If not let me educate you. In 2004 I was told incorrectly I was bipolar (I actually have ADD) the medications was hell. Every single one they gave me cause massive side effects. I almost ran my husband over with the car because I was hallucinating from the medication! I would forget where I was, I would become paranoid and think something was in my house. It was no fun. I finally found a doctor who listened to my words. And fixed it from Bipolar to ADD. I have not had no psychotic breaks since. Know things first hand or research. Because people like me get kinda flustered when those with zero knowledge about what we deal with think they have all the answers.

 

[embufum]

Have you ever hs psychosis? Or delusional thinking? Have you ever take psychotropic medication? Do you suffer from mental illness? If not let me educate you. In 2004 I was told incorrectly I was bipolar (I actually have ADD) the medications was hell. Every single one they gave me cause massive side effects. I almost ran my husband over with the car because I was hallucinating from the medication! I would forget where I was, I would become paranoid and think something was in my house. It was no fun. I finally found a doctor who listened to my words. And fixed it from Bipolar to ADD. I have not had no psychotic breaks since. Know things first hand or research. Because people like me get kinda flustered when those with zero knowledge about what we deal with think they have all the answers.

Finally someone here to give this example. I have a good friend who this happened to and also went through hell because of all the drugs he was given. This poor girl was on so many different kinds of drugs I wonder how she was able to function at all. What bothers me the most is thinking how awful it must have been to be in a tank in total darkness screaming for help with no one to hear you. What a horrible way to die.

 

[Hue Monguss]

...And she was tiny wearing clothing far to big for her... As for the sand substance on her clothes.... she was in California and they have sand. It was likely left over from an outing or something.

Hello! I wouldn't exactly call someone 6'2" 121lbs tiny. Maybe a bit thin. Also Downtown L.A. is not that close to beaches. Getting there using public transportation is no easy task and would take a couple hours by bus. Not to say that she didn't do it. But if you're someone suffering from anxiety or a mental disorder, a crowded bus in downtown L.A. is not the most desirable place to be. Been there, done that. Thankfully we have the benefit of using Uber and Lyft.

 

[Hue Monguss]

Hello! I believe I mentioned the privacy aspect of document requests. But, yes, of coarse you can FOIA video surveillance footage. How do you think news agencies get their footage? Also, if a government entity is in possession of it, then you are entitled to request it. They are required to take whatever steps needed to redact the documents or blur individuals faces in video footage. They can NOT omit any part of video footage. It would no longer be an accurate record of true events as they occurred. If they did omit bits of footage to protect someones identity? Then by doing so, they broke the law. Whoever filed the request should have done something about it. But if they only requested the autopsy report, then that's all you getting. Is the request published somewhere in this forum? I'm interested to know what exactly they requested. Thanks!

 

[Userid]

She was 5'5", not 6'2."

Also, pretty sure the police admitted to removing the footage they showed to the public in order to protect the identities of innocent bystanders who had boarded the elevator after EL.