FL FL - Clifford & Christine Walker, both 23, & 2 kids, Osprey, 20 Dec 1959

So the DNA was inconclusive that it was the killers who snuffed out the Clutter family, right?
 
And sometimes, they forget what they've said in the past.... and the truth or other clues then come to the surface as well. That's happened in numerous cold cases. Also, they may have said things to some people along the way..... and then sometimes, like you said..... they've lived with it so long and just want to get it out and said.

Agree on all points. And, people who didn't think they knew anything ... may have thought of things or remembered things .... and thought it was really so long ago, they didn't feel it was worth bringing up. Some times, it's the smallest thing that leads to the rest.
 
I still keep going back to this. No one in those times, just up and lost track of their .22 rifle. And burned ??? Trying to destroy it and dispose of it ?
If anyone has more info related to what happened to this rifle, what they found out ... if anything, would be interested in it. Even today, some old records on serial numbers can be tracked back to where it was sold, etc.

http://www.heraldtribune.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051219/NEWS/512190421

RUSTY GUN NEW LEAD IN WALKER CASE?

Feb. 16, 1962

A rusty and burned .22 caliber rifle found buried in the dirt Thursday afternoon by two Osprey youths may turn out to be the murder weapon used in the brutal mass slaying of the Clifford Walker family in December 1959.
 
Again, did the DNA clear the In Cold Blood killers?

The DNA evidence was inconclusive, so to answer your question, no it did not clear Smith and Hickock nor were they eliminated as suspects.

On another note, maybe the guy that sold his .22 rifle and couldn't remember who he sold it to, sold it to Smith and Hickock? Whether he did or didn't, I'm now more than ever in the Hickock and Smith did this camp. It takes a special kind of cold to kill a three year old and a baby. The kind of person who would take a majorette uniform and a marriage certificate and knew Christine seems at odds with the kind of person who would rape her and slaughter the whole family. The brutality of the crime sure seemed to suit the likes of Hickock and Smith.
 
Last month marked the 55 year anniversary of the Walker murders. Have there been any anniversary articles about it?
 
I don't think so. I think the killer was obsessed with Christine, knew her and that is why she and her whole family were killed.
 
On another note, maybe the guy that sold his .22 rifle and couldn't remember who he sold it to, sold it to Smith and Hickock?

The reading I've done on it, I think the owner of that .22 was lieing. Plain and simple.

I hate to see a crime like this go unsolved. I think if they had gone thoroughly back thru things and suspects maybe 5-10 yrs later , as if it just occurred, they may have discovered who did it. I don't think it ever will now. Not unless someone makes a deathbed statement, and I think a lot of them are now dead. Don't know who's left alive to even talk to it.

However, I see nothing that should strike Smith and Hickok off the list of suspects either at this point. Vehicle is one thing that makes them even more suspect to me, since one like they were driving had been seen in the area. It appears they had no problem finding a house in the country side, and robbing and / or killing a family.
 
Maybe, they need to dig up the bodies of some of the other suspects and compare DNA evidence as well :

Thought I would put this in here for prosperity.... article when they were exhuming Hickok and Smith for DNA analysis. A comment caught me (below) .... and because I just read one of the suspects (obsessed with Christine) was also in Saratosa that day ..... did Hickok and Smith happen to meet him ? That could have been like mixing gas and a lit match.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/18/richard-hickock-perry-smith-exhumed_n_2324420.html


Hickock and Perry Smith fled to Florida in a stolen car after the Clutter murders. They checked out of a Miami Beach motel on Dec. 19, the day the Walker family was killed, and at some point that day bought items at a Sarasota department store.

Witnesses have said they spoke with Smith and Hickock in Tallahassee on Dec. 21.

McGath said the Walkers were considering buying a 1956 Chevy Bel Air, the kind of car Smith and Hickock were driving through Florida. McGath thinks the Walkers met with the men because of the car.

Smith and Hickock were later arrested in Las Vegas. A polygraph test cleared them of the Walker murders, but a polygraph expert said in 1987 that such tests were worthless in the early 1960s.


And..... this from Pg1 ...............

Wilbur Tooker Reason Suspected: Few suspects seemed to fit better than Wilbur Tooker, a 65-year-old retired railroad worker who got a $101 pension check each month and paid $75 of it in alimony. He lived about a mile southwest of the Walker home and, as the family's closest neighbor, had often visited until he made himself unwelcome because he couldn't keep his hands off Christine. Her mother told investigators that Christine "dreaded" Tooker and was afraid of him. Christine had told her sister that the only way to stop Tooker "was with a bullet."

A half-dozen of the Walkers' friends and family members recounted to investigators how Tooker had, more than once, manhandled Christine, tried to kiss her and get her into bed. When she finally had enough, Christine told her husband. Cliff wanted to kill Tooker, but a friend talked him out of it. Never one to seek out trouble, Cliff warned Tooker not to come around the house anymore because he couldn't behave like a gentleman. Tooker's friend, William Hosmer, told investigators that Tooker was infatuated with Christine and constantly talked about her. After the murders, Hosmer said, Tooker went to the Walker house twice a week because he needed to "gather counter-evidence to protect himself."

Result: Detectives retraced Tooker's steps from the afternoon of the murder. He had eaten dinner in Sarasota with a friend, a retired dentist who said they ate sometime between 5 and 7 p.m. That left Tooker with no alibi between 4 and 5 p.m., when the Walkers were killed. After dinner, Tooker arrived at a Bradenton high school no later than 7:45 and played the violin with the West Coast Symphony Orchestra. Investigators asked people in the orchestra if Tooker seemed troubled, or acted oddly. He "is such a poor player that it would never be possible to determine whether Tooker played more poorly on one night than another," said David Cohen, the orchestra's concert master. Tooker died in March 1963 at Veterans Memorial Hospital in Bradenton and was buried in Edgewood, Ill.
 
They need to dig his *advertiser censored* up and get that DNA. My question is this: how exactly did Tooker meet Christine and how long did he know her? Did her know her when she was in high school?
 
The DNA evidence was inconclusive, so to answer your question, no it did not clear Smith and Hickock nor were they eliminated as suspects.

On another note, maybe the guy that sold his .22 rifle and couldn't remember who he sold it to, sold it to Smith and Hickock? Whether he did or didn't, I'm now more than ever in the Hickock and Smith did this camp. It takes a special kind of cold to kill a three year old and a baby. The kind of person who would take a majorette uniform and a marriage certificate and knew Christine seems at odds with the kind of person who would rape her and slaughter the whole family. The brutality of the crime sure seemed to suit the likes of Hickock and Smith.
The murders happened on the 19th with a bloody cowboy print left at the Walker crime scene. On the 30th the pair was arrested in Las Vegas, just having picked up some items from storage. These items including a pair of boots belonging to Smith were used to tie them to the Clutter murders. According to KBI files other than these recently picked up boots ( which of course we're not with them in Florida) both men had loafer type shoes which left no discernible pattern when arrested in Las Vegas. Not definitive proof of innocence, but one of the many discrepancies in the implication of Smith/Hickock.
 
I have mixed feelings about H & S...capable, yes in the area yup....but, I have a feeling that Smith would have mentioned to Capote. Disappointed that the DNA did not eliminate them though.

Sent from my SM-G925V using Tapatalk
 
They need to dig his *advertiser censored* up and get that DNA. My question is this: how exactly did Tooker meet Christine and how long did he know her? Did her know her when she was in high school?

I agree .. they should. :Also, he lived about 1 mi SW of them, and the rifle was also found 1 mile away (don't know which direction though). As I remember, he had known and seen her when she was in HS. Small town, everyone would know everyone. As I remember he was older than them.

If you want to talk about profiles, this guy was uncontrollably after her .... to me , more likely a person that would take something like the cheerleading outfit, etc. vs Hickok & Smith. The cheerleading outfit, marriage license, etc. are all 'personal' items that I don't see Hickok & Smith caring about ... they would have been more interested in things they could sell and get money for. Since none of that was found with them, and it had no intrinsic value, I doubt it was them. Opportunity ... car type they wanted and being in the town the day of the murder, is a problem in eliminating them though. Wish they could have counted them in our out on DNA.

But, I think checking Tooker's DNA is a definite must if anyone really wants to solve it. They hopefully could rule it was him , or not.

I would be somewhat surprised if Smith wouldn't have told Capote, but then ... on the other side, maybe he didn't want to admit she was assaulted and they killed 2 kids.
 
This case has intrigued me for awhile because it is local (I live in Sarasota).

You know, Florida is often thought of as being primarily a "retirement state" but there is still an element that gives you the feeling you are in the deep South. One theory I have heard is that it was one of Christine's former boyfriends who stalked out the family and shot them but for some reason I have difficulty believing that. I wonder if we will ever know who was responsible for this heinous crime.
 

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
186
Guests online
4,023
Total visitors
4,209

Forum statistics

Threads
592,428
Messages
17,968,758
Members
228,767
Latest member
Dont4get
Back
Top