FL FL - Collier Co, WhtFem 235UFFL, 45-70, in shallow grave, Jun'78

Discussion in 'The Unidentified' started by CarlK90245, Dec 2, 2010.

  1. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: Sep 25, 2018
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  2. KaylaraOwl

    KaylaraOwl Well-Known Member

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    Yes, Doris not Caren (the daughter). The Namus profile says "Cannot estimate" under the weight listing on this UID. Facially (to me) there's a bit of a resemblance. Height is within range as Doris was short. The place this UID was found appears to be on the other side of the Everglades from where Doris went missing.
     
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  3. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    Yes, facially she does look close. Could the UID have been there as long as four years?
     
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  4. KaylaraOwl

    KaylaraOwl Well-Known Member

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    FWIW Namus has the PMI listed as 0-1978. They said she was very decomposed and also covered in Lime. It's possible that whomever killed her thought it would stop the smell or speed up decomposition, but I've read some studies that suggest that burying someone with certain kinds of lime can actually help delay decomposition. We also don't know if Doris would have been killed right after she was reported missing and there was some weirdness with the missing dates when I found their cases. (Doris was listed as missing early in the year, and Caren was listed as missing from like November.)
     
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  5. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    I'd say that's worth submitting then. Nothing to rule it out and quite a bit in its favor.
     
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  6. namstache

    namstache Someday Known: Non-Profit Organization

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    Joyce Kennedy has been officially ruled out.
     
  7. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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    CCSO asks for help in 1978 case of woman found dead in Big Cypress National Preserve
    Dec. 7, 2018
    [​IMG]

    "Collier County Sheriff's Office detectives are asking for the public's help in identifying a woman, whose body was found in 1978.(Photo: Collier County Sheriff's Office)
    Detectives are asking for the public's help identifying a woman whose body was found 40 years ago in a shallow grave in Big Cypress National Preserve, according to the Collier County Sheriff’s Office.

    "The Sheriff’s Office recently updated a composite sketch, hoping to identify the woman who was found in a shallow grave covered in a white powder, possibly lime, according to investigators."
    Her body was found in 1978 off State Road 29 in the national preserve, according to the Sheriff's Office.

    The woman was Caucasian, stood about 5 feet 4 inches tall and had multiple lacerations on her scalp, face and right hand, according to the Sheriff’s Office.

    She was estimated to be between 45 and 70 years old at the time of death; her eye and hair color are unknown, according to the Sheriff’s Office. "
     
  8. silverjug

    silverjug Well-Known Member

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    Was the white powder not tested?
     
  9. Bit of hope

    Bit of hope Have a nice day!

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    OT
    This reminds me of the "lime lady" case.
    It was April 1980 when a group of fisherman discovered the body of a mystery woman along the banks of the North Canadian River in a case that has become Oklahoma's oldest unsolved murder.
    The killers had covered Jane Doe's body in "quicklime," believing the chemical would hasten decomposition, but the substance instead "mummified" the body and preserved evidence, allowing the medical examiner to create a DNA profile of the woman.
     
  10. Bit of hope

    Bit of hope Have a nice day!

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  11. Bit of hope

    Bit of hope Have a nice day!

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    A little different information from the Lost and the Found site (following Namus) The Lost & The Found

    Found buried in a shallow grave on the west bank of Highway 29, 3/10th of a mile south of Alligator Alley. Obese, decomposed, and covered with white powder (possibly lime). Extensive lacerations/mutiliation of face and scalp, and of the right hand.

    Skeletal findings
    The frontal bone displays the early stages of hyperostosis frontalis interna (thickening of the frontal bone). There are pronounced bilateral lesions on the petrous portion of the temporal bone surrounding the auditory tube related to chronic ear infections (otitis media). These lesions may have resulted in some degree of hearing loss due to their close proximity to the auditory nerve.

    There is DNA and dental information.

    Ruled out:
    Helen Vorhees Brach
    Year of birth 1911
    State last known alive Illinois

    Irene Van Buren
    Year of birth 1903
    State last known alive Florida

    Linda Davis
    Year of birth 1946
    State last known alive Oklahoma

    Grace M. Canto Reapp
    Year of birth 1945
    State last known alive Vermont
     
  12. Bit of hope

    Bit of hope Have a nice day!

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    I also wonder what the condition of her teeth were. There is no mentioning of dentals, or a dental plate, missing teeth...

    For convenience; she would have been born between 1908 - 1933

    And did they check if this lady gave birth. I hope so.
     
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  13. madamx

    madamx Well-Known Member

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    Wow this is very interesting..I never heard of the lime lady ... I wonder if they are connected are other similarities or ifvthey are connected...the time frame is close.
     
  14. madamx

    madamx Well-Known Member

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    Thank you dotr for this thread . I had not heard of this woman .

    I was wondering about her weight saying obese. I KNOW in 1978 Obese was not what we consider Obese in 2018. In her reconstruction, she does not look to me like she would be "Obese".

    Also seems like she had no scalp, I can't tell by the description. I don't know where they came up w that hair then..Iam thinking they must of just been remains that were found, but how would they know about the scalp? I guess looking for any Middle Ages Caucasian woman from around that point would be my guess.

    It's frustrating when the info is just so vague! A little smaller window on the time if death could help too. At least they are making an effort to bring this poor woman into the light and hopefully it will jog some memories out there. I do love when they bring up cases from the past Into the public!!!
     
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  15. madamx

    madamx Well-Known Member

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    I found this woman missing from CT she was 5'4 and 150 lbs . I don't know what would qualify as obese in 1978. But I'd thought I would add her anyway.

    3776DFCT - Jacqueline Winfred Kinney

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    Mouse over to enlarge

    Name: Jacqueline Winfred Kinney
    Case Classification: Endangered Missing
    Missing Since: December 5, 1969
    Location Last Seen: Canton, Litchfield County, Connecticut

    Physical Description
    Date of Birth: circa 1934
    Age: 35 years old
    Race: White
    Gender: Female
    Height: 5'4"
    Weight: 150 lbs.
    Hair Color: Red/Auburn
    Eye Color: Blue
    Nickname/Alias: Unknown
    Distinguishing Marks/Features: Right side of abdomen from a previous surgery. Partial disability of left arm, partial paralysis of left side.

    Dentals: Not Available
    Fingerprints: Not Available
    DNA: Available

    Clothing & Personal Items
    Clothing: Unknown
    Jewelry: Unknown
    Additional Personal Items: Unknown

    Circumstances of Disappearance
    Kinney was last seen on December 5, 1969. Few details are available.
     
  16. Elainera

    Elainera Well-Known Member

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    That's a good find madamx. DNA is available for both so it should be relatively easy to rule Jacqueline in or out.
     
  17. ctaylor

    ctaylor Well-Known Member

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    A new article and a new composite sketch at the link for this woman....

    1978 cold case: Help sought to identify woman found dead in Big Cypress Preserve

     
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  18. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    Updated link: Unidentified Person Case

    Ruleouts:

    -- Grace M. Canto Reapp -- -- VT
    MP1733 Linda Davis 01/07/1976 Rogers OK
    MP17790 Joyce Kennedy 03/20/1978 King WA
    MP560 Saunders Rymer 06/20/1977 Bartow GA
    MP23376 Irene Van Buren 10/01/1978 Broward FL
     
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  19. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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  20. Unsolved

    Unsolved Well-Known Member

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    Really a long shot here, but I wonder if they have already checked Marjorie Wilson, missing from Deltona, FL in Dec. 1976?

    NamUs MP3007 Missing Person Case

    The Doe Network: Case File 2871DFFL

    FL - FL - Marjorie Wilson, 66, Deltona, 4 December 1976

    Again I do know it's a long shot, and I have three problems with even bringing it here (but I'm going to have to anyway so I can sleep tonight LOL):

    1) The Lost & The Found link above mentions obese, and Marjorie was only 112 pounds - BUT NamUS says "cannot estimate weight" (so ?)

    2) Marjorie listed as 5' 2" this person estimated 5' 4"

    3) would someone missing in 1976 be consistent with their find in 1978 (tissue, etc.) OR could the lime have affected that?

    Maps show Big Cypress Reserve is only about 1.5 hour drive from Deltona.

    Here's a (poor) side by side I tried to do. Any chance?

    [​IMG]
     

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