FL - FSU Law Professor Dan Markel Murdered by Hitmen *4 Guilty* #22

[cottonweaver]

There were many moments during Rashbaum’s interview that turned my stomach. I had a very hard time watching it to the end but I did. Bringing up Dan Markel’s name and scholarship to defend his killers was beyond despicable. I hope a gag order will be put in place.

Could Everett do that before he appears on Dateline show and - apparently - on Mentour Lawyer for his next interview?

I found him exhausting and at other turns baffling. Occasionally it was like listening to Charlie

 

[Zedzded]

You got me kiddo. This guy could put a spin on a tornado...details, details, details. Technically telling police, "Could you move your police car out of our way, you are blocking the u-haul."...is technically talking to LE, huh? And, "going to the airport is not a crime or a sign of guilt." Technically not. However, I and probably every juror will find it exceedingly suspicious that it was scheduled the day after CA's conviction for murder, they (DA/HA) suddenly had the need to arrange "end-of-life-irrevocable-trusts" (in the event of what?) and a one-way 17 hour flight to a non-extradition country??? If they needed a vacay away from it all...drive to a beachside comminity and turn off your cell phones?
I tried (I really tried) to listen to "Brash-baum" and found it to be an assault on the limits of believability. I thought he was overbearing, exceedingly rude and not likable in the trial. Now after listening to STS interview, my opinion has not changed.

Yeah. No-one ever said DA committed a criminal offence by attempting to flee the country. The point the multitude of legal experts were making was it was consciousness of guilt. A suspects conduct that is suggestive of their guilt like throwing away clothes or trying to flee the country on a way ticket o a country that can't extradite to the US.. Joel needed to hammer that last point. DR defended DA's choice to leave the country and on a one way ticket (I do it all the time, he said). But to tell me people you are trying to find a country you can fly to that can't extradite to the US.....that's not defendable. And lets not forget, DR would have already told her, like he told us, the State does not have a strong case against her so why fear arrest if you're innocent?

 

[mdwannabejd]

With Wendi distancing herself from the family, it could cause Charlie to become more and more bitter and upset that he’s in jail for life and she’s out living her life. If he were to turn on Wendi, what type of incentives can the state offer him. Can he get any substantial reduction in sentence to see the light of day later in life?

 

[Sustained]

With Wendi distancing herself from the family, it could cause Charlie to become more and more bitter and upset that he’s in jail for life and she’s out living her life. If he were to turn on Wendi, what type of incentives can the state offer him. Can he get any substantial reduction in sentence to see the light of day later in life?

Doubt he would get a reduction in sentence but he might get moved to a more favorable prison.

I don't think he'll do anything until his appeals are exhausted.

 

[IQuestion]

Doubt he would get a reduction in sentence but he might get moved to a more favorable prison.

I don't think he'll do anything until his appeals are exhausted.

@Sustained: Great answer!!

With Wendi distancing herself from the family, it could cause Charlie to become more and more bitter and upset that he’s in jail for life and she’s out living her life. If he were to turn on Wendi, what type of incentives can the state offer him. Can he get any substantial reduction in sentence to see the light of day later in life?

@mdwannabejd: Great question!!

 

[Elisaa444]

Dateline is on right now "Family Matters" - discussing the Adelson's

moo/moo

 

[Zedzded]

Yeah like SG, CA will be desperate to get out of prison and even if there's 1% chance of getting out, he'll go for it. Once his appeals are exhausted then he might co-operate, but that will be too late.

 

[Sustained]

After watching Dateline, the two takeaways I have are :

• Wendy deserves an Oscar for her performance the day of the murder and I have no doubt she participated in the plan to kill DM - hopefully LE will come up with evidence to actually charge her before she flees
• Rash encouraged DA/HA to get out of Dodge and probably informed them of countries that had no extradition treaty with the U.S.

 

[Zedzded]

After watching Dateline, the two takeaways I have are :

• Wendy deserves an Oscar for her performance the day of the murder and I have no doubt she participated in the plan to kill DM - hopefully LE will come up with evidence to actually charge her before she flees
• Rash encouraged DA/HA to get out of Dodge and probably informed them of countries that had no extradition treaty with the U.S.

Surely not!?

 

[Knitpicker]

Yes. Continuum is near the Icon. Charlie rented a place there around the time of the murder. They didn’t live in the Icon until after the murder, I think. I am glad it seems the state is now aware of this.

Theres always been confusion on where Wendi went after the murder.
Wendi with Isom, when asked “where are your parents”?, has stated her parents lived in Coral Springs at the time of the murder.Also Wendi was asked the same on the stand and she said the same. Yet at times, at trial, the state has mentioned “Miami”. This is important because if the A’s were living in their family home most of the time,(and that Friday) then the money drop would have been out of their way from where CA’s house was in relation to their going to Tallahassee on the night of the murder. Yes they did stop in Orlando, but even Orlando is north,whereas FortLauderdale is South. Unless one lives in SFlorida one would not realize this.

Even if they weren’t going to CA’s to drop money, they still would not be “passing by” CA’s house on any highway.
Coral Springs to Fort Lauderdale Is Southeast. Tallahassee from Coral Springs is northwest. GC asked Corbett at CA’s trial if they were coming from Miami and he said “yes” yet did not show that H and D’s cell was in a location to prove that. he may have also misunderstood Miami from Coral Springs bc it has been mentioned “its the same“ .It is NOT the same. Two different counties an hour apart. I think because people know the A’s stayed in the condo weekends, they assume there are close to each other. And confused as to where they were that night.

The condo was used for the weekends as HA was working in Tamarac (M-W) which is over an hour away from South Beach (his practice was near to the family home in CS),and could be 1.5 hours with traffic each way. It is not a fun drive.Harvey did work hours not affecting rush hour.he got in late and left late.but still it’s a long hike.

It seems they would be in the family home on the night of the murder, as the boys were coming (remember Wendi cleaning her childhood bedroom) The house wasn’t sold till a year later ,although they may have moved to S Beach full time months later when Wendi's job op fell through, or she convinced her family to move to S Beach full time.(her goal anyway-forcing her dad to retire) The family home was listed as sold in 8/2015. When they moved to Miami full time is not clear.

it wouldn’t make sense that W and boys would immediately go to S Beach,as she had that job offer in Boca Raton (Gary Cohen). (Or that was used to show the court she had a job in S Florida when she tried to get custody of the boys-Gary was D and A’s friend)

People have used Miami and Coral Springs interchangeably.
Anyone living in S Florida knows they are 2 different counties and as I said far apart.
The A institute was only a few miles from the family home.(Broward county).

So, where were D and H coming from as they headed up to Tallahassee the night of the murder?
And were they really passing by Charlies?
Does LE have that information?
I am surprised the state has not already settled this issue.
Just like the issue of where SG’s phone was when he called Harvey on the supposed Jetski incident.

I did contact GC after the trial about these issues.

 

[iluvmua]

I hope wendi is next, although I don't think they would arrest her until her mother's trial and sentencing has concluded. Jmo

 

[cottonweaver]

People have used Miami and Coral Springs interchangeably.
Anyone living in S Florida knows they are 2 different counties and as I said far apart.
The A institute was only a few miles from the family home.(Broward county).

So, where were D and H coming from as they headed up to Tallahassee the night of the murder?
And were they really passing by Charlies?
Does LE have that information?
I am surprised the state has not already settled this issue.
Just like the issue of where SG’s phone was when he called Harvey on the supposed Jetski incident.

I did contact GC after the trial about these issues.

snipping just so can reply to separate issues at question and my reply is already long enough

What you're raising is a new and different point to the old one about the Continuum ( amiscurie's) - your new point is about drop-off route - and it's interesting

However , I do not recall the state ever claiming that the grandparents travelled from Coral to Tallahassee night of 18th. Also, IIRC, Harvey did not work Friday's ( dental staff testimonies) and so, as you say yourself, it might make sense they're in a weekend condo by the time they get Wendi's call and that they depart from there.
Please correct me if that is wrong, I might have misremembered

Rashbaum claimed that the parents were living in Miami part time and claimed they just passed by CA's home because his home was close to the Turnpike and claimed it was the most direct route if you departed from there ( the condos are close to each other, see maps, regardless of which condo you were in that night)

I recall that the texts, evening 18 July 2014 were shown at trial ' outside your house' ' 10 minutes' (or whatever ) but was a demonstrative used for cell tower mapping shown at trial? ( To show how their phones travel to alleged drop-off. )
so, afaik, the state and defense were in agreement that HA & DA did not travel from Coral the night they set off for Tally via Charlie's.

Side - issue. I have no idea whether the state displayed charts which show the cell towers cover both spots, as pinned in the maps. I can't remember now)

(I am omitting the second, separate issue as to where Wendi spent most time after 22nd July 2014 - as per @amicuscurie original queries about Ikon vs Continuum- because it makes the reply so long )
Maybe you want to add maps showing routes from Alton Rd via Turnpike to CA's house and onto to TLH?

Hope that I haven't made this as clear as mud!

 

[JerseyPride]

Rashbaum strikes again on Dateline with insulting mental gymnastics. The latest round? The "murder on spec" and "murder for hire" theories are equally implausible. Why? Because under both theories, the assailants committed the murder before being paid. Gee, counselor, does it not make a difference that under one theory, the assailants were ACTUALLY INSTRUCTED TO COMMIT THE ACT BY THE PEOPLE WHO WOULD BE PAYING???

Let's consider an analogy of a house painter. Scenario 1: House painter takes it upon herself to paint a stranger's home while they are on vacation with the hope that they will pay upon demand when the job is done. Scenario 2: Homeowner actually hires a house painter to paint their house and promises to pay when the job is finished.

By Rashbaum's logic, Scenario 1 is no crazier than Scenario 2. This is utterly preposterous and insulting because, unlike Scenario 1, in Scenario 2, the house painter had a promise of payment and ACTUAL INSTRUCTIONS TO PAINT THE HOUSE.

 

[I am not Sherlock H.]

Katie said on the stand that when she got to Charlie’s house on the night of the murder, Charlie told her his parents had already been there. Cell tower records presented at trial have Donna‘s cell phone near his house that night, around 7pm. There is also a text from Donna to Charlie, shown at trial, that says “outside your house,” this text was also sent around 7pm, if I recall correctly. Cell tower records show Katie‘s phone a location near Charlie’s house after that.

Yes, and wasn’t there also some discussion that the periodontist son never kept large sums of money at his residence? And that the woman spending the night and retrieving monies for payment believed his mother had washed the cash since it was damp or wet?
From what I observed on the most recent Dateline expose, seems the now convicted son would be wise to ‘spill‘ on both his mother, and perhaps sister as well? That conversation between mother and son immediately after the ‘FBI’ informant sting on the mother - sure was incriminating IMO as to mother and son’s apparent involvement?
And how about the widow‘s interview with police in the aftermath of the murder? Her comment about my brother got me a ‘tv’ instead of a hit man to take care of my ‘husband problem’ or words to that affect? Wow! Telling in my opinion. Sure seems to suggest her possible involvement as well or even potential premeditation? MOO
And is it correct that the arrested mother has apparently chosen the same defense attorney? After her son’s trial conviction? Makes one scratch their head IMO?
Sitting there on ice, seems the best option for son if granted appeal or new trial, would be to consider a plea and incriminate others? MOO

 

[cottonweaver]

Rashbaum strikes again on Dateline with insulting mental gymnastics. The latest round? The "murder on spec" and "murder for hire" theories are equally implausible. Why? Because under both theories, the assailants committed the murder before being paid. Gee, counselor, does it not make a difference that under one theory, the assailants were ACTUALLY INSTRUCTED TO COMMIT THE ACT BY THE PEOPLE WHO WOULD BE PAYING???

Let's consider an analogy of a house painter. Scenario 1: House painter takes it upon herself to paint a stranger's home while they are on vacation with the hope that they will pay upon demand when the job is done. Scenario 2: Homeowner actually hires a house painter to paint their house and promises to pay when the job is finished.

By Rashbaum's logic, Scenario 1 is no crazier than Scenario 2. This is utterly preposterous and insulting because, unlike Scenario 1, in Scenario 2, the house painter had a promise of payment and ACTUAL INSTRUCTIONS TO PAINT THE HOUSE.

I haven't seen the show, so I can only ask questions

so, if I have read you right, DR has gone onto Dateline to say that:

'The "murder on spec" and "murder for hire" theories are equally implausible because under both theories, the assailants committed the murder before being paid '


but murder on spec was the foundation for his own first layer extortion defense. ( extortion 1)
On Dateline, did he explain why he's claiming that Donna believed in what he feels is an implausible scenario? ( On STS he said that Donna is very 'bright')

( He'd recorded for Dateline before he went onto STS so it's interesting that he didn't bother trying to argue this to STS, he'd have gotten shot down fast)

 

[cottonweaver]

Returning to @Knitpicker 's post about routes on the night of the alleged money drop off.
I went back to look at what Rashbaum proposed during trial.

Although the state admitted they'd not done a journey time calculation, Rashbaum claims it was impossible to get from Charlies to Orlando within the times which the State proposed. Arrival Orlando at 1.11am

Just looked it up on G directions.


link for image https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Orl...894032!2m3!6e0!7e2!8j1705788000!3e0?entry=ttu

I didn't bother to change the dates on the Directions filter, I used 10pm as start time, obviously it could have been 9.45pm and they only spent 15 mins with CA at his house




background :
DA texts CA 8.59pm ‘ Outside ur house’
Around 9.19pm CA replies ‘ 10 mins’ So he’d be back at his house around 9.30pm
Interval period, maybe 9.30pm for X mins where drop-off & CA, DA, HA meeting occurs
Depart for Orlando - unknown time ( I used 10pm as an example, could be earlier)
Arrival Orlando at 1.11am

 

[Knitpicker]

Returning to @Knitpicker 's post about routes on the night of the alleged money drop off.
I went back to look at what Rashbaum proposed during trial.

Although the state admitted they'd not done a journey time calculation, Rashbaum claims it was impossible to get from Charlies to Orlando within the times which the State proposed. Arrival Orlando at 1.11am

Just looked it up on G directions.
View attachment 476173

link for image https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Orl...894032!2m3!6e0!7e2!8j1705788000!3e0?entry=ttu

I didn't bother to change the dates on the Directions filter, I used 10pm as start time, obviously it could have been 9.45pm and they only spent 15 mins with CA at his house




background :
DA texts CA 8.59pm ‘ Outside ur house’
Around 9.19pm CA replies ‘ 10 mins’ So he’d be back at his house around 9.30pm
Interval period, maybe 9.30pm for X mins where drop-off & CA, DA, HA meeting occurs
Depart for Orlando - unknown time ( I used 10pm as an example, could be earlier)
Arrival Orlando at 1.11am

Right-plenty of time. When I heard Rashbaum say that I knew he was lying.
Now, do this from Coral Springs to Orlando to see that Fort Lauderdale is completely out of the way to Orlando from where the Adelsons were living. If you want the address I can get it. Or just google “Maplewood elementary school, which is a mile from their house.
Let me know if you think they were “passing by” on their way to Orlando.
Of course we would have to know where they left from( I do know GC asked Corbitt if it was Miami ). GC has made an error before saying “Miami” instead of Coral springs),Ex: where Wendi went when she left Tallahassee.

EDIT -Cottonweaver said that Rashbaum also asked Charlie if they left from Miami.


Rashbaum, being from Weston (South of Coral Springs) and having kids, would know how long it takes to get to Disney. Perhaps he figured that the jury from Tallahassee would just believe him?
when I heard that I could not believe it,
especially from a man who lives in South Florida,

 

[Knitpicker]

snipping just so can reply to separate issues at question and my reply is already long enough

What you're raising is a new and different point to the old one about the Continuum ( amiscurie's) - your new point is about drop-off route - and it's interesting

However , I do not recall the state ever claiming that the grandparents travelled from Coral to Tallahassee night of 18th. Also, IIRC, Harvey did not work Friday's ( dental staff testimonies) and so, as you say yourself, it might make sense they're in a weekend condo by the time they get Wendi's call and that they depart from there.
Please correct me if that is wrong, I might have misremembered

Rashbaum claimed that the parents were living in Miami part time and claimed they just passed by CA's home because his home was close to the Turnpike and claimed it was the most direct route if you departed from there ( the condos are close to each other, see maps, regardless of which condo you were in that night)

I recall that the texts, evening 18 July 2014 were shown at trial ' outside your house' ' 10 minutes' (or whatever ) but was a demonstrative used for cell tower mapping shown at trial? ( To show how their phones travel to alleged drop-off. )
so, afaik, the state and defense were in agreement that HA & DA did not travel from Coral the night they set off for Tally via Charlie's.

Side - issue. I have no idea whether the state displayed charts which show the cell towers cover both spots, as pinned in the maps. I can't remember now)

(I am omitting the second, separate issue as to where Wendi spent most time after 22nd July 2014 - as per @amicuscurie original queries about Ikon vs Continuum- because it makes the reply so long )
Maybe you want to add maps showing routes from Alton Rd via Turnpike to CA's house and onto to TLH?

Hope that I haven't made this as clear as mud!

View attachment 476168


View attachment 476169

Yes I watched the trial and I know about the texts and all, I am just saying that we do not have the phone location of Donnas phone, only the texts. It could be at that time the state didn’t think it was important. Unless they have a location for the texts, but why hasn't that been shown at trial (Miami as a starting point)? The same with SG’s phone when he called HA. Just wondering why, and hopeful theres more to come.
Once again- I am not trying to post misleading or false information.
I want to be clear about that.
If I missed phone location I’m hoping someone can assist.
I have watched the testimony several times and I do know GC asked Sgt. Corbitt if they were coming from Miami and he said “Yes”.

 

[Knitpicker]

Returning to @Knitpicker 's post about routes on the night of the alleged money drop off.
I went back to look at what Rashbaum proposed during trial.

Although the state admitted they'd not done a journey time calculation, Rashbaum claims it was impossible to get from Charlies to Orlando within the times which the State proposed. Arrival Orlando at 1.11am

Just looked it up on G directions.
View attachment 476173

link for image https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Orl...894032!2m3!6e0!7e2!8j1705788000!3e0?entry=ttu

I didn't bother to change the dates on the Directions filter, I used 10pm as start time, obviously it could have been 9.45pm and they only spent 15 mins with CA at his house




background :
DA texts CA 8.59pm ‘ Outside ur house’
Around 9.19pm CA replies ‘ 10 mins’ So he’d be back at his house around 9.30pm
Interval period, maybe 9.30pm for X mins where drop-off & CA, DA, HA meeting occurs
Depart for Orlando - unknown time ( I used 10pm as an example, could be earlier)
Arrival Orlando at 1.11a

DBM response

 

[cottonweaver]

Yes I watched the trial and I know about the texts and all, I am just saying that we do not have the phone location of Donnas phone, only the texts. It could be at that time the state didn’t think it was important. Unless they have a location for the texts, but why hasn't that been show at trial (Miami as a starting point)? The same with SG’s phone when he called HA. Just wondering why, and hopeful theres more to come.
Once again- I am not trying to post misleading or false information.
I want to be clear about that.
If I missed phone location I’m hoping someone can assist.
I have watched the testimony several times and I do know GC asked Sgt. Corbitt if they were coming from Miami and he said “Yes”.

Her cell tower locations are going to be interesting - yes it's really complicated and also frustrating not being able to recall exactly what demonstratives were used ( for cell tower)
(In the segment I just re-watched, Rash says leaving Miami and Corbett agrees they left from Miami. I didn't rewatch the whole Corbett again)

I can just imagine the pair of them, sat waiting in their car outside his house in the dark, Donna wide-eyed, excited and Harvey all jittery. Ugh!