FL FL - Royal Palm Beach, WhtFem Skeletal 12UFFL, 20-40, in woods, Dec'87 - Pati Lisa Loguercio Rust

CarlK90245

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The Doe Network:
Case File 12UFFL
http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/12uffl.html

12UFFL.jpg

Reconstructed Image

Unidentified White Female
# Discovered on December 20, 1987 on 130th Avenue, north of Orange Boulevard, in Royal Beach, Palm Beach County, Florida.
# The victim may have been at this location for a period of three months to possibly three years before discovery.
# State of Remains: Skeletal

Vital Statistics
# Estimated age: 20 - 40 years old
# Approximate Height and Weight: 5'1 - 5'6"; 90 - 130 pounds
# Distinguishing Characteristics: Light brown hair with streaks of grey. She was short with a small frame. She may have suffered a back injury or had severe arthritis. Fracture of the right clavicle.
# Dentals: The victim had extensive dental work and dental records are available. 8 fillings and extensive carries.
# Clothing: No clothing or jewelry was found with the victim.

Case History
The victim was located in wooded area near The Acreage in Royal Palm Beach., Florida on December 20, 1987

Investigators
If you have any information on the identity of this woman or the circumstances surrounding her death, please contact:
West Palm Beach Sheriff's Department
562-688-4013
You can remain anonymous when submitting information.

Agency Case Number:
1987-01184


NCIC Number:
U-920672669
 
I was just checking out today's Charley updates, and saw this newly listed MP from back in 1984:

Sandra F. Thompson

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/n/norman_sandra.html

norman_sandra2.jpg
12UFFL.jpg


I looked through the list of Florida female UID's from the 1980's in DoeNet, and found this UID case. There is not much to go on except that the height and age are within range, the estimated year of death is consistent, and there is a striking resemblance on facial structure.

They both have high prominent cheekbones, low sharp jawlines, prominent chins and high noses.

The remains were found less than 300 miles straight south down I-95 from her hometown of Jacksonville.

There isn't much in Charley to match on, but everything available is consistent to this UID.
 
Hi Carl:

Just doing a little search this morning before work and came across a missing person site and there's a Sandra Faye Norman whose married name was Thompson. I've attached the Charley Project for her and think it may be the same person as everything matches up such as missing date, birth date, location, etc.

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/t/thompson_sandra.html
 
Thanks CJ - Good catch.

You attached the wrong link. Here's Sandra Faye Norman's Charley Page.

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/n/norman_sandra.html

They both have the same DLC and DOB. They look quite different, but their facial structures appear to be similar. The two photos appear to be the same person at a different age. SFT looks like an older version of SFN.

norman_sandra.jpg
norman_sandra2.jpg


In the Lake Ponchartrain Jane Doe thread, indianagirl says that according to the LSU Faces lab, there are no identifiers on SFN (DNA or Dentals), and the family is unwilling to submit DNA. So if this Palm Beach Jane Doe is SFN/SFT, they probably have not been able to verify it.

ETA: I sent an e-mail to Meaghan of Charley Project to notify her of this.
 
I sent off an e-mail to the Jacksonville FL tip line to see if they give me the same information that indianagirl got from LSU Faces Lab.

Yesterday, the Charley Project website added a new case file on Missing Person Sandra F Thompson (DOB 02/13/1958). (I subsequently learned that the same woman is listed on a separate case file as Sandra Faye Norman).

With the new photo, I realized that Sandra Faye Norman-Thompson strongly resembles the facial reconstruction of a Jane Doe whose skeletal remains were found in Royal Palm Beach on 20-Dec-1987.

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/12uffl.html

This Jane Doe is not listed in NamUs, and I do not see anywhere that Sandra Faye Norman-Thompson has been ruled out as being this Jane Doe.

A few questions:

(1) Do you know if these two cases have ever been compared?

(2) If Sandra F. Norman-Thompson has been ruled out, do you know what the basis was for the rule-out (i.e., Dentals or DNA)? Since these are skeletal remains, it would not be by fingerprints.

(3) Do you know if Sandra Faye Norman-Thompson is listed in CODIS?

(4) Sandra has been mentioned as a possible match for other unidentified decedent cases. Are there fingerprint records available for her?

Let's see if they give me the same info that Helen Bouzon gave to indianagirl.

ETA: I followed up with two additional questions:

Per my earlier e-mail, two additional questions:

(5) Are there dental records available for Sandra Norman-Thompson?

(6) Is there any indication in Sandra's Missing Persons case file to indicate that Sandra had any physical impairments (e.g., back problems or previously broken collarbone) similar to those mentioned in the Doe Network case file for this unidentified decedent?
 
Just skimming through Doe Network and saw this missing lady, Arlene Ferretti and thought I would post to see what everyone thinks....

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/887dffl.html

AGFerretti.jpg


Arlene Grace Ferretti
Missing since July 15, 1987 from Palm Beach County, Florida
Classification: Missing

Vital Statistics

Date Of Birth: March 13, 1947
Age at Time of Disappearance: 40 years old
Height and Weight at Time of Disappearance: 5'1"; 120 lbs.
Distinguishing Characteristics: White female. Brown hair; brown eyes.

Circumstances of Disappearance
Arlene Ferretti was last seen in West Palm Beach, FL on July 15, 1987.
 
I found what I think is a good PM for this unidentified woman.

Robyn Melanie Adler
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/a/adler_robyn.html
https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/11326/0

adler_robyn.jpg
19609
12UFFL.jpg


Robyn Adler went missing on May 25, 1983 in Loxahatchee, Florida. She had gone to visit her boyfriend and was last seen driving her red car down C Road.
Four days after her disappearance, her car was found. It had been crashed into a tree in a remote area north of Royal Palm Beach.
Although not much else is known about her disappearance, her case is being treated as a homicide investigation.

Here are the similarities I see between this Jane Doe and Robyn Adler:

  • UID's age is between 21 - 35; Adler is 22
  • UID's height is 5'1 - 5'6; Adler is 5'4
  • UID's weight was 90 - 130 lbs; Adler was 110 lbs
  • UID died prior to 1987; Adler disappeared in 1983
  • Both had brown hair
  • Both were white
  • The UID was founds 27 miles from where Adler was last seen. However, it may have been MUCH closer since her car was found just north of Royal Palm Beach.
  • The circumstances line up. Adler's car was found just north of Royal Palm Beach and the UID was found north of Orange Blvd. inside the city. Whoever (presumably) killed Adler would not have to go far to find a secluded area to dump her body.
  • Adler resembles the UID's sketch.

No automatic rule-out could be made because the UID has no dentals or DNA in the system, and Adler only has dentals.
 
I found what I think is a good PM for this unidentified woman.

Robyn Melanie Adler
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/a/adler_robyn.html
https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/11326/0

adler_robyn.jpg
19609
12UFFL.jpg


Robyn Adler went missing on May 25, 1983 in Loxahatchee, Florida. She had gone to visit her boyfriend and was last seen driving her red car down C Road.
Four days after her disappearance, her car was found. It had been crashed into a tree in a remote area north of Royal Palm Beach.
Although not much else is known about her disappearance, her case is being treated as a homicide investigation.

Here are the similarities I see between this Jane Doe and Robyn Adler:

  • UID's height is 5'1 - 5'6; Adler is 5'4
  • UID's weight was 90 - 130 lbs; Adler was 110 lbs
  • UID died prior to 1987; Adler disappeared in 1983
  • Both had brown hair
  • Both were white
  • The UID was founds 27 miles from where Adler was last seen. However, it may have been MUCH closer since her car was found just north of Royal Palm Beach.
  • The circumstances line up. Adler's car was found just north of Royal Palm Beach and the UID was found north of Orange Blvd. inside the city. Whoever (presumably) killed Adler would not have to go far to find a secluded area to dump her body.
  • Adler resembles the UID's sketch.

No automatic rule-out could be made because the UID has no dentals or DNA in the system, and Adler only has dentals.

I think this is absolutely worth submitting.
 
Namus shows dental records are on file for Adler. It should be easy for them to compare to the UID 12UFFL.

The UID has 8 fillings/noted extensive dental work. .. I would submit it. They look alike and the location is so close.
 
Former local chiming in--I lived in south Florida in the 80s, and Loxahatchee and The Acreage were pretty much the "sticks", especially the former. Royal Palm Beach was just starting to get built up. But in the 80s there were miles and miles of lonely dirt roads out there. Due to that and the urban sprawl nature of Sourh Florida, 20 miles is not a long distance between the last-known of Adler and the UID body.
 
Well, that was embarrassing. I called the number on the DoeNetwork site and the conversation went like this:

Me: Hi, my name is Samantha ___, I'm a volunteer with WebSleuths.com and I'm calling you regarding an unidentified body--
Man on the other line: AN UNIDENTIFIED WHAT??
Me: Uh --
Man on the other line: Man, I don't know anything about any unidentified BODIES, I live in Texas!
Cue the awkward apology and hanging up.

Turns out they had the wrong number listed and I ended up scaring the crap out of some random guy who lives up in Texas.
I sent him a text apologizing and explaining that his number was listed on that site and that I'd tell DoeNetwork to take it off. He seems pretty cool about it, he just sent me a text saying ''Ok, no harm, no foul''.

So yeah ... I'mma email the DoeNetwork and tell them they need to take that number off their site so the poor dude doesn't get any more calls about unidentified female skeletons chilling in Florida. Lol
 
Well, that was embarrassing. I called the number on the DoeNetwork site and the conversation went like this:

Me: Hi, my name is Samantha ___, I'm a volunteer with WebSleuths.com and I'm calling you regarding an unidentified body--
Man on the other line: AN UNIDENTIFIED WHAT??
Me: Uh --
Man on the other line: Man, I don't know anything about any unidentified BODIES, I live in Texas!
Cue the awkward apology and hanging up.

Turns out they had the wrong number listed and I ended up scaring the crap out of some random guy who lives up in Texas.
I sent him a text apologizing and explaining that his number was listed on that site and that I'd tell DoeNetwork to take it off. He seems pretty cool about it, he just sent me a text saying ''Ok, no harm, no foul''.

So yeah ... I'mma email the DoeNetwork and tell them they need to take that number off their site so the poor dude doesn't get any more calls about unidentified female skeletons chilling in Florida. Lol

Umm, the conversation started off nicely enough though :)
- but it was all downhill after that by the sounds of things ;)

Good that you rang though - at least you found out the number was wrong.
Now that's sleuthing!!
:)
 
I don't think its Robyn Melanie Adler

Something like severe arthritis and/or a back injury and a broken Clavicle (which the UID had) would have most definitely been noticeable to her family. Robyn Melanie Adler has no such dysfunctions.
 
I think the back injury and broken clavicle could actually raise the chances that the UID is Adler. If she was in the car when it crashed (as the result of an accident or someone intentionally causing it), she definitely could have sustained those injuries.
 

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