GA GA - Raymond Green, 6 days, Atlanta, 6 Nov 1978

Discussion in '1970's Missing' started by christine2448, Nov 18, 2007.

  1. christine2448

    christine2448 Retired WS Staff

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    This mother contacted LTWH for help.

    Help? Ideas?

    My first thought is DNA.

    Raymond was abducted at 6 days old, 29 yrs ago... there is a small chance their DNA could be in some National Database.

    [​IMG]


    DOB: Nov 1, 1978
    Missing: Nov 6, 1978
    Age Now: 29
    Sex: Male
    Race: Black
    Hair: Black
    Eyes: Brown
    Height: 5'10" (178 cm)
    Weight: 189 lbs (86 kg)
    Missing From:ATLANTA GA


    The composite shows what Raymond may look like at 28 years. His height and weight are approximations. Raymond was abducted from his home by an unknown black female on November 6, 1978. The abductor was last seen getting into a brown vehicle. She is described as being 5'06, medium build, and she may have a mole on her left cheek. The abductor may go by the name Lisa.
     
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  3. Taximom

    Taximom Former Member

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    How about local high school yearbooks? Maybe his real mom could page through some of those to see if anyone looks familiar?

    I still think this will be difficult as he could look so differently than the composite....

    I would hope the lady that kidnapped him took good care of him. She probably renamed him.

    Were there local newspaper listings of "births" back then?

    Just thinking out loud....
     
  4. christine2448

    christine2448 Retired WS Staff

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    I have copies of a few articles that I rec'd by fax and are hard to read. I haven't had time to work on this with everything going on in Stephen Lankester Cox's, Red, Cowboy's case!

    I would love to see if you all that are good with newspaper research can find these articles so we can read them clearly.

    I have them and the police reports from Atlanta PD all scanned if someone wants to translate ;)
     
  5. meggilyweggily

    meggilyweggily New Member

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    If you send everything you've got to administrator@charleyproject.org, I will decipher them as best I can and post the info here and on my website.

    I am very intrigued by the strange phenomenon of missing black babies. Almost every long-term confirmed stranger abduction of an infant that I have on my site is of a black baby, not a white, Asian or Hispanic one. I can't understand it. It's not as if there's such a huge shortage of black babies to adopt through legitimate channels -- in fact, America has a surplus right now, and I've read we are exporting some of our black infants to European countries for adoption because not enough Americans want them. There's no need to go and steal someone else's infant then.

    Other missing black babies:

    Carlina Renae White: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/w/white_carlina.html
    Andre Terrance Bryant: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/b/bryant_andre.html
    Shane Anthony Walker: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/w/walker_shane.html
    Christopher Milton Dansby: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/d/dansby_christopher.html
    Donel Jacoby Minor: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/minor_donel.html
    Kamiyah Mobley: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/mobley_kamiyah.html
    Miguel Morin: http://charleyproject.org/cases/m/morin_miguel.html (half black, half Hispanic)

    The first four disappeared from New York City, two of them from the same park, and those cases may be connected. But there doesn't seem to be anything to connect the other cases, they're all missing from different parts of the country. Donel's case seems to be the strangest one, but I don't have much info on Miguel's. I can't understand why Miguel didn't get more publicity.

    Olisa Williams: http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/w/williams_olisa.html is also black and missing, but private information I received makes me doubt she was kidnapped.
     
  6. absinthe

    absinthe Former Member

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    Tragically, I think most of these abductors do not go through legitmate channels because they want these children for unsavory purposes.
     
  7. meggilyweggily

    meggilyweggily New Member

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    The most common reason to kidnap a baby is because you want to raise it, which is why I assume these infants were taken for adoption purposes. Obviously children can and are kidnapped by pedophiles for the purpose of sex abuse, but I don't know whether this is common in babies. It seems to me that if you want to abuse a baby in that manner why bother to kidnap it as well, it's not like it would be able to tell anyone what happened to it, or even remember it later in life.

    I'm not trying to say white babies are never kidnapped. I can think of many white baby kidnappings, but very few on my site. I don't know if it means anything at all; my site has only a fraction of all the missing people in the US.
     
  8. absinthe

    absinthe Former Member

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    Yes, I remember seeing a documentary on people who kidnap babies and pretend that the baby is their biological child. I think the reason that people don't go through legitimate adoption channels in such cases is because they would likely get an older infant, and it would be harder to keep up the facade. They reason I wrote that perhaps these children are being taken for reasons other than "adoption" is because I read the Donel Minor link...from what i understand it is very rare for a man to kidnap a baby in order to raise it normally. It is overwhelmingly women who do that.
     
  9. thefragile7393

    thefragile7393 Chronically sleep deprived

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    How sad....such a sad case.

    Makes me think of the Marlene Santana case I saw profiled on Unsolved Mysteries long ago....likely that girl was raised thinking that her mother is the person who raised her. Cases like this always haunt me give me the chills.....

    And for Kamiyah Mobley.....this makes no sense. Why????
    Some of the others seem to be related somehow as well, IMHO.
     
  10. meggilyweggily

    meggilyweggily New Member

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    Actually, if the mother's story is true I think Donel was taken for adoption purposes. I think it might have happened like this: someone wanted a baby of a certain type, and a "portrait taker" was sent around to photograph babies matching certain physical characteristics. The potential adoptive parent looked at all the portraits and selected the one he or she liked the best -- Donel -- and then the "photographer" kidnapped Donel and delivered him to the adopter.

    In the article I read on the case, the police said the abduction was the most bizarre thing and they'd never heard of anything like it, but the mom passed a polygraph so they had to believe her story. In any case, Donel is definitely missing.

    Regarding Kamiyah, I don't think her parents are under suspicion. Kamiyah's conception and birth resulted in statutory rape charges against her father. Her mother was very young at the time and chances are she did not want the pregnancy. Under the circumstances, perhaps her parents simply want to forget about the whole horrible series of events.
     
  11. SieSie

    SieSie Active Member

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    Feel free to save and share this banner:

    [​IMG]

    If you'd like to post this banner in a MySpace bulletin, just copy/paste the following code:
     
  12. christine2448

    christine2448 Retired WS Staff

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    We will feature this case tomorrow.


    Georgia based Lighting The Way Home is hosting an event with CUE for the Missing!

    CUE will be stopping in Peachtree City, GA on their National Road Tour 2009 August 18, 2009, and we are pleased to announce that we will be having a prayer vigil next to City Hall at 151 Willow Bend Road, 30269. All are invited to attend, 7PM.

    This is a unique opportunity for those of us who are passionate regarding the plight of the missing to stand shoulder to shoulder with families who are seeking loved ones-please help us to draw attention to the suffering of those who are left behind when a family member disappears.

    "On The Road To Remember," is an awareness campaign that focuses on missing person cases that have gone cold, or have not received significant media coverage. The tour, which travels through several states annually, seeks to give these cases the kind of attention they deserve.
    Promotional items will be distributed through the tour and at each rally stop.
    Please spread the word and encourage people to attend-raising awareness enough to close out even one cold case moves one file from the bottom of the pile and ends the suffering, finally, of one family. The reward is priceless.
    __________________
     
  13. NewMommy09

    NewMommy09 New Member

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    http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/11/30/grace.coldcase.walker/index.html

    Very striking similarities in the disappearances of Shane Walker and Christopher Dansby.
    I found this thread by searching Dansby's name. Posting here because it may be related.

    I think this might be an underground baby black market or something. I would really like to see these cases resolved.
     
  14. Foxfire

    Foxfire New Member

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    Home from the CUE Center for the Missing: 'Expanding the Vision' Mational Conference, Wilmington, NC.


    Have a thousand stories to share, but one in particular that simply fractured my heart:

    Let me start by saying that Monica Caison, is an amazing lady whose Vision began over three decades ago, which has been honed to the point of excellence! She has the ability to coordinate searches from alligator infested swamp land, to the Colorado Rockies, Ground Zero NY/NY, to Haiti.. When a victim needs help, they are Priority, 24/7-365. This includes the families. She is an absolute firecracker!

    I was an Atlanta Firefighter, stationed near the Atlanta Stadium in a depressed and high crime area of the city.
    On November 1, 1978, only blocks from this station lived a 16 year old teenager named Donna Green. Donna was rushed to Grady Memorial Hospital, to give birth to a beautiful baby boy named Raymond Lamar Green.

    A Couple days after giving birth, she received a visitor; a teenage stranger that said that her sister had given birth to a baby in an adjacent room. She said that her sister was asleep and ask if she minded if she visited her.

    Donna, being polite and always open to new friendships, said that she would love to have her company. Her new friend visited her everyday thereafter.
    Once Donna and Baby Raymond was released to go home, she received a knock at her door on Prior Street. Much to her surprise, it was her new friend, that had came to check on her and the baby's welfare.

    Donna decided to go upstairs to take a shower and left the baby in the care of her brother. Baby Raymond, got fussy, so her brother was relieved when Donna's friend picked him up and consoled him.

    Her brother dozed off thinking that Raymond, was being well taken care of.
    'Baby Raymond vanished that day, over 31 years ago'...

    Donna frantically called APD and reported the abduction. An investigation was conducted and concluded that Baby Raymond was sold on the Black Market.
    A couple years ago, after three decades of anguish, Donna contacted APD to request a new cold case investigation. She found that there were no records indicating the abduction. She presented APD with the newspaper article for verification.

    Donna was reading a magazine article one lonely night, a few days ago at 1AM, which was about Monica Caison and CUEs National Conference. Donna, at wits end, dialed her number. Donna, expecting a recorder was shocked when Monica answered her phone, listened to her traumatic story, and invited her to the conference, although the registration deadline had passed.

    One of the classes at the seminar was taught by renouned 3D & Forensics Sketch Artist: Diane Trepkov.
    Monica arranged for Donna to meet with Diane, upon arrival. Diane extracted over 4 pages of descriptive information from Donna's memory as well as other pertinent info and had a sketch completed, which was identical to the suspect, by the following morning. By that afternoon, Diane had a sketch completed of Baby Raymond.

    Needless to say Donna Green was overwhelmed wirh emotion, that complete strangers would go to these lengths to locate her lost child, by a simple late night phone call, over 3 decades later...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WENJbSPSmqg
     
  15. Foxfire

    Foxfire New Member

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    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    The conference was attended by FBI(Vicap/Supervisory), amd many other NC, SC, and other State and Local Law Enforcement Officers, as well as K9 handlers and Searchers with a diverse expertise in search techniques as well as researchers, many concerned victim advocates of the missing and murdered, that possess excellent research skills, as does many others on this and other forums.
    Monica Caison, I am confident, will locate him!
    ******************************************************************
    On the final day of the conference, it was learned that Donna Green’s family pleaded with her not to make the 16 hour auto trip from her home in TN, to the Cue Conference in Wilmington, NC.
    They were very concerned about her safety, as well as driving alone, with limited funds preventing her from getting a motel room enroute to rest up. A million scenarios went through their minds, as you can imagine.
    After all they had already had one family member to vanish, and she didn’t know these people from Adams House Cat…
    Donna Green was determined to make the journey, come hell or high water.

    While sharing this info in the conference room, an attendee made the suggestion that a baseball hat be passed around to collect a luv offering, to allow Donna Green, to pay for a motel room to ensure that her journey, in the search for Baby Raymond, safely continues.

    The generosity of the attendees, again was overwhelming…

    There wasn't a dry eye in the house, including Donna Greens'...
    ************************************************************






    Talked to Donna Green, she is still 3 hours from home, after a restful night of sleep.. The news media is ringing her cell phone off the hook.

    I contacted(called: 1-888-OLD-TIPS ) the Fulton County Cold Case Squad and got their 'voicemail'. "Go Figure".. Not a positive start. Guess I'll go get my megaphone, next.

    At least I didn't get a detective on the line that said, "I'm sorry sir we can't discuss this case, It's still underinvestigated".. or "this is not a cold case due to the lack of a file on the alleged victim: Baby Raymond"...
    Simply unbelievable!
     
  16. Foxfire

    Foxfire New Member

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    Irony: The lead Investigator in Baby Raymond's case was the Spouse of an Atlanta News Anchor for WSB Channel 2 news: Monica Koffman....

    Edited: the phone numbers for the investigators has changed, but not updated. Guess the old phone numbers have gone cold, ironically..

    Reached Cold Case Investigator: Michelle Beck.
    She was very nice, although she wasn't familiar with Ronald Lamar Green's case, she had received my email with Baby Ramonds tragic story, and said they were gonna contact Donna Green, asap...

    "Black Market, my Buttocks"..JMHO

    http://idea.library.drexel.edu/bitstream/1860/497/9/Strohman_Lisa_Kathleen.pdf (Page 81) Motives for infant abductions...
    *******************************
    Update: Baby Raymond's case is now an 'Open Case' of Atlanta Police and the investigation is being conducted by Sgt Lacoss and Lt Gurerrucci. If anyone has any information concerning Raymond Lamar Green, their number is 404-546-4235.
     
  17. Foxfire

    Foxfire New Member

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  18. darlin gal

    darlin gal New Member

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  19. nurselady

    nurselady New Member

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    How sad! This story really touched my heart.
     
  20. Foxfire

    Foxfire New Member

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    Melinda Harder | CUE Center for Missing Persons Melinda Harder – DNA Act. October 16, 2009 by monica ... from Saint Petersburg, Florida and long time childhood freind of CUE founder, Monica Caison. ...



    CUE aiding in the solving of 28 year old cold case, now working for better laws to serve cases such as Melinda Harder who was missing from Saint Petersburg, Florida and long time childhood freind of CUE founder, Monica Caison.

    http://www.rd.com/your-america-inspiring-people-and-stories/missing-/article40749.html

    "It could take a long while before we put the pieces together. I can't promise you we'll find him. All I can promise is that you'll get 100 percent of me".
    'Monica Caison'



    Foxfire, "Monica Caison: Founder of CUE, was being very modest when she said, only 100%"...
     
  21. Foxfire

    Foxfire New Member

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    Nurselady, viewing into the caring, yet determined eyes of Baby Raymonds' Mother, gives real meaning to the quote:

    'there is a hole in my heart that only a child can fill'..
     

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