Has Your Opinions of Ron's Involvement Changed?***POLL ADDED***

Has your opinion of Ron's involvement changed? August 2010

  • Yes, I think he is involved and I didn't before

    Votes: 13 5.0%
  • Yes, I no longer think he is involved like I thought before

    Votes: 2 0.8%
  • Yes, I am on the fence now and gave up my old opinion

    Votes: 14 5.4%
  • No, I've always thought he was involved

    Votes: 167 64.2%
  • No, I've always thought he wasn't involved

    Votes: 56 21.5%
  • Other

    Votes: 8 3.1%

  • Total voters
    260
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Lil momma, that's what I want to know too. Good question. It kinda makes me think that they know for a fact that there will be an upcoming trial. I can't see the SA making that kind of deal, if they were not sure if there would be an upcoming trial. Just a thought.

WOW, i am just speechless, really....

I have never seen or heard a deal being made on "IF"...... and like you said, maybe the SA knows for a fact that there will be a trial....

I sure as he77 hope they know what they are doing up there in Putnam County.


Also, i voted that my opinion hasn't changed about Ron. I think he is repsonsible for what happened to his daughter. I think there was a cover up to avoid him loosing custody of JR. (exactly what happened, i am not sure, as i have many theories) JMO :)
 
Hey 1Chump! I've missed you!:innocent:

Honestly, I do not know how plea deals work. Wouldn't SA know what Ron is going to say or testify to? Are you thinking that they know what he's going to say, and it is not going to jive with the evidence and information that they have, so therefore, Ron is being set up? If that's the case then, dropping Ron's 2 highest charges, was all part of the set up?

I don't know 1Chump, maybe you can help me understand it all. But this is what I think: I think that the SA knows exactly what Ron is going to say and testify to if there is ever a trial for Haleigh (which IMO they know is coming soon). I think that whatever Ron has told them is helping their case in some way. I always felt that Ron knew exactly what happened to his daughter but I also felt that he had direct involvement. But what if he didn't have any direct involvement and LE knows this? I think that when there is a trial for Haleigh, Ron will not go untouched. In exchange for his testimony I think that Ron will be charged with a lesser crime like obstruction of justice or tampering with evidence, you know, that kinda thing. I do not think that Ron is innocent in all this but I don't see the SA making a deal with someone who they felt was the "main" suspect in Haleigh's disappearance. Does that kinda thing happen often? I'm not sure.

IMO, Ron is guilty of something, what? I don't know. IMO, the SA knows of his guilt and they accepted the deal with Ron, to help seal their case against the "main" suspect in Haleigh's case. Like I said before, I think Ron will be charged with a lesser crime. Does that make any sense? Have I had one too many? LOL

I respect your thoughts and opinions, 1Chump.

Thank you....I'm afraid to write this in this case.

SA's do not allow someone to plead to lessor charges and be sentenced based on an agreement for testimony in a future trial. Once the person is sentenced, they have no control over that person any more. They cannot void the plea deal and ask that the dropped charges be reinstated. That is double jeopardy, ie you cannot be charged twice for the same crime. Once it is dropped those charges are gone.

They also usually do not allow the person to give a statement under oath then allow them to be sentenced prior to testimony at trail. Yes on the statement but not be sentenced prior to testimony. Again, once they are sentenced no way to insure they will testify to the same thing even with a statement. The person can commit perjury. Sure they have the statement to prove perjury. I'm not sure about Florida perjury laws but perjury charges usually would not be equal to the dropped charges either in time sentenced and minimum mandatory. So I cannot see them willing to trade those two drug charges for possible future perjury charges. More importantly, a change in testimony could help a potential defendant get reasonable doubt.

As far as what Ron will testify too. Either Shoemaker told the SA the gist of what Ron will testify too or Shoemaker allowed Ron to tell the SA off the record what he knows. Either way, there is no way to make sure until he is under oath. IMO, I do think the SA would require Ron to give a statement under oath, in front of a court reporter, probably video also, with LE asking questions. Just to get Ron on record but again that does not mean he will give the same testimony.

I can see four possibilities for the plea agreement.

(1) They continue the sentencing date until AFTER Ron gives testimony at a future trial. In a way this benefits Ron because he stays in jail instead of going to prison now. His sentenced is reduced for time served at the jail. But I cannot believe a SA would agree to this when no charges have been filed for Haleigh's case..the one Ron agreed to testify in, without Ron giving a statement under oath now. But Ron testifies in a trial and has to admit to a plea deal dependant on his testimony....jurors may not see him as credibile....IMO, especially the father of the child. Jurors tend to look at plea deals as you are trying to save yourself so you are more apt to lie and say what the SA wants you to say. With the father of the child making a deal, I just do not see any jury looking at any testimony from him favorably.

(2) Ron pleads to all charges with the SA agreeing that if he adheres to the plea deal, after the trial, the SA will ask the court for a reduction in sentencing and/or charges. They cannot drop charges then add them back in after sentencing (double jeopardy) but they can ask for reduction in time and/or charges after sentencing. You are not being charged twice for the same crime but getting less than the chrages. That seems to not be the case as the plea was to the 3 lessor charges.

(3) He pleads to the three lessor and gets sentenced but the other two are continued until he testifies. If Ron adheres to the plea agreement, they will then drop these charges. Again, this may hurt Ron's credibility in front of the jury because he has to admit to a deal that is dependant on his testimony. Also, this would put Ron in prison. Most people would rather serve "prison" time in jail.

(4) The most likely to me is they have agreed to drop the two bigger charges and allow Ron to plead to the lessor charges based on Ron answering LE questions under oath truthfully now and giving testimony later. Although this is risky if they do not catch Ron in a lie...they are willing to risk it. Because Ron has no idea what evidence they have. His testimony has to be in line with any evidence. But even if they do not catch him in lie, the deal is only on the drug charges.

Unless I am completely wrong. If the SA and LE actually believe that Ron has no involvement, I will be shocked. Because otherwise, there would be nothing that I can see that he could testify too. He can only testify to personal knowledge.

Remember Ron does not have immunity with Haleigh. IMO, this is just about getting Ron to give a statement in Haleigh's since he has not talked to LE since he hired Shoemaker.

Also, the SA cannot promises a sentence...only ask the court for the minimum time. The Judge has full discretion in sentencing. The SA can recommend 15 years and the Judge can give the max.
 
Snipped for space -

I do think that the SA would make a deal with someone who they felt was the "main" suspect in Haleigh's disappearance. The deal is on the drug charges. He's already agreed to testify in any trial that would involve Haleigh's disappearance. He could end up testifying at his own trial as a result - which I believe will be the case.

They cannot make a deal that gives up a Constitutional Right. Ron could agree now but at trial they would not be able to enforce it. A defendant has the Constitutional Right against self incrimination and no court can make him give up that right even with a signed agreement. It would not even void the plea deal.
 
Ok, i have a question though...

What IF there is NO trial regarding HaLeigh? What if there is never any additional evidence that is found, or that one little piece that solves the puzzle? Then does Ron still get those two charges dropped?

I guess i am asking if the so called "deal" has an expiration date?

(give em a rope they will hang themselves)

As long as Ron is willing to keep up his part of the bargain there will be no expiration date. It is up the Prosecutor to bring a case or cases...not RC and when and if that happens then Ron will testify as he has agreed to do.

He will not be penalized if the state brings no case. He cant testify unless the state brings forth a trial.

I believe very much that the DA does believe there are going to be criminal trials in Haliegh's case.

IMO, He is getting his ducks in a row and is also getting his witnesses lined up who will testify in the cases.


IMO
 
Thank you....I'm afraid to write this in this case.

SA's do not allow someone to plead to lessor charges and be sentenced based on an agreement for testimony in a future trial. Once the person is sentenced, they have no control over that person any more. They cannot void the plea deal and ask that the dropped charges be reinstated. That is double jeopardy, ie you cannot be charged twice for the same crime. Once it is dropped those charges are gone.

They also usually do not allow the person to give a statement under oath then allow them to be sentenced prior to testimony at trail. Yes on the statement but not be sentenced prior to testimony. Again, once they are sentenced no way to insure they will testify to the same thing even with a statement. The person can commit perjury. Sure they have the statement to prove perjury. I'm not sure about Florida perjury laws but perjury charges usually would not be equal to the dropped charges either in time sentenced and minimum mandatory. So I cannot see them willing to trade those two drug charges for possible future perjury charges. More importantly, a change in testimony could help a potential defendant get reasonable doubt.

As far as what Ron will testify too. Either Shoemaker told the SA the gist of what Ron will testify too or Shoemaker allowed Ron to tell the SA off the record what he knows. Either way, there is no way to make sure until he is under oath. IMO, I do think the SA would require Ron to give a statement under oath, in front of a court reporter, probably video also, with LE asking questions. Just to get Ron on record but again that does not mean he will give the same testimony.

I can see four possibilities for the plea agreement.

(1) They continue the sentencing date until AFTER Ron gives testimony at a future trial. In a way this benefits Ron because he stays in jail instead of going to prison now. His sentenced is reduced for time served at the jail. But I cannot believe a SA would agree to this when no charges have been filed for Haleigh's case..the one Ron agreed to testify in, without Ron giving a statement under oath now. But Ron testifies in a trial and has to admit to a plea deal dependant on his testimony....jurors may not see him as credibile....IMO, especially the father of the child. Jurors tend to look at plea deals as you are trying to save yourself so you are more apt to lie and say what the SA wants you to say. With the father of the child making a deal, I just do not see any jury looking at any testimony from him favorably.

(2) Ron pleads to all charges with the SA agreeing that if he adheres to the plea deal, after the trial, the SA will ask the court for a reduction in sentencing and/or charges. They cannot drop charges then add them back in after sentencing (double jeopardy) but they can ask for reduction in time and/or charges after sentencing. You are not being charged twice for the same crime but getting less than the chrages. That seems to not be the case as the plea was to the 3 lessor charges.

(3) He pleads to the three lessor and gets sentenced but the other two are continued until he testifies. If Ron adheres to the plea agreement, they will then drop these charges. Again, this may hurt Ron's credibility in front of the jury because he has to admit to a deal that is dependant on his testimony. Also, this would put Ron in prison. Most people would rather serve "prison" time in jail.

(4) The most likely to me is they have agreed to drop the two bigger charges and allow Ron to plead to the lessor charges based on Ron answering LE questions under oath truthfully now and giving testimony later. Although this is risky if they do not catch Ron in a lie...they are willing to risk it. Because Ron has no idea what evidence they have. His testimony has to be in line with any evidence. But even if they do not catch him in lie, the deal is only on the drug charges.

Unless I am completely wrong. If the SA and LE actually believe that Ron has no involvement, I will be shocked. Because otherwise, there would be nothing that I can see that he could testify too. He can only testify to personal knowledge.

Remember Ron does not have immunity with Haleigh. IMO, this is just about getting Ron to give a statement in Haleigh's since he has not talked to LE since he hired Shoemaker.

Also, the SA cannot promises a sentence...only ask the court for the minimum time. The Judge has full discretion in sentencing. The SA can recommend 15 years and the Judge can give the max.
do you think this is a legal ploy from LE to get Ron, on record, answering questions? If he gets caught lieing, he could be in deep boo boo. If he's involved, I can see the temptation for LE to do this, because he just wasn't talking without that carrot dangling in front of him. Also, I don't know about Florida , but here in Tex, things seem to operate a little differently. Back in Oct., my daughter was involved in a family violence situation, with her ex. They were both charged & spent 2 days in county jail, but all charges were dropped in May. Last week, the assistant DA, talked to her about the little amount of evidence he had recieved. The police report made it look like mutual combat, that my daughter started, by 'playfully' slapping him. & it said a neighbor called 911. The only picts were the mugshots, taken before the bruising & swelling set in. NO! He started it, beat the **** out of her, & cracked her skull, among other things...& beat another girl too, while her (unusual)husband, just stood by. My daughter called 911, then called me, & then I called 911!!! So...this assistant DA is reopening the ex's case & said he has 2 years to pursue it. This man has asked for those 911s on 5 different occasions, & is still getting the runaround. So, I'm thinking 'what's up?' & here's the clincher...while my daughter was talking to 911, the ex screamed & cussed her for calling, stopped beating the other girl, knocked the phone out of her hand, & then started beating her again. The other girl wasn't questioned, wasn't mentioned , & the report said my daughter was the aggressor & had inflicted all of his damage. My daughter passed out, while being choked, & the other girl busted a wine bottle over his head, to save her! The cops smelled that alcohol, & wrote that the she & the ex were both drunk! But this is where things finally started swinging in her favor. At county, about 30 mins later, the report said that my daughter was NOT under any influence, but HE was, & he was so out of control, they tazed him & strapped him in a restraint chair, for 3 hours! But my daughter wasn't supposed to fight back? & that's exactly what the cops told her, & told my husband & me. that she should've just called them, & let them handle it.He would've killed her, if the other girl hadn't been there. As you can tell, I'm still just furious. But...my point is this...Dropped charges can be reinstated. They were dropped, not found innocent, so no double jeopardy. & this is my other point...cops don't always see something that's right in front of their danged faces, but others do, like DAs & judges. & this is my last point...xanax causes people to rage.
 
I don't quite understand your statement..."we are all feeling the same way"

What way is that?

IMHO..Ron doesn't have suspicions about anyone else..He didn't learn anything after the fact.....He knows he is the one responsible for whatever happened to Haleigh..As does his mother and grandmother...JMO

where did you get your information about Ron being responsible for Haleigh (whatever the case may be) and his mom and gramma know he did it to?

I am shocked as I hadn't heard this before now.
I was going to say we all feel the same way as being frustrated from not knowing what, who, when, where or why?

THis is just my own opinion however so for that I am confident that LE will figure all of this out.
 
(BBM)


...and to think that the Cummings/Croslin's (including RONALD) expect everyone to believe that they were sooooooooooo scared of "BIG BAD JO" - GMAB!

No, I was asking about being afraid of Ron, not Joe. It seems to be the consensus that everyone was afraid of Ron, therefor covering for him and I was saying in my opinion, Ron is no one to be afraid of as if he was so viscious I REALLY BELIEVE he would have physically went after Joe, Tommy, Timmy and Misty..... but he didnt? I think they are a bunch of wannabee's but I am from California near LA so I have known some REAL drug dealers and gun traffickers...etc.
 
There are serial and other killers who are not physically imposing. Arohn Kee is just one example. At 5'8" he is not physically large. (However, in contrast, Kee is intelligent, reasonably articulate, and seemingly personable, which aided his murderous endeavors.) And no, I am not comparing Ron to a serial killer. I'm saying that, imo, a man does not have to be physically imposing to be dangerous.

moo

What I was trying to say is Ron and the rest of them are just wannabee's and I WILL NOT ever believe that this young man killed his daughter.
I know he probably did not do all the right things but in my opinion he would not go to court and get custody and be under the scrutiny of DCS to kill his daughter on purpose. what would be the reason for him to cover this up? what would be the reason for a grandmother to cover something like this up?
I just will not defer to this kind of thinking whether it be popular or not.
The sheriff said he and Crystal are not involved so I take that for what it is worth.
 
where did you get your information about Ron being responsible for Haleigh (whatever the case may be) and his mom and gramma know he did it to?

I am shocked as I hadn't heard this before now.I was going to say we all feel the same way as being frustrated from not knowing what, who, when, where or why?

THis is just my own opinion however so for that I am confident that LE will figure all of this out.

Not any more shocked than I am that you have never heard this before...
Many here believe Ronald C is responsible and his momma and grandmother have known he is responsible.. And this had been stated time and time again since the beginning..And IIRC you have been posting for quite sometime...
Too Too many strange things coming from all of the Cummings/Sykes Clan in the last 18 plus months for them not to know Ronald C is responsible for whatever happened to Haleigh..And IMHO, his mother and his grandmother know exactly where she is too....Personally, I cannot imagine LE hasn't figured it out yet..Right now I'm just waiting on justice for Haleigh....JMHO..
 
What I was trying to say is Ron and the rest of them are just wannabee's and I WILL NOT ever believe that this young man killed his daughter.
I know he probably did not do all the right things but in my opinion he would not go to court and get custody and be under the scrutiny of DCS to kill his daughter on purpose. what would be the reason for him to cover this up? what would be the reason for a grandmother to cover something like this up?
I just will not defer to this kind of thinking whether it be popular or not.
The sheriff said he and Crystal are not involved so I take that for what it is worth.

I agree he is a wannabee..A wannabee BAD AZZ especially when it comes to showing people what he is going to do to them with his guns... ..And I suspect his daughter paid the ultimate price because of that fact...Too bad he didn't wannabee just an honorable human being...JMHO
 
What I was trying to say is Ron and the rest of them are just wannabee's and I WILL NOT ever believe that this young man killed his daughter.
I know he probably did not do all the right things but in my opinion he would not go to court and get custody and be under the scrutiny of DCS to kill his daughter on purpose. what would be the reason for him to cover this up? what would be the reason for a grandmother to cover something like this up?
I just will not defer to this kind of thinking whether it be popular or not.
The sheriff said he and Crystal are not involved so I take that for what it is worth.
IMO, these people may not fit your stereotype of gangsters or thugs, or whatevers, but they're definantly more than a bunch of wannabes. Ron's a drug user, with a long arrest record, he's a drug dealer, a drug trafficker, a gun collector, just a dangerous all around person. Now, I'll admit that he talks big & doesn't follow through with threats, (that I know of), but there's more to being a criminal than that. Tommy is a thief, a drug addict, a drug abuser, a drug trafficker, & he has the arrest record to prove it. Joe also has a drug history & an arrest record. Misty's a drug user, a drug dealer, & a drug trafficker. & her arrest proves that. & oh yeah...they are all right smack dab in the middle of a murdered child's case. Not being facetious here, but what more do these people have to do to prove their badness? join the Crips? participate in a drive-by? move to a big city? I don't know about anybody else, but I wouldn't feel safe with any one of them, in my neighborhood. & I dang sure wouldn't let one of them babysit.
 
Not any more shocked than I am that you have never heard this before...
Many here believe Ronald C is responsible and his momma and grandmother have known he is responsible.. And this had been stated time and time again since the beginning..And IIRC you have been posting for quite sometime...
Too Too many strange things coming from all of the Cummings/Sykes Clan in the last 18 plus months for them not to know Ronald C is responsible for whatever happened to Haleigh..And IMHO, his mother and his grandmother know exactly where she is too....Personally, I cannot imagine LE hasn't figured it out yet..Right now I'm just waiting on justice for Haleigh....JMHO..

We all want justice for Haleigh, but we want the right person/persons punished on facts, not opinions. Opinions possibly formed by rumors, articles stating facts that are not true, close association or blood ties with the other side of Haleigh's family, anger at Father for his lifestyle, I could go on and on.
LE has stated that Haleigh's parents are not suspects. We are not smarter than they are, and facts, not opinions, will convicts the right person(s).
 
We all want justice for Haleigh, but we want the right person/persons punished on facts, not opinions. Opinions possibly formed by rumors, articles stating facts that are not true, close association or blood ties with the other side of Haleigh's family, anger at Father for his lifestyle, I could go on and on.
LE has stated that Haleigh's parents are not suspects. We are not smarter than they are, and facts, not opinions, will convicts the right person(s).
Not necessarily referring to this particular LE, but to say that we're not smarter than LE is a pretty broad statement. I, personally, have run across some pretty stupid & lazy cops...& trust me, their badges don't make them smart. A lot of cops never even go to college.A guy that graduated with my daughter got his job because of his dad & grandfather & he recently got caught smuggling cell phones etc... to the inmates...for a little bit of money. He was always less than stellar in class, & actually kind of weird. So, LE is full of all kinds of people, just like any other profession.
 
Not necessarily referring to this particular LE, but to say that we're not smarter than LE is a pretty broad statement. I, personally, have run across some pretty stupid & lazy cops...& trust me, their badges don't make them smart. A lot of cops never even go to college.A guy that graduated with my daughter got his job because of his dad & grandfather & he recently got caught smuggling cell phones etc... to the inmates...for a little bit of money. He was always less than stellar in class, & actually kind of weird. So, LE is full of all kinds of people, just like any other profession.

I agree with you, all kinds of people in all professions. Just trying to say our opinion of a person does not mean he is a murderer. We do not know the evidence they have and I believe more than just local LE involved in this case.
 
I agree with you, all kinds of people in all professions. Just trying to say our opinion of a person does not mean he is a murderer. We do not know the evidence they have and I believe more than just local LE involved in this case.

RC may not have been the one who murdered Haleigh, but is there anyone here who does not feel RC is responsible for what happened to Haleigh? Again I will say he is the one who left his innocent child with someone who did not want to watch her, and who was still feeling the affects of partying for three days. HE alone is responsible for everyhthing the Haleigh went through that night !!!
 
RC may not have been the one who murdered Haleigh, but is there anyone here who does not feel RC is responsible for what happened to Haleigh? Again I will say he is the one who left his innocent child with someone who did not want to watch her, and who was still feeling the affects of partying for three days. HE alone is responsible for everyhthing the Haleigh went through that night !!!

I just wonder why, if he doesn't already know what happened, is he not blaming himself? Most parents feel guilt if their kid even gets hurt. Not being the sharpest crayon in the box, he just quit talking to LE, wouldn't go down and even talk with them (IMO) because he couldn't pull it off. He didn't look for her while waiting for the cops to come, he didn't even blame Misty - he married her instead.
 
We all want justice for Haleigh, but we want the right person/persons punished on facts, not opinions. Opinions possibly formed by rumors, articles stating facts that are not true, close association or blood ties with the other side of Haleigh's family, anger at Father for his lifestyle, I could go on and on.
LE has stated that Haleigh's parents are not suspects. We are not smarter than they are, and facts, not opinions, will convicts the right person(s).

Oh,no fear... I want the right person punished and I fully realize someone's opinion on a subject may not be the truth and I have never claimed my opinion concerning what I believe happened to Haleigh is the Gospel according to Emeralgem..
My thoughts and opinions concerning what I believe happened to Haleigh is... just what it is...It is just what I have come to believe from what I have put together over the last 18 plus months following this case..
I certainly don't have a close association or am I related to anyone on Haleigh's mother's side of the family..And Haleigh's father's lifestyle before Haleigh disappeared doesn't, for the most part, anger me in the least....

I do have a problem with LE if they are indeed saying Ron C is not a suspect though and they really do believe that to be the truth.. IMHO.. IF that is the case, then I believe there is a possibility I just may be smarter than they are... Either that or something stinks to high heaven in Putnam County...And under those circumstances, the real culprit will not be held responsible anyways and a scapegoat will possibly take the fall.....JMHOOTS
 
I just wonder why, if he doesn't already know what happened, is he not blaming himself? Most parents feel guilt if their kid even gets hurt. Not being the sharpest crayon in the box, he just quit talking to LE, wouldn't go down and even talk with them (IMO) because he couldn't pull it off. He didn't look for her while waiting for the cops to come, he didn't even blame Misty - he married her instead.

I have the feeling RC has never been taught to take responsibility for anything wrong he's done. He may not feel he is to blame for what happened to Haleigh, he may feel because HE didn't actually do what ever happened to Haleigh that night, then he isn't responsible for what ever happened to her. I guess once you get a lawyer you stop talking and the lawyer starts talking, that whole innocent until proven guilty thing. Yeah, that marrying Misty is somehting I've never been able to understand, but then I don't understand any of the people in this case.
 
Not necessarily referring to this particular LE, but to say that we're not smarter than LE is a pretty broad statement. I, personally, have run across some pretty stupid & lazy cops...& trust me, their badges don't make them smart. A lot of cops never even go to college.A guy that graduated with my daughter got his job because of his dad & grandfather & he recently got caught smuggling cell phones etc... to the inmates...for a little bit of money. He was always less than stellar in class, & actually kind of weird. So, LE is full of all kinds of people, just like any other profession.

And may I add.. or honest....JMHO
 
I agree with you, all kinds of people in all professions. Just trying to say our opinion of a person does not mean he is a murderer. We do not know the evidence they have and I believe more than just local LE involved in this case.

I agree, however when a person lies, has a different story for anyone and everyone concerning his daughter's disappearance...IMHO..thats reason enough to suspect that person...JMHO

For the record, I personally have never referred to Ronald Cummings as being a murderer eventhough I do believe he is the person who is physically responsible for Haleigh's death...JMHO
 
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