How toxic is the water?

[Mabel]

Oh, I didn't mean that!!! Please don't think I do. I'm really at a loss as to how they can get the water out fast, but yet, get the water out so as not to hurt the environment. I thought they had to pump it out fast because they need to begin going from house to house. I didn't think they could wait to come up with the engineering and means to treat it while they pump it. I really meant no harm.

:blowkiss:

 

[cynder]

The Bush years are going to go down in environmental history as a travesty.
Wonder if they will edit, purge and rewrite the environmental impact statements on THIS event to make them say what they want instead of the truth?
I honestly don't think the Bush administration gives a damn about what gets pumped into the Mississippi River, Lake Ponchatrain or the Gulf of Mexico. I don't think they give a damn about what all those refineries, chemical processing plants, petrochemical manufacturing plants, oil rigs, tankers and ruptured pipelines are spewing, leaking and oozing into the water or the soil. Right now the focus is on the money being lost every minute they are out of commission and how badly that is going to impact gas and heating oil prices (and future campaign donations). The mid term elections are not that far away and the Republicans cannot afford to lose any ground.
Any environmental impact will be up to the media to ferret out and report on. Otherwise it will get buried so deep under Katrina backlash and spin that the general public will never hear a word.
And it's not just the water - every speck of debris and soil removed from NO and surrounding areas will have to be carefully placed in a special, segregated and lined pit or all that contamination will just leech right into the groundwater with every rain.
If they don't handle this very carefully, coastal LA is going to become a dead toxic wasteland. The impact to ALL living things could very easily become our Chernobyl.
I hope we are paying attention and I hope we insist on the truth.

 

[BarnGoddess]

I heard on the radio about cases of Norwalk or Norfolk Virus outbreaks. I haven't googled yet but has anyone else heard this?

 

[poco]

Government tests confirmed that the floodwaters are thick with sewage-related bacteria in amounts at least 10 times higher than acceptable safety limits. The muck is believed to contain E. coli, certain viruses and a type of cholera-like bacteria.

The danger of infection was not limited to the New Orleans area. The bacteria are feared to have migrated to crowded shelters outside the state, where many evacuees are staying. Four deaths -- one in Texas, three in Mississippi -- have been attributed to infected wounds, said Tom Skinner, spokesman for the CDC.

http://aolsvc.news.aol.com/news/article.adp?id=20050824033709990005

 

[poco]

I heard on the radio about cases of Norwalk or Norfolk Virus outbreaks. I haven't googled yet but has anyone else heard this?

Norwalk virus is the leading cause of viral gastroenteritis in the U.S.

Norwalk virus causes acute gastroenteritis with nausea, vomiting, fever, and myalgia that lasts 24-48 hours. The virus is transmitted through fecal-oral contact. The Norwalk virus is well established as the chief cause of viral gastroenteritis epidemics. The disease occurs throughout the year without a seasonal predominance.

Norwalk virus was first associated with gastroenteritis in 1972. It was identified by electron microscopy of stool samples that had been saved from a 1968 gastroenteritis epidemic that occurred in Norwalk, Ohio. In a 2-day period, acute gastroenteritis developed in 50% of 232 students or teachers in an elementary school. The virus initially was labeled as a small, round, structured virus, and it was named after the city in which the outbreak occurred.

Information on the molecular characteristics of the virus is limited. It cannot be grown in any cell culture, and no readily available nonhuman animal model becomes ill from the Norwalk virus.

The virus is transmitted through contaminated food, water, or infected contacts. After ingestion, the virus infects the mucosa of the proximal small intestine, damages microvilli, and causes malabsorption of D-xylose, lactose, and fat. Although no histopathological lesions can be found in the stomach mucosa, the virus causes abnormal gastric motility and delayed gastric emptying. It does not invade the colon and, therefore, does not cause fecal leukocytes or hematochezia.

http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic1648.htm

 

[BarnGoddess]

Thank you so much Poco. I guess it's now a problem in some shelters. That's mild compared to what could come along.

BTW, I don't think we've had any West Nile in our County this year. I spend big bucks to vaccinate horses each year at $17.00 per head. We spent about $375.00 this year to protect them. I watched a horse go down with West Nile a couple of years ago. Not a pretty sight.

 

[KrazyKollector]

What illnesses can come of all of this toxicity? I've heard a few mentioned, but I'm sure I'm missing a ton.

*Hepatitis
*Tetanus
*Dysentary
*West Nile Virus
*Cholera

Q Fever
Typhus
Typhoid Fever
The intestinal parasites such as:
Enterobius vermicularis(pinworms)
Giardia lamblia
Ancylostoma duodenale(hookworm)
Necator americanus(hookworm)
Entamoeba histolytica
Skin infections:
erythrasma
impetigo
staph
folliculitis

In the future:
Cancer
Lung Disease

Here's a blurb about skin infections:
Skin infections are common and may be caused by bacteria, fungi or viruses. Breaks in the skin integrity, particularly those that inoculate pathogens into the dermis, frequently cause or exacerbate skin infections. Bacterial skin infections caused by corynebacteria include erythrasma, trichomycosis axillaris and pitted keratolysis. Staphylococci may cause impetigo, ecthyma and folliculitis. Streptococcal skin infections include impetigo and erysipelas. Human papillomavirus skin infections present as several different types of warts, depending on the surface infected and its relative moisture, and the patterns of pressure. The many dermatomycoses (skin infections caused by fungi or yeasts) include tinea capitis, tinea barbae, tinea cruris, tinea manus, tinea pedis and tinea unguium (onychomycosis). Candidal infections occur in moist areas, such as the vulva, mouth, penis, skinfolds and diaper area. Wounds caused by wood splinters or thorns may result in sporotrichosis. Animal bites may result in complex, serious infections, requiring tetanus and, possibly, rabies prophylaxis in addition to appropriate antibiotic therapy

http://www.aafp.org/afp/980515ap/odell.html

My list of the long range illnesses is short because I just started feeling so sad, I couldn't continue. Hopefully, most people will have a good enough immune system to fight anything off. The ones with a compromised system, I will pray they get prophylatic antibiotics.

Another long term problem will be as these infections are treated, they will become more and more resisitant to the treatments.

*with tears*

 

[KrazyKollector]

When the governor met with Bush and the mayor and said she wanted 24 hours to think about it I thought she should be forced to go without food and water while she thought. For this I think she should wade around in that water several times a day while she waits for the test results.

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :blowkiss:

 

[Casshew]

What illnesses can come of all of this toxicity? I've heard a few mentioned, but I'm sure I'm missing a ton.

*Hepatitis
*Tetanus
*Dysentary
*West Nile Virus
*Cholera

ecoli

 

[BillyGoatGruff]

What illnesses can come of all of this toxicity? I've heard a few mentioned, but I'm sure I'm missing a ton.

*Hepatitis
*Tetanus
*Dysentary
*West Nile Virus
*Cholera

Scarlet Fever
Norwalk Virus
Sleeping Sickness
Encephalitis
and when the rats and feral dog packs take over the city you can add the threat of
Bubonic Plauge
Rabies

 

[BillyGoatGruff]

If this is directed to me because of the title of the thread, I realize it's toxic, but what I'm wondering about the wisdom of pumping it out into the lake and river. Is it expected that the toxins will become so diluted with fresh water that they'll no longer be a danger?

Ponchartrain is not a fresh water lake, its salt.
And there is no other place TO pump it. It either goes into the lake or the river or the surroundign bayous, all of which feed into the Gulf.
However, human waste/sewage can be largely neutralized by being filtered through, all things, ponds full of water lilies, which have been used as the final-stage filtration system in the NO area for nearly a century.

 

[rollerbladr123]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050909/ap_on_go_ot/katrina_environment_4;_ylt=AiL5i5XnCwb37CBIGrsUShgbLisB;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUlEPA Chief Had Hard Choice in New Orleans

Quote 1 "We were all faced with a difficult choice," EPA Administrator Stephen Johnson said in an interview with The Associated Press. "The choice was, we have to get the water out of New Orleans for the health and safety of the people and we need to put it someplace." The other option was to pour it into the Mississippi River, where it eventually would move into the Gulf of Mexico, said Johnson. "Our collective judgment was to put it into Lake Pontchartrain."He said he could not speculate on the possible environmental fallout for the massive freshwater tidal estuary, but the EPA was prepared to "take whatever steps we need to take" to deal with future environmental problems.

Quote 2
Of the watery soup that has engulfed New Orleans, Johnson said: "This water is very unsafe. It's a health hazard."

The first set of samples tested show it has a level of sewage-related bacteria that is at least 10 times higher than acceptable, as well as a surprising amount of lead. Louisiana officials believe it is laced with an assortment of heavy metals, pesticides and toxic chemicals. Johnston said the EPA is testing for more than 100 chemicals from heavy metals, pesticides, industrial chemicals and PCBs and expects a more definitive word on the makeup of the hazardous brew in the coming days, possibly as early as this weekend.

more at link...

 

[tybee204]

Lake Pontchartrain is going to be a big huge Love Canal.

 

[rollerbladr123]

Lake Pontchartrain is going to be a big huge Love Canal.

Yes most definitely- that concoction of chemicals is just unreal-the high ppm of lead is just so disturbing

 

[cynder]

Yes most definitely- that concoction of chemicals is just unreal-the high ppm of lead is just so disturbing

What is scarier is that they haven't yet figured out WHERE the lead contamination is coming from. The researchers are very perplexed - this was NOT something they expected to find.

 

[rollerbladr123]

What is scarier is that they haven't yet figured out WHERE the lead contamination is coming from. The researchers are very perplexed - this was NOT something they expected to find.

Yes cynder the above is true and perplexing- they did not expect such high lead from residential area samples- in the article one of the things they surmise is that since the samples were taken from the French quarter (lots of old buildings) and residential neighborhoods so perhaps some of the old paint (which would contain lead) made it into the water but still the high ppm is scary at the least. And if they find Lead and heavy metals in the sediment, god, that cleanup is going to take decades!!

 

[LinasK]

Just to add, also heard anti-freeze is in the water too... Can this be part of the lead contimination???

 

[dani]

Just to add, also heard anti-freeze is in the water too... Can this be part of the lead contimination???

Plus…battery acid is also in the water.

 

[BirdieBoo]

I have heard the word
"polio" being thrown around as well.

 

[dani]

West Nile is all over south Lousiana. Do you have a source for your info, dani? I'm wondering if that is 9 confirmed cases in HUMANS or birds? Because here in Lafayette if we find a dead bird we take it to the health unit and they have it tested. If it tests positive, it's reported as a "confirmed case." A bird found down the block from me was positive. Talk about spraying yourself down with OFF. I'll worry about the deet thing later! We do have humans who have it, too, but at a much lower rate.


Editing: the oil on the water is going to be the least of the long term problems. I hate to mention Halliburton, but Halliburton is experienced in removing oil from water. There's this stuff they throw on top and it absorbs oil only. They then pick up the stuff and the water is clean of oil. The chemicals and bacteria, those are going to be forever type contamination.

I just told my husband that we will have to buy frozen fish from other areas; this will be a first for us. Living by the gulf, we are so spoiled, we have only had fresh seafood.

Hi kgeaux

I heard it on TV (regarding 9 West Nile cases in New Orleans), but I just tried to Google it and the link below is the Google results. The story is in there somewhere, as you will be able to see the quote in the New Orleans Metro News, but I guess I'd have to ready every single story to find the one that contains the info. I read the 1st two and didn't find it, but it's almost 1:30 am and I'm too sleepy to keep reading. Sorry I can't be of more help. The report on TV did say it was "human", however.

http://www.google.com/search?client...+new+orleans+before+Katrina&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

dani