Human Remains (*cadaver) Detection (HRD) dog questions and answers **NO DISCUSSION**

Discussion in 'Lisa Irwin' started by nursebeeme, Oct 21, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. sarx

    sarx Verified Expert/Professional in SAR and K9SAR

    Messages:
    6,315
    Likes Received:
    138
    Trophy Points:
    63
    You are most welcome!

    Disclaimer-All talk is based on well trained dogs, and using the right dogs, if they are not then all bets are off, lol.

    I agree, I think it's safe to say she did not walk out on her own.

    In regards to babies and trailing dogs, I've seen some interesting results. Babies smell different to us and to dogs as well. We were lucky to have a baby in the family to use for training and therefore had a very reliable group of dogs on baby trails, however I have seen a fair share of dogs that have had a lot of trouble picking up a scent of a trail laid by a baby in a stroller or being carried. Why? Is it the smell of the baby, is it the way scent disperses differently when the subject is being carried or pushed? Is it a combo? Regardless, it is something to take into consideration and I think important to know whether the dogs have trained on the kind of scenario.

    So, there are a lot of variables going on here, without info. on their background, I'm not sure we can really say.
     


  2. ~n/t~

    ~n/t~ New Member

    Messages:
    17,672
    Likes Received:
    25
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Thanks for the reply. So when does human decomp smell become noticeable to a human being? hours, days, weeks? I realize it all depends on environmental factors....ie heat, etc. but in your experience with SAR what would be your opinion? Specific to home environment, if possible.
     
  3. Oriah

    Oriah Verified Expert

    Messages:
    7,762
    Likes Received:
    26
    Trophy Points:
    0
     
  4. ~n/t~

    ~n/t~ New Member

    Messages:
    17,672
    Likes Received:
    25
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I'm going o/t as well and I apologize......just to be clear. I don't think Lisa was walking yet. We see her standing holding on to the glass door but I haven't heard or read anywhere she was walking on her own. Was that confirmed? TIA
     
  5. Oriah

    Oriah Verified Expert

    Messages:
    7,762
    Likes Received:
    26
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Not really off topic- because I believe that has a lot to do with when, where, and why HRD dog(s) may have been brought in on her case.

    I thought I recalled a parent stating at some point that she was walking? I don't know where or what news report, though. Just remember thinking that would be why I would try to trail immediately. My first thought was she may have stumbled outside somehow (10 month old babies being stumblers...)

    No clue if that's fact, though.
     
  6. Oriah

    Oriah Verified Expert

    Messages:
    7,762
    Likes Received:
    26
    Trophy Points:
    0
    It depends not only on environmental factors, but also on amount and type of decomp- as well as each individuals human sense of smell.

    I can smell decomp about a mile away. A friend of mine couldn't smell it (or identify it) if it was in the next room.

    No different than dogs. Some have good sniffers- some don't. ;)
     
  7. dog.gone.cute

    dog.gone.cute Kyron Horman - Missing Since 6-4-10

    Messages:
    15,587
    Likes Received:
    1,315
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Sarx and Oriah,

    This might be an "odd" question and thought I would ask since the thread has sort of "slowed down" :innocent::innocent:

    I was wondering can a dog "detect" the "death" of a person -- even if the dog is NOT trained in HRD ?

    I was wondering about this from a personal experience -- when my mother passed away at home [terminal illness], all of us family were there, including the 2 Beagles, and right when she passed, the Beagles let out a "howl" that I have never heard from them before ...

    I have always thought to myself the "dogs knew" Mom was not with us any more ... Sorry to mention this ...

    It is just "fascinating" to me how "dogs" can sense things ... oh, and another thing I remember was when the "dogs" alerted when that Tsunami was about to hit !

    THANKS SO MUCH ... and so sorry for the question, but I had to ask ...:innocent:
     
  8. sarx

    sarx Verified Expert/Professional in SAR and K9SAR

    Messages:
    6,315
    Likes Received:
    138
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Absolutely. I mean, not all dogs, but yes, I have personally seen that type of thing with just a reg. ole house pet. I've talked to a number of nurses and hospice care workers that have seen the same things many times over.
     
  9. stillwatersc

    stillwatersc Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,627
    Likes Received:
    820
    Trophy Points:
    113
    http://www.usatoday.com/news/offbeat/2007-07-26-foreboding-feline_N.htm

    When Oscar curls up on a patient's bed and stays there, the staff knows it's time to call the family. It usually means the patient has less than four hours to live.
    ...
    The 2-year-old Oscar was adopted as a kitten and grew up in a third-floor dementia unit at Steere House, which treats people with Alzheimer's, Parkinson's disease and other illnesses. After about six months, the staff noticed the cat would make his own rounds, just like the doctors and nurses. He'd sniff and observe patients, and those he stayed with would wind up dying in a few hours.
     
  10. dog.gone.cute

    dog.gone.cute Kyron Horman - Missing Since 6-4-10

    Messages:
    15,587
    Likes Received:
    1,315
    Trophy Points:
    113

    :tyou:
     
  11. dog.gone.cute

    dog.gone.cute Kyron Horman - Missing Since 6-4-10

    Messages:
    15,587
    Likes Received:
    1,315
    Trophy Points:
    113

    Wow ... Very Interesting ... TY !
     
  12. Dewey2Me1MoThyme

    Dewey2Me1MoThyme Have clue will sleuth!

    Messages:
    5,005
    Likes Received:
    23
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I think we need to change the name of this thread. every time I search the Lisa Irwin section and see "HUMAN REMAINS" in big bold letters my heart jumps up into my throat thinking they found her body. You'd think after all this time I'd be used to seeing this title and know what it is, wouldn't you? :redface:
     
  13. greenpalm

    greenpalm I don't say much unless I've really thought it thr

    Messages:
    1,028
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    38
  14. Oriah

    Oriah Verified Expert

    Messages:
    7,762
    Likes Received:
    26
    Trophy Points:
    0
  15. Oriah

    Oriah Verified Expert

    Messages:
    7,762
    Likes Received:
    26
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I'm sorry for the loss of your mom, dog.gone.cute. :(

    That's kind of an interesting question- for several reasons. I've been in a couple of different situations when a person was alive, and then passed- with both HRD dogs present (disasters) and pet dogs present (friends/family.)

    My HRD dogs did not HR alert (they are cross trained) at all. Even after the persons had passed. But perhaps that is because the person was removed quickly and we released them back into search mode?

    My pet dogs appeared to grow very 'protective'- circling, touching noses, giving kisses, snuggling, etc.

    It is a science worth studying, for sure.
     
  16. nursebeeme

    nursebeeme Registered User

    Messages:
    53,157
    Likes Received:
    68
    Trophy Points:
    0
    bumping up
     
  17. SleuthyMama

    SleuthyMama Listening to my gut

    Messages:
    1,461
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Animals are just the most amazing creatures. That's all.
     
  18. SurfieTX

    SurfieTX Active Member

    Messages:
    12,156
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    38
    After today's search, I have a question. What is the protocol about the dog's collar(s)? Does it change depending on terrain/water?
     
  19. Mountain_Kat

    Mountain_Kat Heca, firimar!

    Messages:
    11,119
    Likes Received:
    3,943
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Sort of off topic, but sort of not:

    Last year our black lab, Bear , started this thing where he would sniff me and whine. We sort of blew it off as him acting like a weirdo. Then we noticed that, whenever we hiked up in the woods, he would walk right in front of me and stop dead in my path if I got too far behind him. Then he'd come back to me, sniff me and whine. Not long after that, during a routine check up, my doctor discovered that my bloodwork was just nuts. I won't get into the medical particulars, but I'm convinced Bear knew something wasn't right. He still sticks to me like glue whenever we're out and about , despite the fact that his number one human is Hubby. Before my medical issues, he paid very little mind to me at all.

    I just thought that was a neat story to share here. Dogs rock! :rocker:
     
  20. dog.gone.cute

    dog.gone.cute Kyron Horman - Missing Since 6-4-10

    Messages:
    15,587
    Likes Received:
    1,315
    Trophy Points:
    113

    :tyou:
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page



  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice