ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 13

[NotHammerToed]

still think the perp wasn’t known to any of the victims. This person really fits the profile of a voyeuristic serial killer. If he knew the victims surely he wouldn’t have left any survivors? My guess is he didn’t even know the other two were there.

 

[TooMuchGun]

is it possible the empty bedroom on the 2nd floor is accessible by the hill?

 

[Kdot112]

I think it’s very possible that one or two of the four had an exchange with someone very unhinged/obsessive/spiteful that just couldn’t let *something* go. I just don’t have any other theory at this point…


Does anyone else get the feeling LE is lying to the public to make their undivulged suspect feel safe while they continue to tie up the loose pieces of the investigation?

Sending some loving hugs to their families during this very difficult holiday season

Yes, I think LE is being vague and not forthcoming so they can watch everyone involved.

 

[CityKid]

I do think the dog's whereabouts is key. If the dog was in the house, I would think the prep would let him/her outside so there would be no distraction/dog interaction. However, with the weather, the dog would have probably gone to the bathroom and then started barking at the door (to get in). This scenario would disrupt the prep's attack (possibly waking other people in the house as well). It would be too risky to have the dog in the house (barking at the attack) or outside the house (barking to get in).

I think guessing at how a dog none of us knows will behave in a situation none of us knows is fairly futile.

 

[Margrock]

I agree. I think the target was a "type", also. I also agree it seems unlikely it's the killer's first murder. What I do believe, however, is that the killer is close to the same age as the victims. I feel it's likely this person had an obsession with this type of crime, and with serial murder in general, and expressed that interest thru an immersion in single-killer computer games, and a hero-worship of people like Ted Bundy, Danny Rolling - who used a Ka Bar in his murder spree - and Israel Keyes, among others.

I also find it fascinating that the knife attack of the couple in Salem OR, in which the husband was killed - happened around a week from when classes began at U of Idaho in 2021. What if this was the killer's first attempt, and it had been unsuccessful in his eyes, as he left the wife alive. Perhaps he left for school right after the attack, and became loosely acquainted with the King Rd group. I've seen some TikTok video of a party at King Rd, one year to the day before the murders in 2021; also three months to the day after the Salem attack. Perhaps he attended that party and felt slighted or dismissed in some way, and he decided to make the house his target, one year to the day later. Sometimes dates are important to these guys.

I dunno, there are so many gaps in what we've been told about that night, the 911 call, the crime scene, that I'm just spitballing here. It sure feels like LE is rather stymied, with the FBI revisiting the house and all.

 

[AngTxGal]

I hope an attorney can comment on what probable cause would be needed to search someone‘s apartment. If anyone they have had the opportunity to interview seems like they could fit the profile, what do they need to establish probable cause to go through that apartment? If the killer went back into their apartment, there has to be some traces along the banister walking up the stairs, And around the apartment. No matter how careful they were to clean up, Luminol and all that can pick that up. Now if they got right into a car to leave town, that’s some thing else. But I think that they know probably who it is and they’re just trying to find the proof for the case.

This is a great question! I wonder if they simply ask first, or ask for a person to submit a polygraph, or ask for a DNA sample?
It will be very interesting this next week if they begin to ask for males in all the apartments around there if they will volunteer a DNA sample!
Of course guys can say No, but wow would that add some pressure if they begin to ask those questions.

JMO

 

[SteveP]

We don’t technically know the roommates found anybody with blood. One discussion has been bedrooms were locked and roommates couldn’t get in. Banging on doors, dog barking, calling phones with no answer. Therefore called friend(s) to say something weird is going on. Then called 911.

Another thought could be that perhaps the bedroom door was not locked, but one of the victims had managed to get to the door before collapsing against it, in this case, leaving the surviving roommates unable to push it open more than just a crack. In such a case, they probably could surmise that someone was lying against it, but would be unable to see in well enough to determine the extent of injuries. Perhaps when others came over, including possibly a male or males, they were able to push the door open and that is when the 911 call was made. JMO

 

[Happyshoes]

So glad to hear girl fought back. Those fingernail scraping could help solve this case. I can't get past the idea that one of the blondes was targeted. Some dude probably felt humiliated, totally angry about getting the brush off, or got yelled at/cussed at, or worse, laughed at. You guys are great. We all wish we could help them. God bless their families and friends.

 

[tokyorose]

because if he starts on floor 3 he stops after killing X and E

MOO but I believe that you attack the target first, it is where your rage directs you to go.

 

[tokyorose]

Yep and here's another one of them checking LOS yesterday:

Is that red evidence tape on the L side of the window?

 

[Snoop Sister]

That’s most likely what happened.

I never thought of that! Especially if they are friends with someone who lives in they grey apartments across the way- where some folks think those last group photos were taken.

Makes perfect sense.

I also thought there was some possibility that E had plans that morning and friends came by when they couldn’t get ahold of him on his phone. I wonder if that is what woke the roommates. Just MOO.

I think it was reported that J lives behind the house somewhere as well. It was discussed on previous threads. Going to try and find a link.

 

[layer]

This is a great question! I wonder if they simply ask first, or ask for a person to submit a polygraph, or ask for a DNA sample?
It will be very interesting this next week if they begin to ask for males in all the apartments around there if they will volunteer a DNA sample!
Of course guys can say No, but wow would that add some pressure if they begin to ask those questions.

JMO

Why just males?

 

[Ozoner]

It felt to me like they were looking for cameras. Or they had found cameras, and footage already, that didn’t show what someone told them should be there. Eg “I was at the house at midnight, went upstairs to the third floor, went into someone’s room and then I left and drove down Blank St to my apartment”. Yeah then how come footage doesn’t show a light in the 3rd floor window, and your car wasn’t captured on that footage?

They might be looking for footage, but it is very unlikely that they would have been able to identify any POI this quickly based on security-camera footage. Most security footage is good for getting an approximate height and build for a perp, and that's about it. Most of the time you can't even tell the ethnicity of the person. You might be able to identify somebody who walked right up to a doorbell camera on a well-lit porch, but even in that situation the identification would take time.

 

[CSparks_astro]

Does anyone know if tox screen results have been released?

 

[layer]

Does anyone know if tox screen results have been released?

Not released

 

[kbckcern22]

Exactly! Trivia for you Crime Junkies…
What and When was the last case where all these things happened?—
- multiple people killed
- brutally killed
- In their own residence
- in an urban area, there are neighbors
- during the night
- victims have no criminal history
- no connections to drugs, mafia, cartel
- no burglary
- no sexual assault
- no one seems to have heard or seen anything
- two weeks goes by without any POI

This situation is quite rare, how can anyone feel safe if they cannot ensure their own safety in their own home?
That is why this has our attention, IMO

And add on young, happy go lucky college kids- best years of their young adulthood. I know the day I send my kids off to college, this awful incident will be running wild through my brain and every night there often for awhile I am sure!

 

[Colorado303]

Lots of the good old vague language, like "are not believed to be involved", "does not appear to be evidence", etc.

But this is the line that struck me (BBM): "TIPS: Detectives are looking for context to the events and people involved in these murders".

It's an interesting and perhaps telling choice of words. It doesn't inspire much confidence in what LE has managed to uncover so far. I keep thinking that the ex of K theory didn't pan out and LE was right back to square one, and that was a week ago now. All JMO.

We don’t know what LE has or hasn’t uncovered. Announcing they’re very close to an arrest would be counter-productive. Giving details on evidence collected typically won’t help an investigation and I get the feeling that they’d share anything they felt might assist them in solving the case. They have a ton of resources working the crime and I’m sure they know much, much more than we do. Might not be the info they need to find the perp, but I believe they’ll get there.

MOO

 

[diggndeeperstill]

Exactly! Trivia for you Crime Junkies…
What and When was the last case where all these things happened?—
- multiple people killed
- brutally killed
- In their own residence
- in an urban area, there are neighbors
- during the night
- victims have no criminal history
- no connections to drugs, mafia, cartel
- no burglary
- no sexual assault
- no one seems to have heard or seen anything
- two weeks goes by without any POI

This situation is quite rare, how can anyone feel safe if they cannot ensure their own safety in their own home?
That is why this has our attention, IMO

I‘d say Vallow-Daybell fits those criteria. Although we don’t know where they were killed.

 

[SkyBoomer]

Exactly! Trivia for you Crime Junkies…
What and When was the last case where all these things happened?—
- multiple people killed
- brutally killed
- In their own residence
- in an urban area, there are neighbors
- during the night
- victims have no criminal history
- no connections to drugs, mafia, cartel
- no burglary
- no sexual assault
- no one seems to have heard or seen anything
- two weeks goes by without any POI

This situation is quite rare, how can anyone feel safe if they cannot ensure their own safety in their own home?
That is why this has our attention, IMO

It certainly wasn’t the last case, but the Gainesville Murders check every box, there.

As I have shared before, I was a student at UF at the time, and a stone’s throw from Tracy and Manny’s (the final victims) apartment. It was terrifying to live there, with so many apartments backing up to wooded areas and with sliding glass doors and flimsy front doors locks and poor lighting. None of the victims seemed to be involved in high-risk behaviors (which was true), and none of them had any connection to the killer, Danny Rolling. It literally could have been ANY of us.

One interesting fact about Rolling: he showered and cleaned up in the apartment of his first (Gainesville) victims, Sonja and Christina and posed their bodies. Apparently time wasn’t an issue for him.

It does make me wonder if the lack of bloody footprints/ smudges visible on the outside of the house was due to the killer showering after the attacks. That speaks to a level of calm that is frankly terrifying. (Jodi Arias was thought to have showered off in the stall with Travis’ dying body, wasn’t she?)

Sorry for the rambling…..ADHD getting in my way!

 

[TooMuchGun]

MOO but I believe that you attack the target first, it is where your rage directs you to go.

yes but breaking into the 3rd floor means breaking into a bedroom. Also wouldn’t u look into the closest room for ur target.