ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 22

[ChatteringBirds]

This tragedy seems to be breaking news:

Police said they responded to King Road for a report of an unconscious person. When officers arrived, they “discovered four individuals who were deceased...”

4 Idaho college students killed in 'targeted attack,' no suspects in custody

Four University of Idaho students were found dead on Sunday, officials said.

abcnews.go.com

Thread #1
Thread #2
Thread #3
Thread #4
Thread #5
Thread #6
Thread #7
Thread #8
Thread #9
Thread #10
Thread #11
Thread #12
Thread #13
Thread #14
Thread #15
Thread #16
Thread #17
Thread #18
Thread #19
Thread #20
Thread #21

Media Thread/No Discussion

Press photo album (compilation courtesy of WS member cujenn81)

Moscow ID Police Departement Facebook page

City of Moscow re King Road Homicide

Detectives are looking to develop context for the events and people involved in the four murders at 1122 King Rd in Moscow, Idaho. Anyone who observed notable behavior, has video surveillance, or can provide relevant information about these murders:

• Telephone: 208-883-7180
• Email: tipline@ci.moscow.id.us
• Digital Media: fbi.gov/moscowidaho

 

[Sillybilly]

Please read The Rules (linked in my signature), and continue discussion here.

Also, for anyone other than victims or an officially named POI/suspect, use initials or your post will be removed.

No sleuthing or insinuations/accusations against anyone who is not officially named a POI/suspect by LE.

 

[Sillybilly]

Admin Note > Horse's mouth:

LE has said the skinned dog is not related.

Detectives are aware of a Latah County Sheriff’s Office incident of the report of a skinned dog and have determined it is unrelated to this incident. Contact Latah County Sheriff’s Office for further details. Additionally, Detectives are also aware of a Moscow Police incident of the report of deceased animals left on a resident’s property. This was determined to be wildlife activity and unrelated to the incident.

Members have been advised before not to discuss it any further. If you still wish to discuss it further, call the Sheriff's Office but don't post about it here or you may lose posting privileges.

Thank you.

 

[Sillybilly]

The following Johnny Law youtube was originally posted by Mayboy1998 earlier today but because it was not a podcast host we were familiar with and we did not have time to view it in its entirety, it was removed. Having now had time to view it, it is being approved on a one-time basis because it does seem to provide an excellent analysis of the layout of the house, where individuals may have been sleeping, and it speaks to the location of the red liquid in relation to the overall layout of the house.

 

[Sillybilly]

Thread is open again.

When someone posts a rumor, please do NOT respond. Just Report and let us nip it in the bud.

Responding makes a lot of extra work for us, and we get cranky when we have to read through almost an entire thread to find and clean up 25+ responses about something that should never have been posted in the first place.

Thank you.

 

[Sillybilly]

Thread 13, post #977 has the pic with obvious berries on the tree right next to the deck.

Sorry, can't get it to link.

We don't quote post numbers because those can change over time due to Mods having to remove posts.

The following will help everyone know how to quote a post from elsewhere and then your link will not change due to moderation:

How to Quote a Post from Another Thread

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

This post lands at random

To any members who have complained about removal of their off topic posts and TOs issued for derailing the discussion.

There is a very good reason Off Topic posts are a violation of Websleuths TOS.

First of all, the threads are not personal chat or comedy rooms. Off topic posts derail the thread, making the thread all about you and what you want to talk about. Each day, hundreds of members and thousands of guests come to Websleuths to read about the topic the thread is dedicated to, not to read about you or your life or what you think is funny. It is disrespectful to the victims who these threads are dedicated to.

The one thread you post off topic in is not the only active thread that Mods and Admins deal with every day. WS has thousands of threads, 212,000+ members, and only 4 staff to deal with hundreds of active threads 24/7 .

Simple math ... if there are 200 members currently online and even 5% of those members feel it is okay to sneak in that innocuous little off topic post, and each of those 10 posts receives 10 responses and those responses receive even 2 responses each, that is 200 off topic posts alone that our volunteer Moderators would have to search for and remove in a day (in addition to all the other TOS violations they have to deal with).

This means that for your little post that you think is harmless, our staff have to go through pages and pages of posts to find all the responses to your OT post.

Please be courteous to other members, the families and guests reading here, and to our volunteer staff who work very hard in trying to keep the discussions respectful and on topic.

Thank you.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

Stop bringing rumors into this discussion, and stop stating opinion as fact.

There is no approved source to support that EC was found in the hallway.

Mods have had to remove or modsnip tons of posts based on members discussing "whispers" (i.e RUMORs) and/or members theories that contain information as fact when such "fact" is actually based on rumor.

Members who violate the above TOS are subject to a temporary or permanent loss of posting privileges.

 

[Sillybilly]

Hey everyone,

WS requires links to information stated as fact. What you "heard somewhere" or "read somewhere" "think I heard" etc is NOT an approved source. If you can't link it, you can't post it.

No link, no post !!

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

Reddit is not an approved source and rumors are not allowed at Websleuths.

Next member to bring Reddit or rumors to this thread will get a 1 week TO.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

Little rumor, big rumor .. doesn't matter. A rumor is a rumor. Don't bring them to Websleuths.

Also, at Websleuths every family member, every parent, friend, etc. is considered a victim unless they are an officially named POI or suspect. If parents don't go public and give interviews, people think that's not right. If they give interviews, people think that's not right. You aren't in their shoes ... lay off the criticism of how those innocent people may or may not be reacting during their time of grief.

And, it's been said many, many times, stop the generalized LE bashing.

Thousands of members every day have no problem posting in accordance with our rules and policies. Please post responsibly and respectfully.

Thank you.

 

[Strong1]

During a live report on Fox just now, the reporter said they were expecting a report today from Moscow police. This is the second time I have heard this on Fox this morning. Is there anything scheduled out there for today?

 

[docfishbone28]

universities, you pay for the location as much as the specific dwelling unit, and that neighborhood would be desirable for students because of its proximity to campus.

We know how it goes, weve all been to high school. Somethings just come easier to some kids. You see those rich beautiful kids with their party house and new cars and all their friends, kids that dont have those opportunities feel slighted and hold *advertiser censored* agaisnt people who have been given a disirable life. I would say kids living in a 3 story party house are probably more taken care of then those in that apartment. If this were the case still something had to trigger them. Maybe you have somewhat of a carrie situation, no sexual assault is what its stumping me. Seems very personal. Dont think anyone would think they were bold enough to commit and actually get away with 4 murders. Maybe someone was waiting for x and e to come home, my understanding they were at home for majority of the night and then went to the frat house for a minimal amount of time and returned home before K and M. Then you may have blood transfer leading up the steps telling that he didnt have to go up the stairs. I feel as though SG is on a state of madness, he doesnt believe this should have happened to his daughter making it seem as she was not the target, thats why he is so upset. I dont think they were sleeping together, it says likely, i think they were either corralled together after encountering the perp or was aware of something going on and went to M's room being in fear and then calling ex bf for help

 

[hopewell]

Courts have ruled that asking for DNA doesn't violate a person's right to remain silent, so it's exactly like fingerprints. So yes, you could ask for your lawyer and refuse to cooperate. You would be paying that lawyer, because you wouldn't be charged with anything yet. It's called "refusing to cooperate." And you don't have to.

It would land you squarely on the short list of suspects, of course. It's not "privacy rights" when you are called in for a criminal investigation and you refuse to cooperate by providing breathalyzer or even blood tests (if they think you are intoxicated). Certainly call a lawyer, but be prepared for juries to have a dim view of one's resistance to blood, toxicology, dna and fingerprint collection because of a "right to privacy." Note that in my scenario, there is other evidence to connect you to the criminal situation.

You would also have to be prepared to sit a long time in the station without water or coffee or using the restroom (because your DNA can be collected, legally, from door handles, cups and so on).

I am into privacy rights as much or more than anyone I know, but I also know the criminal investigation system. People called in as suspects in murders fall into two groups: cooperative and uncooperative. The latter group arouses suspicion in everyone who is investigated and in most people with common sense. It's not a casual matter or a casual decision. And police can have you sit a very long time while you obtain a lawyer and that lawyer shows up. Don't touch anything if you're fearful your DNA will implicate you in some way.

They can't obtain DNA without probable cause and perhaps even a warrant, both of which are pretty high bars.

It really isn't a right to privacy as much as it is a 5th Amendment right, which is fundamental. A successful PR campaign by authorities (and media) over the last 50 years that it somehow implies guilt doesn't negate that absolute right. Anyone, innocent or not, shouldn't talk to police without an attorney present, and they certainly shouldn't be volunteering personal identifiers for a stored, collective law enforcement database.

The whole "if you had nothing to hide, you would do it" mantra is absurd.

My opinion.

 

[10ofRods]

Courts have ruled that DNA collection does not fall under Miranda. That being said, a person can refuse.

I have never seen a case where a defense attorney successfully used thé increased scrutiny to persuade either judge or jury.

DNA was eventually obtained without a warrant.

They can't obtain DNA without probable cause and perhaps even a warrant, both of which are pretty high bars.

It really isn't a right to privacy as much as it is a 5th Amendment right, which is fundamental. A successful PR campaign by authorities (and media) over the last 50 years that it somehow implies guilt doesn't negate that absolute right. Anyone, innocent or not, shouldn't talk to police without an attorney present, and they certainly shouldn't be volunteering personal identifiers for a stored, collective law enforcement database.

The whole "if you had nothing to hide, you would do it" mantra is absurd.

My opinion.

Please don't put words in my mouth. I'm speaking from my own years of professional experience and that mantra had nothing to do with my statements.

I do know for a fact that if a bunch of people are asked to volunteer DNA samples, all of them being contacted because of a particular scenario that is leading an investigation, and ONE of them says Nope to the DNA that it is not at all difficult to obtain it - even without probable cause.

Courts have ruled, for example, that no probable cause is needed to grab a piece of trash left behind by any person. And "probable cause" covers many such situations. In this case, of course, LE is trying to rule people out not in, by asking for samples. Would a judge later agree that LE had probable cause to grab a straw out of a JitB trash bin, and the DNA on the straw leads them to the killer (as evidenced by many others things - not just the DNA)?

I think the judge would so rule (and likely would not hear about it otherwise - no one would, outside LE). If the DNA exonerates the person, it just goes in a file.


Naturally, LE doesn't do this unless they have suspicions about a particular person.

 

[ACG2x]

Someone had asked about Greek Life in a previous thread. Sororities and Fraternities use Greek letters to signify their name. This has been a tradition passed down since Sororities and Fraternities began in the United States on college campuses.

The reason why they use Greek letters is because in the US in the late 1700's & early 1800's, higher education was dominated by the study of both Latin and Greek. Most colleges required students to know Latin before even applying. However, Greek was only taught at a college so if you knew Greek, you were an educated, well-cultured individual. It was considered prestigious if you knew Greek because that meant your family was well-off enough to send you to university.

The first fraternity was an academic honor society called Phi Beta Kappa which was founded in 1776 at William & Mary. Prior to this, there were a few Latin-based academic societies but when PBK was founded, it was considered more prestigious because again they used Greek letters instead of Latin.

Once PBK was founded, other fraternities copied them to give an aura of prestige and high class to their organization. However, the early fraternities were not what you'd think of today when it comes to rush/pledge week, parties/mixers, etc. They only allowed those who were considered prestigious and educated enough to join and created a "you can't get in" aura which made people want to do more to join them and the tradition has carried on to today.

Think about early fraternities like in the movie Titanic when after dinner, the first-class men go to the smoking room to have a cigar and brandy and - as Rose says - "congratulate each other on being masters of the universe". That's basically what it was.

 

[CaliSun]

Here is a link to that press conference.

The police said “specifically wearing a white hoodie” at the 11/20 press conference. But now their online list doesn’t specify that.

It changed shortly after to just “male”

 

[10ofRods]

It really isn't a right to privacy as much as it is a 5th Amendment right, which is fundamental. A successful PR campaign by authorities (and media) over the last 50 years that it somehow implies guilt doesn't negate that absolute right. Anyone, innocent or not, shouldn't talk to police without an attorney present, and they certainly shouldn't be volunteering personal identifiers for a stored, collective law enforcement database.

My opinion.

I do not know a single case where DNA from unconvicted persons are put in any database so that’s a red herring.

I have been working in forensic DNA consulting and study since 1987.

 

[Balthazar]

TJK - The information about the ring camera was here on Websleuths along with a diagram of the house and what angle the camera could capture. Look way back in the earliest threads. The ring camera was on the gray house pictured here but faced away from 1122 Kings rd.

 

[cottonweaver]

<modsnip>


'Steve Goncalves raised his fears Sunday in an exclusive interview with The Post, saying he was also concerned one suspicious character had been ruled out too quickly — seemingly allowing him to flee the country without taking a DNA test'

Note the Post's CYA in the sentence above. NYP can't substantiate that

Dad of slain Idaho student Kaylee Goncalves turns to P.I.s as cops too ‘inexperienced’

The grieving father of murdered University of Idaho student Kaylee Goncalves is working with his own private investigators — because he fears cops in the major case are too “inexperienc…

nypost.com

<modsnip>