ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #1

[Mountaingazer]

The results of the polys might also assist LE in the "redirection."

JMO

I am glad they are finally doing the poly's, I wish they had done them sooner!

 

[desert-blue]

I know this has been gone over many times but I am still confused so can someone help answer.

It was stated in 1 article that "Great Grandpa" was at camp with a friend. Then it was also stated in another article that the boy stays with "Grandpa" at his house.

So the question I have is there 2 people here being discussed?
Is there BOTH a Great-Grandpa and a Grandpa ?
Or is there only 1 Grandpa?

There are two people, a grandpa and a great grandpa.

The grandpa is baby Deorr's paternal grandpa. He has made public statements, however he was NOT the grandpa on the trip. http://www.people.com/article/missing-boy-idaho-grandfather-speaks

The person on the camping trip is supposedly Mitchell's maternal grandpa (Deorr's great-grandpa). This person has not been identified nor has he made any public comment. From searching online, however, both of whom appear to be Mitchell's grandpas, LM (paternal) and LB (maternal), are deceased. So, it is unclear who this person is.

 

[renarde]

I wish someone would interview the store clerk. I still can't figure out if "filthy" described the bawling child, or the person he was with.

 

[Roselvr]

I really wish they would have put a net across the water at some point, just in case.

Press Release by Lemhi County Sheriff’s Office 7/20/15

Ref: DeOrr Kunz

The Lemhi County Sheriff’s Office is officially scaling back an intensive and exhaustive search of the Timber Creek/Stone Reservoir, area, southwest of Leadore, for the missing 2 yr old boy, DeOrr Kunz. After 10 days of searching, diving, and scouring the hillsides, the Sheriff’s Office has decided to redirect the investigation. The primary searchers included multiple agencies such as, Salmon Search & Rescue, The Lemhi County Sheriff’s Office, The Bonneville County Sheriff’s Office & Bonneville County Search & Rescue, Salmon PD, Idaho Fish & Game, multiple canine handlers, divers, and the public, especially the community of Leadore. The family of DeOrr has continued to cooperate with law enforcement and has volunteered to take polygraphs, which is common in these types of investigations. The parents are not considered suspects and this is a routine procedure. The Sheriff’s Office will keep a presence in the Timber Creek area, continuing to search for clues, and has not ruled out abduction by strangers or wild animals. Numerous resources, including helicopters with FLIR, diver’s, side scan sonar, scent dogs, cadaver dogs, horses, atv’s, and over 300 people, were used to grid and search the reservoir, the creek, and the hillsides, with absolutely no sign of the victim. We are asking the public to continue to report any information to the Idaho Fusion Center at 208 846-7676, or to the Lemhi County Sheriff’s Office at 208 756-8980.

Sheriff Lynn D. Bowerman/Chief Deputy Steve Penner

 

[slashkiss]

I wish someone would interview the store clerk. I still can't figure out if "filthy" described the bawling child, or the person he was with.

I'm with you ... I want to know more from the store clerk. Confusing 6pm and 1pm for the sighting also doesn't seem very likely to me and I can't understand why the family would immediately think that?

 

[renarde]

And yes, it would be risky to stop there if one had just abducted a child, but what if this person had no choice? Maybe they were desperately low on gas, and this was the only gas station for a while?

 

[teeandcee]

has not ruled out abduction by strangers or wild animals.

Quoted from latest press release. In addition to my wild animal theory not being ruled out yet, I'm also surprised they haven't ruled out abduction. It seems like such a remote possibility, but then they know more than I do and not ruling it out doesn't equate to it at the top of their list of possibilities either. I assume in a case like this all all possibilities are considered until the case is solved.

 

[1&2&3]

Thank you for this update.

"The family of DeOrr has continued to cooperate with law enforcement and has volunteered to take polygraphs, which is common in these types of investigations. "

https://www.facebook.com/LemhiCountySheriffsOffice?fref=nf

Snipped by ME

Wonder why the family hasn't already been given polygraphs? Usually this is done immediately.

While the parents stayed at the campsite, the great grandfather and friend did not stay during the search. So they could have been tested already and LE just has not announced it.

I believe there was one of two things that happened. It was either a miscommunication as to the parents were leaving and her grandfather was to watch DeOrr or her grandfather just took his eyes off the toddler for a few minutes and the little tyke took off, slipped and fell into the creek.
Either way, no one wants to point a finger of blame at DeOrr's great grandfather.

 

[SweetT]

I'm with you ... I want to know more from the store clerk. Confusing 6pm and 1pm for the sighting also doesn't seem very likely to me and I can't understand why the family would immediately think that?

I would have said What? And made sure that was investigated thoroughly cause that would have alluded to a kidnapping IMO. IDK why they automatically assumed it was a mistake by the clerk and that it was them some 5 hrs earlier. ??? You would have to guess that LE has already confirmed or not if the clerk were accurate or not. As I stated earlier having this issue cleared up would answer a few questions and very easy to find the information etc.

 

[steelman]

If somebody is out walking their dog close to that campsite next week, and stumbles across him, I'm just gonna completely give up on LE when it comes to "exhaustive searches".

 

[LayzeeDayzee]

And what about other campers who would have been out there at that time (of course we still have not been made aware of how many other campers were there)....what if little Deorr climbed into the storage compartment of someone's RV/trailer and fell asleep inside, or got stuck, or fell asleep and owner had no clue and just happened to be leaving the campground that afternoon and did so with little Deorr inside? Some of those storage compartments can be pretty deep.

Has anybody bothered to look up underneath the vehicles that were on site ?

 

[Inthedetails]

I really wish they would have put a net across the water at some point, just in case.

Press Release by Lemhi County Sheriff’s Office 7/20/15

The words "scaling back" sure do give a pang of sadness.

 

[1&2&3]

True story on how quickly a little one can disappear. Family was at Kings Dominion, I had 3 1/2 yr old in restroom with me. We washed hands, I handed him a paper towel, reached up to get mine, looked down at side where he was standing, and he was gone!! In fact, the packed restroom had emptied out at that second! Freaked out, started calling his name, ran outside to stroller, back inside where now there is no one but housekeeper. She called Security. Ran back outside to meet up with Dad and we are both looking as we wait on Security. This is all just a matter of several minutes.

There isn't a word to describe what I felt at that time. Plus I was sure my insides were going to fall out from the anxiety tearing me apart, not to mention I was 8 months pregnant in August heat. Security came, asked for description, put it out on the park's radio, and reassured us that no one would get out of the park with a child looking anywhere close to the description. As they escorted us to "Lost Parents" to wait, they told us "we will be back within 20 minutes with your child".

Lo and behold, 16 minutes later, here comes the initial security man carrying my beautiful child! My child's comment to me "Mommy you were lost" with the biggest smile on his face.

For parents whose children go missing and there is not that immediate help, I cannot imagine the fear and trauma that envelopes them. After that incident, my heart crumbles with each case where a child is missing when there is not parental involvement! The torture they live through is unbearable!

 

[SleuthMom]

I am glad they are finally doing the poly's, I wish they had done them sooner!

Hope the poly's are done for all 4 and not just the parents.

 

[Donjeta]

Quoted from latest press release. In addition to my wild animal theory not being ruled out yet, I'm also surprised they haven't ruled out abduction. It seems like such a remote possibility, but then they know more than I do and not ruling it out doesn't equate to it at the top of their list of possibilities either. I assume in a case like this all all possibilities are considered until the case is solved.

How would anyone absolutely rule out stranger abduction anyway? It's pretty hard to prove a negative. It seems very unlikely since the time window seems to be pretty short and it's so desolate and if the family never saw any suspicious strangers or vehicles nearby... But it's pretty hard to rule out that there was certainly no one else. I doubt there are any traffic cameras for miles and miles.

I wonder if the father saw any traffic when he was out there driving for cell coverage?

 

[Cardinal47]

I was thinking more along the lines of one of the vehicles being moved or repositioned after they arrived there, and somehow the little guy got wedged up underneath it or climbed underneath it. There's a lot of nooks and cavities up underneath a pickup truck.

To be honest, I'm just about "idea'd" out.

I'm just about idea'd out too! But, there is always a but, I wonder if they will release results of polys to quiet the folks that are playing the blame game? Seems to me if polys are given and passed it's only to the benefit of little Deorr because when people are kept uninformed they are less likely to help and assist with getting his picture and information about him missing.

Social media can be a bad or good thing. Beating the drums when a child is missing might help. Fingers crossed.

I figured they would be ending up. I read somewhere in time ten days is the search time. So that's it folks.

I was hoping NG would have something on her show but lately it seems she has more misinformation than facts. Sigh...

The person up thread that said it will be hard to find him in that Camo jacket kind of hit the spot. It will be hard to find the little guy in water wearing something like that.

I would love to hear what the woman at the store has to say. By now she has to know if the child she saw was Deorr and his father. Their picture has been everywhere. Also how can anybody mix up 1pm and 6pm. Nopers on that one.

I don't think an abductor would march into a convenience store with his victim but times and people are very strange these days.

 

[flourish]

I read Peter Hyatt's Statement Analysis blog. Very interesting, indeed.

A few things that continue to niggle at my brain.

1. If the parents went on and on about how little Deorr NEVER goes anywhere without his blanket (and cup, etc), then why was that blanket reportedly found in their truck? That's kind of a huge contradiction, no? Is it possible that maybe the family arrived at the campground, little Deorr fell asleep in the truck on the drive (Dad had stated in interview that his nap time was 2pm), there with his blanket......and instead of waking him up they just let him sleep there in the truck?

2. If Dad is so sure that he's been abducted then I'm confused about the store clerk (the store 40 minutes away) who said she had seen a man and filthy little bawling blonde boy @ 6pm buying candy. This was discussed in the long interview w/ parents and little D's Dad said the store clerk made a mistake. I think what he meant was that he and Deorr had been at the store earlier in the day, 1pm was it?......but not at 6pm so she was mistaken.............but..........if Dad was leaning toward little D having been abducted, why would it be a mistake on the clerk's part to say she saw a man/little boy similar to little D's description? Couldn't it have potentially been an abductor at the store with the little boy at 6pm?

3. In the interview, little D's Dad states "we weren't more than fifty" and his wife cuts him off and says "10 minutes".......then he cuts her off and says "fifty yard and 10 minutes." Made me wonder if he'd intended to say 50 minutes before wife cut him off?

4. In long interview Dad says little D was going to "be good with Grandpa around the campfire".........but if that would have been sometime between 2pm and 2:30pm or so, would it be usual for someone at this time of year to have a campfire going in the early afternoon? Most people don't waste firewood when camping, as they've only brought a certain amount with them and it has to last them the entire time they're gone........and you can really go through a lot of it with a fire going throughout the entire evening. And it doesn't sound like the kind of campground where one can buy firewood (from what I've read it sounds like a very basic no-service campground......with nothing more than a firepit and picnic table at each site...and not even a campground where one has to register or pay for the campsite).

4. Very perplexed by Dad's mention of "Snake River" twice during the interview, particularly when he was talking about Search and Rescue. Seems he had Snake River on his mind. Why?

Because there are so many places, businesses, etc. with "snake river" in the name, IMO. I grew up around there...even wrote a poem for the newspaper about the snake river when I was little. Awww. Search and rescue and snake river are both "S" & "R" so I get how they could get confused. IMHO


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[ninij9]

If I was dad I would put both boots in the creek miles and miles downstream with five volunteers and walk upstream with sticks and search every single nook and cranny a portion at a time literally leave no stone unturned, until I got back to the campsite and then some. That little boy is in the creek, he's just got to be. As far as the polygraphs go, we don't know at what point they were given, just that they were. It could have been within hours of him going missing. I really don't smell foul play with these parents. I'm not sure about Great Gramps and friend because we have been given nothing in regards to them.
CREEK CREEK CREEK and CREEK.
JMO.

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[flourish]

Thank you for this update.

Here are some key things I noticed from the update.

"After 10 days of searching, diving, and scouring the hillsides, the Sheriff’s Office has decided to redirect the investigation. "

"The family of DeOrr has continued to cooperate with law enforcement and has volunteered to take polygraphs, which is common in these types of investigations. "

https://www.facebook.com/LemhiCountySheriffsOffice?fref=nf

The just going to bump this. For clarity. And reminders.


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[Jules71]

So what are all the possible scenarios

Fell in creek
Fell in reservoir
Lost in woods
Was never at the campground
Was at the campground but was passed off to someone else during store trip
Stranger abduction
Family disappeared him
Animal carried him off
Fell out of Dad's truck while napping
Bigfoot
Climbed into someones vehicle
Fell in a hole
Fell in toilet (which I read in sm were drained/checked)


If I thought my child was abducted, I would not so easily dismiss a possible sighting (the store at 6 pm, filthy bawling younger blonde with a gentleman and a black truck).

Where did the other vehicle description come from that was listed on flyers that have been circulating?

If I were the parents, I would bring in private search groups (as someone else said).

This child has vanished without a trace it seems. Very sad.



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