If the plan was to be seen at the school.....

[oceanblueeyes]

This is the biggest hangup I have had about this case from the very beginning.

While some have said that she picked this day because everyone would be busy with so many people there, I just cant wrap my mind around that. I think back to when my own children when they had science fair exhibits and it was a day of repeated conversations of "well hi there, xxxxx, so nice to see you again." yada, yada, yada etc. Seeing many that I hadn't seen in awhile but knew I was the mother of the children they knew and knew I had volunteered at the school. Many of them coming up and saying "oh aren't you xxxxxxx's, mom?"

Terri knew parents,students, teachers, school staff and rightly or wrongly they thought she was Kyron's bio mother, imo and Kyron had attended this same school since the beginning.

To me someone less noticed or unassuming could have taken Kyron out of there without being detected than the woman with the flaming red hair that so many people knew there. Especially if it didn't register that this person wasnt a family member since Kyron would not with his mother so they could put two and two together.

Maybe she did this, but if so it will remain a mystery how she could have pulled this off with that school being packed with 300 people (many who would have to know her by sight) and no one saw her leave with Kyron.

IMO

 

[evelyn24]

Well we know she went early that day and from the picture she took there weren't many people around at that time. She probably left shortly after that before most of the other people arrived. If someone else was responsible they would have to know just when he arrived and just hang around till TH left the school. If it was someone at the school they would have opportunity to do it at any time during the school year, this was the only time probably that TH brought him to school cause he was a bus-rider usually.This was probably the only time she could pass his disappearance off on someone else to, seriously what other opportunity might she have had other than this one? And if someone saw her go to the car with him she could always say they forgot something in the car and were retrieving it and that he later went back in and she waved to him goodbye from the hall. I mean no one is going to stand around and watch her every move there is always an excuse for your actions.

Yep. I don't think she was too worried about being seen because of what you just mentioned. Also, you're correct about people were busy and not watching her every move and she knew this.

 

[evelyn24]

Has LE actually stated that no one saw Kyron leave the school with Terri?

Good point.

 

[tlcya]

If the plan was to have Kyron seen at the school, why not go one step further and be seen all around town that day by as many witnesses as possible WITHOUT Kyron in your care? Why instead, spend your day in ways you cannot account to LE?

IF the disappareance was planned by Terri to ocur on that day in that way, why not have it further planned out so that your time can later be accounted for by LE?

It just doesn't add up to me. I really doesn't.

 

[tlcya]

Yep. I don't think she was too worried about being seen because of what you just mentioned. Also, you're correct about people were busy and not watching her every move and she knew this.

If you plan to kidnap/harm your stepchild and make a big show of dropping him off at school so he can disappear on the school's watch rather than yours, wouldn't you make darn sure people noticed you leaving UNACCOMPANIED by said stepchild? I know I would.

 

[kgeaux]

............and then leave the school after taking the picture at the science fair, then how in the world did TH figure out a way to get Kyron out of the school and feel secure enough that she wasn't seen? The school didn't call and say he was absent, so for all she knew they did see her leave with him. :waitasec:

My logical mind isn't wrapping around this theory. Help!

The only way it makes sense to me that no one saw Kyron leave with anyone is that someone got incredibly lucky. No way could someone PLAN to be so lucky. :twocents:

She sent him out the side door under his classroom, down the stairs to the soccer field, and out to the access road where she met him with the truck. Steep slope, tall grass, everyone busy looking at exhibits, nobody sees a thing. And if, by some slim chance someone does, she's got an excuse--he forgot something in the truck. Easy peasy.

http://s780.photobucket.com/albums/yy81/gwenabob/Skyline School/

He forgot something in the truck, and she had already left the parking lot, so he chased her down to the access road? I'm just not seeing this as a viable theory.

I don't know why, but, you have hit on the one thing that makes me doubt SM is involved. I can't get past this one in any way to make her look guilty.

The fact is that Kyron was last seen inside the school, according to LE. He was not seen leaving the school with anyone. Yet, obviously he did leave the school with someone.

I'm curious; how do you think those facts point particularly to SM?

 

[evelyn24]

If the plan was to have Kyron seen at the school, why not go one step further and be seen all around town that day by as many witnesses as possible WITHOUT Kyron in your care? Why instead, spend your day in ways you cannot account to LE?

IF the disappareance was planned by Terri to ocur on that day in that way, why not have it further planned out so that your time can later be accounted for by LE?

It just doesn't add up to me. I really doesn't.

If she's responsible for his disappearance I'm sure she needed to do other things and was unable to drive around without him in the truck just to be seen.
IF she did this then there had to be a point where the last thing she wanted to do was be seen. In other words she had to get rid of him, hide evidence, go home and pretend everything was ok; posting pics on facebook etc.

A plan is never perfect.

 

[momtective]

I think she told him she was going to show him a "cool electric" something.

Me too...maybe she has a friend who an electrician or something. Maybe she told Kyron she was taking him to see her friend who would show him a cool electric project. With the Sauvie thing I had initially thought maybe she told him she was taking him to see a dam. Whatever she told him, I think it had something to do with a cool electric "something" and he went where he told his friend he was going...downstairs. Isn't that where the door is to the soccer field?

 

[evelyn24]

The only way it makes sense to me that no one saw Kyron leave with anyone is that someone got incredibly lucky. No way could someone PLAN to be so lucky. :twocents:



He forgot something in the truck, and she had already left the parking lot, so he chased her down to the access road? I'm just not seeing this as a viable theory.




The fact is that Kyron was last seen inside the school, according to LE. He was not seen leaving the school with anyone. Yet, obviously he did leave the school with someone.

I'm curious; how do you think those facts point particularly to SM?

Some times it is "luck" or timing involved even when there is a plan.

 

[SusieMom]

............and then leave the school after taking the picture at the science fair, then how in the world did TH figure out a way to get Kyron out of the school and feel secure enough that she wasn't seen? The school didn't call and say he was absent, so for all she knew they did see her leave with him. :waitasec:

My logical mind isn't wrapping around this theory. Help!

This is exactly my sticking point.... not that it *could* have happened.. sure somebody could have walked out the door with a live and well Kyron without anyone noticing. Clearly that could happen.... however it would be pure chance, not in any way something that a person could have *counted* on so, IMO, no one in their right mind other than a complete stranger would have taken that risk... Its hard to believe that TH, being well known to this very small school community would have considered this her best plan. Another mom pulling into the parking lot at that exact moment, etc somebody glancing out a window.. about a zillion ways she could have been seen, many that she would have no way of knowing about. As a key part of a possible premeditated plan, it would have been a terrible choice, especially in a season and location where "losing" a kid in remote place wouldn't have been that hard.

So if she did walk out the door with him, IMO, she's 1. very far gone mentally, which perhaps if recently reported alleged events are proven true would support and 2. extremely lucky, b/c I really do think that if they had a single credible eyewitness that saw her leave the school property with Kyron, she would have already been arrested by now.

I still have lots and lots of uncertainty.. this is the weirdest case ever.

 

[GrainneDhu]

If the plan was to have Kyron seen at the school, why not go one step further and be seen all around town that day by as many witnesses as possible WITHOUT Kyron in your care? Why instead, spend your day in ways you cannot account to LE?

IF the disappareance was planned by Terri to ocur on that day in that way, why not have it further planned out so that your time can later be accounted for by LE?

It just doesn't add up to me. I really doesn't.

That's what makes me think that it was not premeditated, if TMH is the perpetrator (I'm not convinced but I'm leaning). I think if this were premeditated, the temptation would be overwhelming to do too much, to try too hard for an alibi.

In any case, better a very loose and difficult to confirm story because there would, of necessity, be a slice of about an hour or so to kill Kyron and dispose of his body. And then get over whatever emotional aftermath there was. It wouldn't do to have witnesses saying "yes, she came in at 10 am, dishevelled and looking really agitated."

Far better to drive around for awhile afterwards, get her composure back, then head home and pick up her day as if everything was normal.

Better for there to be no witnesses than for there to be damaging ones.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

ITA susie - but remember WE don't know that someone hasn't surfaced that saw her leave with him. Then LE goes back to TH and asks her about it. She could very easily say - he forgot his lunch, homework, whatever, in the truck and just came out to get it - I walked him back in and up the stairs to watch him walk down the hallway.

We just don't know. IMO I believe TH is "thumbing her nose" at LE and everything they ask her. AND for everything they ask her - she has an answer - a viable, credible, no way to prove otherwise, answer.

I, too, believe she is mentally unstable - but not to the point that she can't carry on with a very cunning plot.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

ITA susie - but remember WE don't know that someone hasn't surfaced that saw her leave with him. Then LE goes back to TH and asks her about it. She could very easily say - he forgot his lunch, homework, whatever, in the truck and just came out to get it - I walked him back in and up the stairs to watch him walk down the hallway.

We just don't know. IMO I believe TH is "thumbing her nose" at LE and everything they ask her. AND for everything they ask her - she has an answer - a viable, credible, no way to prove otherwise, answer.

I, too, believe she is mentally unstable - but not to the point that she can't carry on with a very cunning plot.

I think if LE had a credible witness or witnesses that saw Kyron leaving with Terri that day this case would have long ago ended in an arrest.

Imo, no one saw Kyron leaving with his mother that day.

IMO

 

[oceanblueeyes]

That's what makes me think that it was not premeditated, if TMH is the perpetrator (I'm not convinced but I'm leaning). I think if this were premeditated, the temptation would be overwhelming to do too much, to try too hard for an alibi.

In any case, better a very loose and difficult to confirm story because there would, of necessity, be a slice of about an hour or so to kill Kyron and dispose of his body. And then get over whatever emotional aftermath there was. It wouldn't do to have witnesses saying "yes, she came in at 10 am, dishevelled and looking really agitated."

Far better to drive around for awhile afterwards, get her composure back, then head home and pick up her day as if everything was normal.

Better for there to be no witnesses than for there to be damaging ones.

To me if she had planned this all out and it was premediated she would have made SURE several people (adults) saw her leaving alone that day.

IMO

 

[matou]

............and then leave the school after taking the picture at the science fair, then how in the world did TH figure out a way to get Kyron out of the school and feel secure enough that she wasn't seen? The school didn't call and say he was absent, so for all she knew they did see her leave with him. :waitasec:

My logical mind isn't wrapping around this theory. Help!

I'm sure she has an accomplice. She placed herself as far away from Kyron when she waved 'bye' to him and took a separate stairwell just before this. She did want to be at the school and be seen with him and then separated herself from him while in the school. Why? Signaling to the accomplice in the stairwell? Gotta go right now but I'll expand on this later.

 

[tlcya]

I am in an unhappy marriage, I suspect my husband is having an affair, so I hire a landscaper and approach him about murdering my husband. If you are in an unhappy marriage and want ou tthe easist way is divorce, not murder. I must assume IF this plot took place that the motive is financial.

How does Kyron's disappareance factor in? If the motive for that was financial, then it would be interesting to know if there is life insurance on little Kyron. Even so, this theory feels wrong because there must be a proof of death for a life insurance payout, or a long seven year wait to declare him dead.

I keep trying to find a theory to fit the circumstance and nothing is adding up. It just isn't.

 

[GrainneDhu]

This is exactly my sticking point.... not that it *could* have happened.. sure somebody could have walked out the door with a live and well Kyron without anyone noticing. Clearly that could happen.... however it would be pure chance, not in any way something that a person could have *counted* on so, IMO, no one in their right mind other than a complete stranger would have taken that risk... Its hard to believe that TH, being well known to this very small school community would have considered this her best plan. Another mom pulling into the parking lot at that exact moment, etc somebody glancing out a window.. about a zillion ways she could have been seen, many that she would have no way of knowing about. As a key part of a possible premeditated plan, it would have been a terrible choice, especially in a season and location where "losing" a kid in remote place wouldn't have been that hard.

All of the above is predicated on the idea that TMH could not be seen leaving the school building with Kyron or she'd be much more of a suspect. Enough of a suspect that she'd probably be arrested by now.

But, why would this be? She was his stepmother, she was there for a legitimate reason, it would be the most natural thing in the world for them to be seen walking out of the school building together.

The trick is that she would need to be able to give it a reasonable, logical and believable explanation.

I think it's well established as fact that TMH and Kyron were in the school building together that morning around 8:15 am. She took pictures of him with his exhibit that included two adults and one little girl in the background, plus the president of the PTA witnessed her taking the pictures.

What if TMH and Kyron left the school building together right after those photos were taken?

The problem for TMH is that she doesn't want to be the last known witness.

So. Do a little simple re-arranging of the time line and it all works much better.

The solution could be to tell LE that after she arrived at school with Kyron, they went in together. Then she remembered that Kyron had left something (probably his backpack) in the truck and they walked back out together to get it. Then, after they came back in together, they toured, she took the photo, etc.

That would nearly neutralise any potential witness who saw them leave the building together. Sure, they left together but they came back together, look at this photo! The discrepancy in times would probably be less than ten minutes. It wouldn't be likely that any potential witness checked the time, so that would be a minuscule risk.

Several WebSleuths posters have said that they would notice which parents and children were at the school for such a function and I don't doubt them. Some people remember people, some don't. But I don't see anyone who has posted that they could nail down within a matter of five minutes the time they saw a parent or child.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

I am in an unhappy marriage, I suspect my husband is having an affair, so I hire a landscaper and approach him about murdering my husband. If you are in an unhappy marriage and want ou tthe easist way is divorce, not murder. I must assume IF this plot took place that the motive is financial.

How does Kyron's disappareance factor in? If the motive for that was financial, then it would be interesting to know if there is life insurance on little Kyron. Even so, this theory feels wrong because there must be a proof of death for a life insurance payout, or a long seven year wait to declare him dead.

I keep trying to find a theory to fit the circumstance and nothing is adding up. It just isn't.

ITA - but maybe NOT life insurance - but I know a good, hefty, meaty negligence lawsuit against a public school district could land millions! IMO and all..............

just sayin'......................

 

[tlcya]

ITA - but maybe NOT life insurance - but I know a good, hefty, meaty negligence lawsuit against a public school district could land millions! IMO and all..............

just sayin'......................

True, I hadn't considered that angle and you make a very good point. Again, that takes me back to making darn sure someone saw me leave that building and get in my vehicle/drive off without Kyron though, KWIM? On a busy day with so many people in and out of the building, how hard is it to time your exit to coincide with another's? Make some small talk as you exit the building together heading towards were the vehicles are parked.

Not being argumentative and I appreciate your thoughts, just trying to make all the pieces fit for myself.

 

[SusieMom]

I am in an unhappy marriage, I suspect my husband is having an affair, so I hire a landscaper and approach him about murdering my husband. If you are in an unhappy marriage and want ou tthe easist way is divorce, not murder. I must assume IF this plot took place that the motive is financial.
.

Hasn't TH been divorced before? More than once even, IIRC.. I have an older sister who has been divorced 4 times. She is the Queen of "divorce strategy"... if any of her friends are heading for divorce court she's the one they go to.. she knows how to work the system, use the lawyers, to get the absolute best outcome. If her current husband were to cheat or otherwise behave badly enough for her to throw in the towel (which apparently doesn't actually take all that much) he'd be toast. Why, if this is the possible motive, would she not feel the same? She's survived it before..... and esp if he's engaged in adultery, she would have come out pretty sweetly. She's been a devoted SAHM to his two children (one not even her own) while he was out earning 100k a year... Why on earth would you decide... nah.. I think I'll take my chances hiring the yardman to kill him? I know people do it, but there is just no logical way to look at it......