Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - #155 *Richard Allen Arrested*

[Tricia]

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[Blondie in Spokane]

Thanks for the responses everyone. This is one case I will be following & be glued to all the way thru trial….

 

[CSIDreamer]

BBM -It has been discussed previously and it is a popular place for these types of photos. I believe that this was taken some time ago as his daughter is now in her late 20's and married.

I would venture to guess it's a popular landmark, too.

JMO

 

[photographer4]

I have a legal question: if a person is charged in a serious crime such as murder and their spouse files for divorce, can that spouse be compelled to testify if they are in the middle of divorce proceedings, or if they have successfully obtained a divorce before the trial or can they still claim spousal privilege?

 

[m00c0w]

I have a legal question: if a person is charged in a serious crime such as murder and their spouse files for divorce, can that spouse be compelled to testify if they are in the middle of divorce proceedings, or if they have successfully obtained a divorce before the trial or can they still claim spousal privilege?

No. If it was privileged communication that occurred during the marriage, it’s still privileged after divorce. RA can petition to have anything like that suppressed and probably be very successful in doing so.

MOO

ETA: That only applies to communications, though. She could still be called to testify about character or whereabouts or other things of that nature from my understanding.

 

[Spartygirl]

Yes, but John Prior is a privately retained attorney. If Chad had retained a pubic defender, the same would not apply.

AHhh Got it.
I am not a legal eagle at all and I am seeing posts about the Alford plea.
We do not have that in my state so I have never heard of it and had to google it.

I guess I dont understand that plea at all.
If I am innocent, I am going to fight for my innocence, not use a plea that would render me guilty while I maintain my innocence.

That confuses me but again, I am not a legal expert at all and most of what I have learned over the years is from following court cases/ death cases here on WS and watching these trials as they are happening, so there's that.

Thank you for answering and see, I learned something new again--that is why I love being here with all of you who have experience in different avenues of legal and medical and all kinds of expertise

 

[Wallendo]

I don't interpret the hand-written request for a public defender as legal brilliance and cunning strategy. It seems to me like a person parroting legal phraseology from movies and TV shows. Popular entertainment always the well-dressed defense lawyer immediately arriving with briefcase in hand, but rarely points out that only the rich can pay their legal fees with cash in hand in a major crime case. It is hard to imagine how a pharmacy tech could pay for a murder defense where he would not only have to pay his lawyer, but also all the expert witnesses, lab fees, and investigative fees.

If the victims's families sue for wrongful death and place a lien on the house it can get very complicated very quickly. His wife's financial situation could become dire.

If, somehow, RA is proven innocent and LE knew or should have known, he may get his money back with a wrongful prosecution judgment. That is extremely unlikely, however.

 

[Charlot123]

<modsnip: Quoted post was removed>

So far as I know, nobody has a recording of RAs voice that we could compare to Bridge Guy's voice. All we have is a belief in the judgement of LE and the judge (who has since recused himself from the case). And truth be told, LE has been mistaken before, so it might be possible they are wrong here as well. I sure hope not. MOO

JMO. The problem is not that LE have been mistaken. This country doesn’t have enough cameras in public places, so we have to live with LE who really work often being mistaken. (I’ll be repeating it: to solve crimes, LE need clues).

However: this case is like an underbelly of a long -abandoned ship, when questionable witnesses, tongue-tied YouTubers, local amateur detectives, newspapers, TV of all kinds, plain trolls and public, all stick to it like seashells. This overgrowth is shocking.

In this situation, LE has been criticized, no big deal, but they have also been ridiculed, and it is worse.

While I think that RA bears some resemblance to BG, I can also imagine that someone else, perhaps bothered that KAK might finally spill his database, or else, hid stuff in the yard of a local alcoholic, and called the tip line. Or someone closer, who visits the house, has set him up. In short, it is hard for the case to be airtight after five years.

I imagine that LE is in the process of an active investigation, now, to get the whole story, in details that should match. (I have heard good war correspondents do it, it is very hard, to get through all details, but BM’s case has shown the importance of it).

I also hope that should LE realize that they got the wrong person, they will have courage to acknowledge it, because the true criminal would not be too far, this time.

 

[Charlot123]

I don't interpret the hand-written request for a public defender as legal brilliance and cunning strategy. It seems to me like a person parroting legal phraseology from movies and TV shows. Popular entertainment always the well-dressed defense lawyer immediately arriving with briefcase in hand, but rarely points out that only the rich can pay their legal fees with cash in hand in a major crime case. It is hard to imagine how a pharmacy tech could pay for a murder defense where he would not only have to pay his lawyer, but also all the expert witnesses, lab fees, and investigative fees.

If the victims's families sue for wrongful death and place a lien on the house it can get very complicated very quickly. His wife's financial situation could become dire.

If, somehow, RA is proven innocent and LE knew or should have known, he may get his money back with a wrongful prosecution judgment. That is extremely inlikely, however.

I hope they bring a doctor to see him. Without details because we are not allowed to discuss the handwriting and choice of words, anyone can see that physically, the man is not right. Sounds like we have two sick men in two parallel cases in jail, one, KK with seizures, and the other one, RA…concerning.

 

[adbou00]

Just pondering the attorney/public defender thing. I keep seeing people saying they're surprised no big shot defense attorney has taken on his case pro-bono. Could it be that the PC is sealed they don't want to take on this case sight-unseen. Or can they see the sealed PC before agreeing to take him on as their client? I don't know much when it comes to homicide cases and how defense attorneys take on a case such as this one. Thank you in advance.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Just for perspective, I've asked friends/family (about 10 people in total) what they thought about LE arresting a suspect in the Delphi murders.

Not one single person asked knew what I was talking about, they had no clue. We, myself included, tend to forget that the majority of the public is not as hyper aware of these cases as we become.

Cases, especially child murder, become emotional and personal to us after months or years of following every detail, just human nature. I sometimes have to step away from them for awhile.

I think LE has the right man in custody, I don't believe they wouldn't beyond thoroughly vet the facts before making an arrest considering all the criticism they've received thus far. Plus, I don't think they'd put the families of the victims through a nightmare like this if they weren't absolutely convinced.

MOO

 

[Jovin]

I do feel sorry for the innocent family members though, IF they are truly unaware of his possible connection to these murders. It's hard to believe that after all these years that they didn't see a hint of a chance that he could be involved.

 

[Erutan]

Is there a chance RA - if guilty - could be incompetent for execution under the Eight Amendment?

Unless this crime is what many of us have thought, which is a wider conspiracy, a “sick predator”, and thus quite likely he has other offences, as in if it was a wild psychotic one-off and he actually doesn’t remember it etc etc, perhaps there is something very wrong in this person’s head.

Just being devil’s advocate here. Personally from the photos and videos I’ve seen of him I strongly believe he has the empty affect displayed by true psychopaths (as opposed to sociopaths), and the little we do know about the crime suggests he could be that “sick predator”, but there’s all this other background fluff which leaves a small window of doubt in my mind. Plus there’s the information vacuum which is rapidly being filled by those of us outside the LE agencies involved. Who knows.

The fact he’s gone this long without a lawyer makes me think perhaps he’s gone mute. Or perhaps as others suggested he is a major addict and is detoxing. Either way this window of inaction on his part either could be indicative of - or maybe used as a way to innocuously suggest - some form of insanity.

But then, as a relatively sane person myself, I can’t imagine being in his shoes right now and thinking “damn I gotta beat the death penalty, loads to live for.”

JMO. Thinking out loud.

emphasis mine.
Lol at the bolded, in a sarcastic way directed only at the alleged perp !
Hahaha !

On a serious note, I fervently hope if he did all of this to the girls and their families... that he doesn't evade justice through some loophole, or pretending to be be insane.
Nothing from what I've gleaned, regarding RA's actions previously -- have indicated any forms of mental blackouts or the type of insanity where a person has no idea what they've done after the act.
He had a job and a decent house and a family, fgs.
Why did he throw it all away ?
Of course there's still a lot we don't know.
And all of my comments directed at RA are allegedly, but I still think LE have arrested their man, and I shudder to think what evidence LE have that we don't know of yet.

Anyone who knew him previously will hopefully come forward with any bit of information.
Maybe he was a stalker or a peeping tom before ?
Or worse ?

It's hard to imagine going from smaller crimes to brutally killing two teens.
And I do believe the crimes against Abby and Libby were brutal, sorry to say.
If this arrest and probable trial reveal other past crimes and closure or answers for another family -- I'm all for it !!!!
M00.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Frosted, that's a really good point, and there are arguments on both sides IMO. My own feeling is that when LE first began looking at RA for the murders, they did not say anything about it publicly, but they began investigating him exhaustively.

They only get one chance at the prosecution, and the very fact of arresting him throws many innocent lives into turmoil (family, co-workers, etc)--my own guess is that LE would have checked every single thing they could about RA and about any evidence. So I suspect that it LOOKED like it was out of nowhere, but that the LE people put in a TON of work behind the scenes. Just a guess, though.

Thanks. I was just wondering if I missed something or if it was a MOO. I'll assume it's a MOO until someone comes up with a link or we see the probable cause (which may be years from now).

 

[photographer4]

Is it possible that the spouse of an accused could have their own lawyer regarding divorce proceedings and that their counsel could communicate with the accused in jail?

 

[Erutan]

I do feel sorry for the innocent family members though, IF they are truly unaware of his possible connection to these murders. It's hard to believe that after all these years that they didn't see a hint of a chance that he could be involved.

I think Gary Ridgeway's family had no idea ?
In a way, he destroyed his family and relatives' lives.
I still hope they've been able to have some sort of life after everything that he did.
He not only devastated the victim's families forever, he also ruined a large portion of the family and relatives' lives, who thought they knew this man.

I agree that anyone completely in the dark about RA's actions or worse -- suspecting but fearful for their lives -- are suffering as well.
I'm not sure, but it may be worse to be the relative of the perp than the relative of the victim, the shame would be a life sentence in itself.
M00.

 

[Erutan]

Frosted, that's a really good point, and there are arguments on both sides IMO. My own feeling is that when LE first began looking at RA for the murders, they did not say anything about it publicly, but they began investigating him exhaustively.

They only get one chance at the prosecution, and the very fact of arresting him throws many innocent lives into turmoil (family, co-workers, etc)--my own guess is that LE would have checked every single thing they could about RA and about any evidence. So I suspect that it LOOKED like it was out of nowhere, but that the LE people put in a TON of work behind the scenes. Just a guess, though.

My guess is that LE have some pretty solid evidence ?
Something that cannot be easily dismissed ?

I don't want to speculate too much, but I was thinking dna evidence, or clothing in RA's possession ?
The suspect can try explaining that one away !
Imo.

 

[Erutan]

Thanks for posting that, seeing those photo images in a side by side comparison and the voice snippets convince me even more that RA is BG, no doubt.

MOO

Agreed.
The voice is a bit higher pitched for a man and is eerily similar, it's uncanny.

 

[steeltowngirl]

I hope they bring a doctor to see him. Without details because we are not allowed to discuss the handwriting and choice of words, anyone can see that physically, the man is not right. Sounds like we have two sick men in two parallel cases in jail, one, KK with seizures, and the other one, RA…concerning.

Curious as to what you noticed about RA that seems physically sick?

 

[photographer4]

It’s really quite simple even without speculation. Maintaining a house, even without a mortgage to pay, costs money. Taxes, hydro, water, natural gas, maintenance. The Allen’s income ceased the day he was incarcerated and his poor wife’s life was changed forever. We all think once we’ve made the last mortgage payment we own the property. Try not paying your property taxes. JMVHO

eta I see @Nikynoo beat me too it

I just wondered who will maintain the exterior of the property while he is incarcerated given that he has noted in his letter that his wife has left the residence. Who will manage things like lawn care and snow removal?