Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #132

[Tricia]

Welcome back to the Delphi Murders discussion thread.

On the afternoon of Feb. 13th, 2017, best friends Abigail Williams and Liberty German were dropped off at a bridge in the town of Delphi. On Feb 14th their bodies were discovered around noon about 50 feet from the north bank of Deer Creek which is about 0.5 miles from the bridge.
The Sheriff's office gave a press conference on 4/22/19 and we have some solid information. Please take a look below

HERE IS THE NEW SKETCH FROM THE PRESS CONFERENCE ON 4/22/19

HERE IS THE NEW AUDIO. IT'S-A BIT LONGER THAN THE FIRST AUDIO:
https://www.in.gov/isp/files/Delphi_Audio_Edited_2019x3.wav

Here is the old audio in a loop:
http://www.in.gov/isp/files/Delphi_male_voice_loop.mp3

LATEST PRESS CONFERENCE 4/22/19

FOR MORE CLICK HERE FOR THE CARROL COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE FACEBOOK PAGE.

Anyone with information about this case, no matter how insignificant, is encouraged to call the Delphi Homicide Investigation Tip Line at (844) 459-5786.

Information can also be reported by calling the Indiana State Police at(800) 382-7537, or the Carroll County Sheriff's Department at (765) 564-2413.

Information can also be emailed to Abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com

video of press conference from 2017 02/22/17: https://www.facebook.com/NewsCenter1...4728963476130/

Let's do this. Let's commit to getting this killer's picture and voice out there any possible way we can.

Pictures of Abby and Libby

Link to post with all Threads #1-98 (Courtesy of margarita25)

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Rules Etiquette & Information

Case map by skibaboo updated with grayhuze crime flow video

Grayhuze youtube channel

Verified Insiders: None in this case at this time. Verified Professional, Member michael.gartley, is a Verified Expert in Imaging Science.

RULES OF THIS DISCUSSION
DO NOT post photos of random individuals (including persons featured in MSM articles about other area crimes) to compare to the images of unidentified suspect on the bridge.

PLEASE DO NOT POST PICTURES OF SEX OFFENDERS!

Do not sleuth family, PERIOD. This includes previous public records which have nothing to do with this case. They are victims here. Plain and simple.

If you feel you have a tip, by all means, phone it in. Do NOT discuss your tip here. Contact the authorities and give them time to follow your lead.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

Some posts have been removed as off topic. Hopefully the following clarifies.

For those enquiring about the use of initials, reference is made in TOS under Name Calling and Derogatory Name Variations by simply stating "Initials may be used, and are encouraged".

There are rules and then there are policies. WS policy is to NOT use full names so that the names of innocent people are not forever etched in stone on a crime sleuthing website when they may have had nothing to do with the actual crime. It could also have potential legal ramifications that nobody needs. The policy has been that we can use full names for a victim and a POI/suspect who has been officially named by LE but for most others we use initials. It is a matter of discretion and WSers have been adhering to that policy for about 20 years now and it has served us well, so it is very possible for members to get used to it. If we can get to know members by their anonymous user IDs such as 1973Aplus8, surely we can get used to initials used throughout a specific case.

Example: One thread some of us are familiar with, a person not only self-identified, but also stated they knew they were a POI although LE had not named them as such. That highly qualified person subsequently reported they were having difficulty getting employment because their name was showing up to potential employers in google searches connected to discussion of a horrific murder.

This is Thread #123 for Abby and Libby and we've have done alright so far. If someone wants to complete the list of initials and abbreviations, please submit it to us via private message and we will include it in future Opening Posts. Otherwise, please stay on topic in this thread.

If you have questions, please do not discuss them on the thread so we don't derail the thread with off topic conversation. You may private message a Mod or Admin for clarification.

Thanks.

 

[Sillybilly]

Hey everyone,

Other than a similarity to the Delphi sketch, there is no indication from LE that Martrell Weaver is considered a POI or suspect in the murders of Libby and Abby. We've been down this road before where there are similarities between sketches and other individuals but there ends up being no connection.

Please do not continue to discuss him unless/until we find out that LE is investigating him as a POI or suspect in relation to the Delphi case.

As usual, members may sleuth behind the scenes and discuss via private messaging where up to 20 members can be added to the private conversation. Just don't post your findings on this public thread.

If there is any change, we will review it if/when that happens.

Thanks.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

This thread is becoming rife with rumor posts and creating extra work for our Moderators in having to review and trying to determine what is known fact and what is rumor.

RUMORS ARE NOT ALLOWED.

If you can't link information to Websleuths approves sources, do NOT post it with "I read it somewhere" or "I'll find the link later ...".

This is Websleuths folks. Take time to do your homework. Please don't just throw stuff out there. Before you post something make doubly sure what you are stating is FACT as we know it from MSM, LE or another approved Websleuths source.

Thank you.

 

[Sillybilly]

Sleuthing or discussing RSOs just because they are on the registry is not allowed. There are sex offenders everywhere and unless there is a known connection to this case, or LE indicates there may be some connection, please don't bring them into this discussion.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Since both girls were active in sports, I assume they were in the habit of tying their shoe laces tightly. It seems like it would have been really hard to lose a shoe.

 

[MistyWaters]

Do we know the Black Nikes were the lace-up style? They also make black slip-ons.

I’m only able to find a reference to “shoes”. BBM

“She was last seen wearing a tie-dyed shirt with fringe at the bottom, gray sweat pants with unknown black lettering and black Nike shoes.”
https://www.wrtv.com/news/local-new...-missing-after-being-dropped-off-to-go-hiking

“Kelsi German helped searchers identify the bodies by the color of her sister’s shoes.
“I yelled down to them. I told them they were Lilly’s* shoes,” she said. “They yelled again that they found them.”...”
Delphi murders discussion on Dr. Phil fuels hope that case will be solved | wthr.com
*clearly the word is “Libby’s”

 

[minazoe]

I thought she was wearing chucks? I'll have to look again. mOO

 

[FrostedGlass]

In the pic of Abby on the bridge, it looks to my eyes that she's wearing lace-ups that go up to her ankles. I just assumed that Libby probably wore the same type of shoes. At any rate, most hikers/walkers that I know really tie their laces securely so their shoes don't come off.

 

[Yemelyan]

In the pic of Abby on the bridge, it looks to my eyes that she's wearing lace-ups that go up to her ankles. I just assumed that Libby probably wore the same type of shoes. At any rate, most hikers/walkers that I know really tie their laces securely so their shoes don't come off.

Teens don't, though.

They often modify their laces on sneakers so that they become, in effect slip ons. Even chucks.

Libby's shoe was reportedly a black Nike shoe.

 

[Inthedetails]

In the pic of Abby on the bridge, it looks to my eyes that she's wearing lace-ups that go up to her ankles. I just assumed that Libby probably wore the same type of shoes. At any rate, most hikers/walkers that I know really tie their laces securely so their shoes don't come off.

Warning: Don't tie too tight when hiking/walking. I injured my tendon this way (the one that goes on top of foot) and it took forever to heal. Give room for you foot to expand as the day goes on. Off topic, I know.

Back to the topic, I forgot all about the shoes being the first items spotted. My hunch is BG ordered them off at the final site, not on the walk. He needed them to move quickly, imo, not spend any extra time on the route.

jmo

 

[Beachlife926]

“The year 2021 should be filled with cap & gowns, graduation parties, and college choices for Libby German and Abby Williams. Instead, their families are holding on to the hopethat this is the year their killer is brought to justice.
“We will get answers. We will get answers. We will have to wait patiently for that,” Abby’s mother, Anna Williams said.
.........
Every tip received is entered into an FBI system called “Pyramid.” That system stores information like names, descriptions and motives so it can be cross-referenced with other tips locally and across the country to find any possible connections.
The process is always working, comparing tips received about the Delphi murders with hundreds of other cases and tips. Investigators say they have worked a number of tips and leads that have come directly from that system or the tip line, although they say both have been able to connect dots they had no idea existed.”

BBM - thoughts ?
ETA: I realized this info was from an article on feb 14th so sorry if this was already brought up. I’m searching the threads to find discussion now.
I commend the patience of the families and feel bad it seems they always have to remind outsiders to do the same.
The Unsolved Casefile: Who Killed Liberty German & Abigail Williams? - Court TV

 

[photographer4]

Since both girls were active in sports, I assume they were in the habit of tying their shoe laces tightly. It seems like it would have been really hard to lose a shoe.

Have we considered that maybe the killer was part of the search party and grew impatient that no one had found his display yet? Maybe he placed the shoe? Maybe it was on his person the entire search??

 

[Ozoner]

Since both girls were active in sports, I assume they were in the habit of tying their shoe laces tightly. It seems like it would have been really hard to lose a shoe.

In the pic of Abby on the bridge, it looks to my eyes that she's wearing lace-ups that go up to her ankles. I just assumed that Libby probably wore the same type of shoes. At any rate, most hikers/walkers that I know really tie their laces securely so their shoes don't come off.

We shouldn't be assuming anything about how tightly the girls tied their shoes. I've been an avid hiker for many years and I don't tie my shoes particularly tightly. In fact, my shoes are constantly coming untied. (I also don't wear hiking boots; I see those as a gimmick. I've hiked very strenuous trails in tennis shoes/cross trainers and not had any issues whatsoever.)

 

[MistyWaters]

Have we considered that maybe the killer was part of the search party and grew impatient that no one had found his display yet? Maybe he placed the shoe? Maybe it was on his person the entire search??

The search was organized that day, people signed in at the fire hall and teams were assigned to specific locations. Wouldn’t it seem very suspicious if a searcher insisted on being assigned the specific area where the bodies were later found? And yes, there were casual searchers but nothing has ever been said the searchers involved in the discovery were anything but involved in the official search.

For anyone volunteering to help search for two missing teens and then unexpectedly finding two bodies, that must be a horrible gut-wrenching experience never to be forgotten.

JMO

 

[Imvp2]

Teens don't, though.

They often modify their laces on sneakers so that they become, in effect slip ons. Even chucks.

Libby's shoe was reportedly a black Nike shoe.

I was just going to comment that very thing. My girls are the same age. They made sure their gym shoes could be slipped on or off. The only shoes that were tied for certain were/are softball cleats

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I do think that is a possibility. I've considered before that whether by force or by accident, L, at least, would have had a hard time running with only 1 shoe. I've also considered maybe they were made to wade farther upstream, or that he even took a shoe or two with him, as well.

Another consideration is where exactly the shoe was found? Along the bank, in the mud, in the water, which side? It's the kind of information LE could probably attain a lot from, but we don't have.

"In the driveway" of some house it couldn't have been the crime scene on RL-land, I think, but the opposite shore/bank of Deer Creek. Is that correct or is the location "driveway" still in dispute?

 

[Thelastleg]

Have we considered that maybe the killer was part of the search party and grew impatient that no one had found his display yet? Maybe he placed the shoe? Maybe it was on his person the entire search??

I don't think he would have risked handling the shoe in case he left a trace of his DNA on it. I wonder if Libby had the other shoe on when she was found. And no mention of Abby's shoes either. Your post has reminded me of the shoe tree somewhere in that area

 

[sunshineray]

Below is a snip of conversation from DHT:

DTH:
I want to go back to the video for a moment. Have you seen the whole video?

Sgt. Kim Riley:
Yes.

DTH:
Obviously, without telling us the parts that you don’t want to release, can you tell us what that’s like to watch that video?

Sgt. Kim Riley:
It was scary. Uh, I guess would be one way to put it. Just [pause] seeing, um, you know—seeing, just seeing the feelings that were going through the girls at the time. I’m not going to say which one, in particular. But, just knowing that—I, you know, just knowing what they knew is—is just, is just frightening for, uh, a 13- or 14-year old girl to know.

**********************************
What did the girls know, and how quickly did they know it?? This quote makes me think that something was pre-setup for the victims. Any victims and these girls just happened to be the victims. Maybe he originally planned on one victim, but two came along. Who knows? Additionally, how do you see the feelings that were going through the girls at the time unless there was a video, of the girls?? This begs the question: what the hell was on the video that allows LE to see the feelings that were going through the girls at the time, or one girl in particular? Did Lib capture some video of Abby as they were taken by the guy? Did she capture part of the crime scene pre-mortem? How did she do it without BG seeing / seizing the phone?

So... could one of the signatures be, as a wild possibility, that BG took the phone and recorded the girls reactions to whatever he was showing them / where he led them to? Maybe a scene was already set up? Then he put the phone back in a pocket or wherever LE found it?

That would surely be above and beyond what is necessary to commit the murders. It would surely shock those who saw it. It would fit as a signature, no?

I realize we have no idea, because LE hasn't told us, but is it POSSIBLE?

Some are saying they don't think the girls sensed trouble until later, not when they were approached. I think Sgt. Riley's words put it into very clear focus just how terrified those two sweet girls were as soon as the killer made his way to confront them.

I hope he recieves justice asap and then rots like the garbage he is...sorry if that's crude, just thinking about the terror they felt devastates.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

"In the driveway" of some house it couldn't have been the crime scene on RL-land, I think, but the opposite shore/bank of Deer Creek. Is that correct or is the location "driveway" still in dispute?

The only place I’ve seen it said that the shoe was found on a driveway of any kind, is in individual posts in here on WS or or other forums. Early reports always say it was found on the creek bank. When and how it morphed to the driveway, I don’t know.