Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #148

[Tricia]

Welcome back to the Delphi Murders discussion thread.

On the afternoon of Feb. 13th, 2017, best friends Abigail Williams and Liberty German were dropped off at a bridge in the town of Delphi. On Feb 14th their bodies were discovered around noon about 50 feet from the north bank of Deer Creek which is about 0.5 miles from the bridge.
The Sheriff's office gave a press conference on 4/22/19 and we have some solid information. Please take a look below

HERE IS THE NEW SKETCH FROM THE PRESS CONFERENCE ON 4/22/19

HERE IS THE NEW AUDIO. IT'S-A BIT LONGER THAN THE FIRST AUDIO:
https://www.in.gov/isp/files/Delphi_Audio_Edited_2019x3.wav

Here is the old audio in a loop:
http://www.in.gov/isp/files/Delphi_male_voice_loop.mp3

LATEST PRESS CONFERENCE 4/22/19

FOR MORE CLICK HERE FOR THE CARROL COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE FACEBOOK PAGE.

Anyone with information about this case, no matter how insignificant, is encouraged to call the Delphi Homicide Investigation Tip Line at (844) 459-5786.

Information can also be reported by calling the Indiana State Police at(800) 382-7537, or the Carroll County Sheriff's Department at (765) 564-2413.

Information can also be emailed to Abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com

video of press conference from 2017 02/22/17: https://www.facebook.com/NewsCenter1...4728963476130/

Let's do this. Let's commit to getting this killer's picture and voice out there any possible way we can.

Pictures of Abby and Libby

Link to post with all Threads #1-98 (Courtesy of margarita25)

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Rules Etiquette & Information

Case map by skibaboo updated with grayhuze crime flow video

Grayhuze youtube channel
Murder sheet YouTube

Verified Insiders: None in this case at this time. Verified Professional, Member michael.gartley, is a Verified Expert in Imaging Science.

RULES OF THIS DISCUSSION
DO NOT post photos of random individuals (including persons featured in MSM articles about other area crimes) to compare to the images of unidentified suspect on the bridge.

PLEASE DO NOT POST PICTURES OF SEX OFFENDERS!

Do not sleuth family, PERIOD. This includes previous public records which have nothing to do with this case. They are victims here. Plain and simple.

If you feel you have a tip, by all means, phone it in. Do NOT discuss your tip here. Contact the authorities and give them time to follow your lead.

NOTE - per Tricia and Sillybilly’s 5.28.2021 post here, JBC as a poi is now open for discussion in the Delphi thread.

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

Theorizing based on some known fact sourced from MSM or LE is fine, but speculation not based on known fact is not allowed.

Also, a few reminders from TOS:

It is WS preferred policy to use initials only for anyone other than victims or perps.

If you have questions about rules or moderation, please do not ask them on the thread. Just private message a Mod or Admin for clarification.

Rumors are not allowed. If you can't link information to Websleuths approved sources, do NOT post it with "I read it somewhere" or "I'll find the link later ...".

Before you post something make sure what you are stating is FACT as we know it from MSM, LE or another approved Websleuths source.

Sleuthing or discussing RSOs just because they are on the registry is not allowed. A thread specific exception may be made by Tricia or an Admin depending on geographical location in relation a crime.

Photo alterations or side-by-side comparisons are not allowed.

 

[Tiff23fr]

Mod Note:
For general JBC II discussions please use his thread. In Abby & Libby’s thread, JBC II should only be discussed in the context of a possible connection to Abby & Libby’s case.
Thanks Everyone!

JBC II Thread:
IN - James Chadwell II, 42, arrested after girl 9, found in his home, Lafayette, 19 Apr 2021 #3

Added 12/12/21
For general discussion on KAK’s current case please use his thread.
IN, Peru - Kegan Anthony Kline, 27, arrested Aug 29, 2020, 30 Counts associated with CSAM

 

[TL4S]

KAK has 29 CSAM-related charges dating back to 2016 and 2017, then one lone charge from 5/14/2020, which is 35-42-4-4(b)(2)/F5: Child Exploitation-Disseminate, exhibit, or offer to do so; send or bring into... This is perplexing to me. Why the three year span in charges? It makes me wonder if he unwittingly offered to share CSAM with an undercover officer on 5/14/2020, or something along those lines. What's more curious is that on 5/13/2020 (the day before that charge), KAK supposedly posted that backdated Vegas job starting on 2/12/2017 (MOO, since I don't think I can link that). I wonder what was happening in May 2020, just three months before he was arrested.

 

[minazoe]

I know KAK was into passive income..i think putting this on line could make him quite a bit of money..sadly.
I wonder if a lot of true gore on the internet is pay for view? I imagine it would be. mOO

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

KAK has 29 CSAM-related charges dating back to 2016 and 2017, then one lone charge from 5/14/2020, which is 35-42-4-4(b)(2)/F5: Child Exploitation-Disseminate, exhibit, or offer to do so; send or bring into... This is perplexing to me. Why the three year span in charges? It makes me wonder if he unwittingly offered to share CSAM with an undercover officer on 5/14/2020, or something along those lines. What's more curious is that on 5/13/2020 (the day before that charge), KAK supposedly posted that backdated Vegas job starting on 2/12/2017 (MOO, since I don't think I can link that). I wonder what was happening in May 2020, just three months before he was arrested.

Since we know that he habitually collects CSAM and shares it, I’m assuming that he couldn’t control his sexual impulsivities and was caught by some branch of LE, doing what he does best which is preying on and sexually exploiting children, again.

I think your right about him unwittingly offering to share CSAM with an undercover officer.

m00

Edit to add: Perhaps he shared the CSAM with who LE thinks is BG.

 

[TL4S]

Since we know that he habitually collects CSAM and shares it, I’m assuming that he couldn’t control his sexual impulsivities and was caught by some branch of LE, doing what he does best which is preying on and sexually exploiting children, again.

I think your right about him unwittingly offering to share CSAM with an undercover officer.

m00

Edit to add: Perhaps he shared the CSAM with who LE thinks is BG.

For how long KAK seemed to be at his CSAM stuff, and with his dropbox supposedly being involved in the largest CSAM investigation in IN state history, I'm actually surprised at how very few dates his charges stem from. Most of the dates have multiple charges connected to them, but there are only 5 different dates for CSAM-related charges, another date for just synthetic identity deception, and others for obstruction of justice (deleting his phone). This spans over four years. I can't help but wonder if it really is difficult for prosecutors to prove usage, the ages of unknown victims, etc.

I'm also a little shocked at how these kinds of CSAM charges are only level F5 or F6 (the most minor of felonies in IN). A few of KAK's have aggravated factors that elevated them to a F4 (all from 2/17/17). I guess I figured CSAM was damaging enough on children that it would be a higher offense. Shows what I know, I guess...

It does make me wonder if the dropbox lead LE to other suspects early on. Maybe they assumed KAK was only an unknowing middle-man between a_shots and L, and the killer was elsewhere in that web. Maybe before the April 2019 new direction, the digital trail circled back to a_shots, after all? IDK.

 

[MassGuy]

Court filings, river search indicate potential movement in Delphi probe

INDIANAPOLIS — A pair of court filings and a search of the Wabash River in Peru may indicate movement in the probe of the murders of two girls in Delphi in the winter of 2017, according to a retire…

fox59.com

INDIANAPOLIS — A pair of court filings and a search of the Wabash River in Peru may indicate movement in the probe of the murders of two girls in Delphi in the winter of 2017, according to a retired veteran police investigator.

”All those things happening at the same time certainly is an indication that there’s further investigation going on and obviously they’re looking for something,” said former IPD Deputy Chief Robert Turner, currently an attorney in private practice. ”A police officer just can’t go to a suspect or defendant that’s in jail without getting the clearance of the defense attorney.”

<snip>

“I was a narcotics investigator for many years and I was taken on a lot of road trips,” said Turner as he recalled the defendants who sought to leave jail for a few hours to trade information with detectives or lead them to evidence.

”It may be that that person has something that he can show you but may not be able to tell you where it is, how you can locate it. Or he may have to explain to you what it is once he tells you where it is. There’s obviously information that he has that he cannot import to you in jail, that you need him out and he’s gonna assist you somehow to locate something that identifies something or explains something.”

<snip>

Turner said a search so soon after investigators take custody of a defendant could indicate that information crucial to the case was exchanged.

”It has to be an important case for the detective to take those extraordinary steps to work with someone like that and obviously there has to be something that that detective is offering to that person who is cooperating,” said Turner. ”In most of the cases the person is sincere and there’s something that that person is trying to earn or some benefit that person wants from you.”

<snip>

”What currently seems to be the focus are the Klines,” said Cain, “and we think that seems fair given that you have an online predator communicating with one of the girls in the lead up to her murder in that she by all accounts wanted to meet with.”

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Court filings, river search indicate potential movement in Delphi probe

INDIANAPOLIS — A pair of court filings and a search of the Wabash River in Peru may indicate movement in the probe of the murders of two girls in Delphi in the winter of 2017, according to a retire…

fox59.com

INDIANAPOLIS — A pair of court filings and a search of the Wabash River in Peru may indicate movement in the probe of the murders of two girls in Delphi in the winter of 2017, according to a retired veteran police investigator.

”All those things happening at the same time certainly is an indication that there’s further investigation going on and obviously they’re looking for something,” said former IPD Deputy Chief Robert Turner, currently an attorney in private practice. ”A police officer just can’t go to a suspect or defendant that’s in jail without getting the clearance of the defense attorney.”

<snip>

“I was a narcotics investigator for many years and I was taken on a lot of road trips,” said Turner as he recalled the defendants who sought to leave jail for a few hours to trade information with detectives or lead them to evidence.

”It may be that that person has something that he can show you but may not be able to tell you where it is, how you can locate it. Or he may have to explain to you what it is once he tells you where it is. There’s obviously information that he has that he cannot import to you in jail, that you need him out and he’s gonna assist you somehow to locate something that identifies something or explains something.”

<snip>

Turner said a search so soon after investigators take custody of a defendant could indicate that information crucial to the case was exchanged.

”It has to be an important case for the detective to take those extraordinary steps to work with someone like that and obviously there has to be something that that detective is offering to that person who is cooperating,” said Turner. ”In most of the cases the person is sincere and there’s something that that person is trying to earn or some benefit that person wants from you.”

<snip>

”What currently seems to be the focus are the Klines,” said Cain, “and we think that seems fair given that you have an online predator communicating with one of the girls in the lead up to her murder in that she by all accounts wanted to meet with.”

Information from the MS podcast seems to indicate that ISP was searching in the Wabash for a few days prior to Aug 23 when they became aware of it.
If KAK was taken into custody on Aug 19 and on Aug 22 his attorney filed motions indicating they had entered into negotiations, to me, that means they found something…somewhere…that was significant enough for the prosecutor to feel like it was worth negotiating about. I don’t see negotiating for things you MIGHT find.

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

Court filings, river search indicate potential movement in Delphi probe

INDIANAPOLIS — A pair of court filings and a search of the Wabash River in Peru may indicate movement in the probe of the murders of two girls in Delphi in the winter of 2017, according to a retire…

fox59.com

INDIANAPOLIS — A pair of court filings and a search of the Wabash River in Peru may indicate movement in the probe of the murders of two girls in Delphi in the winter of 2017, according to a retired veteran police investigator.

”All those things happening at the same time certainly is an indication that there’s further investigation going on and obviously they’re looking for something,” said former IPD Deputy Chief Robert Turner, currently an attorney in private practice. ”A police officer just can’t go to a suspect or defendant that’s in jail without getting the clearance of the defense attorney.”

<snip>

“I was a narcotics investigator for many years and I was taken on a lot of road trips,” said Turner as he recalled the defendants who sought to leave jail for a few hours to trade information with detectives or lead them to evidence.

”It may be that that person has something that he can show you but may not be able to tell you where it is, how you can locate it. Or he may have to explain to you what it is once he tells you where it is. There’s obviously information that he has that he cannot import to you in jail, that you need him out and he’s gonna assist you somehow to locate something that identifies something or explains something.”

<snip>

Turner said a search so soon after investigators take custody of a defendant could indicate that information crucial to the case was exchanged.

”It has to be an important case for the detective to take those extraordinary steps to work with someone like that and obviously there has to be something that that detective is offering to that person who is cooperating,” said Turner. ”In most of the cases the person is sincere and there’s something that that person is trying to earn or some benefit that person wants from you.”

<snip>

”What currently seems to be the focus are the Klines,” said Cain, “and we think that seems fair given that you have an online predator communicating with one of the girls in the lead up to her murder in that she by all accounts wanted to meet with.”

I find it a bit (okay more than a bit) odd that they are sharing this information with us, the public. They have been so hush-hush for years about their investigation which leads me to believe that this is some type of red herring as in look over here while we (LE) are looking elsewhere. And/or are trying to tell BG that they’re close to apprehending him. Perhaps even trying to intimidate him so that he will expose himself in some way, shape, form or fashion, so that they can arrest him.
IMO it seems that their recent actions don’t line up with their typical way of doing things.

But man oh man I hope I’m wrong for the sake of finally getting justice for Abby and Libby’s murders.



YMMV. m00.

 

[MassGuy]

I find it a bit (okay more than a bit) odd that they are sharing this information with us, the public. They have been so hush-hush for years about their investigation which leads me to believe that this is some type of red herring as in look over here while we (LE) are looking elsewhere. And/or are trying to tell BG that they’re close to apprehending him. Perhaps even trying to intimidate him so that he will expose himself in some way, shape, form or fashion, so that they can arrest him.
IMO it seems that their recent actions don’t line up with their typical way of doing things.

But man oh man I hope I’m wrong for the sake of finally getting justice for Abby and Libby’s murders.



YMMV. m00.

This isn't them sharing. This is based on public court filings, things that podcast learned about, and law enforcement/legal experts offering their take on it.

So there's a lot of reading between the lines here.

 

[MassGuy]

Information from the MS podcast seems to indicate that ISP was searching in the Wabash for a few days prior to Aug 23 when they became aware of it.
If KAK was taken into custody on Aug 19 and on Aug 22 his attorney filed motions indicating they had entered into negotiations, to me, that means they found something…somewhere…that was significant enough for the prosecutor to feel like it was worth negotiating about. I don’t see negotiating for things you MIGHT find.

A lot of times the negotiation seems to be contingent upon the suspect delivering. So if one of them was KK leading law enforcement to a weapon or something, and it wasn't recovered, then it could be "no deal."

I've seen this with bodies, and sometimes the suspect leads law enforcement on a wild goose chase because they just want to get out of jail/prison for a while.

 

[JnRyan]

I find it a bit (okay more than a bit) odd that they are sharing this information with us, the public. They have been so hush-hush for years about their investigation which leads me to believe that this is some type of red herring as in look over here while we (LE) are looking elsewhere. And/or are trying to tell BG that they’re close to apprehending him. Perhaps even trying to intimidate him so that he will expose himself in some way, shape, form or fashion, so that they can arrest him.
IMO it seems that their recent actions don’t line up with their typical way of doing things.

But man oh man I hope I’m wrong for the sake of finally getting justice for Abby and Libby’s murders.



YMMV. m00.

We've had so many dead ends in this case I'm wondering what ISP's motives and strategies are with respect KAK and the Delphi Murders. This is all part of the same posse that went after RL, DN, JBC, TB and others. KAK's currently scheduled for trial in Jan 2023. I suspect by then, if there is something leading to the killer, we'll have an arrest. OR maybe LE decides on a "Newer Direction" by then. I'm not getting excited by any of this yet.

 

[sandy_80]

I find it a bit (okay more than a bit) odd that they are sharing this information with us, the public. They have been so hush-hush for years about their investigation which leads me to believe that this is some type of red herring as in look over here while we (LE) are looking elsewhere. And/or are trying to tell BG that they’re close to apprehending him. Perhaps even trying to intimidate him so that he will expose himself in some way, shape, form or fashion, so that they can arrest him.
IMO it seems that their recent actions don’t line up with their typical way of doing things.

But man oh man I hope I’m wrong for the sake of finally getting justice for Abby and Libby’s murders.



YMMV. m00.

this was just a retired personal take on the case
nobody who knows whats really going on

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

This isn't them sharing. This is based on public court filings, things that podcast learned about, and law enforcement/legal experts offering their take on it.

So there's a lot of reading between the lines here.

Respectfully, the fact that a podcast of all things obtained this info substantiates my opinion about this being a red herring. I mean honestly, a podcast (a podcast!) on the World Wide Web, sharing this info sounds awful fishy to me regardless if they have LE and legal experts offering their take on it. I’ve watched many of podcasts where info has been leaked/obtained that feature retired and/or former FBI agents, chiefs, legal experts, former LE, etc that have shared their insights and, yet there was practically nothing that they shared with the world that we ourselves could’ve ascertained without them sharing their expert opinions. They’re have been many times that we’ve had to read between the lines and yet most of those things haven’t been purported by LE any more than what was already been stated by them if at all.
So what’s the difference between now and then? Nothing.

Apparently LE was ok with the public knowing that some of KAK’s court records were being sealed. Why you ask? Because they understood that we wouldn’t be able to obtain what those records say which was the entire point of them closing them to begin with. Again keeping that info close to the chest, to themselves. And leaving us to clamor with the info that they allowed for us to know about.

All of this sounds characteristic and par for the course if you ask me.

m00.

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

this was just a retired personal take on the case
nobody who knows whats really going on

Exactly.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

this was just a retired personal take on the case
nobody who knows whats really going on

You are entirely correct. No one knows what’s really going on. That includes you.
Folks A interpret what has happened this week as positive movement in this case.
Folks B interpret the exact same happenings as nothing to see here.
It’s OK we all don’t agree, we all want justice for Libby and Abby. Most of us are accepting of differing opinions.
I will add that no matter how anyone interprets the river search and KAK’s time with ISP, it is a very positive thing that KAK has entered into negotiations, whether that reveals him a killer, an accomplice or not involved at all.

 

[Seattle1]

Apparently LE was ok with the public knowing that some of KAK’s court records were being sealed. Why you ask? Because they understood that we wouldn’t be able to obtain what those records say which was the entire point of them closing them to begin with. Again keeping that info close to the chest, to themselves. And leaving us to clambyor with the info that they allowed for us to know about.

^^rsbm

I dunno. Initially, I believed that KK's Child Solicitation and Child *advertiser censored* Poss charges were by the Feds and whereby the feds would seal this docket tight.

However, I've since learned from the AA that these charges were all filed by the state of Indiana. I've not listened to the Murder Sheet but it's very interesting that state troopers took possession of the defendant. That's big, actually. JMO

Court filings, river search indicate potential movement in Delphi probe

INDIANAPOLIS — A pair of court filings and a search of the Wabash River in Peru may indicate movement in the probe of the murders of two girls in Delphi in the winter of 2017, according to a retire…

fox59.com

 

[Ozoner]

You are entirely correct. No one knows what’s really going on. That includes you.
Folks A interpret what has happened this week as positive movement in this case.
Folks B interpret the exact same happenings as nothing to see here.
It’s OK we all don’t agree, we all want justice for Libby and Abby. Most of us are accepting of differing opinions.
I will add that no matter how anyone interprets the river search and KAK’s time with ISP, it is a very positive thing that KAK has entered into negotiations, whether that reveals him a killer, an accomplice or not involved at all.

We can hope that KAK has entered into negotiations in good faith. I personally doubt it. I think it's more likely that he's just playing games with LE.

 

[M. Kay]

We can hope that KAK has entered into negotiations in good faith. I personally doubt it. I think it's more likely that he's just playing games with LE.

I don't think KAK is positioned to play games. Today I searched the internet for what I might not know or understand about both Klines. I was relieved that
he's incarcerated and that the families and community finally have indications
that justice is in the works, though those wheels grind slowly. We don't have to depend on his good faith, should he have any.