Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #99

[7%Reichenbach]

In regards to LE why would they confirm any outside analysis? They have been very quiet about all details of this case and I wouldn't expect them break that silence because someone else has a similar, plausible theory as to how the commission of the crime happened. Every detail is crucial to them and to securing a legal confession so again why risk that by confirming?

I have made no claim that his theories are fact. However there is factual data contained within the video especially in regards to establishing a timeline. While time stamps are not infallible it is not only possible but probable they are accurate to a degree to establish a basic timeline. If the photo of Abby was posted at 2:07 and Cheyenne's photo was posted at 3:47 can we not find it reasonable that the crime had taken place with BG already gone from the area if he had a vehicle waiting long before Cheyenne was ever near the bridge. There is talk of her photo being posted at 2:47 which is inaccurate as the crime was probably being committed at that very moment.

 

[ocgrad]

What end of the bridge is it though? The one close to the trailhead parking or the other side?

The other end of the bridge, south, goes over the road shown. That is where LE spent much time investigating and where dirt/leaves were left disturbed. It is pretty steep.

 

[LadyL]

What I do know is they said something about a man behind them. So someone else stated it was a creepy guy? That doesn't really change my thinking. They mentioned the man behind them for a reason. Apparently he sparked some concern.

Police: Delphi murder victims spoke of man behind them in audio played for family

[bbm/sbm]

I think we can all agree that BG was indeed a 'creepy' guy, regardless of who referred to him as such.

 

[gitana1]

Becky Patty. She did an interview on Facebook and it was her wording when saying "creepy guy". She did not say the girls said creepy guy.

Thank you. Grandma, right?

 

[TTF14]

Thank you. Grandma, right?

Yes, Libby's. It's a very complicated family tree.

 

[MistyWaters]

I have never stated that I believe Libby's Dad saw BG. I stated that Libby's Dad saw a guy (aka FSG per many conversations here) who did see BG (link I am trying to find, unsuccessfully so far).

LE have said sketch #1 and #2 are two different men. So are you suggesting it only occurred to LE a couple of weeks ago that FSG saw BG? I’m sorry but I’m having trouble understanding how something as significant as a witness who saw someone very close to the crime scene would be overlooked by LE for more than two years.

 

[gitana1]

The other end of the bridge, south, goes over the road shown. That is where LE spent much time investigating and where dirt/leaves were left disturbed. It is pretty steep.

I'm dense. Sorry. So "the other end" is the south end and that is closer to the Mears farm than the north side?

TIA.

 

[tresir2012]

They’re not taking a wild guess that a vehicle was parked at a particular location, at a specific period of time.

This perpetrator could have parked anywhere, yet they are focused on this abandoned building.

There is a reason for that.

They have to have this info.

Could he have been temporarily staying in this abandoned building for shelter perhaps? Then left immediately after the murders in his vehicle? I wish there was more local info about this now demolished (how convenient for him ) building.

 

[LadyL]

I just realized it's about time for thread #100.

I bet none of us thought we would still be here discussing and wondering and still seeking justice for the girls two years later.

It is disheartening.

 

[TTF14]

Could someone bump the new map someone made today?

 

[gitana1]

Yes, Libby's. It's a very complicated family tree.

Lord!

P.S. I hope I'm not annoying people too much with going over this stuff. I'm starting to remember one of the reasons I didn't follow as closely in the beginning. Tons of info and too confusing for me.

 

[K9Enzo]

Maybe mentioning The Shack in the PC was a brilliant way for LE to distract on-line sluethers, so they could get some work done.

“Look squirrel!” lol

 

[janewall]

Maybe that's what the Shack Reference is about.
The Shack tip was maybe a red herring to throw LE off,and have them search a shack that has no connection whatsoever to this case,but would be just be believable enough,because the tip came from a seemingly respectable source.

What is 'The Shack tip'? I do not recall this, only the reference to the movie/book that was made by Doug Carter at the presser on 4/22. But like practically everyone else here, I cannot keep up with all the posts and so haven't read everything.

TIA

 

[ilovechili]

I think he probably had a gun too.

But I don't think that anyone here has better software than the FBI and I believe they gave us the clearest and most detailed images possible.

I agree with you that they probably have far better software but I am not so sure about giving us the most detailed images possible. In every single case, video is always partial (if provided) and it seems always blurry; I have to believe they get it far more enhanced in some cases than we see but save it for reasons of investigation integrity?

Not an argument at all, I just have noticed it many times in many, many cases--not just this one. It just seems like it is intentionally not quite enough for us to make certain things out.

That being said though, he very well could have had a gun. I have no decision on that one way or the other since we do not know. For the type of person I believe he is, he most likely did have a gun and needed one to feel like a big man to two young innocent girls.

 

[gitana1]

@gitana1, It's important to remember there are 2 parking lots. One at the main entrance near Route 25 and another on 300N road. The parking lot of 300N road was not a parking lot condoned for public use but people parked there, just the same. It only had room for about 3 or 4 cars. My understanding is that the father was to pick up the girls at this parking lot on 300 N Road and I also understand that that is where the sister had dropped Abby and off Libby earlier in the day. That entrance at 300 N Road is much closer to the Monon High Bridge.

That's very helpful. So they didn't walk the whole length of the trail, necessarily.

Was there any sighting of the flannel shirt guy or of BG by anyone, like Libby's dad, in or near this parking lot?

 

[KentuckyMama]

I'm dense. Sorry. So "the other end" is the south end and that is closer to the Mears farm than the north side?

TIA.

Not necessarily this post, a previous one of yours.
What you're asking for is a list of people involved and their relationship, such as parent, grandparents, siblings, etc with corresponding initials? And also a fact based list of times such as drop off, pictures taken, calls made, etc? Just making sure I'm understanding you.
Jillian

 

[castilloisno1]

Wells nice job. So I'm confused.

I see you have FSG at the trail head at 3:15 which sounds right but then you have FSG at the Freedom Bridge at 2:35 which I don't understand.

From what I understand Derrick came upon FSG at the trail head at approx 3:15 and then he takes the trail towards the water, sees nothing, heads back to the trail head and takes the trail towards the Freedom Bridge and sees FSG again so the time FSG is seen again by Derrick would be after 3:15....What am I getting wrong???

Please forgive me:
Who is Derrick and FSG? Wait a minute..Flannel shirt guy??!! Who spotted him first?

 

[Spy Versus Spy]

I realize they both said they saw a couple but since I couldn't find where FSG saw the couple, or if they were a different couple than the couple CE saw, I didn't put the ones FSG referred to on the map.

Im still not clear on the meaning intended by 'couple'. There are indeed two involvements of 'couple(s) imo iirc.

My reading is that Fl Sh G replied to DG that he hadnt seen the two girls in question but he'd seen a couple (of girls)under the bridge. ( sourced from the JM intvw with MP and BP but very much moo on intonation and interpretation)

The other couple was referred to by the woman who took the pictures at the bridge a short time after the girls/bg were there. (Moo) who stated ,along with other things, that she had seen a couple at the bridge (At or on not under...iirc moo)

How incorrect am I to hold this stance?

 

[Wells]

Thanks. His videos aren't that helpful to me. Too many, too long, extraneous stuff I have to wade through to get what I'm looking for and he assumes people watching know every person he mentions.

Also LE has been pretty clear that the video recreations out there aren't factual. So I never know if what I'm watching of his is accurate!

I think for time's sake I just need a quick, linear guide!

I liked he map that @steeltowngirl posted because it makes sense. If we could just add a compass to it it would be great.

Girls dropped off between 1:15 and 1:45 at Monon Trailhead Parking (I believe there is dispute in MSM between LE and family on the exact time)

Snapchat Photo at 2:07.

Video of BG begins around 2:17 (MOO).

FSG on Freedom Bridge at 2:35.

FSG sees BG on trail at 2:47 (still working on MSM verification)

CE on South end of Bridge @ 2:49. Said she saw a guy and a couple.

Libby's Dad Derrick arrives at Monon Trailhead Parking at 3:15 approximately.

Libby's Dad Derrick talks with FSG at 3:15 approximately who tells him he saw a couple.

Additionally: a teenager or a group of teenagers on the trail, the woman who helped created OBG sketch on or near the trail and Man in Black

 

[MistyWaters]

Many of us have been here from the very beginning of the crime. While GH's videos are mostly good, and informative to a degree, LE has already stated that the crime flow videos that are out there right now are not accurate. Most of what GH talks about are his own inferences and ideas, just like ours are. They're good for supplemental information, but really shouldn't be taken as the definitive information.

I agree. Other than the driving route to the trail which apparently was provided to him by BP, GH is not privy to any inside information nor do I recall he’s ever claimed he is.

 

[gitana1]

• I agree with you that they probably have far better software but I am not so sure about giving us the most detailed images possible. In every single case, video is always partial (if provided) and it seems always blurry; I have to believe they get it far more enhanced in some cases than we see but save it for reasons of investigation integrity?

Not an argument at all, I just have noticed it many times in many, many cases--not just this one. It just seems like it is intentionally not quite enough for us to make certain things out.

That being said though, he very well could have had a gun. I have no decision on that one way or the other since we do not know. For the type of person I believe he is, he most likely did have a gun and needed one to feel like a big man to two young innocent girls.

Man, I haven't seen one case where they released a blurry photo in the attempt to get the public to ID the person in the photo when they already had a clearer image. I'm not sure how that would make sense, ya know? Can you cite to one?

I mean I can understand if at some point they find a clearer image they didn't have before or if they released what hey had the day of and then in a week or so released an enhanced one.

But in this case enough time has passed to enhance it as much as can be enhanced.

And they want to get this guy. There would be zero reason to give us a blurry photo if they have a clearer one. Inexplicable.