IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #37

[fruity]

Just a reminder of the Monon High Bridge as it was 2 days before the crime:
[video=youtube;y0MNncO9lLs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y0MNncO9lLs[/video]

Credits to Phillip Benson of Lafayette, IN
Published on Feb 11, 2017
Monon High Bridge Near Delphi

Thanks so much for this.

And people think BG was overdressed?! I'd hate to think what they'd say about my choice of clothes in that type of weather :/ I can barely walk whenever there's snow around, I wear so many layers. I feel the cold very badly and it's painful for me.

 

[WebSight]

Very new here, been reading for a few weeks (a bit obsessively lol) and lurking. However, one thing that I believe has been noted about the "pristine" word is someone else in an interview with RL (Jean casarez I believe?) Used the word pristine, then he parroted the word back in a response. I am new and unable to find/cite links though I have tried. Can anyone help me with that interview transcript? I believe this may help understanding the word "pristine" being used. HtH

MOO

:greetings::wagon::welcome:

 

[razzledazzle]

Am I correct in thinking that LE and/or the Medical Examiner would be able to tell whether or not the girls were moved after they were deceased? They haven't released any info, but i think they know. JMO

 

[Momma2cam]

Thanks so much for this.

And people think BG was overdressed?! I'd hate to think what they'd say about my choice of clothes in that type of weather :/ I can barely walk whenever there's snow around, I wear so many layers. I feel the cold very badly and it's painful for me.

The weather warmed up on the 13th and was in the 40s in the afternoon. The snow was melted. 40s in February in Indiana/ Michigan is almost shorts weather. Kidding I don't think he was overdressed. But, it was warmer than on 2/11.

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk

 

[margarita25]

My first post. I have done my best to read every post in this forum regarding the murders of Abby and Libby. I agree with a great deal of the theories, statements and or opinions I have read thus far. I look forward to any feedback. It doesn’t hurt my feelings to give 2 cents and get change back. I’m not a believer in coincidences.

“Coincidence is the word we use when we can't see the levers and pulleys” – Emma Bull

The images below were captured from a news media video located at this link [video=youtube;s91Q1WRuN3E]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s91Q1WRuN3E[/video]


Below shows 2 images of RL on February 16, 2017 on his property near the location of the crime scene.

The below image is of the suspect (BG) identified by LE from a video found on Libby German’s cell phone February 13, 2017.

BG

I am sure most of you are recognizing the resemblances between RL and BG from the above images. Here’s my questions based on my observations.

1. Are they both are wearing hoodies?
2. Are they both wearing camouflaged baseball style caps?
3. Are they both wearing similar outer jackets over the hoodies?
4. Are they both wearing jeans?
5. Are they both wearing glasses? Maybe transition lens.
6. Are they both displaying the same style of gait?
7. WHY WOULD BG WANT TO PORTRAY HIMSELF AS RL?
a. Is it a coincidence that the suspect is attempting to look like the property owner where he is planning on committing the crime?
b. Do Abby and Libby know RL?
c. If so, would this allow someone to get close to Abby and Libby before they realize it’s not RL?
d. Did BG know RL and where his property lines were located?
e. Maybe BG had a grudge with RL with so much sophisticated effort in framing him? It sure has taken the attention away from BG.
8. What alarmed Libby to begin recording BG?
a. If Libby or Abby was acquainted with RL did they think it was RL and started recording for fun and then realized it was not RL?
b. Did she realize it was someone else she recognized and then hid her phone?
c. Did Libby think the man was over dressed for the current temperature? Was BG over dressed for the temperature as well as possible concealing a weapon and other items needed in order to commit the pre-planned crime?
d. Notice how Abby is dressed on the bridge in the photo Libby had posted to snap chat. It appears a light jacket with a light shirt. Sun was shining and notice the fall of her shadow on the bridge as does BG’s shadow in his photo. This is the same time of the day.
9. Was it a coincidence this terrible crime happened on Monday, February 13[SUP]th[/SUP]?
a. Was it public knowledge that there would be no school on this day?
b. How far in advance was it posted and how was this information passed on to the community?
c. Did anyone from either family mention to anyone that Abby and Libby would be going to the trail that day? Did anyone mention to anyone else the time they would be getting dropped off?

I don’t find it much of a coincidence at all that BG went out of his way to portray RL as a ruse for getting close to the girls and to allow anyone else in the area to believe he was RL with just a quick glance. I don’t find it a coincidence the bodies were found on RL’s property. BG gathered intel and conducted recons of the area and rehearsed the phases to commit these killings. It’s not a coincident he was aware of the exact time window he had to complete the crime and flee the area before a search party would be on scene saturating the woods searching for the girls.

IMO known facts instead of assumptions: BG was totally unaware Libby had a cell phone much less had already recorded him and was continuously recording. If Libby’s phone was found on her person or in her clothing BG never searched for the phone or if the phone was found tossed away from the scene Libby deliberately cached the phone for LE to recover.

Confusion: Was the area of the crime scene searched by volunteers the night of February 13[SUP]th[/SUP]? Is there a chance the bodies were overlooked in the dark or are they certain the bodies were not there during the initial search? I have read where there was a theory the bodies could have been brought back to the crime scene between 2:00 – 9:30 am.

Wow, welcome Savoy6 . That's quite a first post!

:welcome3:

 

[DatelineFan]

Wouldn't LE leave some kind of presence there in case the killer returned to the 'scene of the crime'?

IMO, yes, the area was likely under surveillance.

 

[jon70]

What if BG grabbed the girls, did whatever, then hid the phone(s) in RL's truck and RL's trip matched up with the pings?

 

[Elley Mae]

I have always thought that, "down the hill" was said in a way of saying which way to go.

Putting in quotes what Slocum said.

"he said they believe he was talking to the girls-almost certain from the evidence they have."

Jmo

Once again I'm far behind so apologies if this has already been posted - I'm only on #250! Also, I'm trying to get all of it into one post so as not to take up too much space, lol.

First, here's the link to Sgt. Slocum's interview this morning on WBAT radio:

http://www.wbat.com/episode/tony-slocum/

He recapped the case, pointed out that it's not like TV where cases get solved in an hour, said he's been out to the trail and wouldn't have any worries letting his kids go out there. He says Libby is a hero and how the girls stayed together.

Starting around 6:00 Slocum says LE doesn't know if there were multiple people there. He said LE is not saying the photograph and audio are the same person for sure. He says they believe he was talking to the girls - almost certain from the evidence they have. He says there are 13 people in jail right now due to arrests (not connected to the murders) while checking on tips.

Slocum also talked about the impact of SM on the case. He said the public has overreacted on some things and doesn't want someone going after an innocent person. LE is monitoring SM. He said it's possible that the suspect has left the area but he is positive LE will make an arrest sooner rather than later.

Next, LE has modified the way they are vetting the tips in order to make it more efficient:



http://www.theindychannel.com/news/...w-resources-to-assist-in-delphi-investigation

And finally, here is quote from RL's attorney prior to today's hearing:



http://wishtv.com/2017/03/22/more-t...ation-continues-in-delphi-double-murder-case/

 

[atmh]

Savoy6 (and anyone who believes the "impersonation of RL" theory), I don't buy that paricular one at ALL. No way, would someone intending to kill two teens, plan to "trick" them into thinking he was a neighbor that lived near the bridge. Nothing we've learned (officially) would suggest to us that L and A knew RL well enough, his mannerisms and body language well enough, to be tricked into thinking a man coming at them on the bridge would be him. Way too far fetched, imo.
I believe it's MUCH more reasonable/likely that we have coincidental similarities, or RL himself (which I don't believe). For those who are not from central IN, and more specifically from the area of Delphi, that clothing is VERY typical of guys in the local area. Hoodies, jeans, casual wear jackets that are not the latest trend. It's very much a blue collar area, and we're in the heart of the midwest. Simple folks, simple dress, no disrespect intended. Seriously, when we moved here from out of state several years ago, we (dh and i) commented on how similar many of the guys dress (Duck Dynasty-ish, pre Duck Dynasty) and how every other middle income home seemed to have a pick-up in the driveway. It's corn country, after all.

 

[margarita25]

Am I correct in thinking that LE and/or the Medical Examiner would be able to tell whether or not the girls were moved after they were deceased? They haven't released any info, but i think they know. JMO

Yes, in a nutshell this would be one of the first things for them to assess, any variables or lack thereof would be evaluated such as drag marks, blood, shoes, feet, condition of bodies, exposure to elements, environmental disturbances, etc, etc. One of the first things to do would be to evaluate the number of potential crime scenes.

 

[Angela_Beckett]

Agreed. And even when we don't know if it was a sexual motivated attack, I believe it was, and the perp killed the poor girls because he hadn't access to a vehicle to get away in time before the kids could get any help. OMG, sorry for posting something this awful, don't want to be insensitive, but it's what I believe happened :crying:

Personally, I do not think it was his first time. I base that on what I've heard elsewhere hat we cannot address here. I think he may have just been out "trolling" and either came across them earlier on the trail and doubled back or watched them enter and followed. I doubt he assumed he had time or opportunity to take them elsewhere to commit the acts then return them - that it happened where they were found or near there. He may have started moving them and got spooked or something. I do not the k he would still be around unless he's totally insane, arrogant or a complete narcissist who can't imagine being caught. The girls may just not have been found the first night because it was dark. Could be that simple. Often times people who commit crimes don't really have an escape route planned. They just walk away with no urgency and don't draw attention to themselves - because they have no conscience like the rest of us. They are workmanlike about it. It's what they do.

I realize that's not real sexy but it's more often the case. Henry Lee Lucas killed a ton of people and just moved on down the road. It's just what he did.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[WebSight]

My first post. I have done my best to read every post in this forum regarding the murders of Abby and Libby. I agree with a great deal of the theories, statements and or opinions I have read thus far. I look forward to any feedback. It doesn’t hurt my feelings to give 2 cents and get change back. I’m not a believer in coincidences.

“Coincidence is the word we use when we can't see the levers and pulleys” – Emma Bull

The images below were captured from a news media video located at this link [video=youtube;s91Q1WRuN3E]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s91Q1WRuN3E[/video]


Below shows 2 images of RL on February 16, 2017 on his property near the location of the crime scene.

The below image is of the suspect (BG) identified by LE from a video found on Libby German’s cell phone February 13, 2017.

BG

I am sure most of you are recognizing the resemblances between RL and BG from the above images. Here’s my questions based on my observations.

1. Are they both are wearing hoodies?
2. Are they both wearing camouflaged baseball style caps?
3. Are they both wearing similar outer jackets over the hoodies?
4. Are they both wearing jeans?
5. Are they both wearing glasses? Maybe transition lens.
6. Are they both displaying the same style of gait?
7. WHY WOULD BG WANT TO PORTRAY HIMSELF AS RL?
a. Is it a coincidence that the suspect is attempting to look like the property owner where he is planning on committing the crime?
b. Do Abby and Libby know RL?
c. If so, would this allow someone to get close to Abby and Libby before they realize it’s not RL?
d. Did BG know RL and where his property lines were located?
e. Maybe BG had a grudge with RL with so much sophisticated effort in framing him? It sure has taken the attention away from BG.
8. What alarmed Libby to begin recording BG?
a. If Libby or Abby was acquainted with RL did they think it was RL and started recording for fun and then realized it was not RL?
b. Did she realize it was someone else she recognized and then hid her phone?
c. Did Libby think the man was over dressed for the current temperature? Was BG over dressed for the temperature as well as possible concealing a weapon and other items needed in order to commit the pre-planned crime?
d. Notice how Abby is dressed on the bridge in the photo Libby had posted to snap chat. It appears a light jacket with a light shirt. Sun was shining and notice the fall of her shadow on the bridge as does BG’s shadow in his photo. This is the same time of the day.
9. Was it a coincidence this terrible crime happened on Monday, February 13[SUP]th[/SUP]?
a. Was it public knowledge that there would be no school on this day?
b. How far in advance was it posted and how was this information passed on to the community?
c. Did anyone from either family mention to anyone that Abby and Libby would be going to the trail that day? Did anyone mention to anyone else the time they would be getting dropped off?

I don’t find it much of a coincidence at all that BG went out of his way to portray RL as a ruse for getting close to the girls and to allow anyone else in the area to believe he was RL with just a quick glance. I don’t find it a coincidence the bodies were found on RL’s property. BG gathered intel and conducted recons of the area and rehearsed the phases to commit these killings. It’s not a coincident he was aware of the exact time window he had to complete the crime and flee the area before a search party would be on scene saturating the woods searching for the girls.

IMO known facts instead of assumptions: BG was totally unaware Libby had a cell phone much less had already recorded him and was continuously recording. If Libby’s phone was found on her person or in her clothing BG never searched for the phone or if the phone was found tossed away from the scene Libby deliberately cached the phone for LE to recover.

Confusion: Was the area of the crime scene searched by volunteers the night of February 13[SUP]th[/SUP]? Is there a chance the bodies were overlooked in the dark or are they certain the bodies were not there during the initial search? I have read where there was a theory the bodies could have been brought back to the crime scene between 2:00 – 9:30 am.

BBM
Phew, that is some post awesomeness! I am really intrigued by your theory that BG purposely dressed like RL. Many interesting points to ponder..

:welcome::welcome:

 

[No it's not]

Oh, thanks for that and linking the video. I will have to have a look. Sorry to be so late in responding I had to be away for awhile...life called.

Just wondering: one thing that we cannot know I guess though is whether Libby video'd on zoom and the photo was grabbed from it or whether LE grabbed the shot (from non-zoomed video) and blew it up. If the video was not shot in zoom then Libby would have shot it from farther and that would put him nearer that 5th platform. So, were you guys assuming that Libby video'd in zoom?

I think LE enlarged the frame from Libby's video, yes. I should have called it scale factor, as it is the result of the information gathered through data of Libby's cell phone camera ( lens, zoom). The video of the bridge GH is basing his placement of the POI/BG on - as I am too- was taken from a certain distance, with a certain lens/ possible zoom.
When scaling- in the POI/BG pic on the bridge video still (youtube) I had already figured out the bridge walkway width due to Abby's height of 5'4". So when I scaled in the POI, I recreated the opposite side of the POI base on adjusted perspective. I had to move it all further to the left. Then I was able to measure the height. So I was not really worried to know, whether the POI/BG was closer to platform 4 or 5, because a zoom would change it anyway. I only went by a certain width across the feet of the POI/BG.

GH went ahead and found the exact spot on the youtube video of the bridge and scaled in the POI/BG. That's how he saw, where the actual location is.

-Nin

 

[margarita25]

Any news? I am so obsessed I was buying paper towels and read it as BG Roll instead of Big Roll.

(I fought the name BG for many threads, but finally had to succumb.)

 

[Tulessa]

Man, things sure get far afield here. Disguises? Fall guys? Planted evidence? Moving bodies? Kill kits? Framing? More times than not, the simplest answer is the right one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

True, but you can't ignore the *not so obvious*. I've been a member here a long time, and I think I have seen them all. Pertaining to kill kits, read our Israel Keyes thread.

 

[margarita25]

A "Kill Kit" is not farfetched. Prior cases tell us this. They need their supplies, restraints, weapons, etc.

Off the top of my head, Jeffrey Willis and RB/ Jessica Heeringa. Look up what he had in his van.

 

[razzledazzle]

Any news? I am so obsessed I was buying paper towels and read it as BG Roll instead of Big Roll.

(I fought the name BG for many threads, but finally had to succumb.)

Nothing new - LE continues to "plow" through remaining tips. RL still in custody on unrelated charges.

 

[Justice101]

Any news? I am so obsessed I was buying paper towels and read it as BG Roll instead of Big Roll.

(I fought the name BG for many threads, but finally had to succumb.)

'Fraid not. Wish we had an arrest.

 

[doubtingthomas]

For those who are not from Indiana our weather can be a little strange. We can go for weeks and the temp not get out of the teens. Then jump to the 50's for a day or two and back to the teens. I went back and looked at the temps for the days prior to 2/13. On 2/9 the high was 24. On 2/10 it was 43. On 2/11 it was 59. On 2/12 it was 50. Then on 2/13 it was 43. So it does not surprise me to see Abby in a spring like jacket. And IIRC Libby in a t-shirt and sweats. I am assuming that around 2-3 would be the warmest part of the day. I could see BG wearing what he is wearing in the picture early in the morning but MOO he is over dressed for this time of day. Again MOO.

 

[Bently]

Once again I'm far behind so apologies if this has already been posted - I'm only on #250! Also, I'm trying to get all of it into one post so as not to take up too much space, lol.

First, here's the link to Sgt. Slocum's interview this morning on WBAT radio:

http://www.wbat.com/episode/tony-slocum/

He recapped the case, pointed out that it's not like TV where cases get solved in an hour, said he's been out to the trail and wouldn't have any worries letting his kids go out there. He says Libby is a hero and how the girls stayed together.

Starting around 6:00 Slocum says LE doesn't know if there were multiple people there. He said LE is not saying the photograph and audio are the same person for sure. He says they believe he was talking to the girls - almost certain from the evidence they have. He says there are 13 people in jail right now due to arrests (not connected to the murders) while checking on tips.

Slocum also talked about the impact of SM on the case. He said the public has overreacted on some things and doesn't want someone going after an innocent person. LE is monitoring SM. He said it's possible that the suspect has left the area but he is positive LE will make an arrest sooner rather than later.

Next, LE has modified the way they are vetting the tips in order to make it more efficient:



http://www.theindychannel.com/news/...w-resources-to-assist-in-delphi-investigation

And finally, here is quote from RL's attorney prior to today's hearing:



http://wishtv.com/2017/03/22/more-t...ation-continues-in-delphi-double-murder-case/

Thank you for the update. I'm mostly on phone, and for some reason my "thank you" button hasn't worked on phone for over 4 months! :dunno:

The quotes were excellent to attach, and appear so clean in your post. Just an FYI, with fabulous posts like yours that folks want to reply to, the

quote box words you are quoting

do not appear when folks respond. Just a note in case others care.... I changed from putting into at

quote box when I quote articles

and instead put in "......x.x.x.xxxx" quotes so it can be actually pulled forward with quote in a reply. Just a subtlety and nuance of the site fyi as many times I am so and have to backtrack to see the quote on the computer (and CANNOT backtrack when I'm on my phone to see original post)