Identified! IN - Hammond, Bones found buried, gold ring, Oct'11 - Francine Carlson

[chmiller0904]

A couple things do come to mind. First of all, I don't think they know who the skull belongs to. The article states... “We’re looking at people who that person (the potential suspect) might have known who have gone missing,”

However, I definitely think that they have a suspect. I googled both the owners names and they seem to be very clean. That doesn't mean that their friends, patrons, or employees weren't a little on the creepy side. My thought about this is though, it has been ten years that this shop has been closed. Unless the cops stirring around have brought back up memories of the place, patrons, owner or whatever, I don't suspect the same people that were living there ten years ago are still living there today... at least not very many. This place is located on a major street and there are apartments and such right nearby. I do know that the businesses have certainly changed in this area.

There are a couple local bars (others have come and gone) in the area. There is even a Chop Suey restaurant nearby. I wonder if the investigators are combing this area. An area of town where people do hang out, because of the restaurant bars and such. There could be some "regulars" moving around there at night. And like my Whiting friend had told me, there was access to the crawl space from outdoors.

I'm saying that maybe it is someone like this. It doesn't necessarily have to be someone that is still creeping today, but maybe a few years back, or so. I am telling you.. Whiting is a fairly small town. The HS is small & the patrons of these bars hop all throughout the town. Like I said, my dad lived there for over 20 years... and he was a single man!

I know that the rumors are flying around there, too. My friend tells me that they are saying that the body is that of a young girl... not necessarily an adult. She said it has even gone as far as people saying that this poor girl was chopped into pieces and buried that way. (JUST RUMORS)

Please know that within the last ten to fifteen years, Whiting has also been plagued with some gang violence and such. It has not always been this way. I agree with you though, Bessie.. bangers do not take time to hide bodies, so this is something else. Something even more cynical.

I wonder if there have been other incidents tied to this supposed "suspect." Maybe that is why the suspect's name does come up. I just pray that it ends with just the one victim...

sorry for being so winded... The last few postings brought a lot of different things out for me.

 

[Cubby]

Taking a guess on the victim and possible perp.

Yasmin Rayon Acree went missing from the Austin neighborhood of Chicago back in January of 2008. She was residing with an aunt via marriage, who told police in 2009 a man by the name of Jimmie Terrel Smith and his father were living in the same building that Yasmin went missing from after Jimmie was arrested for raping 5 teenage girls and kidnapping 2 teenage girls.

In a press interview from jail, Smith admitted to knowing what happened to Acree and admitted to being responsible for 4 murders he was not charged with.

Smith also admitted to dealing drugs in the immediate area near Acree's apartment.

Source: Charley project - but CP also states the jail house press release is *not confirmed*

Yasmin has a thread here, and IIRC her cousin or an uncle is a pastor which might explain the cross ring.

Charley Project link:
http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/a/acree_yasmine.html

Yasmin's WS thread:
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59103&highlight=acree

If Smith was dealing drugs in the Austin neighborhood, it's easy to conclude he may have been going back and forth to Hammond dealing or making buys there too.

All JMO

ETA: Of course I have no idea if Smith has ties to Hammond or this particular address/bait and tackle shop before or after it's closing.

 

[Soulmagent]

A couple things do come to mind. First of all, I don't think they know who the skull belongs to. The article states... “We’re looking at people who that person (the potential suspect) might have known who have gone missing,”

However, I definitely think that they have a suspect. I googled both the owners names and they seem to be very clean. That doesn't mean that their friends, patrons, or employees weren't a little on the creepy side. My thought about this is though, it has been ten years that this shop has been closed. Unless the cops stirring around have brought back up memories of the place, patrons, owner or whatever, I don't suspect the same people that were living there ten years ago are still living there today... at least not very many. This place is located on a major street and there are apartments and such right nearby. I do know that the businesses have certainly changed in this area.

There are a couple local bars (others have come and gone) in the area. There is even a Chop Suey restaurant nearby. I wonder if the investigators are combing this area. An area of town where people do hang out, because of the restaurant bars and such. There could be some "regulars" moving around there at night. And like my Whiting friend had told me, there was access to the crawl space from outdoors.

I'm saying that maybe it is someone like this. It doesn't necessarily have to be someone that is still creeping today, but maybe a few years back, or so. I am telling you.. Whiting is a fairly small town. The HS is small & the patrons of these bars hop all throughout the town. Like I said, my dad lived there for over 20 years... and he was a single man!

I know that the rumors are flying around there, too. My friend tells me that they are saying that the body is that of a young girl... not necessarily an adult. She said it has even gone as far as people saying that this poor girl was chopped into pieces and buried that way. (JUST RUMORS)

Please know that within the last ten to fifteen years, Whiting has also been plagued with some gang violence and such. It has not always been this way. I agree with you though, Bessie.. bangers do not take time to hide bodies, so this is something else. Something even more cynical.

I wonder if there have been other incidents tied to this supposed "suspect." Maybe that is why the suspect's name does come up. I just pray that it ends with just the one victim...

sorry for being so winded... The last few postings brought a lot of different things out for me.

Is there anyway to check paroled inmates work records. Dont they have to report employment? Now it is probation but it used to be parole and they had to report jobs. Just wondering.

 

[chmiller0904]

The victim has been dead at least a decade!!!!!! THAT HELPS A LOT!!

http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/hammond/article_dc9e0c78-f808-5f8e-857a-aa3fc5209296.html

 

[chmiller0904]

You know what else? I wonder if the police have the info, because this perp is already behind bars? I betcha! I betcha the perp is already in jail and they are just trying to tie this together.

The way the articles sound the police have a "could-be suspect". Usually they would be using words like... person of interest, etc. Maybe in this case it doesn't really matter, because the suspect is either dead or already incarcerated? I found the wording strange to begin with.

I am going to google around later and try to find out about some past murders, or rapes that took place in this area back in the days.. maybe 1980's or 1990's. Maybe some of the "long time" folks remember this information and passed it along to the police... and all the cops have to do is identify a woman that went missing while this perp was on the loose.

 

[CarlK90245]

The victim has been dead at least a decade!!!!!! THAT HELPS A LOT!!

http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/hammond/article_dc9e0c78-f808-5f8e-857a-aa3fc5209296.html

That would seem to indicate that the victim was placed in that location while the bait and tackle shop was in business. If they already have a perp in mind, that would seem to me that the perp is someone connected with the B&T shop.

 

[Sandraella]

i just wanted to say that i'm thinking the ring is a class ring as i have one from when i went to middle school and on the left of the ring is a cross like symbol with 4 different things around the cross not sure what it stands for though as it wasn't a religious school i noticed this while looking at my ring last night and the stone is blue to see the mascot of the school so am wondering could the ring in this case be done that way as well??

 

[Cubby]

CBS2 is reporting the bones may date back 5-10 years. I think it's too soon to determine exactly how old they may be other than to say they've been there a long time.


http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2011/10/12/person-of-interest-identified-in-indiana-bones-mystery/

 

[Claudette]

CBS2 is reporting the bones may date back 5-10 years. I think it's too soon to determine exactly how old they may be other than to say they've been there a long time.


http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2011/10/12/person-of-interest-identified-in-indiana-bones-mystery/

Says they have a poi now too. Goes so far as to say cops pretty sure they know who did it. Just confirmation of what many were thinking.

 

[chmiller0904]

Just heard on the news.. Channel 5, I believe... The suspect was someone that "stayed" at the Bait Shop??? I am looking for the feed on the NEWS, but haven't found it.

 

[bessie]

So then it would be at least a decade. I'm really curious how LE got a lead on this person they're looking at now, and if it was because of the darn ring. I can't stop thinking about it. All along I've been wondering how many relatives of missing women have contacted LE, and how many thought the ring looked familiar. Or, if a tip came in from someone who was familiar with the bait shop and the POI, was it because of the ring? Like, "I remember a girl who wore a ring like that. She went out with so-and-so who used to stay at the shop sometimes. All of a sudden she disappeared. I thought she left town." That kind of thing.

I apologize for my rambling. This story really has a grip on me. I look at the picture of the skull and the ring, and I think, who are you? And what the heck happened to you?

 

[Cubby]

I'm not sure what to make out of "stayed at the bait shop". When? Before or after it closed? Was it still known as "the bait shop" to locals long after the placed closed down and was vacant? If that's the case it could mean someone who was known to stay in the building long after it closed down.

It will be interesting to see how quickly LE releases a better photo image of the ring. Or do they already have an idea of the victims identity and are holding that close to the vest while trying to tie the perp to the crime? That ring holds a lot of 'keys' to this case imo. Though if the perp believed it to be an identifier leading back to him or her, why leave it on the victim?

too many questions for this tired brain.

Praying for a quick identification.

 

[chmiller0904]

http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/hammond/article_83d559c1-199e-5182-b147-cfe0abb90bdf.html

Okay guys... does this say that maybe they think there is a link between this skull and this serial killer?

Couple things.. This man killed teenage boys. I specifically remember it. His home is in north Hammond... I would say perhaps 5-8 miles south of this location off of Calumet Ave. I only know this, because it was two blocks over from where my mom lived. He buried the boys in his concrete basement.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,105559,00.html

I googled him to be sure I knew what I was saying and it did say he may have been responsible for another murder also. I am wondering if he might have hung around the bait shop at one time???

Maybe the folks living in the area brought it up. If he did hang around the area, how could they have forgotten it when he went to jail for some serial killings later. Incidentally, this guy died in prison.. hanging.. maybe some foul play involved via the inmates, too.

 

[Cubby]

So then it would be at least a decade. I'm really curious how LE got a lead on this person they're looking at now, and if it was because of the darn ring. I can't stop thinking about it. All along I've been wondering how many relatives of missing women have contacted LE, and how many thought the ring looked familiar. Or, if a tip came in from someone who was familiar with the bait shop and the POI, was it because of the ring? Like, "I remember a girl who wore a ring like that. She went out with so-and-so who used to stay at the shop sometimes. All of a sudden she disappeared. I thought she left town." That kind of thing.

I apologize for my rambling. This story really has a grip on me. I look at the picture of the skull and the ring, and I think, who are you? And what the heck happened to you?

BBM. My guess is someone with a lengthy criminal history tied to this building who is believed to possibly have living victims who never filed a police report or didn't follow through on pressing charges?

This case has a grip on me too.

 

[Cubby]

http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/lake/hammond/article_83d559c1-199e-5182-b147-cfe0abb90bdf.html

Okay guys... does this say that maybe they think there is a link between this skull and this serial killer?

Couple things.. This man killed teenage boys. I specifically remember it. His home is in north Hammond... I would say perhaps 5-8 miles south of this location off of Calumet Ave. I only know this, because it was two blocks over from where my mom lived. He buried the boys in his concrete basement.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,105559,00.html

I googled him to be sure I knew what I was saying and it did say he may have been responsible for another murder also. I am wondering if he might have hung around the bait shop at one time???

Maybe the folks living in the area brought it up. If he did hang around the area, how could they have forgotten it when he went to jail for some serial killings later. Incidentally, this guy died in prison.. hanging.. maybe some foul play involved via the inmates, too.

From your first link:

The forensic anthropologist also investigated at the Hammond home of serial killer David Maust during the exhumation of remains in 2003, when bodies of three teenagers were discovered entombed in a concrete slab on the property, Miller said.


Read more: http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/...99e-5182-b147-cfe0abb90bdf.html#ixzz1acmnTG5i


I'm reading this to mean the same anthropologist working on this case is the same who worked on the remains found in the Maust case. Not that the two cases are related.

hope that makes sense. Kind of on sleep posting now.... ​

 

[chmiller0904]

When I reread it, it doesn't necessarily mean that they are connected. However, maybe they saw some similarities... here is another serial killer who killed two hammond prostitutes.

http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/article_d1c73ff2-8281-11de-ac58-001cc4c03286.html

The area does have several bars throughout that stretch and there were many "non-professional" type prostitutes that hung out at those bars.. so, maybe they can tie this guy in with this. One of his Hammond victims ended up in Wolf Lake, which is actually Robertsdale.. a stone's throw away!

Maybe he hung out on that stretch of the blvd... the Bait Shop was a 24 hr bait shop so who knows what activities happened around there after dark!!

Notice the Chief's name... same man working on this case...

http://www.gohammond.com/blogs/chief_miller/?p=29

 

[bessie]

I don't think LE suspects David Maust is connected to this case. All of his many known victims were boys, and he was incarcerated from 1981-82 until 2002. A woman who met up with trouble in a bar is a more likely scenario. I'm going to read your link now, chmiller.

 

[Cubby]

When I reread it, it doesn't necessarily mean that they are connected. However, maybe they saw some similarities... here is another serial killer who killed two hammond prostitutes.

http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/article_d1c73ff2-8281-11de-ac58-001cc4c03286.html

The area does have several bars throughout that stretch and there were many "non-professional" type prostitutes that hung out at those bars.. so, maybe they can tie this guy in with this. One of his Hammond victims ended up in Wolf Lake, which is actually Robertsdale.. a stone's throw away!

Maybe he hung out on that stretch of the blvd... the Bait Shop was a 24 hr bait shop so who knows what activities happened around there after dark!!

Notice the Chief's name... same man working on this case...

http://www.gohammond.com/blogs/chief_miller/?p=29

In order for Urdiales to be a viable candidate for a POI based on the timelines given in the link, these remains would have to date back to 96. He was convicted in Cook in 02, looks like he was arrested for these murders in 96 and prior to moving to IL in 96 was in California for several years.. Assuming he was incarcerated from the time of his arrest in 96 to his conviction in 02.

 

[chmiller0904]

He did have a brief window and he was obviously scouting for prostitutes.....

Urdiales moved to Illinois after his discharge and police arrested him in 1996 in Hammond after they spotted him loitering in an area known for prostitution. A search of his truck turned up an unlicensed firearm.

Ballistics tests on the gun found it was the same weapon used to shoot and kill three women who were murdered in Illinois in 1996 and 1997

Read more: http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/article_d1c73ff2-8281-11de-ac58-001cc4c03286.html#ixzz1acxnj26g


BTW.. here is a youtube.com video of a local radio station interviewing the owner of the dog...
2011-10-06-Preacher.wmv - YouTube

 

[bessie]

Maybe not so brief. He lived in Chicago with his parents after his discharge 1991. Also at this trutv link, on the previous page it says that he knew Chicago victim Cassandra Cossum for two years before he killed her in 1996.

Killing four women during his Southern California military service, he received an honorable discharge in 1991 and returned to Chicago to live with his parents. Urdiales returned to California in September 1992 for a short visit in which he attacked Jennifer Asbenson, but returned to Chicago again
http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/predators/andrew-urdiales/loner.html

The reason I'm doubtful about Urdiales is that his three Chicago victims were disposed of in water.