Japan - Miyazawa family of 4 murdered, Setagaya, Tokyo, 30 Dec 2000 #2

[Charlot123]

Random speculation, imo.
If it is true that a garage door might lead into the hallway, could the perp have been hiding in the garage all along, maybe even snuck inside a car?
Although i mentioned it before and it is unlikely, not impossible- i still wonder just a little, if the killer brought a container of blood (his own or someone else's) to the scene and strategically place it to mislead an investigation?
Which leads me to wonder if the killing had more to do with anger at LE, wanting to taunt and mess with them, and families in the community at large?

I thought about it.

But even more, now that @FacelessPodcast has mentioned such a possibility, of whether there might be a hallway running under the two connecting houses and ending in a garage?

 

[Tiger Stripes]

Also to add climbing out of such a narrow bathroom window with a pretty bad hand injury would be pretty difficult to manoeuvre without causing yourself pain or just falling out of it entirely, no? And no fibres while struggling out of it potentially one-handed? Doesn’t make much sense.

Perhaps he entered that way and was stealthy enough to not leave any trace (unsure if that’s even possible), but exited via the balcony due to injury instead?

Just tossing this out there...

When I lived and worked in Japan (for 5 years; different parts of the country, plus visits to many regions within the country), one thing that continually amazed me was this: That many Japanese families didn't regularly lock their front doors. (Yes, I have also lived in places here in the States where residents rarely lock their doors -- house doors, as well as car doors -- and it also startled me; now in 2024, hopefully more people in *both* countries are more aware of the need for vigilance, thus locking doors.)

I mention this casual mindset in passing from some 20 years ago re: the not locking of doors, to perhaps help fellow readers know that, often in the *past* in Japan, next-door neighbors and family members rarely locked their doors. If coming over even just to drop off something (food, a borrowed item, etc.) in a neighbor's entryway/genkan, all that was ever done/expected was a quick "rap" on the door with an Ojama shimasu ("I'm going to be a nuisance" is the casual rendering). Then one would quickly slide open the entryway door **without actually entering**, place the item carefully inside the entryway, slide the door closed, and head on one's way.

All of that to say that not all entryway/front doors in the Setagaya of 2000 were constantly locked. Hoping this throws more light on the case, for those contemplating individuals climbing in/out of windows, etc.

 

[Incoherent]

Just tossing this out there...

When I lived and worked in Japan (for 5 years; different parts of the country, plus visits to many regions within the country), one thing that continually amazed me was this: That many Japanese families didn't regularly lock their front doors. (Yes, I have also lived in places here in the States where residents rarely lock their doors -- house doors, as well as car doors -- and it also startled me; now in 2024, hopefully more people in *both* countries are more aware of the need for vigilance, thus locking doors.)

I mention this casual mindset in passing from some 20 years ago re: the not locking of doors, to perhaps help fellow readers know that, often in the *past* in Japan, next-door neighbors and family members rarely locked their doors. If coming over even just to drop off something (food, a borrowed item, etc.) in a neighbor's entryway/genkan, all that was ever done/expected was a quick "rap" on the door with an Ojama shimasu ("I'm going to be a nuisance" is the casual rendering). Then one would quickly slide open the entryway door **without actually entering**, place the item carefully inside the entryway, slide the door closed, and head on one's way.

All of that to say that not all entryway/front doors in the Setagaya of 2000 were constantly locked. Hoping this throws more light on the case, for those contemplating individuals climbing in/out of windows, etc.

It is true people in Japan were much more lax back then, and this case most definitely made people more aware to secure their windows and doors.
The front door could not be confirmed locked or opened when the family were discovered due to Haruko not being able to recall, but we do know the bathroom window was open and there were footprints below it on the ground, also the screen was taken off. Rei’s balcony has not been confirmed by TMPD at all.
It was confirmed no footprints or fingerprints around or on the front door which, even if open, the killer would have to at least touch to escape.
Here is a picture of the front door I took a while ago:




Circled you can see a double lock system, meaning a key has to be turned into both keyholes to open the door.
To the right you can see a doorbell intercom, and to the bottom you can see a security fence that is able to be extended.
So, in my opinion, the family were decently aware of security and I don’t think the door was left unlocked at the time of the murder which was after 11pm at night. The bathroom window being open was the exception.

Could the killer have unlocked it from inside to escape? Possibly, but there was no trace of him there.
But then again, there was no trace of him on the bathroom window either. Except evidence of him being below it at some point.
Rei’s balcony as a point of entry/exit is the only totally unknown/not commented on.

 

[penelopeb]

We know there was 50 minutes between the discovery of the bodies and the police being called, and there is a possibility that Haruko fainted. She definitely walked around and checked on the family, maybe Ann and her husband did as well. So the absence of evidence isn’t indicative that the killer was never near the front door, maybe it’s that stuff got wiped from all that activity prior to forensics.

Haruko must have been covered in blood, haven’t read anywhere about whether An, her husband, and her son were too. There are so many details in this case that the police would know answers to but they haven’t released them. But I fully believe he just walked out. He’s not climbing over anything with his hand injury. Is it even possible to make it over the balcony with one hand?

 

[FacelessPodcast]

I thought about it.

But even more, now that @FacelessPodcast has mentioned such a possibility, of whether there might be a hallway running under the two connecting houses and ending in a garage?

I think it was just a door from the Miyazawa hallway to their garage. As I understand it, there is no connection between the two houses at all.

 

[FacelessPodcast]

We know there was 50 minutes between the discovery of the bodies and the police being called, and there is a possibility that Haruko fainted. She definitely walked around and checked on the family, maybe Ann and her husband did as well. So the absence of evidence isn’t indicative that the killer was never near the front door, maybe it’s that stuff got wiped from all that activity prior to forensics.

Haruko must have been covered in blood, haven’t read anywhere about whether An, her husband, and her son were too. There are so many details in this case that the police would know answers to but they haven’t released them. But I fully believe he just walked out. He’s not climbing over anything with his hand injury. Is it even possible to make it over the balcony with one hand?

Yes totally. The reconstruction by the TV channel showed the guy clearly using both hands. I actually think it might be harder getting out of the window than in, which already looked pretty challenging. Also they kind of flub the reconstruction because they help him head-first into the window. The killer was going in head-first with no such help. Yet he would’ve pulled it off seamlessly without making noise (already seemingly impossible as far as the reconstruction is concerned for all the noise he made against the wall / fence) to land in the bathroom with time enough to strangle Rei. Let’s say he did this in a minute (already a very fast estimate), it would have taken Mikio only seconds to climb those stairs. If he had any inkling whatsoever that something was off, I don’t think the killer has enough time to get to Rei. As @Incoherent says, he definitely or almost certainly sized up the bathroom window. But I don’t think it tracks given the above. For that reason, my best guess is that he used the car to get up to Rei’s balcony which explains the sequence of murders and also why the TMPD were focusing on the car (despite saying the killer never entered the garage). The next time I speak with the Chief, I’ll ask about Rei’s balcony.

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

Even if the killer didn't *succeed* in entering or leaving via the bathroom window, the cut screen suggests he attempted it.

Based on the direction of the cuts, the TMPD should know whether he was inside or outside the house when he cut the screen. But if I remember correctly they have never divulged that information?

 

[FacelessPodcast]

Even if the killer didn't *succeed* in entering or leaving via the bathroom window, the cut screen suggests he attempted it.

Based on the direction of the cuts, the TMPD should know whether he was inside or outside the house when he cut the screen. But if I remember correctly they have never divulged that information?

If he gets up to the window to cut the screen from the outside why doesn’t he enter? Seeing as his gloves are presumably still on at that point, that might explain the lack of prints of fibres there, though. Alternatively, if he cuts the screen from the inside and then decides against *exiting* that way, how does he do that leaving no prints or fibres now with an injured hand and not wearing gloves. It’s a riddle inside a puzzle. As for the TMPD, they’ve given very limited information on this.

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

I think this has been answered before, but I can't find it so please forgive me for asking. Were the killer's footprints actually found on the ground underneath the bathroom window, or is that just a rumor?

If his footprints were found, that has to be important and mean something. But like so much in this case, it's difficult to know *what* it means--beyond the obvious fact that at some point, and for some reason, the killer walked at the back of the house.

 

[Incoherent]

The next time I speak with the Chief, I’ll ask about Rei’s balcony.

This would be ideal if you were able to have any light shed on it.

In the meantime when I get a minute, I’m going to read into what the Japanese-side of the discussions have to say about the entry and exit points to see if anyone else is as curious as we are here. If I recall I have seen Monazite question it a few times. But he questions everything.

 

[Incoherent]

Re: the screen. Screens in Japan slide across windows, so the killer would have had to physically touch it and slide it off to remove it and then either place it or push it out onto the ground. Simply stabbing it out wouldn’t work.

There was a picture of the entire thing on the floor that I will try to find again, so he definitely took it off.

From the inside he would have to climb into, or onto, the bathtub to reach outside the window to do this, which at that point would be full of water and documents. And then if he managed it, throw it outside.
From the outside it would be much easier to do and with his gloves he could leave no prints there. So I would say he climbed up to the window and removed it. But then whether he entered or not is our guess.

Re: footprints at the bottom of the window, yes they were definitely there.

Edit: here is the image believed to be the screen. I believe it’s from the DVD the TMPD have, and likely footage the morning of the murder that shows what the surroundings looked like at the time.

 

[Sor Juana]

How many of those killers perpetrated japan’s most notorious murders and got away with it? How many of those 25 are currently living out their lives in the US having left behind only prints and evidence?

There have been instances where US military personnel have been transferred to Japanese custody for prosecution under Japanese law, though these are not traditional extraditions. 1995 Okinawa Rape Incident, 2002 Yokosuka Murder Case to name a few. These cases involve the transfer of custody rather than formal extradition, but they illustrate the cooperation between US and Japanese authorities in handling serious crimes committed by US military personnel in Japan.

Given the high profile of the Miyazawa case, I find it hard to imagine that the US would refuse to extradite one of their citizens if compelling evidence is presented. I firmly believe they will cooperate once the evidence is clear. This is why I strongly support the idea of Japanese undercover agents conducting a special operation to obtain the suspect’s DNA samples. Such action would either confirm or rule out this scenario, bringing much-needed clarity to the case.

 

[Sor Juana]

That idea that Joe Public can pull my POI’s fingerprints and send them to the Chief to make the match isn’t realistic for so many reasons (some which are obvious, some which I can’t get into).

RSBM. I'm very curious about what those reasons could be, but since you're not disclosing them, I won't press further. However, I'd like to share some well-known cases where similar initiatives from the public or undercover agents proved pivotal in identifying the perpetrator.
The Golden State Killer Case. Also known as the East Area Rapist and the Original Night Stalker, was responsible for a series of crimes including murders, rapes and burglaries across California from the 1970s to the 1980s. In this case, it wasn't just a single member of the public, but rather the use of public DNA databases that played a crucial role. A relative of the perpetrator, Joseph James DeAngelo, had uploaded their DNA to a public genealogy website. Investigators used this information to create a family tree and narrow down their list of suspects. Once DeAngelo was identified as a suspect, police obtained a DNA sample from an item he discarded (a tissue or smth) to directly match it with the DNA from crime scenes.
The Grim Sleeper Case. Lonnie David Franklin Jr., known as the "Grim Sleeper," was responsible for at least 10 murders and one attempted murder in Los Angeles between 1985 and 2007. The case remained unsolved for many years due to a lack of evidence connecting Franklin to the crimes. In this case, it was the involvement of Franklin's son that led to his arrest. A member of the public, specifically an undercover officer posing as a waiter, obtained a DNA sample from Franklin, which was then linked to the crimes. It demonstrates how members of the public, including undercover operatives acting in public capacities, can play a pivotal role in criminal investigations.

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

Re: the screen. Screens in Japan slide across windows, so the killer would have had to physically touch it and slide it off to remove it and then either place it or push it out onto the ground. Simply stabbing it out wouldn’t work.

There was a picture of the entire thing on the floor that I will try to find again, so he definitely took it off.

From the inside he would have to climb into, or onto, the bathtub to reach outside the window to do this, which at that point would be full of water and documents. And then if he managed it, throw it outside.
From the outside it would be much easier to do and with his gloves he could leave no prints there. So I would say he climbed up to the window and removed it. But then whether he entered or not is our guess.

Re: footprints at the bottom of the window, yes they were definitely there.

Edit: here is the image believed to be the screen. I believe it’s from the DVD the TMPD have, and likely footage the morning of the murder that shows what the surroundings looked like at the time.

View attachment 506025

Thanks. So it was the whole screen and frame, not just the screen fabric. Gotcha.

It seems like that would be pretty difficult to remove from inside.

I've mentioned this before, but I wonder if there's *any* chance the killer made some noise, Mikio heard it and went outside to check it out, then the killer was able to sneak in through the front door whilst Mikio was distracted.

 

[Sor Juana]

How to Remove Window Screens from the Outside

 

[FacelessPodcast]

There have been instances where US military personnel have been transferred to Japanese custody for prosecution under Japanese law, though these are not traditional extraditions. 1995 Okinawa Rape Incident, 2002 Yokosuka Murder Case to name a few.

And there have been instances where they have not. So, what? As I stated above, I have personally spoken to people on-base party to such serious crimes that occurred in Japan yet local authorities deferred to US detention and processing. At any rate, the SOFA is riven with idiosyncrasies that Japanese authorities have long complained about. Moreover, the Okinawa rape case you cite first is one of the very exemplars of my point: it re-ignited the debate over the very presence of US military in Japan, led to mass protests, and stoked anti-American sentiment in Japan. But this is moot because our killer here was never apprehended or identified and possibly fled to the US. I’m yet to see a similar case where Japanese secret agents, such as they are, went to rural Maryland or deepest Ozark to lift fingerprints or take long-distance photos of a murder suspect. Perhaps that has happened.

Given the high profile of the Miyazawa case, I find it hard to imagine that the US would refuse to extradite one of their citizens if compelling evidence is presented.

Let us assume the killer is American. Let assume Tokyo detectives do not want to consider this for whatever reason. What possible reason could there be, if not the possibility above, for that evidence to have to be presented as opposed to secured themselves? We know the US would be very amenable to cooperation with one of their closest allies. We know the TMPD is the best-funded police force on earth.

I firmly believe they will cooperate once the evidence is clear. This is why I strongly support the idea of Japanese undercover agents conducting a special operation to obtain the suspect’s DNA samples. Such action would either confirm or rule out this scenario, bringing much-needed clarity to the case.

Then you are a person with more faith than me. Not only because the US are not always the quickest to extradite their own citizens at the best of times, such as the case of Harry Dunn (the ‘lopsided’ extradition treaty between the U.K./U.S. has been debated in Parliament as such). Not just because of all the problems with DNA x Japanese LE investigations. But because why hasn’t this already happened if it was going to happen? 24 years. Are they biding their time? En fin, I am saying in the absence of TMPD explanation for why they would not consider the American angle here, geopolitical relations could be one possible factor in explaining that reticence. You are saying that is not a possibility because this case is high-profile. We can agree to disagree.

 

[Sor Juana]

So, I’ll try to be clearer. I think he is skeptical, not for the idea that the killer could be American, but because he thinks it’s naturally unlikely that I could theoretically find the killer where they could not.

RSBM.
It's a bit confusing. Nevertheless, I find myself somewhat puzzled by the Chief Investigator's reluctance to accept new ideas, especially considering the prolonged failure to identify the killer. While I certainly acknowledge the immense effort put forth and understand the complexity of the task, one would expect a more open-minded approach from someone in such a position. However, if this is indeed the stance of the Chief Investigator, past or present, then there may be little that can be done.

Nonetheless, history offers examples to the contrary, such as the renowned Zodiac Killer case. In this case, amateur code-breakers and detectives played a crucial role in deciphering the cryptic messages sent by the Zodiac Killer to newspapers. One amateur code-breaker, David Oranchak, along with his colleagues Sam Blake and Jarl Van Eycke, spent years studying the Zodiac's ciphers and eventually cracked one of the most famous ones, known as the "340 Cipher," in December 2020. The efforts of Oranchak and other amateur sleuths have contributed to keeping the case alive and generating new theories and investigative avenues.

Another example: the Hinterkaifeck murders that occurred in Germany in 1922 when six members of the Gruber family were brutally killed on their farmstead. The case remains one of Germany's most infamous unsolved crimes. In 2007, a retired German detective, Günther Kaufmann, conducted his own investigation into the Hinterkaifeck murders. Using modern forensic techniques and his expertise as a former detective, Kaufmann developed a theory about the identity of the killer. Kaufmann conducted a detailed analysis of the crime scene photos, witness statements, and historical documents related to the case. He also consulted with experts in forensic psychology and criminal behaviour to develop his theory. It has sparked renewed interest and debate among both amateur sleuths and professional investigators.

The Murder of Dorothy Jane Scott. Dorothy Jane Scott disappeared in 1980 in California and was later found murdered. Her case remained unsolved for decades until amateur sleuths, including blogger Todd Matthews, began investigating. Their efforts led to the identification of a suspect, Michael Anthony Neal, who had been stalking Scott prior to her disappearance.

The Disappearance of Julie Mott. Julie Mott disappeared from a funeral home in San Antonio, Texas, in 2015. Despite extensive searches, her body was never found, and the case remained unsolved. However, a group of websleuths took an interest in the case and conducted their own investigations. Their efforts led to the identification of a suspect, who was eventually charged with Mott's murder in 2019.

These examples demonstrate the valuable contributions that amateur sleuths can make to solving crimes and bringing closure to families affected by tragedy.

 

[FacelessPodcast]

RSBM. I'm very curious about what those reasons could be, but since you're not disclosing them, I won't press further. However, I'd like to share some well-known cases where similar initiatives from the public or undercover agents proved pivotal in identifying the perpetrator.
The Golden State Killer Case. Also known as the East Area Rapist and the Original Night Stalker, was responsible for a series of crimes including murders, rapes and burglaries across California from the 1970s to the 1980s. In this case, it wasn't just a single member of the public, but rather the use of public DNA databases that played a crucial role. A relative of the perpetrator, Joseph James DeAngelo, had uploaded their DNA to a public genealogy website. Investigators used this information to create a family tree and narrow down their list of suspects. Once DeAngelo was identified as a suspect, police obtained a DNA sample from an item he discarded (a tissue or smth) to directly match it with the DNA from crime scenes.
The Grim Sleeper Case. Lonnie David Franklin Jr., known as the "Grim Sleeper," was responsible for at least 10 murders and one attempted murder in Los Angeles between 1985 and 2007. The case remained unsolved for many years due to a lack of evidence connecting Franklin to the crimes. In this case, it was the involvement of Franklin's son that led to his arrest. A member of the public, specifically an undercover officer posing as a waiter, obtained a DNA sample from Franklin, which was then linked to the crimes. It demonstrates how members of the public, including undercover operatives acting in public capacities, can play a pivotal role in criminal investigations.

1. The Chief is retired.
2. He doesn’t speak English.
3. He is not open for members of the public to send him random fingerprints.
4. For obvious reasons, he is not a hugely trusting person.
5. Joe Public is rarely going to speak Japanese / have the inclination to do this / have the Chief’s contact details. So on, so forth. These are the obvious reasons.

As for the two cases you mentioned, thanks, I’m aware of them. To my eye, neither are hugely comparable to the murders in question. And they both hinge on DNA. So, as mentioned at length, we’re back to the Japanese DNA issue.

 

[lilykaluva]

There have been instances where US military personnel have been transferred to Japanese custody for prosecution under Japanese law, though these are not traditional extraditions. 1995 Okinawa Rape Incident, 2002 Yokosuka Murder Case to name a few. These cases involve the transfer of custody rather than formal extradition, but they illustrate the cooperation between US and Japanese authorities in handling serious crimes committed by US military personnel in Japan.

Given the high profile of the Miyazawa case, I find it hard to imagine that the US would refuse to extradite one of their citizens if compelling evidence is presented. I firmly believe they will cooperate once the evidence is clear. This is why I strongly support the idea of Japanese undercover agents conducting a special operation to obtain the suspect’s DNA samples. Such action would either confirm or rule out this scenario, bringing much-needed clarity to the case.

I think this case also has a few potential major differences with those you've cited, though. If the killer really was underage, but not by much, that adds an additional complicating factor. Would he be up for the death penalty in Japan, or would his age exempt him? Would he face extradition from the USA if someone who was a minor at the time was up for the death penalty? Would Americans be okay with that?

And beyond public opinion, what kind of precedent does that set for extradition to other countries that might prescribe the death penalty for crimes the US wouldn't consider to be criminal (think Saudi Arabia, where there is also a large US military presence)? That's the trouble with political decisions; they never occur in a vacuum. There's always "precedent" to consider. So this case, even if it would seem like it could be considered a on-off incident, wouldn't be considered such.

Not to mention if he's not a US serviceman himself, but the child of one. US servicemen in Japan is already a tense issue (and was also a major tension in the wake of the Okinawa incident when this case broke; there were protests, and there have been on and off since, and the tensions have increased in recent years again). There's a whole host of legal and ethical and political complications that could quite honestly blow this case up in the news on both sides of the world and bring potential serious ramifications.

And that's without even getting into the potential ethnicity of the killer. If he is Korean-American or Chinese-American in heritage, there are tensions between those countries and Japan as well that this could bring up. The Okinawa incident had claims of racial discrimination because the defendants were African-American. This would be even more complicated given history between these countries.

 

[fridaybaker]

Regarding the whole situation of whether or not TMPD would be willing to take "unoficially obtained" prints, extradition, etc., I think part of the problem in discussing cases is that we "websleuths" tend to look at these cases with our own, built-in, bias. I notice it all the time here on these threads. We see a case on a somewhat granular level and, as is simply a reality, without a lot of the surrounding picture. In this case, there is just so much that is "layered" onto the case that makes action or inaction hard to cipher, such as Japanese culture vs. American culture; an always-shifing political picture, most of which we can only guess at at any given time; politics, personalities and other realities particular to this case; and more.

And, just to throw this out there: I don't think Japanese citizens would be the only ones outraged by a U.S. Serviceman or his son savagely murdering an entire Japanese family. There is much sentiment here already against having our frintprint all over the world. I can only imagine that such a thing would cause a political storm here as well. I know it would for me, and that's all I'll say about that.