jodi arias TAKES THE STAND #66 *may contain graphic and adult content*

[katiecoolady]

Minor4th was your :clock:

Hope you didn't slap him too hard!

I'm confused! Subtitles pleased!

 

[Kamille]

Well said, all of it. I can tell you've been thinking about this case a lot. Me, too. I am relieved to hear you are still doubting the sex that day. He was blocking her from his life. Travis was mad in that text and I doubt he just let her in again. He had lost all trust in her.

I'm having a difficult time believing she got there in the middle of the night and he let her get into bed with him to sleep. IMO, her premeditated plan has a hidden part to it. Mainly, did Travis even know she was there, and if so, did he let her stay willingly.

Is it possible that Travis was on the computer early in the morning and she was peeping in the window which is how she know this? Maybe she didn't come in at that time because of the roomates? Waited until after they left to sneak in the house? Did they see her car?

And if he was up that late, which it appears from the calls on the previous evenings he was known to do, is it possible that he went to bed at some point and was still sleeping around 1:40 in the afternoon. It was really hot that day. Could he have just laid on top of the bed naked because of the heat? Air conditioning doesn't work that well on the top floor of two story houses.

Is there a time stamp for the braid picture? That is the only one that looks like it might have been taken by someone else.

So it's possible that she woke him up around that time and there was no sex?

The only thing that is strange is that it appears the shower door is open in all the shower pictures. He would not have done that if he thought he was alone. So I'm really unsure about those pics and how they came about.

Regarding the pics, didn't JA say that either she or Travis had deleted some before the shower pics? Wouldn't the shower pics have overwritten those on the memory card before they were deleted? I'm not familiar with this but it would seem difficult to retrieve two sets of pics deleted from the same memory card at different times? I noticed JM was really questioning her about who deleted the pics and when. Do you think he knows this and that it's impossible for him to have deleted pics before the shower pics were taken?

MOO

 

[ctmom]

I nearly wet my pants laughing while putting this together. My sister called me twice with new observations.. I was going to post this after closing arguments... but after the BS "body slam" and "like a linebacker" testimony... It was late at night... I was hungry... The Cinnabon was an afterthought.:floorlaugh:

 

[Cailin Rua]

Looked more so like she was demonstrating a lazy butterfly stroke.

I kind of wish she had lost her balance and fallen over, further demonstrating the absurdity.

 

[PhantomAngel]

I would like to thank all you great Websleuthers for your help, guidance and kindness. I posted a few times through the Casey fiasco and just never left. I just dont believe Travis knew she was there. I know I could be wrong, I was one time - lol - but after the Bishop confession, and the texts messages telling her what she was, I just don't see it.
Thanks again to all - I am at home

 

[Schuby]

Is it possible that Travis was on the computer early in the morning and she was peeping in the window which is how she know this? Maybe she didn't come in at that time because of the roomates? Waited until after they left to sneak in the house? Did they see her car?

And if he was up that late, which it appears from the calls on the previous evenings he was known to do, is it possible that he went to bed at some point and was still sleeping around 1:40 in the afternoon. It was really hot that day. Could he have just laid on top of the bed naked because of the heat? Air conditioning doesn't work that well on the top floor of two story houses.

Is there a time stamp for the braid picture? That is the only one that looks like it might have been taken by someone else.

So it's possible that she woke him up around that time and there was no sex?

The only thing that is strange is that it appears the shower door is open in all the shower pictures. He would not have done that if he thought he was alone. So I'm really unsure about those pics and how they came about.

Regarding the pics, didn't JA say that either she or Travis had deleted some before the shower pics? Wouldn't the shower pics have overwritten those on the memory card before they were deleted? I'm not familiar with this but it would seem difficult to retrieve two sets of pics deleted from the same memory card at different times? I noticed JM was really questioning her about who deleted the pics and when. Do you think he knows this and that it's impossible for him to have deleted pics before the shower pics were taken?

MOO

If there was no sex, why put the sheets in the wash? Sheets in the wash=Jodi's DNA on the sheets=sex

 

[popsicle]

So I goggled court reporter typewriter and found what the keyboard looks like and the print out that is typed. crazy

 

[Furiously_Following]

Thank you so much for your insights and your personal knowledge of this type of personality.

I agree with you -- it wasn't jealousy, because she thought she'd still have power over him even if he was dating other girls. It was being exposed when Travis figured out exactly who she was that pushed her to the point of murder.

I think Jodi understood that she was obsessed with Travis, and I think Jodi understood that she was out of control and didn't like it, but still could not reign in her obsession. As she felt her power over Travis slipping away, helpless to do anything to stop it, she engaged in even more dysfunctional behaviors in a desperate attempt to regain control. Having some distance from her, Travis began to see her for who she really was and told her exactly what he thought - he shattered the reality that Jodi had constructed for herself, and Jodi could not tolerate it.

My experience with these kind of ppl is---you are with them or against them-no in between!

 

[Gypsy Road]

Hi everyone, I'm a looong-time lurker but first time poster. :seeya:

I know a lot of people keep questioning what made Jodi snap and kill Travis. I have a little different explanation of her motivation based on being raised by a mother with "cluster B" personality disorders (mostly borderline but could be classified under almost all of them).

Jodi and my mother are very, very similar. So similar it's scary; however, my mother never killed anyone. But, my mother was hyper sexual (with men and women), displayed stalker tendencies (spying on people, listening in on conversations, steaming open her boyfriend's mail), would become "obsessed" with certain people to the point of having no other friends, did crazy things to people she perceived wronged her (tire slashing, nails under tires, sugar in gas tanks, faked suicide attempts) and lived only in her own "truth". Yet, people who only saw my mother in social situations (like at work) thought she was very nice.

So how does this tie in with Jodi? In my opinion, Jodi killed Travis because he questioned and threatened her "truth". The texts from him to Jodi show he had started to figure out who she really was. The fact that he shared this knowledge with her was probably enough to start planning how to get rid of him. In my experience, things like jealousy or betrayal don't have the same effect on cluster B disordered people. Things that trigger them make no sense to those of us who aren't disordered.

If Jodi is anything like my mother, her "truth" is the world that she creates in her mind and that she chooses to live in. Any questioning of her "truth" was completely unacceptable. Any time I questioned my mother's truth, she became physically violent with me while telling me how it was all my fault she had to hit me.

My mother used to tell us constantly that she was only being honest when she saw situations completely different than everyone else. I'm sure Jodi did the same to Travis. Being around these people for any length of time does make you begin to think that you are crazy.

My heart breaks for Travis' family and for Travis and the hell that Jodi put him through. I hope this post makes sense...it's not something I speak of often.

WOW. Your mom sounds exactly like my mom. Especially the sneaking and spying and sugar in gas tanks! I don't know if my mom actually ever did it, but she spoke about putting cake batter in people's gas tanks that she felt betrayed her. Also, how your mom told you it was your own fault that she hit you! A lot of people thought my mom was nice, too - unless they got a glimpse of her craziness. One glimpse and their opinion of her changed and they avoided her like the plague. My mom was never able to keep steady friends. Definitely disordered, and I can totally sympathize with what you went through as a child. I'm very sorry!

Awesome first post. Thank you for sharing your story, and WELCOME to WS!!!!!!:seeya:

 

[norest4thewicked]

If there was no sex, why put the sheets in the wash? Sheets in the wash=Jodi's DNA on the sheets=sex

I believe that she put the sheets in the wash in case they had ANY DNA from her. One single hair that fell out of her head while she posed for the photos would be enough. I don't think they had sex that day either and think that she posed for the photos of her with a timer.

 

[KarmicLaw]

If it comes to having a nice guy attorney who loses cases or an *advertiser censored***ole who wins them, then give me the second every time. I doubt seriously that JM cares one bit how people perceive him. He's there to win cases and not win popularity contests. I think he does a fabulous job and apparently so do his previous juries! That's all that matters. He brings justice for the families.

I always say this about doctors. I don't care aout their bedside manner as long as they are competent. HOWEVER, there is some truth to the saying that "a jury is 12 people who decide which side has the best lawyer". For some reason, or lack of reason, jurors do allow themselves to be persuaded by the "attractiveness" of a lawyer. Heck, look at how we want to see the ME and other attractive folks on the stand!! I know that JM has a lot of experience. Jodi is a different breed. In many of the high profile cases JM has won, the defendant never took the stand. And I doubt he has ever seen the likes of a monster like Jodi. I just don't want to underestimate the ability of Jodi to get under JM's skin to the point that he turns even one juror. I think he had a strong finish on cross and I think it's just his style to be passionate and on the aggressive. I can take it, but I know a lot of people who are still incapable of believing that HA did this alone, or didn't have a good reason. Ugh, I hope they aren't on the jury.

 

[scorpio24]

Travis having "gone to the bishop" casts a whole new light on the above. Once a sexually active single Mormon has "gone to the bishop," a whole process of repentence is started up. He has to name the partner and that partner's bishop is informed that an affair has been transpiring. The partner is called into their bishop's office.

The reporting person is considered the more righteous. Women are considered less culpable than men. A man who is reported for sexual misconduct (by neighbors, friends, etc) may be either disfellowshipped or sent up the ladder of authority to the stake level for an excommunication trial, which is called a "Court of Love." It looks just like an inquisition with 15 or so chairs in a half circle around the single chair of the accused in the
center. It is not really a trial (no witnesses or facts) just the all-male suits talking and the accused. A person may be excommunicated even if they are repentent and promise to drop the person.

At some point after Arias left Mesa, and after the phone sex, Travis went to the bishop, according to Dateline. He would have to go back and confess again if he had sex with Arias after the visit. He was able to avoid losing his membership or undergoing the embarrassment of disfellowship by promising to cut her out of his life completely. He bailed on his plans to see her but did not tell her he had gone to the bishop out of fear of retaliation (he knew who slashed his tires....etc)

I think Jodi found out he had gone to his bishop and began to realize that she had lost all those wonderful friends (actually Travis' friends) in Arizona and now she was going to be facing excommunication herself as the unrepentant person in a fornication case. The actions of those courts are announced in Mormon leadership meetings and become the fodder for gossip. My point: he was taking away her reputation by confessing and naming her.

Nobody takes anything away from Ms. Arias. I believe that's when she began assembling evidence--taped the sex phone call, tried to find anything incriminating and ruin his reputation in return.

If he was going to dump her and take away from her the connection to the Mormon Church and PPL (intertwined), how would she be able to *advertiser censored* jump from man to man posing as a sincere believer/insurance saleswoman?

It was a lot harder from her Yreka bedroom at Grandma's than it was to throw that chum out in the water and sucker in a rich guy at a conference in Las Vegas.

To back up my point-

SHE NEVER WORKED THE PPL, just went to meetings. She made a grand total of $1700 in a year-- and that was with personal help from Travis and weekly inspirational phone calls from Gus.

SHE NEVER LIVED LIKE A MORMON, failing to keep the most basic rules which were promised at baptism. Believe me, as a single bombshell, those rules were laid out to her in fourth grade vocabulary.

SHE NEVER SOLD A PHOTOGRAPH, choosing to "focus" on her interest in taking pictures and turning down a good-paying career as a wedding planner because that did not put her in proximity to rich eligible bachelors, rather put her next to women less pretty (in her view) than she was and they were getting married!

ROAD TRIPS were not vacations and she refused to allow them to be referred to that way. They were her work. Photography was a way to justify the road trips where she leaped from man to man to man, making bank deposits along the way.

SHe thought she had it made in the shade latching onto MOrmonism because it was a way she could APPEAR to be religious or good without being that way. And she could be among a ton of men eager to get married. Which was EXACTLY WHAT SHE WANTED It is far more effective for a maneater like Jodi to be Mormon because unlike other religions, it is considered to be unspiritual and slightly weird to be unmarried; therefore, the men are all looking for wives. Also, they are naive.

Utah is the multi-level marketing mecca of the USA. It is also the state with the most white collar affinity crime - Mormons on Mormons. Young men ages 16-24 in Utah have the highest suicide rate in the United States. Utah is the state with the largest *advertiser censored* consumption in the nation. The whole focus on not-masturbating creates tragedies and mental illness for many normal Mormon males. As a single attractive female convert in Mormonism, EVERY SINGLE MAN I dated asked me to marry him-- and quickly too! I soon realized this was not my charms in action, this was a cultural problem.

Against this backdrop crawls forth Jodi Arias. She must have thought she died and went to heaven at her first Mormon-loaded PPL meeting. To hell with you, Daryll, I found some MARRY-MINDED boys and I have what they want.

She saw herself as having something unique to offer--the kinks of the worldly experience with the absolution of baptism and now she's clean, childless and oh-so-available.

Travis' rejection was taking away from her his love and allowing another woman to have what she felt was hers. It was also taking away from her the entire stage of theater on which she was performing so beautifully. She went from bed to bed to bed and in the Prepaid Legal world, she could travel the country that way-- she might never need to work. Imagine how she felt when she acquired a BMW from Travis! She was SET!

Now he was going to not only take away his love, but take her reputation with him, and now she learns he's gone to the bishop. That is the real end of the relationship. The going to the bishop. Her masquerade was definitely over.

I don't believe he had sex with Jodi when she showed up. I think he forbade her to come. I believe she took photos of him staging sex with the kY tubes while he was sleeping and photos of herself.

Thank you so much for these insights! It adds an entirely new perspective to the "impromptu visit." I am beginning to believe that there was no sex on June 4, as well. :twocents:

 

[Schuby]

I believe that she put the sheets in the wash in case they had ANY DNA from her. One single hair that fell out of her head while she posed for the photos would be enough. I don't think they had sex that day either and think that she posed for the photos of her with a timer.

Why pose for photos you hope no one will ever see? Remember she did NOT want those pictures to survive.

 

[PAXIMUS]

So apparently I never read the texts just posted or I am just on information overload and forgot. I listen to the trial everyday at work and read most of these threads.

Wow. Those texts from Travis are eye-opening. It seems to me Jodi's behavior on the stand is pretty normal and this is really her personality (crazy) - it's not just an act. Do we know what set him off? I wonder what antics she was trying to pull on him. I cannot imagine him going from that sour mood at the end of May and then welcoming her into his home and bed a week later. No way. No matter how good the sex was.

WHERE CAN I READ THE TEXTS I dont see them.

 

[Karmady]

I disagree. I think the court would tell the defense team that Nurmi started the examination, and Nurmi must finish it. I do not think the court would allow Wilmott to redirect the witness after Nurmi examined her.

Yes, Nurmi started with direct, but I'm gonna call you out on the court PROHIBITING Wilmot from re-directing. lol. Like I said, I don't think she's going to. But I think the court would allow it. There's really no logical basis not to and I don't know of a rule that precludes it.

 

[GetSmart]

ok I got Radio Show ..Kimster is on

 

[DebinGA]

I joined the trial late with JM's cross of JA, blessedly avoiding the repellent Nurmi. This has probably been covered a hundred times, but why in the world didn't Travis change his locks, pin numbers, passwords, etc. long before his death? According to Flores, JA was still accessing his test messages/voice mail the day she slaughtered him. It's incredible to me that those were still available to her. And he never locked his house? Sheesh.

 

[norest4thewicked]

I always say this about doctors. I don't care aout their bedside manner as long as they are competent. HOWEVER, there is some truth to the saying that "a jury is 12 people who decide which side has the best lawyer". For some reason, or lack of reason, jurors do allow themselves to be persuaded by the "attractiveness" of a lawyer. Heck, look at how we want to see the ME and other attractive folks on the stand!! I know that JM has a lot of experience. Jodi is a different breed. In many of the high profile cases JM has won, the defendant never took the stand. And I doubt he has ever seen the likes of a monster like Jodi. I just don't want to underestimate the ability of Jodi to get under JM's skin to the point that he turns even one juror. I think he had a strong finish on cross and I think it's just his style to be passionate and on the aggressive. I can take it, but I know a lot of people who are still incapable of believing that HA did this alone, or didn't have a good reason. Ugh, I hope they aren't on the jury.

Oh gosh! For a minute there I thought you were saying that Nurmi was more attractive than JM! :what: hahaha

 

[looneymama]

So I goggled court reporter typewriter and found what the keyboard looks like and the print out that is typed. crazy

:what:you just blew my mind.

but...how....:waitasec:

 

[Sustained]

Looked more so like she was demonstrating a lazy butterfly stroke.

Now this is a real linebacker pose ...

http://celebslists.com/2686-dick-butkus@imagedick-butkus-05.jpg.html