Discussion in 'Trials' started by KayElJay, Nov 15, 2019.
Don’t you mean the horse is already out of the barn?
We must get our colloquialisms correct.
Maybe they are SF's? Maybe she wears a denture(s)?
I couldn’t agree more! Facts all the way around. PF is a complete monster and he is proving that more and more each day.
Totally agree here. And so Now I'm going back to motive. At first I thought he wanted money...like insurance, the condo, out of child support, etc. And while I still think that's part of it, I'm really thinking now that he just wanted to do something like this. Regardless of whom, it would ave happened to some woman somehow. The timing and circumstance just made it KB. If she had left earlier it would have been someone else, but it would have happened.
To me, he really wanted to do something like this, get $, get rid of have to pay any $, and have some other female handle it all for him and take the fall. The only thing I"m really surprised about is, at least to me, seeing that he found he really enjoyed it..the adrenaline rush...and he acknowledge that he liked it. Just that he would have that is bad...a true psychopath was born then.
CB needs to add SF to the civil suit, take that franch and scrape it clean off the planet.
I'm getting the impression that they were not particularly close. As in she made it known she did not like him. His ego can't take that. Vengeful. I am hear her telling JM "I told you so".
That could also be taken to mean that he despised her, or that she had a lot of dirt on him, or that he was willing to pay a premium.
wait what letters about JMs wife/partner?
Could be. Maybe she had them pulled. Or the teeth are at the house because they belong to one of Sheila’s kids from when they were little.
This and I wonder how many jurors heard the messages in the letters and thought if he is going after witnesses, what would he do to a juror?
Don't know if this was ever answered...
You can watch Sam's live FB videos after. I usually watch them the next morning. All have been posted.
Sam Kraemer TV
ETA: so much trouble posting this morning...I give up!
Here you go... not sure what he means by the "hole in S to sell" ?
Letters to the prison buddy:
Top of Letter One
Flush when you're done
You know where to find
Krystal Jean Kenny Lee?
They all need to disappear unseen until at least November 22 after the trial.
Wendy is the cash cow. Joe has all kinds of **** to sell.
Pass a message to her or call.
Use a fake name that all the horses are taken care of?
Or have her tell me the elk hunt was successful?
Front of Letter 12 - sounded like the note said something like:
How gangster will you get?
I've got an idea.
Hole in S to sell?
But you'd have to kidnap and hide em until you're done.
South Florrisant, guy and chic.
55 to 60 years old.
Have cards shipped to hack and sell.
Front of Letter 16
Joe is bald on top, brown/gray hair on top, 5'10", 220
Wendy gray, brown hair, 5' 8"
Only thing is they can't show back up before or during trial
Joe Moore, Krystal Kenney, Michelle Stein, Chad Lee are all going to testify against me. Can you make them all disappear?
Wendy is a cash cow.
All of this is just between us right??? (3 question marks)
If you rob their place, the sky is the limit within reason.
I thought this was debunked early, but now that we know about code words, anyone want to wonder if "witch" was one of them after all?
As for the jailhouse letters, excellent tip for future criminals: PLEASE put everything, especially the sensitive stuff, in writing.
Defense might not have to authenticate PF's letters.
"PF, did you write these?"
I thought this, as well. I wonder if he thought that KB's family had a big farm, and she was a pilot making a lot of money. Over time, he realized that was not the case. He was actually having to help support KB with the baby. With that, she now wanted to work part time, without medical coverage. I think, she became of no use to PF, at that point. I've always thought this crime was motivated by money, not custody. He really doesn't care for his daughter. A person like PF only cares about one person, himself. Everyone else is a pawn, a means to an end, a "cash cow". Poor Kelsey, she didn't have a chance with this guy. Please let this jury convict him; so no other woman will end up like Kelsey because I believe he won't stop. JMO
He's been superb!
Sam's been our Main Man throughout.
Were it not for Sam Kraemer, we here would not have one septillionth of the information about the trial that we've gotten courtesy of Sam.
He's been the one reporter who's worked tirelessly to cover this case from its onset.
He's been the one reporter to provide the daily, detailed debriefs re: courtroom testimony since this trial began.
He's been the one reporter to sit there faithfully documenting what occurs in that courtroom, day after day, the fact that he took an entire Friday off to attend some wedding, notwithstanding.
We here owe Sam a debt of gratitude we can never repay, so here's what we can do to repay him:
@GoJacks can take some of the used gift cards MassGuy sent him and give them to Sam in court on Monday.
It's literally the least we can do for Sam after all he's done for us.
GoJacks, I know regifting is considered tacky, but so is giving people used gift cards in the first place, so it's okay.
With any luck, Taco Bell is Sam's favorite restaurant.
I’m sure you are right, but they couldn’t prove he didn’t write them at the time. Or were able to cite case law against their admission. IMO of course.
If they wanted to appeal, they would have to put it on record they objected to the ruling. They could request a DNA analysis and if it came back with no PF DNA they could have grounds for an appeal to be sent for review. That still doesn’t mean they would get an automatic appeal though. However, IMOO, the jail notes are the prosecutions weakest link to an appeal simply because of the timing. On the other hand, those notes were just the dessert, not the meal. The case was very strong without them.
My bad. I skipped a step.
"PF, did you write these notes?"
"I don't want to answer that out loud. But do you have a paper towel?"
Honestly writing out his hit list, including the key to his code, describing how to kill and how to conceal, how to distract with false texts it would be laughable, if it weren't so chilling.
Nature, nurture, he ain't right in the head. If he got kicked in the head, IMO, the hoof must still be in there.
I'm just so sad Kelsey got mixed up with the likes of him. She was a good person with so much to offer the world! As a woman, as a mother, as a pilot. Training Air Force cadets.
And then there's PF. Who seemed to feel entitled to other people's lifestyles. Who sought women and hated women.
I for one am glad he spelled out his intentions so clearly. He's a murderer and, given the chance, he's not done. Lock him up and throw away the prison.
MOO MOO MOO
I want to be respectful of your POV. But I don’t understand it. How is it that you’re still riding the same horse as back in Feb. How is it that all that testimony - and then the paper towel kill list - doesn’t sway you one iota?
“There is something about the whole plot that, for me, reeks of female scheming. And KK has an identifiable motive where PF's is unknown and only guessed about.
It makes no sense to me that KK was in a relationship with PF 15 years ago, has always carried a torch for him, hooked up with him again in 2016, the love of her life - then in 2018 he is now suddenly evil incarnate, may have killed before, is soliciting KK to commit murder for months, threatening her, threatening her children, and KK is blabbing all this to her BFF to spread the word that PF is going to murder KB - then KK goes to CO to help dispose of evidence.
It looks like KK was setting up PF for months.”
I am unclear as to who exactly was on PF’s hit list. I know KK, her ex-husband, her best friend, Agent Slater, JM, JM’s significant other, CB. Are there any others?
FRAZEE TRIAL DAY 10: Judge says if jury doesn't convict on 1st-degree murder, lesser charge is an option
The people the jail friend claims Frazee asked him to kill are as follows:
Agent Gregg Slater, CBI
Sydney Kenney, Krystyal's dad
Deddy McIntyre, Krystal's mom
Kolton Kenney, Krystal's brother
Kristi Kenney, Krystal's aunt
Joe Moore, Frazee's friend
Wendi Clark, Joe Moore's wife
Chad Lee, Krystal's ex husband
Michelle Stein, Krystal's friend
Cheryl Berreth, Kelsey's mother
Kendi Kenney, Krystal's brother