GUILTY LA - Jaren Lockhart, 22, New Orleans, 5 June 2012 - #5

[Agatha_C]

Can you imagine presenting the words of a guy who calls himself 'Joke' as evidence in a court of law?
His words are just words as there's no way to verify his claim - he doesn't back his words by using his real name.
Not to mention the mistakes contained within the article. For instance, they report that Speaks was in prison until 2005. That's untrue.
The comment was made by a detective from the Sheriff's department according to the author. Double trouble.
There once was a time when we could rely on the info given in the news.

My goal isn't to be argumentative or unfriendly. I'm trying hard to keep it real, uncover some facts and hopefully truths.
In order to do this, I have to push aside emotions and may sound cold hearted at times. Sorry.

Ummm, I was only sharing something I found. I wasnt claiming this was something important, just interesting. Sorry that you misunderstood that. Can you please show me where I said this was an important person that would make a great witness? Or maybe how sharing the comments on an article was meant to confuse the case?

It was simply something "I" found interesting and thought maybe someone else would too, clearly it wasnt you. Sorry if it confused you....

 

[bessie]

Hope i didnt ramble. Ill put more thought and orginize my next post a lil better

Not a bit. It was an excellent, well constructed post. :thumb:

 

[Lera213]

Thank You!!!! I have begun to feel more and more that way especially after her interview in that show and another thing that bothered me was her asking the friends they stayed with if they'd heard about Jaren. I think it was one of the first things she said. If you were feeling remorse and guilt that's the last thing I'd think you'd talk about.

But Lera, I am really leaning that way very quickly. So glad I'm not alone! MAS is beginning to look a little bit like a sociopath to me...

The more I think about MAS, she is bi-polar (rumored) my guess is she is jealous, she wants what a lot of dancers had. Her body type wasn't good enough for her to be a dancer, she wanted to be like them. The comment on the TV show of "You're my Bar Pet" (something like that) struck me as that bothered MAS. She looks at herself as not being good enough, to have what the other girls have and that was a MAN who loved them, doted on them. Addie, and Jaren!

You cannot fit everything into a neat common sense theory's because MAS has mental issues and uses drugs. Her thinking will not be like a normal person, it will be erratic.

 

[bessie]

Jumping in early, I still have 2 threads before caught up. Just learned about this yesterday and have been reading the threads since then.

Excuse me if this all has been touched on so far and I'm way off but my brain is going a mile a minute here.

First of all hats off to Eileen730 who first mentioned Addie Hall's case.

Second of all someone posted a question if Addie met up with TS when she was 14 years old. That is a good possibility because she was in Durham county, NC (1992) and Surry County is right next to Durham. TS was a sexual predator and who knows. I do not know if this was dis-proven or proven so far since I'm behind two threads.

Now MAS I think is a manipulator and a very Jealous person. I think she had some type of involvement in Addie's death whether that was seeing Zack after Addie kicked him out and MAS egged him on or even helped him. Don't know but I don't think she was just an innocent friend of Addie's either. I watched the TV show she was on before I read one word of this case here. I can tell you just from watching that show something was right. It was too clean, a murder, notes left around, and him committing suicide, it was too clean, to set up for my liking while watching the show. First I thought was, was there ever any hand writing analyses done on the suicide and journal entries?

MAS didn't know TS at the time, this is why I'm leaning towards MAS is the ring leader (so to speak) in Jaren's murder. I think she somehow got Zack and then TS to do her dirty work, the leg work the heavy lifting. They are all guilty but MOO she is the RING LEADER!

Her crying and poor me, is a front! That is how she gets what she wants. MOO

OK back to reading...and OH My My

Blessings to Jaren's family and Jaren is with the Lord.

I doubt the handwriting was analyzed because there was never any question that Zack committed suicide. Hotel security cameras captured him walking back and forth from the pool to the edge of the roof twice before he finally went over the edge.

The hotel security tape, described in an interview with police sources, shows him struggling to muscle up the courage. Up to the railing, then back. Up again, then back.
Just before 8:30 p.m., he leaped to his death, landing on the roof of the hotel parking garage below.

http://blog.nola.com/tpcrimearchive/2006/10/katrina_survivalists_descent_i.html


It's my personal view that Addie and MAS were not as close as MAS portrays in the film. Her name does not come up in any of the numerous blogs and articles written immediately after the murder/suicide, nor is she mentioned in Ethan Brown's book Shake the Devil Off. Many other friends and associates have been quoted, but MAS' name didn't come into the picture until a year or so ago when the television show was filmed. So, IMO, what we heard from MAS in the Final Witness episode was a fabrication of her own design.

Secondly, all of the evidence suggests that Zack acted alone and of his own volition. He spent two weeks living it up while Addie's charred remains rotted in their apartment. Many people remember seeing him out and about in the Quarter throwing money around and partying endlessly. It's been said that he enjoyed the company of various strippers during that time, but I've never heard that he was seen in the company of any particular woman. If MAS was on the scene with Addie and Zack, now that she's become notorious because of Jaren's murder, wouldn't someone remember her and have spoken out by now?

What happened back in 2006 was about two people, one ill-fated couple and no one else, IMO. Many factors came together to create the Zack and Addie tragedy, temperament, cocaine, alcohol, PTSD, even low self esteem, and finally a conflict over an apartment. A power play on Addie's part is what it was, actually. Sneaky and vindictive, and it enraged Zack, and sent him into a homicidal frenzy. IMO.

But on Oct. 5, during a dispute over which of their names would appear on the lease, Hall told Watermeier she intended to kick Bowen out of the apartment, after finding out that he had cheated on her, Watermeier said.

Bowen did not take the news well, Watermeier said.
"He said, 'Did you just let her sign a lease alone? Because I'm screwed. I'm totally messed up now. She's trying to kick me out of our apartment,' " Watermeier said.

http://blog.nola.com/tpcrimearchive/2006/10/boyfriend_cut_up_corpse_cooked.html

I don't know enough about the circumstances surrounding Jaren's death yet to form an opinion about MAS' role in the murder. We know she was there, and we know she offered money to one or two other dancers prior to leaving the club with Jaren. Without question, she's involved. But how much did she know beforehand? What did she think was going to happen that night? Was it a situation that spiraled out of control? I'm not defending MAS, but TS is a seasoned criminal with a long history of deceit. I might change my mind later if we ever learn more details, but right now, I don't see him as someone who can be manipulated.

 

[gngr~snap]

I doubt the handwriting was analyzed because there was never any question that Zack committed suicide. Hotel security cameras captured him walking back and forth from the pool to the edge of the roof twice before he finally went over the edge.

http://blog.nola.com/tpcrimearchive/2006/10/katrina_survivalists_descent_i.html


It's my personal view that Addie and MAS were not as close as MAS portrays in the film. Her name does not come up in any of the numerous blogs and articles written immediately after the murder/suicide, nor is she mentioned in Ethan Brown's book Shake the Devil Off. Many other friends and associates have been quoted, but MAS' name didn't come into the picture until a year or so ago when the television show was filmed. So, IMO, what we heard from MAS in the Final Witness episode was a fabrication of her own design.

Secondly, all of the evidence suggests that Zack acted alone and of his own volition. He spent two weeks living it up while Addie's charred remains rotted in their apartment. Many people remember seeing him out and about in the Quarter throwing money around and partying endlessly. It's been said that he enjoyed the company of various strippers during that time, but I've never heard that he was seen in the company of any particular woman. If MAS was on the scene with Addie and Zack, now that she's become notorious because of Jaren's murder, wouldn't someone remember her and have spoken out by now?

What happened back in 2006 was about two people, one ill-fated couple and no one else, IMO. Many factors came together to create the Zack and Addie tragedy, temperament, cocaine, alcohol, PTSD, even low self esteem, and finally a conflict over an apartment. A power play on Addie's part is what it was, actually. Sneaky and vindictive, and it enraged Zack, and sent him into a homicidal frenzy. IMO.

http://blog.nola.com/tpcrimearchive/2006/10/boyfriend_cut_up_corpse_cooked.html

I don't know enough about the circumstances surrounding Jaren's death yet to form an opinion about MAS' role in the murder. We know she was there, and we know she offered money to one or two other dancers prior to leaving the club with Jaren. Without question, she's involved. But how much did she know beforehand? What did she think was going to happen that night? Was it a situation that spiraled out of control? I'm not defending MAS, but TS is a seasoned criminal with a long history of deceit. I might change my mind later if we ever learn more details, but right now, I don't see him as someone who can be manipulated.

Is he someone that knew her past and might have used it to make her "look" like the "psycho chick" that dreamed all of it up on her own?

See I can't decide!!! IMO it could go both ways~ maybe just two birds of a feather?

I am still having a hard time not believing TS knew of AH... prior to her death... EVEN THOUGH HE WAS IN JAIL AT THE TIME!
TS seeking out MAS seems "possible" but in no way excuses her...

AT ANY RATE... MAS KNEW AH AND JL how well or how close? :dunno: they both died and were dismembered and THAT I find beyond comprehension! There IS A LINK OF THE CHAIN SOMEWHERE! imho...:seeya:

 

[Nolaallycat]

There is no doubt in my mind that MAS had nothing to do with AH's murder. I think MAS's "close friendship" with AH and ZB was nothing more than an exaggerated flight of fancy. My impression of AH after reading "Shake the Devil Off" was that she wasn't really a girl's girl. She seemed to surround herself with men...having them as roommates, drinking and drugging buddies etc. Towards the end, Addie knew that Zack was cheating on her with another man and wasn't afraid to let others (that knew them both) know. There is ZERO mention of MAS in the book. I think MAS looked up to AH when they worked together and wanted to be like her and created a little fantasy in her head that they were great friends. IMO, the only connection between the AH case and Jaren's is that MAS was on the outskirts of both of their lives and the recollection of Addie's dismemberment stood out in her mind as a "good way" to get rid JL's body. Of course things didn't go according to plan.

In New Orleans everyone knows someone who's friends with somebody else. It's a classic case of six degrees of separation in this city. Actually it's more like two degrees of separation here. Especially in the French Quarter.

 

[stormsurge]

*SNIP*
As for MAS's "wedding". i figured it was some sham things like that. There is even a French Quarter quickie wedding venue where you walk in and get married. I always wondered how that worked because Louisiana law has the following requirements:

Either bride or groom or both must apply in person for the license at the courthouse.

You will need to bring a picture ID and a copy of your birth certificate to the Parish clerk’s office. The two other pieces of information you will need to have on hand is the bride and grooms parents’ names (including maiden and middle names) and their state of birth. You will also need to know both the bride and grooms SSN.

If either party is divorced, he/she must present a certified copy of the final divorce decree.

Each party must have proof of his/her social security number. Examples: Social Security Card, Drivers License with social security number on it, Military ID, W2.

There is a 72-hour waiting period between the time of issuance of the license and the ceremony.

At least 10 days after the wedding one party must bring in their white copy to be recorded and sealed.

So I'm not sure how the quickie wedding chapel works within those regulations. TAS was married before and would need his divorce decree and would have had to declare his full name which I am sure he would not do on paperwork in a court since he was on the run.

*SNIP*

I got married at that chapel this year. The place and people are very nice and they have been very active in lobbying for marriage license and wedding law. They are also very nice if you are on a tight budget.

A couple of things:

1) MAS may not have had a clue she needed a license.
2) From my experience, the only thing both parties have to be present for is the wedding itself for it to be legal. I did almost all the paperwork filing for our wedding myself. The now-wife never had to step foot in a govt building.
3) If TS was using decent fake docs, it wouldnt have been too hard to get a license. Its not like they do background checks to see if you can get married. Its just not legal if something comes up and they find out it was uncompleted incorrectly.
4) I dont think its past TS to flat out lie to her that the marriage was legal. I dont think she would question him.

 

[gngr~snap]

I got married at that chapel this year. The place and people are very nice and they have been very active in lobbying for marriage license and wedding law. They are also very nice if you are on a tight budget.

A couple of things:

1) MAS may not have had a clue she needed a license.
2) From my experience, the only thing both parties have to be present for is the wedding itself for it to be legal. I did almost all the paperwork filing for our wedding myself. The now-wife never had to step foot in a govt building.
3) If TS was using decent fake docs, it wouldnt have been too hard to get a license. Its not like they do background checks to see if you can get married. Its just not legal if something comes up and they find out it was uncompleted incorrectly.
4) I dont think its past TS to flat out lie to her that the marriage was legal. I dont think she would question him.

~bbm
Forgive me if this has been brought up already... I have tried to follow closely.

"Sanchez said she and Speaks were married earlier this year by a minister who also works as a doorman in Bourbon's 300 block."

"Cops who interviewed her said she was miffed when she later learned she wasn't legally married.":jail:

So this "doorman" was also a minister??? The man married Sanchez and Speaks on the same block where JL worked...

From the article it does sound like the "minister/doorman" may indeed have been "legit" but Speaks was using an "alias"?
***see below...
I believe I read when police caught them she was "reportedly" not giving Speaks real name??? MAYBE she never knew it in the first place???

http://www.abc26.com/news/lo
cal/wgno-detectives-lockhart-murder-suspects-had-fake-bourbon-street-wedding-20120705,0,844884.story

***"Cops say before being arrested, suspect Terry Speaks used the alias "Leslie Rice"...Leslie Allen Rice"...

""Leslie Rice" also happens to be the name of an award-winning Australian artist, whose more famous works include paintings of decapitated and dismembered people.":what:~this is news to me~

...but that the sheriff's office learned Speaks stole the name from someone he knew in his home state of North Carolina to commit identity fraud.

heebie jeebies here!
"As for Sanchez's TV interview on her butchered friend in 2006"...

"We can't overlook these similarities as being a mere coincidence though it may be", Saucier said.

http://www.abc26.com/news/local/wgno-lesrice-070612,0,3483605.story

More than just a few "coincidences" here (specifically with "dismemberment being a common theme through out )

It honestly sounds like MAS didn't know and was never told Speaks real identity... (I'm NOT dismissing her involvement) could she have REALLY thought they were married??? ~ clearly Speaks had stolen the man's identity in NC! :dunno:

 

[stormsurge]

~bbm
Forgive me if this has been brought up already... I have tried to follow closely.

"Sanchez said she and Speaks were married earlier this year by a minister who also works as a doorman in Bourbon's 300 block."

"Cops who interviewed her said she was miffed when she later learned she wasn't legally married.":jail:

So this "doorman" was also a minister??? The man married Sanchez and Speaks on the same block where JL worked...

From the article it does sound like the "minister/doorman" may indeed have been "legit" but Speaks was using an "alias"?
***see below...
I believe I read when police caught them she was "reportedly" not giving Speaks real name??? MAYBE she never knew it in the first place???

http://www.abc26.com/news/lo
cal/wgno-detectives-lockhart-murder-suspects-had-fake-bourbon-street-wedding-20120705,0,844884.story

***"Cops say before being arrested, suspect Terry Speaks used the alias "Leslie Rice"...Leslie Allen Rice"...

""Leslie Rice" also happens to be the name of an award-winning Australian artist, whose more famous works include paintings of decapitated and dismembered people.":what:~this is news to me~

...but that the sheriff's office learned Speaks stole the name from someone he knew in his home state of North Carolina to commit identity fraud.

heebie jeebies here!
"As for Sanchez's TV interview on her butchered friend in 2006"...

"We can't overlook these similarities as being a mere coincidence though it may be", Saucier said.

http://www.abc26.com/news/local/wgno-lesrice-070612,0,3483605.story

More than just a few "coincidences" here (specifically with "dismemberment being a common theme through out )

It honestly sounds like MAS didn't know and was never told Speaks real identity... (I'm NOT dismissing her involvement) could she have REALLY thought they were married??? ~ clearly Speaks had stolen the man's identity in NC! :dunno:

I dont know about any of that. I know that I'm a licensed minister (you can be too! Takes 5 minutes online! And its FREE!!). You have to register to do weddings in the state, but I didnt check to see if the guy who did my wedding was registered. So, it could easily have been a legit religious wedding ceremony, just didnt punch the ticket legally for the state.

 

[akashana]

I think Bessie's assessment of the Zack-and-Addie tragedy is quite accurate, supported by eyewitness accounts, video footage and handwritten confessions. I don't think that MAS had a role at all, although I think it impacted her profoundly, as I imagine it did to anyone who knew either Zack or Addie, however tangentially. It was a horrific crime and stuck out even in a city with a skyrocketed murder rate. I do think it's possible that MAS, when presented with the grisly reality of a dead body needing to be disposed of, reached back into the recesses of her memory and remembered that Zack was able to dismember Addie, and possibly suggested same to TS.

 

[gngr~snap]

Usually I just lurk around Jaren's thread and keep quiet bc I have nothing of value to add really. But man it is quiet in here, especially today..dropping off some loves for Jaren..

:heartbeat: :heartbeat: I hope you haunt the hell out of the FBI and LE til they bring you and yours justice! :rocker:



Now where's Woe, Ladybug(lub?), and gngersnp to get this thread going??lease: I know there's many many more regular posters but my short term memory only lets me remember 3 at a time :floorlaugh: the rest of you are included too! Swapmama?! Justthefacts! BabyCat....or maybe it was mommacat LOL!

In all seriousness though, I want to thank each and every one of you that has kept Jarens thread going! Sleuth On!! eace:

:blushing:
I needed a pink fuzzy slipper day!

Who am I kidding??? I needed a mental health day!

I have not given up on JAREN!!!

 

[dontbringmedownbruce]

:blushing:
I needed a pink fuzzy slipper day!

<snipped>

Lol!! You take all the pink fuzzy slipper days and mental breaks you'd like! Y'all have done an excellent job sleuthing this case :rocker: I was just being a turd:blushing:

Keep up the great work ladies and gents!! :cheers:

 

[SwampMama]

I dont know about any of that. I know that I'm a licensed minister (you can be too! Takes 5 minutes online! And its FREE!!). You have to register to do weddings in the state, but I didnt check to see if the guy who did my wedding was registered. So, it could easily have been a legit religious wedding ceremony, just didnt punch the ticket legally for the state.

yep, i was gonna say that it is incredibly easy to get the credentials online to be able to marry people in Louisiana. We looked into it in reference to our eventual wedding. I am soooooo not into the big, fancy, frou frou wedding stuff, heck if the minister could come to our house and marry us in our pajamas, I'd be fine with that!

But you say you went to the chapel in the Quarter, we have considered that since it would be simple, fast and no frills needed. We have the complication of needing to provide proof of my divorce from my first husband and him to provide the death certif of his estranged wife so I was wondering how much crap that would involve. Any info you provide would be appreciated on the venue and how easy it was and any useful things to know.

Back on topic, I think MAS is an attention seeking little liar who plays up her part in everything with Addie. But I firmly believe she was all in on killing Jaren. MAS listed the "SAW" series of torture flicks as her favorite movies on her FB page, TS took the alias of an artist who specialized in painting of mutilated people. That was their common interest which kept them together. I hope they enjoy frying together. I wish we still had ole Sparky the electric chair and I wish ole sparky had room for both of them at the same time.

 

[gngr~snap]

I think Bessie's assessment of the Zack-and-Addie tragedy is quite accurate, supported by eyewitness accounts, video footage and handwritten confessions. I don't think that MAS had a role at all, although I think it impacted her profoundly, as I imagine it did to anyone who knew either Zack or Addie, however tangentially. It was a horrific crime and stuck out even in a city with a skyrocketed murder rate. I do think it's possible that MAS, when presented with the grisly reality of a dead body needing to be disposed of, reached back into the recesses of her memory and remembered that Zack was able to dismember Addie, and possibly suggested same to TS.

~BBM

I have mot read "Shake Off the Devil"... I NEED TO!

From the Final Witness episode it sounded like it took ZB quite some time to dismember Addie... (assuming he did it alone, as I believe he did)...

If JL's death was not pre-planned where would they have gotten the "tools" to do the work? That was some quick work! (almost "professional") as her body turned up so quickly! :waitasec: Maybe he was a hunter or a butcher at some point and had prior knowledge :dunno:
and MAYBE all it takes is a REALLY sharp knife...I'm sure the ME knows if he had "experience" or if this was perhaps his first time, just by examining the body....
I really do believe that the L. Rice "artist" from Australia can be dismissed just yet.
(* I hope they have compared this person's "ART" to the condition of Jaren's body!!!)
side note...
http://www.peekyou.com/usa/leslie_rice

There are over 400 L***** Rice's in the USA... 57 in North Carolina, 7 in Louisiana and 38 here in Georgia.... (of course both sexes are included... some spelled differently )
BUT if TS was a fan of the artist... It sure wasn't hard to find someone with the same name near by... and "assume" his identity (or claim that's what he did)

wasn't something else said about a book? I think this was a rumor related ti HM but HOW ODD the police mention the man/artist! ~ wonder if he wrote any books???
moo

 

[MrsBungi]

Sorry I haven't been here lately!!! Have been SO busy....my son had fever for a few days so I took him to the Dr and found out he had walking pneumonia! But all is good!!

I have not given up....I think about Jaren all the time. I'm constantly catching myself praying for her and her family. The current page of this forum stays on my phone at all times! Even if I don't have time to log in! This is far from over and I will be here til the end!

Okay not sure if it has been posted yet but TS is in NC here's the link.......
https://www.vinelink.com/vinelink/d...34003&agency=69&id=222643&searchType=offender

Check out the pic.....did he cut his hair or is this an older pic that they are using?

 

[Vann]

I think Bessie's assessment of the Zack-and-Addie tragedy is quite accurate, supported by eyewitness accounts, video footage and handwritten confessions. I don't think that MAS had a role at all, although I think it impacted her profoundly, as I imagine it did to anyone who knew either Zack or Addie, however tangentially. It was a horrific crime and stuck out even in a city with a skyrocketed murder rate. I do think it's possible that MAS, when presented with the grisly reality of a dead body needing to be disposed of, reached back into the recesses of her memory and remembered that Zack was able to dismember Addie, and possibly suggested same to TS.

I agree. I believe the stab to the chest was what killed JL and the panic to get rid of her body came from the seed planted in her brain from AH' case.
It's the only scenereo that makes any real sense so far.
The real mystery still is what happened that night.
What was promised to JL? Where did they go? What went wrong for JL to lose her life? Was it premeditated or did things simply get out of control?
I so hope this will all come out.

 

[MrsBungi]

One more thing, while I have been out I did read the book and watched final witness. In the book ZB stayed with a stripped for two days in Metarie, Im wondering who this lady was, as far as MAS this broad is way out there! I'm starting to believe that it was premeditated 'cause its just too many coincidences revolving around these two! IMO Does LE know what these two were doing a few days prior to JL disappearance!

 

[MyNikki]

Interesting - more people are commenting on this blog since the Final Witness show aired on Wednesday.

http://mylifeofcrime.wordpress.com/2006/10/20/adriane-addie-hall-murder-100506/

<modsnip>

So....her remains were claimed in 2006? anyone have a date? and was TCS in jail at the time? If so that would positively rule him out as somehow being her older brother.

Did you see the comment made by a Margaret in 2010? I am almost positive it is MAS.

 

[Vann]

I too think MAS is an attention getter in her own weird way. I can just picture her telling TS all about how she's gonna be famous because of the final witness show. How she knew zack and Addie and telling him every single detail about the case.
When I watched her on final witness it seemed like she glorified the so called love story along with exaggerating the friendship she had with them. Can you imagine what else she made up that was cut out of the show and what she made up when telling TS. They are both proven liars.
The similarities between ZB and AH vs MAS and TS are eerie in the sense that all four were and are disturbed people. A mind like that are the same ones that commit what the rest of us consider unspeakable horrific crimes.
Sounds like MAS got what she wanted alright.......to be famous or should I say infamous.

 

[MyNikki]

Does anyone know AH brothers age? I thought I had read him and TS were the same age an I'm pretty sure I know his name now and wanted to look up something.