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I agree. Chief Beckner has stated that the head blow came 45 minutes to 2 hours before the strangulation with cord. Why an intruder would wait this long is beyond me. Distraught parents trying to figure out what to do, on the other hand, makes sense. JMO.

45 minutes – 2 hours is Beckner’s and I suppose Kolar’s opinion and not fact. Yes, it is based on something that one expert or other said, or is at least their interpretation as to what one expert or other said; but, we know that there was not a consensus of expert opinion on this, and we know that expert opinion’s allow for the controversy over which came first, head blow, or asphyxiation, to continue.

Still, if IDI, and if the head blow came first (I see no reason to doubt this) and if it was also the killer’s first act upon encountering his victim, then he would have still had to write the ransom note, move the victim to the basement, tie her, pull down her clothes, assault her, rearrange the clothes, construct the garrote, etc. So, some period of time would have passed.
...

AK
 
I agree. Chief Beckner has stated that the head blow came 45 minutes to 2 hours before the strangulation with cord. Why an intruder would wait this long is beyond me. Distraught parents trying to figure out what to do, on the other hand, makes sense. JMO.

I agree.

In her retirement interview, the author of the report about the timing between the head blow and strangulation disclosed she presented her findings to the Colorado GJ. If she developed her opinions in the same protocol as she did in other crimes, she would have reviewed the autopsy report with photos, received the formalin fixed brain from the ME and written her report after doing her autopsy.

This doesn’t mean that another expert wouldn’t have challenged her in a court of law. Unfortunately, we know a court challenge is as likely as seeing, well, something like this - pigsfly.gif
 
45 minutes – 2 hours is Beckner’s and I suppose Kolar’s opinion and not fact. Yes, it is based on something that one expert or other said, or is at least their interpretation as to what one expert or other said; but, we know that there was not a consensus of expert opinion on this, and we know that expert opinion’s allow for the controversy over which came first, head blow, or asphyxiation, to continue.

Still, if IDI, and if the head blow came first (I see no reason to doubt this) and if it was also the killer’s first act upon encountering his victim, then he would have still had to write the ransom note, move the victim to the basement, tie her, pull down her clothes, assault her, rearrange the clothes, construct the garrote, etc. So, some period of time would have passed.
...

AK

You make good points, but why wouldn't the intruder take her out of the home if she had been unconscious for that long period of time? Also, I thought it was in general agreement that the ransom note, if IDI, was written before the Ramseys came home from the White's. Do you think the intruder would've written a note after hitting JBR in the head as hard as they did?
 
You make good points, but why wouldn't the intruder take her out of the home if she had been unconscious for that long period of time? Also, I thought it was in general agreement that the ransom note, if IDI, was written before the Ramseys came home from the White's. Do you think the intruder would've written a note after hitting JBR in the head as hard as they did?

OliviaG1996,
oops, pardon me, surely you mean why bother with the ransom note if you have just asphyxiated JonBenet?

Then what do you tell your Foreign Faction associates once they discover JonBenet is dead, they have no body to ransom, and one of their own is a child sex offender?

IDI has no evidence, no suspects, and no coherent theory, just what is this IDI thing all about?

.
 
OliviaG1996,
oops, pardon me, surely you mean why bother with the ransom note if you have just asphyxiated JonBenet?

Anti-K theorized that if the head blow did indeed come before the strangulation, and if IDI, then perhaps the intruder wrote the ransom note, constructed the garrote, etc. before ultimately killing JBR with the cord, and that this could be the reason for the big time gap between the head injury and the strangulation. That's what I was responding to.

Then what do you tell your Foreign Faction associates once they discover JonBenet is dead, they have no body to ransom, and one of their own is a child sex offender?

"Where's the kid?" "Yeah, about that..."
 
I agree.

In her retirement interview, the author of the report about the timing between the head blow and strangulation disclosed she presented her findings to the Colorado GJ. If she developed her opinions in the same protocol as she did in other crimes, she would have reviewed the autopsy report with photos, received the formalin fixed brain from the ME and written her report after doing her autopsy.

This doesn’t mean that another expert wouldn’t have challenged her in a court of law. Unfortunately, we know a court challenge is as likely as seeing, well, something like this - View attachment 80111

I would like to read that “retirement interview.” Who is the person that you’re referring to? Is this Dr Rorke who Kolar uses in his book? Because as I remember it, what Rorke said as reported by Kolar is not supported by what we see in the autopsy report.
...

AK
 
You make good points, but why wouldn't the intruder take her out of the home if she had been unconscious for that long period of time? Also, I thought it was in general agreement that the ransom note, if IDI, was written before the Ramseys came home from the White's. Do you think the intruder would've written a note after hitting JBR in the head as hard as they did?

IMO, if IDI, the killer never intended to remove his victim from the house. He intended from the very beginning to kill her in the house and to hide her in the house.

IDI opinions vary on when the note was written. Some think it was written in the house while the Ramseys were at the White’s but not everyone thinks that the killer entered so early. Some think that he entered after the Ramseys had gone to bed. And, any time between the two extremes.

Some think the note was written in advance, off-site and then copied into the notepad once in the house. Some think that the notepad may have been “stolen” on an earlier day, the note written off-site and then returned with the notepad on the night of the crime. Etc and so forth.

If there is a commonality than I suppose it would be that almost no IDI think that the note was written after the murder. But, there are even some who believe that that happened.

IMO, if IDI, the note was written before the killer encountered his victim.
...

AK
 
45 minutes – 2 hours is Beckner’s and I suppose Kolar’s opinion and not fact. Yes, it is based on something that one expert or other said, or is at least their interpretation as to what one expert or other said; but, we know that there was not a consensus of expert opinion on this, and we know that expert opinion’s allow for the controversy over which came first, head blow, or asphyxiation, to continue.

How big would your "consensus" have to be, Anti-K? I can think of five: Werner Spitz, Tom Henry, Henry Lee, Ronald Wright and Kerry Brega. (There's a sixth--the one Kolar mentioned, but I'm not as good with names as I used to be.) It wasn't just someone's "opinion."

Still, if IDI, and if the head blow came first (I see no reason to doubt this) and if it was also the killer’s first act upon encountering his victim, then he would have still had to write the ransom note, move the victim to the basement, tie her, pull down her clothes, assault her, rearrange the clothes, construct the garrote, etc. So, some period of time would have passed.

But WHY? I'd just get the hell out.
 
I would like to read that “retirement interview.” Who is the person that you’re referring to? Is this Dr Rorke who Kolar uses in his book? Because as I remember it, what Rorke said as reported by Kolar is not supported by what we see in the autopsy report.
...

AK

It was only a one sentence comment in a newspaper which mentioned that Rorke testified during the GJ.

Before the GJ when ME Meyer did his autopsy, he was said to be keeping a side-record of notes, because he believed he would be called to testify in court. It’s been my thought that the BPD also felt this would reach court, and they were engaging experts to review her injuries. It’s only my opinion that because of lawsuits and especially in a high-profile case, a forensic neuropathologist would not provide a report or testify at a GJ without following a standard protocol of doing a brain autopsy.

As far as her analysis being different from Meyer’s, it’s my understanding that Meyer was not a forensic neuropathologist. That’s a very specialized field within forensic science. (OT, but relevant, Meyer also sent off baby Jason Midyette’s brain to a forensic neuropathologist.)

I'm only pointing out here that it was likely a more formally developed report and, of course, one which we'll never see tested in court. We all have a variety of opinions about some of the experts who were engaged – Spitz, Lee, etc.
 
It was only a one sentence comment in a newspaper which mentioned that Rorke testified during the GJ.

Before the GJ when ME Meyer did his autopsy, he was said to be keeping a side-record of notes, because he believed he would be called to testify in court. It’s been my thought that the BPD also felt this would reach court, and they were engaging experts to review her injuries. It’s only my opinion that because of lawsuits and especially in a high-profile case, a forensic neuropathologist would not provide a report or testify at a GJ without following a standard protocol of doing a brain autopsy.

As far as her analysis being different from Meyer’s, it’s my understanding that Meyer was not a forensic neuropathologist. That’s a very specialized field within forensic science. (OT, but relevant, Meyer also sent off baby Jason Midyette’s brain to a forensic neuropathologist.)

I'm only pointing out here that it was likely a more formally developed report and, of course, one which we'll never see tested in court. We all have a variety of opinions about some of the experts who were engaged – Spitz, Lee, etc.

I’m never really certain to what degree the effects of the asphyxiation on the head blow injury was considered when some of these experts came to their conclusions. I don’t even know if this sort of thing is common enough for any meaningful data, etc to have accumulated. Maybe. But, I don’t know.

My point being that I have some concern that the effects of the asphyxiation on the head blow injury might not have been properly considered.

That being said, since I’ve been going on so-IMO lately (:)), I might as well add that I have NO opinion on how much time passed between one and the other. There’s a range of time and I think one end of it is as full of possibilities as is the other.
...

AK
 
It was only a one sentence comment in a newspaper which mentioned that Rorke testified during the GJ.

Before the GJ when ME Meyer did his autopsy, he was said to be keeping a side-record of notes, because he believed he would be called to testify in court. It’s been my thought that the BPD also felt this would reach court, and they were engaging experts to review her injuries. It’s only my opinion that because of lawsuits and especially in a high-profile case, a forensic neuropathologist would not provide a report or testify at a GJ without following a standard protocol of doing a brain autopsy.

As far as her analysis being different from Meyer’s, it’s my understanding that Meyer was not a forensic neuropathologist. That’s a very specialized field within forensic science. (OT, but relevant, Meyer also sent off baby Jason Midyette’s brain to a forensic neuropathologist.)

I'm only pointing out here that it was likely a more formally developed report and, of course, one which we'll never see tested in court. We all have a variety of opinions about some of the experts who were engaged – Spitz, Lee, etc.


Please questfortrue - if you have a link for that one sentence comment in a newspaper mentioning Rorke testifying during the GJ could you post it here. Or if you don't have a link can you please post whatever further information you do have. Thanks
 
This is just as silly as the stun gun.

There has never been even the slightest bit of evidence that anyone other than Patsy wrote the notes. Leaps and bounds of unrelated conjecture is not how a detective works.

For instance Fleet White pulls, or yanks, the door to the small wine room and looks in without flipping the light switch on and sees nothing. One hour and 8 minuets later John Ramsey pulls, or yanks, the door to the small wine room and looks in without turning on the light switch and begins screaming.

Now how can that be? After agreeing to this event you can start to manufacture conjecture about what happened because it leads from facts-not supposition.

The whole note thing is irrelevant without evidence that someone else wrote it-and of course there is none.
 
Please questfortrue - if you have a link for that one sentence comment in a newspaper mentioning Rorke testifying during the GJ could you post it here. Or if you don't have a link can you please post whatever further information you do have. Thanks

I know this was not addressed to me, and I'm sorry for interjecting, but here it is (BBM):

After 50 years studying children's brains, she's on to new frontiers

<SNIPPED>

Rorke-Adams leaves a legacy of important findings on the development of the infant brain, the origin and classification of childhood brain tumors, shaken-baby syndrome, and central nervous system disorders unique to children.

All of this while serving as a part-time medical examiner for the City of Philadelphia, testifying before the grand jury in the JonBenet Ramsey case, taking care of samples of Albert Einstein's brain, and teaching medical students. In addition, she was the first female president of PGH's medical staff and the president of the medical staff at Children's.

<SNIPPED>
 
(rsbm)
All of this while serving as a part-time medical examiner for the City of Philadelphia, testifying before the grand jury in the JonBenet Ramsey case, taking care of samples of Albert Einstein's brain, and teaching medical students. In addition, she was the first female president of PGH's medical staff and the president of the medical staff at Children's.
A few thoughts on this:

Dr. Lucy ( I’ll refer to her as that, not out of disrespect, but because it’s so much easier to write than Rorke-Adams) is not mentioned in any of the early books or articles (or even the Bonita Papers) on the investigation. TMK, it wasn’t until she was mentioned by Kolar in FF that her name was known to the general public. What was so startling when it was published was her idea that there may have been as much as 45 minutes to two hours between the head blow and the strangulation. Until then, most estimates of the difference in time were so small as to even cast doubt on which injury might have come first. There are still people today who contend that the head blow must have come after the strangulation -- usually basing their opinion on the misconception that there was too little blood in the skull to account for a head blow to a living person. That subject has been debated at length in other threads and it’s not my intent to reopen that discussion here. But I can’t help but question exactly when Dr. Lucy was consulted -- and by whom.

Kolar did little to no investigation himself. He was hired by the DA’s office (after Lacy’s having taken it away from the BPD) to review the investigation that had been done and see if he could find something that had been missed by other investigators. And that he did! (But it just wasn’t what Lacy wanted to hear.) So I doubt it was he who initially contacted Dr. Lucy. If she wasn’t contacted early on by BPD investigators (since it was never previously reported), and she wasn’t contacted by Kolar, that kind of suggests that she was indeed contacted specifically by the one of the investigators assigned to the RGJ -- or that she had been consulted (as suggested above by questfortrue) by Dr. Meyer. If either of those is the case, what information and evidence was she provided (brain sections, histological slides, etc.) to make her determinations; and did she write a report that was presented to the RGJ (or Meyer), or did she actually testify in person allowing the Jurors and Prosecutor to ask questions? Did she only see photos of the brain stem which she supposedly concluded was coned enough (tonsillar herniation) to support that long time frame (a difficult assessment even while personally examining it, and something that was not mentioned by Dr. Meyer in the AR)? Further, was Kolar able to speak with her, or did he simply read the report she would have written? I still have doubts about that long time frame and, especially because of his ambiguity in answering questions about that time frame, I wonder if that might have been Kolar’s interpretation of Dr. Lucy’s opinion.

I’ll add that I agree with AK here about questioning whether these “experts” take into consideration the synergy of different contributing factors in forming their opinions. I don’t think it’s such a simple matter as the amount of blood, the amount of cerebral edema, the number of petechiae, etc. when more than one injury is affecting the same area of the body.

All in all, I guess I still have more questions than answers.
 
BBM
This is just as silly as the stun gun.

There has never been even the slightest bit of evidence that anyone other than Patsy wrote the notes. Leaps and bounds of unrelated conjecture is not how a detective works.

For instance Fleet White pulls, or yanks, the door to the small wine room and looks in without flipping the light switch on and sees nothing. One hour and 8 minuets later John Ramsey pulls, or yanks, the door to the small wine room and looks in without turning on the light switch and begins screaming.

Now how can that be? After agreeing to this event you can start to manufacture conjecture about what happened because it leads from facts-not supposition.

The whole note thing is irrelevant without evidence that someone else wrote it-and of course there is none.

The experts hired by BPD, the experts hired by the DA&#8217;s office and, yes, of course, the experts hired by the Ramseys did not identify Mrs Ramsey, or anyone, as the ransom note author. The opinion of these experts as presented to the Court (Carnes) seems to have been that Mrs Ramsey probably did not write the note. If the evidence is that Mrs Ramsey did not write the note, than it must also be that someone else wrote the note. Another Ramsey, or an intruder.
...

AK
 
(rsbm) A few thoughts on this:

Dr. Lucy ( I&#8217;ll refer to her as that, not out of disrespect, but because it&#8217;s so much easier to write than Rorke-Adams) is not mentioned in any of the early books or articles (or even the Bonita Papers) on the investigation. TMK, it wasn&#8217;t until she was mentioned by Kolar in FF that her name was known to the general public. What was so startling when it was published was her idea that there may have been as much as 45 minutes to two hours between the head blow and the strangulation. Until then, most estimates of the difference in time were so small as to even cast doubt on which injury might have come first. There are still people today who contend that the head blow must have come after the strangulation -- usually basing their opinion on the misconception that there was too little blood in the skull to account for a head blow to a living person. That subject has been debated at length in other threads and it&#8217;s not my intent to reopen that discussion here. But I can&#8217;t help but question exactly when Dr. Lucy was consulted -- and by whom.

Kolar did little to no investigation himself. He was hired by the DA&#8217;s office (after Lacy&#8217;s having taken it away from the BPD) to review the investigation that had been done and see if he could find something that had been missed by other investigators. And that he did! (But it just wasn&#8217;t what Lacy wanted to hear.) So I doubt it was he who initially contacted Dr. Lucy. If she wasn&#8217;t contacted early on by BPD investigators (since it was never previously reported), and she wasn&#8217;t contacted by Kolar, that kind of suggests that she was indeed contacted specifically by the one of the investigators assigned to the RGJ -- or that she had been consulted (as suggested above by questfortrue) by Dr. Meyer. If either of those is the case, what information and evidence was she provided (brain sections, histological slides, etc.) to make her determinations; and did she write a report that was presented to the RGJ (or Meyer), or did she actually testify in person allowing the Jurors and Prosecutor to ask questions? Did she only see photos of the brain stem which she supposedly concluded was coned enough (tonsillar herniation) to support that long time frame (a difficult assessment even while personally examining it, and something that was not mentioned by Dr. Meyer in the AR)? Further, was Kolar able to speak with her, or did he simply read the report she would have written? I still have doubts about that long time frame and, especially because of his ambiguity in answering questions about that time frame, I wonder if that might have been Kolar&#8217;s interpretation of Dr. Lucy&#8217;s opinion.

I&#8217;ll add that I agree with AK here about questioning whether these &#8220;experts&#8221; take into consideration the synergy of different contributing factors in forming their opinions. I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s such a simple matter as the amount of blood, the amount of cerebral edema, the number of petechiae, etc. when more than one injury is affecting the same area of the body.

All in all, I guess I still have more questions than answers.

I&#8217;m not sure if I recall this exactly, but as I remember it the question about &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar&#8221; was that her description of the head blow seemed a description of a generic head blow &#8211; usually this is the result.

For instance, &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar,&#8221; talked about the brain swelling such that part of it was being pushed through the foramen magnum. Maybe this is what usually happens but it didn&#8217;t happen here. At least not from what we see in the AR.

For some, this raises the question, was Rorke speaking in general, or specifically; if specifically, then why does she &#8220;as reported by Kolar&#8221; read as if she is talking in general?

If she is talking in general, than &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar&#8221; does not seem to be taking the asphyxiation into account. The asphyxiation is why jbr&#8217;s injuries are not as described by &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar.&#8221; The asphyxiation prevented the injuries from progressing until becoming, as &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar&#8221; described them. IOWS, once taken into account, the asphyxiation could shorten the time&#8211;frame.

Maybe.

I don&#8217;t know.
...

AK
 
I know this was not addressed to me, and I'm sorry for interjecting, but here it is (BBM):

Thanks for your reply Olivia. This whole business about the evidence of Dr Rorke is very strange. The first time I had ever heard of her involvement in the case was from the 2012 Kolar book and until a couple of days ago I didn't realise she had ever testified at the grand jury, I thought the Boulder Police must have just consulted her. I looked up everything there was available on her back in 2012 and there was no mention on any of her sites then that she had appeared before the grand jury. She must have added that information since then.

I would really like to know the exact wording of her evidence because what Kolar says she said doesn't make much sense to me.
 
(rsbm) A few thoughts on this:

Dr. Lucy ( I&#8217;ll refer to her as that, not out of disrespect, but because it&#8217;s so much easier to write than Rorke-Adams) is not mentioned in any of the early books or articles (or even the Bonita Papers) on the investigation. TMK, it wasn&#8217;t until she was mentioned by Kolar in FF that her name was known to the general public. What was so startling when it was published was her idea that there may have been as much as 45 minutes to two hours between the head blow and the strangulation. Until then, most estimates of the difference in time were so small as to even cast doubt on which injury might have come first. There are still people today who contend that the head blow must have come after the strangulation -- usually basing their opinion on the misconception that there was too little blood in the skull to account for a head blow to a living person. That subject has been debated at length in other threads and it&#8217;s not my intent to reopen that discussion here. But I can&#8217;t help but question exactly when Dr. Lucy was consulted -- and by whom.

Kolar did little to no investigation himself. He was hired by the DA&#8217;s office (after Lacy&#8217;s having taken it away from the BPD) to review the investigation that had been done and see if he could find something that had been missed by other investigators. And that he did! (But it just wasn&#8217;t what Lacy wanted to hear.) So I doubt it was he who initially contacted Dr. Lucy. If she wasn&#8217;t contacted early on by BPD investigators (since it was never previously reported), and she wasn&#8217;t contacted by Kolar, that kind of suggests that she was indeed contacted specifically by the one of the investigators assigned to the RGJ -- or that she had been consulted (as suggested above by questfortrue) by Dr. Meyer. If either of those is the case, what information and evidence was she provided (brain sections, histological slides, etc.) to make her determinations; and did she write a report that was presented to the RGJ (or Meyer), or did she actually testify in person allowing the Jurors and Prosecutor to ask questions? Did she only see photos of the brain stem which she supposedly concluded was coned enough (tonsillar herniation) to support that long time frame (a difficult assessment even while personally examining it, and something that was not mentioned by Dr. Meyer in the AR)? Further, was Kolar able to speak with her, or did he simply read the report she would have written? I still have doubts about that long time frame and, especially because of his ambiguity in answering questions about that time frame, I wonder if that might have been Kolar&#8217;s interpretation of Dr. Lucy&#8217;s opinion.

I&#8217;ll add that I agree with AK here about questioning whether these &#8220;experts&#8221; take into consideration the synergy of different contributing factors in forming their opinions. I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s such a simple matter as the amount of blood, the amount of cerebral edema, the number of petechiae, etc. when more than one injury is affecting the same area of the body.

All in all, I guess I still have more questions than answers.

I have similar thoughts to you otg. I'd just like to add that, since Dr Rorke did actually testify before the grand jury, that she would have made it a point to study the autopsy material in detail. So she must have made sure she read the whole report and viewed all the photos and whatever opinion she gave would have been well considered.

I'm inclined to think it wasn't until the grand jury that she was consulted. I think if she had been consulted by the coroner back in the early days her name would have been mentioned in the media at the time along with all those other experts who were reported as having been consulted by the coroner.

But as for Kolar's reporting of what she stated, well... I don't really want to say what I think as I know no-one will agree with me so there wouldn't be any point
 
(rsbm) A few thoughts on this:

Dr. Lucy ( I&#8217;ll refer to her as that, not out of disrespect, but because it&#8217;s so much easier to write than Rorke-Adams) is not mentioned in any of the early books or articles (or even the Bonita Papers) on the investigation. TMK, it wasn&#8217;t until she was mentioned by Kolar in FF that her name was known to the general public. What was so startling when it was published was her idea that there may have been as much as 45 minutes to two hours between the head blow and the strangulation. Until then, most estimates of the difference in time were so small as to even cast doubt on which injury might have come first. There are still people today who contend that the head blow must have come after the strangulation -- usually basing their opinion on the misconception that there was too little blood in the skull to account for a head blow to a living person. That subject has been debated at length in other threads and it&#8217;s not my intent to reopen that discussion here. But I can&#8217;t help but question exactly when Dr. Lucy was consulted -- and by whom.

Kolar did little to no investigation himself. He was hired by the DA&#8217;s office (after Lacy&#8217;s having taken it away from the BPD) to review the investigation that had been done and see if he could find something that had been missed by other investigators. And that he did! (But it just wasn&#8217;t what Lacy wanted to hear.) So I doubt it was he who initially contacted Dr. Lucy. If she wasn&#8217;t contacted early on by BPD investigators (since it was never previously reported), and she wasn&#8217;t contacted by Kolar, that kind of suggests that she was indeed contacted specifically by the one of the investigators assigned to the RGJ -- or that she had been consulted (as suggested above by questfortrue) by Dr. Meyer. If either of those is the case, what information and evidence was she provided (brain sections, histological slides, etc.) to make her determinations; and did she write a report that was presented to the RGJ (or Meyer), or did she actually testify in person allowing the Jurors and Prosecutor to ask questions? Did she only see photos of the brain stem which she supposedly concluded was coned enough (tonsillar herniation) to support that long time frame (a difficult assessment even while personally examining it, and something that was not mentioned by Dr. Meyer in the AR)? Further, was Kolar able to speak with her, or did he simply read the report she would have written? I still have doubts about that long time frame and, especially because of his ambiguity in answering questions about that time frame, I wonder if that might have been Kolar&#8217;s interpretation of Dr. Lucy&#8217;s opinion.

I&#8217;ll add that I agree with AK here about questioning whether these &#8220;experts&#8221; take into consideration the synergy of different contributing factors in forming their opinions. I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s such a simple matter as the amount of blood, the amount of cerebral edema, the number of petechiae, etc. when more than one injury is affecting the same area of the body.

All in all, I guess I still have more questions than answers.

Also otg, it would appear Dr Rorke was not consulted by Meyer or that she had ever spoken with Kolar - I'm quoting a March 31 2013 post here by Brothermoon, which I hope is OK


"I sent a letter to Dr. Rorke asking for a comment on the disrepancy in Kolar's book pertaining to his quote of her contribution to the post mortem exam. She replied:

Good morning, Mr. Sxxxxx,
I have no idea who James Kolar is nor have I seen his book in which he mentions my involvement in the Jan Benet Ramsey postmortem examination. Hence I cannot answer your question re brain swelling and herniation as it did/did not apply to that case.
Sincerely,
Lucy B Rorke-Adams, MD

I sent this e-mail:

Pardom me, but I would also like to know if it was observed by you or any other pathologist that JonBenet's brain had swollen through the foramen magnum and do I have permission to post these e-mails on the Ramsey case forums and discuss them on talk radio? Thanks, Mark S.

She replied by e-mail:

I do not wish to discuss the Jon Benet Ramsey case with you. Please do not contact me further.
Lucy B Rorke-Adams, MD"





I don't know about you otg, but her reply to Brothermoon kind of suggests to me that she saw no evidence of 'brain swelling or herniation'
 
I&#8217;m not sure if I recall this exactly, but as I remember it the question about &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar&#8221; was that her description of the head blow seemed a description of a generic head blow &#8211; usually this is the result.

For instance, &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar,&#8221; talked about the brain swelling such that part of it was being pushed through the foramen magnum. Maybe this is what usually happens but it didn&#8217;t happen here. At least not from what we see in the AR.

For some, this raises the question, was Rorke speaking in general, or specifically; if specifically, then why does she &#8220;as reported by Kolar&#8221; read as if she is talking in general?

If she is talking in general, than &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar&#8221; does not seem to be taking the asphyxiation into account. The asphyxiation is why jbr&#8217;s injuries are not as described by &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar.&#8221; The asphyxiation prevented the injuries from progressing until becoming, as &#8220;Rorke, as reported by Kolar&#8221; described them. IOWS, once taken into account, the asphyxiation could shorten the time&#8211;frame.

Maybe.

I don&#8217;t know.
...

AK

Hi AK, you probably don't care one way or the other but if you are saying that Dr Rorke's description of the head blow seemed like a description of a generic head blow and not what happened in the case JonBenet's head blow, which was associated with a strangulation event then I agree with you, but thousands wouldn't.
 

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