Legal Questions for Our VERIFIED Lawyers #1

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Answered in part above. :)

I did want to add that sanctions in the form of excluding the offending party's evidence are, of course, possible. However, I think HHJP will not exclude any of the defense experts, because he has shown a clear desire not to let KC's attorneys' antics affect her substantive rights.

No one is going to get thrown off the case.

Oops somehow I missed the above answer! Thanks though...
 
Hi! :)

Question: Would an attorney conspire against his own partner in a case? To change the outcome from a trial to a plea?

My Theory: I believe Mason is doing this on two fronts. First, he appears to not be helping JB with the expert information that has been repeatedly requested of them and now compelled from them. Sanctions will likely happen against the Defense. It is my contention that Mason wants JB to be embarrassed in front of his client. Possibly removed from the situation to allow him to work a bit on KC in private.

On the second front, we have the slew of motions from the Defense. HHJP will rule on this on January 3rd as noted in the press. Likely, HHJP will also take on the sanctions on this day as well. We all agree that HHJP is likely to exclude or preclude some information about KC's lays and lies and other things. But obviously not all. Some of the information the Proscecution may not want to even use at trial and so they may not object. Other pieces of information that they believe is critical they will fight for. ICA will be sitting in the courtroom the entire time her "lovely" past is brought up. All 6 motions will be heard in the same day. This lass will get another taste of what a TRIAL is going to be like. I think Mason is hoping that KC might see JB being sanctioned and the bringing out of a lot of her dirty laundry as embarrassing and possibly not worth the risk of losing. Maybe Mason thinks that ICA will be primed for him to deal with?

I know that the Defense is always going to try and do all it can. But by all accounts, Mason and HHJP are good friends outside of work. They supposedly hang out and play golf with one another. Mason would have no benefit in getting chastized and delaying in getting documents out...because HHJP knows Mason is capable of creating and filing legible motions in a timely manner and complying with the Orders of the court...I can only surmise that this is all a strategy on Mason's part to get JB out of the picture so that he can work on KC without too many distractions and get a plea...

Otherwise, Mason is not very involved in the case at all...and doesn't care, is senile or a substance abuser...because I don't think any of those are true...or that he is a bad irresponsible attorney incapable of complying with an Order of the Court, it has to be that he is trying to kick JB to the curb, albeit with his good friend, HHJP's help. JMO. Is this logical? Make sense at all?
 
Hi! :)

Question: Would an attorney conspire against his own partner in a case? To change the outcome from a trial to a plea?

My Theory: I believe Mason is doing this on two fronts. First, he appears to not be helping JB with the expert information that has been repeatedly requested of them and now compelled from them. Sanctions will likely happen against the Defense. It is my contention that Mason wants JB to be embarrassed in front of his client. Possibly removed from the situation to allow him to work a bit on KC in private.

On the second front, we have the slew of motions from the Defense. HHJP will rule on this on January 3rd as noted in the press. Likely, HHJP will also take on the sanctions on this day as well. We all agree that HHJP is likely to exclude or preclude some information about KC's lays and lies and other things. But obviously not all. Some of the information the Proscecution may not want to even use at trial and so they may not object. Other pieces of information that they believe is critical they will fight for. ICA will be sitting in the courtroom the entire time her "lovely" past is brought up. All 6 motions will be heard in the same day. This lass will get another taste of what a TRIAL is going to be like. I think Mason is hoping that KC might see JB being sanctioned and the bringing out of a lot of her dirty laundry as embarrassing and possibly not worth the risk of losing. Maybe Mason thinks that ICA will be primed for him to deal with?

I know that the Defense is always going to try and do all it can. But by all accounts, Mason and HHJP are good friends outside of work. They supposedly hang out and play golf with one another. Mason would have no benefit in getting chastized and delaying in getting documents out...because HHJP knows Mason is capable of creating and filing legible motions in a timely manner and complying with the Orders of the court...I can only surmise that this is all a strategy on Mason's part to get JB out of the picture so that he can work on KC without too many distractions and get a plea...

Otherwise, Mason is not very involved in the case at all...and doesn't care, is senile or a substance abuser...because I don't think any of those are true...or that he is a bad irresponsible attorney incapable of complying with an Order of the Court, it has to be that he is trying to kick JB to the curb, albeit with his good friend, HHJP's help. JMO. Is this logical? Make sense at all?

I don't think this could possibly be Mason's strategy. He is jointly responsible for court filings and would not intentionally leave himself open for sanctions. Also, this recent filing re: experts is not so terrible as to guarantee sanctions--it's a lazy half-compliance more than a non-compliance--and even if there were sanctions, how would that get rid of JB? KC is more likely to get mad at the judge than to get mad at JB.

If Mason wanted to get a plea offer on the table, IMO he'd work directly with the SA to try to get one. Then he'd go meet with KC personally--he doesn't need JB's permission or presence to meet with her. A strategy based on getting JB sanctioned while somehow not getting himself sanctioned, then convincing KC that the sanctions actually meant anything bad about JB, THEN still having to arrange a plea deal and convince her to take it seems way too difficult and unlikely to succeed.
 
Snipped:

But by all accounts, Mason and HHJP are good friends outside of work. They supposedly hang out and play golf with one another

Wouldn't this be a conflict of interest? Or is this an accepted practice in the legal community?
 
Wouldn't this be a conflict of interest? Or is this an accepted practice in the legal community?

First, I should say that I haven't seen anything confirming the supposed friendship between Mason and HHJP. Quite honestly they don't seem to have compatible personalities lol. But I haven't looked for a link or anything.

It would not be an automatic conflict of interest in any event. If HHJP felt that he would be affected by the friendship to the point that he couldn't be fair, I assume he would have recused himself. IMO even if he felt he could be fair, he should have disclosed the friendship (if it exists) in case the SA wanted to object. The fact that I don't recall him making any such disclosure is one reason I question whether there is any close friendship between him and Mason.

In a small town, standards would be different. There are outlying counties in AZ where relationships between judges and counsel that would certainly be disclosed and probably lead to recusal in Phoenix would be accepted without question, because there just aren't enough judges to allow them to recuse themselves every time their buddies have a case. ;)
 
With the SA now asking for sanctions against the defense regarding the expert discovery, I would like to know if our legal minds think: A) The defense filing was so lacking that it clearly was not in compliance with the judges order, and B) What are the chances that HHJP will actually place sanctions against them? TIA!
 
First, I should say that I haven't seen anything confirming the supposed friendship between Mason and HHJP. Quite honestly they don't seem to have compatible personalities lol. But I haven't looked for a link or anything.

It would not be an automatic conflict of interest in any event. If HHJP felt that he would be affected by the friendship to the point that he couldn't be fair, I assume he would have recused himself. IMO even if he felt he could be fair, he should have disclosed the friendship (if it exists) in case the SA wanted to object. The fact that I don't recall him making any such disclosure is one reason I question whether there is any close friendship between him and Mason.

In a small town, standards would be different. There are outlying counties in AZ where relationships between judges and counsel that would certainly be disclosed and probably lead to recusal in Phoenix would be accepted without question, because there just aren't enough judges to allow them to recuse themselves every time their buddies have a case. ;)

This certainly makes sense to me. But then why can't judges befriend "bloggers?" What makes that any different?
 
With the SA now asking for sanctions against the defense regarding the expert discovery, I would like to know if our legal minds think: A) The defense filing was so lacking that it clearly was not in compliance with the judges order, and B) What are the chances that HHJP will actually place sanctions against them? TIA!

(A) I think it was clearly lazy and smartassy. I think it was also not in compliance with the order, but I recognize that opinions could differ on that point.

(B) I hope he does. JB needs to be taken down a peg if he's going to focus on the business of representing his client instead of trying to get attention by being the "class clown." I really want to read the motion for sanctions, though, before I say what the chances are that it will be granted. I'm thinking that something might have happened at one of the expert depos to make the deficiencies in JB's filing more clear. If so, the chances of the motion being granted are higher.

This certainly makes sense to me. But then why can't judges befriend "bloggers?" What makes that any different?

They can, but they shouldn't say "good job being fair" to a blogger with respect to a case pending in the judge's court. Which I'm not saying anyone did. Or that, if anyone did it, it actually meant that he was biased. Or a bad judge whatsoever. Or that it wasn't all a setup by the defense. Or that it was. I shall retreat into a corner now and put up my Rotten Tomato Shield. ;)
 
If there was evidence that the knife was used to cut the duct tape, of course it will come in. But we have all the forensic evidence back on the knife and IIRC there is nothing matching it up with the duct tape. IMO the State will not even argue that it was used.
I expect the State to argue the same as they did at the death penalty hearing i.e. that Caylee was smothered by the duct tape which is a prolonged, cruel, cold, calculated and painful death justifying imposition of the death penalty against Casey.

I agree that Tim's internal speculation about what Casey was about to do is irrelevant. I just don't think you need an order excluding it. Suppose the SA was stupid enough to ask the question, "So, Tim, in your opinion what would Casey have done if she hadn't been stopped?" Even JB would know enough to object to that, right? Right? :waitasec:
I agree that Tim can't testify about what other people knew or were about to do. However, Tim can testify about what he actually observed i.e. Geoge put a map in front of Casey, George handed Casey a pen, George told Casey to mark an x on the map where Casey thought they should start searching, Casey said OK, Casey leaned towards the map, Casey reached towards the map with her hand containing the pen, Cindy entered the room shouting and took the pen away from Casey, and so forth. The defense can dispute Tim's description of what happened by presenting their own witnesses like George and Cindy who will say that never happened, but IMO everything Tim saw Casey say/do (plus hearsay statements admitted for their effect on the listener rather than the truthfulness of the hearsay statements) is fair game.

Katprint
Always only my own opinions
 
This question pertains to RoyKronk...I thought the defense had until 12/24/10 to enter the motion in limine to introduce RK's prior bad acts, trying to introduce him as a suspect. A reporter asked if he was backing off RK as a suspect...Baez claims that is 100% false....so, I don't see any motions filed for this motion in limine to introduce RK as a suspect...Am I wrong about the deadline??? TIA

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/en...ts-roy-kronk-report-as-100-percent-false.html
 
Good Morning!!

I have been following this case since the beginning, but have never posted before. I like to think that I am open minded and everyone is innocent until proven guilty. I watch every murder show around (forensic files, Hard Evidence, snapped, etc). With everything that has been released and covered by the media in this case, I feel like there is an overwhelming amount of evidence against the defendant (both circumstantial and forensic). Many people have been convicted with much less.

I realize that jurors wont see everything that we have and I cant help but wonder what will be going through their minds while they serve on the jury. My question for all of you brilliant people is, will the defendant testify?

If I were a juror, I would want, almost need to hear what the defendants story is. I would need to hear about the last time that she saw her daughter and circumstances surrounding that event. I know that her only statement to police says that she left her daughter with the babysitter, but will she stick to that story?

I just feel like if she does not testify, the evidence is so overwhelming that a guilty verdict is certain.
 
...I agree, I think she should testify. Wehn someone doesn't take the stand in their defense, especially with so much circumstantial evidence against them- I think they look guilty.
 
This question pertains to RoyKronk...I thought the defense had until 12/24/10 to enter the motion in limine to introduce RK's prior bad acts, trying to introduce him as a suspect. A reporter asked if he was backing off RK as a suspect...Baez claims that is 100% false....so, I don't see any motions filed for this motion in limine to introduce RK as a suspect...Am I wrong about the deadline??? TIA

http://blogs.orlandosentinel.com/en...ts-roy-kronk-report-as-100-percent-false.html

I believe you have the deadline correct, but IIRC the motion was to introduce Kronk's "prior bad acts" into evidence, not to suggest that he was a suspect. In any event, the defense can attempt to do one or both of those things at trial without filing a motion first, if they want. I imagine there will be objections, of course. :)

Good Morning!!

I have been following this case since the beginning, but have never posted before. I like to think that I am open minded and everyone is innocent until proven guilty. I watch every murder show around (forensic files, Hard Evidence, snapped, etc). With everything that has been released and covered by the media in this case, I feel like there is an overwhelming amount of evidence against the defendant (both circumstantial and forensic). Many people have been convicted with much less.

I realize that jurors wont see everything that we have and I cant help but wonder what will be going through their minds while they serve on the jury. My question for all of you brilliant people is, will the defendant testify?

If I were a juror, I would want, almost need to hear what the defendants story is. I would need to hear about the last time that she saw her daughter and circumstances surrounding that event. I know that her only statement to police says that she left her daughter with the babysitter, but will she stick to that story?

I just feel like if she does not testify, the evidence is so overwhelming that a guilty verdict is certain.

She won't be testifying, unless JB is an idiot. Well, you know what I mean...whether or not he's an idiot, I don't think she'll be testifying. What can she possibly say that doesn't directly contradict something she's already said or some item of solid evidence? JB's only hope is to make the jury buy into a conspiracy theory whereby someone has set Casey up but for some reason she has to lie about it.
 
Curious as to how $$ sanctions work...

How does it work when there is a team of lawyers? Do all lawyers pay an equal portion or if say one doesn't have the money does the other lawyer have to pay it all?

Also how long do they have to pay and what if anything happens if they don't pay by the date due.

Thanks in advance!
 
JB's only hope is to make the jury buy into a conspiracy theory whereby someone has set Casey up but for some reason she has to lie about it.

Respectfully SBBM

AZ, thank you for boiling it down to this.

The defense has NO defense against the facts that KC was the last person to see her alive, that there were decomp hits on KC's car, that KC did NOTHING that any mother--hell, any responsible adult--would have done if her child had actually been abducted. They have no defense against 31 days. And all KC's lies about SOD have panned out as nothing more than that... lies. It will be interesting to see how they handle the call that KC alleged the afternoon before CA blew the whole thing up.

Back on topic here--in re the defense motion to suppress KC's past "scandalous" behavior, how will HHJP navigate this motion? Do you think he will grant the motion to suppress everything prior to June 2008?
 
Curious as to how $$ sanctions work...

How does it work when there is a team of lawyers? Do all lawyers pay an equal portion or if say one doesn't have the money does the other lawyer have to pay it all?

Also how long do they have to pay and what if anything happens if they don't pay by the date due.

Thanks in advance!

Normally, if the sanctions are for a filed document, the entire team would be sanctioned. I have never heard of anyone not paying! :)

Respectfully SBBM

AZ, thank you for boiling it down to this.

The defense has NO defense against the facts that KC was the last person to see her alive, that there were decomp hits on KC's car, that KC did NOTHING that any mother--hell, any responsible adult--would have done if her child had actually been abducted. They have no defense against 31 days. And all KC's lies about SOD have panned out as nothing more than that... lies. It will be interesting to see how they handle the call that KC alleged the afternoon before CA blew the whole thing up.

Back on topic here--in re the defense motion to suppress KC's past "scandalous" behavior, how will HHJP navigate this motion? Do you think he will grant the motion to suppress everything prior to June 2008?

I talked about the defense motions earlier in this thread, as did rhornsby. The short answer is that I think most things will come in; relevance is a pretty broad concept.
 
(snip) Casey's sexual behavior both shortly before and after the murder/kidnapping should come in to show motive (freedom from child creates more opportunities for sex with hot guys) and mental state (consistent with intentional killing but not with kidnapping/accident).

RSBM

AZ, I guess this is what I was trying to hone in on. How will HHJP define "shortly before"?

If I am a juror, who has been trucked a number of miles, and who has been asked to consider only the facts presented by the two sides, then not being able to consider KC's "scandalous" and lying behavior prior to June (oh let's say) 9th may give me room to think that her behavior post-Caylee's-disappearance was really unusual for her, and therefore she is not culpable due to ??? mental defect?

If we erase all evidence of her behavior pre-June 15 2008 then it seems to me it will be harder for the prosecution to argue premeditation.

I very much want to be argued down here, btw.
 
Is there a point where enough is enough? To further clarify, is there a point where the defense undermining their own client's right to a fair trial overrules appeal issues? Or do judges worry more about appeal than the defense doing what they are supposed to do for trial? I guess I'm just trying to figure out if I should get my hopes up about sanctions or get ready to be disappointed yet again. I can't believe Baez hasn't come under scrutiny before now.
 
I believe you have the deadline correct, but IIRC the motion was to introduce Kronk's "prior bad acts" into evidence, not to suggest that he was a suspect. In any event, the defense can attempt to do one or both of those things at trial without filing a motion first, if they want. I imagine there will be objections, of course. :)



AZlawyer said:
She won't be testifying, unless JB is an idiot. Well, you know what I mean...whether or not he's an idiot, I don't think she'll be testifying. What can she possibly say that doesn't directly contradict something she's already said or some item of solid evidence? JB's only hope is to make the jury buy into a conspiracy theory whereby someone has set Casey up but for some reason she has to lie about it.


Thanks AZ...so if Baez files it anyway and His Honor denies that motion, for he surpassed the "drop dead" date, will this be enough for an appeal, when ICA is found guilty?
As far as Baez suggesting he should be considered a suspect is due to his Ex claiming she duct taped her hands...so, it could cause concern/reasonable doubt. I just hope it doesn't go that way...JMHO

I would LOVE to see ICA take the stand in her own defense. Just to hear the lies flow out of her mouth would be such a treat and would also get her that guilty verdict. The State would rip her to shreds..Wondering if ICA will insist she take the stand to explain those compelling reasons she didn't notify authories in those crucial 31 days...I recall Baez stating she had compelling reasons we would hear at trial. Coming out of his mouth would do no good, it must come from the accused herself...JMHO

Justice for Caylee

Justice for Caylee
 
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