Identified! MA - Granby, off Route 116, WhtFem 15-26, UP14969, shallow grave, clothes, gold ring, Nov'78 - Patricia Ann Tucker

[rats]

Wait, it says in her Doe Network page that she had visibly decaying teeth. Why would the police go the college student route? If she couldn't afford dental work, she definitely couldn't afford college. I think they were looking for her identity in the wrong community

As a recently graduated college student... well, in addition to loans and scholarships, people would skip even necessities to pay for their education in my experience. I have a friend who hasn't gotten dental work done in 10 years even though she needs it - she just can't get to a dentist. Also, I graduated college but my teeth are pretty horrible just genetically and also because for all of my teenage years I had terrible hygiene because of my depression. Don't judge and jump to conclusions lmao.

 

[UnlicensedPI]

As a recently graduated college student... well, in addition to loans and scholarships, people would skip even necessities to pay for their education in my experience. I have a friend who hasn't gotten dental work done in 10 years even though she needs it - she just can't get to a dentist. Also, I graduated college but my teeth are pretty horrible just genetically and also because for all of my teenage years I had terrible hygiene because of my depression. Don't judge and jump to conclusions lmao.

No judgment from me! I certainly don't mean to come off that way.

I'm a few years into the work force so I know exactly what you mean, but college was much more affordable in 1978. I'm not sure how much people would have sacrificed necessities back then. Though if she was a college student and poor, she probably took advantage of in-state tuition or went to community college. I wonder if they looked into community colleges, or just the major Central/Western Mass schools.

I think Doe Network specified her FRONT teeth had noticeable decay. It's obviously not impossible for a college student, but I would say it's uncommon. Things that could potentially hinder employment become priorities.

FWIW, I talked about this case with my mom who graduated high school in '79 and has much more insight into college life back then. She said the same thing when I got to the teeth description, "probably not a college student." But again, improbable doesn't mean impossible.

 

[LadyBadWolf]

Again, a situation where a picture or a more elaborate description would be helpful. "Visibly decaying teeth" - what does this actually mean? Were the front teeth rotting and in need of extraction or were they visibly discolored? Was this a note from the autopsy or a note from the discovering officer?

The more details, the better!!

 

[UnlicensedPI]

What about Linda Nickell? She looks to be a little heavier-set, wearing the same type of shirt in her ID picture, from a poor family, and had several teeth removed. She was known to hitchhike around Michigan...could she have decided to travel farther?
The National Missing and Unidentified Persons System (NamUs)
Linda Sue Nickell – The Charley Project

 

[theshadow45]

Granby Jane Doe has been unidentified for 41 years today.

 

[carbuff]

Back in the 70s, at most colleges you could get free or steeply reduced dental care through the school, especially if they had a dental program.

 

[LadyBadWolf]

Bumping for GG - Wishing every day for new information!

 

[LadyBadWolf]

A quick run through of the past 11 pages of posts, and I didn't see this list anywhere. For what it is worth, there are currently 50 exclusions listed for GG in NamUS. I am very curious what grounds they are being excluded on, but is reassuring to see an extensive list. Makes me feel like this is still being looked at (please don't correct me if I am wrong, let me live in this optimism for a bit ).

It doesn't paste neatly, but this is the current list:

MP28085 Helen Allison 05/11/1972 Fairfax VA
MP2560 Maria Anjiras 02/12/1976 Fairfield CT
MP7081 Bonita Bickwit 07/27/1973 Sullivan NY
MP20107 Mary Bostwick 07/18/1972 Tioga NY
MP3070 Judith Brown 04/06/1977 Queens NY
MP7592 Rosemary Buck 08/11/1973 Onondaga NY
MP5909 Rosemary Calandriello 08/25/1969 Monmouth NJ
MP11085 Ilonka Cann 05/26/1970 Luzerne PA
MP4532 Cynthia Constantine 07/11/1969 Suffolk NY
MP5978 Jan Cotta 06/26/1973 Monmouth NJ
MP8048 Valarie Cuccia 05/04/1974 Kings NY
MP6007 Nelida Del Valle 12/20/1976 Middlesex MA
MP2492 Wendy Eaton 05/17/1975 Delaware PA
MP33036 Cornelia Enright 04/24/1969 Schenectady NY
MP6077 Margaret Fox 06/24/1974 Burlington NJ
MP2494 Ranee Gregor 10/21/1977 Allegheny PA
MP25178 Lynda Hanley 11/04/1971 Providence RI
MP8897 Sandra Hopler 09/29/1973 Lackawanna PA
MP2510 Cheryl Ann Iacovone 07/12/1977 Delaware PA
MP13877 Nancy Jason 07/17/1977 Montgomery MD
MP2387 Karen Kamsch 06/01/1976 Anne Arundel MD
MP2493 Tracy King 07/08/1975 Adams PA
MP18246 Elaine Kwiatkowski 05/29/1976 Plymouth MA
MP4613 Rhonda Labbe 08/07/1974 Essex MA
MP4933 Vicke Lamberton 02/01/1974 Worcester MA
MP37130 Irene LaRosa 03/01/1971 Tolland CT
MP6309 Charlotte Loomis 09/01/1972 Monmouth NJ
-- Patricia Luce -- -- CT
MP7574 Sylvia Lwowski 09/06/1975 Richmond NY
MP1836 Sheila Lyon 03/25/1975 Montgomery MD
MP1837 Katherine Lyon 03/25/1975 Montgomery MD
MP947 Barbara Monaco 08/23/1978 Virginia Beach VA
MP3977 Cathy Moulton 09/24/1971 Cumberland ME
MP47 Audrey Nerenberg 07/15/1977 New York NY
MP6505 Pamela Pedro 09/13/1982 Merced CA
MP2555 Janice Pockett 07/26/1973 Tolland CT
MP18331 Darlene Polizzi 04/24/1967 Bergen NJ
MP1469 Deborah Quimby 05/03/1977 Middlesex MA
MP1782 Angela Rader 02/08/1977 Roanoke VA
MP1838 Betty Redmond 09/26/1976 Anne Arundel MD
MP5133 Teresa Rhodes 09/27/1975 Westmoreland PA
MP2779 Simone Ridinger 09/02/1977 Middlesex MA
MP6975 Lynne Schulze 12/10/1971 Addison VT
MP5533 Denise Sheehy 07/07/1970 Queens NY
MP5426 Deborah Spickler 07/24/1968 Tolland CT
MP9506 Linda St. Germaine 02/13/1973 Clinton NY
MP2509 Edna Thorne 06/24/1975 Philadelphia PA
MP31545 Diane Todd 04/10/1973 Fairfax VA
MP2876 Mary Wesolowski 08/18/1971 Warren NY
MP2559 Lisa White 11/01/1974 Tolland CT

 

[Blurgle]

No judgment from me! I certainly don't mean to come off that way.

I'm a few years into the work force so I know exactly what you mean, but college was much more affordable in 1978. I'm not sure how much people would have sacrificed necessities back then. Though if she was a college student and poor, she probably took advantage of in-state tuition or went to community college. I wonder if they looked into community colleges, or just the major Central/Western Mass schools.

I think Doe Network specified her FRONT teeth had noticeable decay. It's obviously not impossible for a college student, but I would say it's uncommon. Things that could potentially hinder employment become priorities.

FWIW, I talked about this case with my mom who graduated high school in '79 and has much more insight into college life back then. She said the same thing when I got to the teeth description, "probably not a college student." But again, improbable doesn't mean impossible.

I graduated about ten years after this. There was no way I could have even so much as dreamed of seeing a dentist when I was in university. This was very common among my friends.

One trip to the dentist could cost the same as a semester's tuition back then.

 

[branmuffin]

Saw this UID on another thread trying to id the top. To me it looks more like a top that would have been popular in the late 60s rather than the 70s. It doesn't say what the material is but the collar and piping around the princess style neck seems fairly thick since it holds it shape. That would suggest a polyester fabric from that era. Obviously, there is no identifying tag inside the item so it's possible it could be home made. If you can't afford to buy instore you become good at sewing sometimes. Here is a Simplicity pattern from the late 1960s that is very similar in style.

Edited to add: I also think it could be a golf shirt. As for the decayed front teeth, assuming the person is poor may just be personal bias, I can think of several rock stars whose teeth should be perfect but fear of the dentist could be classified as a primal fear.

 

[branmuffin]

If her height and weight are unknowns how do they know she had a chunky build? Is it based on the size of the top? People are known to wear clothes both too small or too big for them.

 

[branmuffin]

I'm glad that previous posters have included information from links because some are no longer active.

It would be very beneficial for all posters as well as new eyes to have a list of the UID's personal effects, including clothing. I got the impression that only the top was found. LE sometimes make it very difficult to get help.

 

[Melt71]

What strikes me about the exclusions list a few posts back is that they are almost all from the NE. Perhaps we should be looking for options from further afield.

 

[branmuffin]

I was looking at the top/pullover again. A couple of things come to mind.

Firstly, what if the decedent was in the very early months of pregnancy? The fit and design would work for someone who may have been pregnant, maybe around 2nd or 3rd month. Some women just wear larger clothes until they absolutely have to wear maternity clothes, too, so not necessarily 'chunky' based on clothing size.

I was looking at bone formation in fetuses. Up until around the 13th to 15th week, the bones are just cartilage. So if the decedent's remains are skeletal is it possible our decedent was pregnant? Can a pathologist detect a pregnancy that has been terminated before the fetus develops bone? I know there's this thing called microchimerism where fetal cells enter the mother's circulation system where evidence of pregnancy can be detected years after birth. I don't know how long ago that was discovered but I suppose it could be moot if just skeletal remains are all we have.

Another thing I was wondering about was whether the top could be considered part of a uniform. I know it was mentioned earlier in this thread about nurses, etc and it's true back then they still wore white. My mom worked in a old age home back then as a cook and she wore a white uniform like a nurse. But what about other types of uniforms like restaurants, fast food joints, and hotel maids?
Here's an image of some fast food outfits back in the 1970s.

That got me thinking about what might have been around back then. If there are locals who were around back then please chime in. The word 'swan' in German is 'schwan'. I looked up restaurants, grocery chains, butchers and food providers and found a company called Schwan Food Company and Schwan's Home Service. They are still all through the northeastern states. Now they provide frozen foods including ice cream using home delivery services. Is it possible that our Jane Doe worked for that company and they had a uniform. If they sold ice cream could the top be what someone behind an ice cream counter would wear?

 

[UnlicensedPI]

I was looking at the top/pullover again. A couple of things come to mind.

Firstly, what if the decedent was in the very early months of pregnancy? The fit and design would work for someone who may have been pregnant, maybe around 2nd or 3rd month. Some women just wear larger clothes until they absolutely have to wear maternity clothes, too, so not necessarily 'chunky' based on clothing size.

I was looking at bone formation in fetuses. Up until around the 13th to 15th week, the bones are just cartilage. So if the decedent's remains are skeletal is it possible our decedent was pregnant? Can a pathologist detect a pregnancy that has been terminated before the fetus develops bone? I know there's this thing called microchimerism where fetal cells enter the mother's circulation system where evidence of pregnancy can be detected years after birth. I don't know how long ago that was discovered but I suppose it could be moot if just skeletal remains are all we have.

Another thing I was wondering about was whether the top could be considered part of a uniform. I know it was mentioned earlier in this thread about nurses, etc and it's true back then they still wore white. My mom worked in a old age home back then as a cook and she wore a white uniform like a nurse. But what about other types of uniforms like restaurants, fast food joints, and hotel maids?
Here's an image of some fast food outfits back in the 1970s.

That got me thinking about what might have been around back then. If there are locals who were around back then please chime in. The word 'swan' in German is 'schwan'. I looked up restaurants, grocery chains, butchers and food providers and found a company called Schwan Food Company and Schwan's Home Service. They are still all through the northeastern states. Now they provide frozen foods including ice cream using home delivery services. Is it possible that our Jane Doe worked for that company and they had a uniform. If they sold ice cream could the top be what someone behind an ice cream counter would wear?

AFAIK, Schwan is a home delivery only company. There are no counters from which to serve ice cream! I doubt a young girl is going to be driving trucks and delivering frozen meals for this company.

Edit to add: We used to get some frozen meals delivered. I don't know if it was from Schwan, but I don't think the guy wore a uniform. He would give us these HUGE containers of cookie dough, we'd eat it raw

 

[branmuffin]

AFAIK, Schwan is a home delivery only company. There are no counters from which to serve ice cream! I doubt a young girl is going to be driving trucks and delivering frozen meals for this company.

Edit to add: We used to get some frozen meals delivered. I don't know if it was from Schwan, but I don't think the guy wore a uniform. He would give us these HUGE containers of cookie dough, we'd eat it raw

Is that how it was 40 years ago? In Ontario my parents belonged to Chambers food club where you could order tubs of ice cream and half a cow! Is Schwan's that type of company?

 

[UnlicensedPI]

Is that how it was 40 years ago? In Ontario my parents belonged to Chambers food club where you could order tubs of ice cream and half a cow! Is Schwan's that type of company?

I wasn't around 40 years ago, so I'm not sure, but from the company info pages is looks like it has always been delivery without a physical location. I think you can order from a catalog, and they have options like frozen chicken nuggets, frozen marinated beef, frozen pasta dishes, frozen desserts, etc...Digging into the company, it looks like it started in the 50's in Minnesota. I don't know when they expanded to New England.

Wait, how do you order only half of the cow??!!

 

[UnlicensedPI]

It actually makes me think about the swan boats in Boston. Has that already been explored?

Of course, she could have just liked the shirt and we're jumping down rabbit holes.

 

[branmuffin]

It actually makes me think about the swan boats in Boston. Has that already been explored?

Of course, she could have just liked the shirt and we're jumping down rabbit holes.

I wasn't around 40 years ago, so I'm not sure, but from the company info pages is looks like it has always been delivery without a physical location. I think you can order from a catalog, and they have options like frozen chicken nuggets, frozen marinated beef, frozen pasta dishes, frozen desserts, etc...Digging into the company, it looks like it started in the 50's in Minnesota. I don't know when they expanded to New England.

Wait, how do you order only half of the cow??!!

Lol. You ordered something like 3 rib roasts, 10 pounds of hamburger, 2 eye of round roasts, 20 pounds of stewing beef, etc.

 

[UnlicensedPI]

Lol. You ordered something like 3 rib roasts, 10 pounds of hamburger, 2 eye of round roasts, 20 pounds of stewing beef, etc.

Yeah, that's...half a cow